IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector


S

Searcher7

I was given an IBM T22 laptop about 4-1/2 years ago and it has been gathering dust ever since.

I took it out and powered on, but there is a password set and so I decided to open it up and disconnect the main and back-up batteries following the instructions on page 60, 61, and 62 of the ThinkPad Computer Hardware Maintenance Manual PDF. (http://download.lenovo.com/ibmdl/pub/pc/pccbbs/mobiles_pdf/62p9631.pdf).

After wiggling and pulling for 15 minutes the black ground wire broke loosefrom the connector. (http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/T22BackUpBattery_zps79b3fee3.jpg).

So even though it wasn't mentioned in that battery removal section I guess that I should have found a way to take the laptop apart further beforehand.

Can anyone tell me if the battery/holder/connector is replaceable?

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
 
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C

Charlie Hoffpauir

I was given an IBM T22 laptop about 4-1/2 years ago and it has been gathering dust ever since.

I took it out and powered on, but there is a password set and so I decided to open it up and disconnect the main and back-up batteries following the instructions on page 60, 61, and 62 of the ThinkPad Computer Hardware Maintenance Manual PDF. (http://download.lenovo.com/ibmdl/pub/pc/pccbbs/mobiles_pdf/62p9631.pdf).

After wiggling and pulling for 15 minutes the black ground wire broke loose from the connector. (http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/T22BackUpBattery_zps79b3fee3.jpg).

So even though it wasn't mentioned in that battery removal section I guess that I should have found a way to take the laptop apart further beforehand.

Can anyone tell me if the battery/holder/connector is replaceable?

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Virtually everything is replacable. Visit the web site and download a
service manual in PDF. It used to be on IBM's site back when they made
the T-series, but when I looked for the manual for my T-42, the
information had been moved to Lenovo's site.

A quick google gives me:

http://download.lenovo.com/ibmdl/pub/pc/pccbbs/mobiles_pdf/62p9631.pdf
 
M

Mike Tomlinson

Charlie said:
Virtually everything is replacable. Visit the web site and download a
service manual in PDF. It used to be on IBM's site back when they made
the T-series, but when
Don't you just love it when people don't even read the post they're
replying to?
 
P

Patrick

I was given an IBM T22 laptop about 4-1/2 years ago and it has been
gathering dust ever since.

I took it out and powered on, but there is a password set and so I
decided to open it up and disconnect the main and back-up batteries
following the instructions on page 60, 61, and 62 of the ThinkPad
Computer Hardware Maintenance Manual PDF.
(http://download.lenovo.com/ibmdl/pub/pc/pccbbs/mobiles_pdf/62p9631.pdf).

After wiggling and pulling for 15 minutes the black ground wire broke
loose from the connector.
(http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/T22BackUpBattery_zps79b3fee3.jpg).

So even though it wasn't mentioned in that battery removal section I
guess that I should have found a way to take the laptop apart further
beforehand.

Can anyone tell me if the battery/holder/connector is replaceable?

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
I've got a T22 (fan not working), anyway I have replaced the CMOS battery.
The battery comes with a lead and the plug on the end.
Here are some pictures of said.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/vvvyaaiqjmctvjv/SppCt61_Dq?m

I'll have a look to see if I can recall where I bought the new
battery-with-lead, think it was only a couple of £ on ebay.
 
P

Patrick

Patrick said:
I've got a T22 (fan not working), anyway I have replaced the CMOS
battery. The battery comes with a lead and the plug on the end.
Here are some pictures of said.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/vvvyaaiqjmctvjv/SppCt61_Dq?m

I'll have a look to see if I can recall where I bought the new
battery-with-lead, think it was only a couple of £ on ebay.
Heres a link to ebay (USA) to showing the prices (in diddly-dollars) :)
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313&_nkw=IBM+T22+CMOS+battery&_sacat=0&_from=R40
http://preview.tinyurl.com/bszv3gs
 
P

Patrick

I was given an IBM T22 laptop about 4-1/2 years ago and it has been
gathering dust ever since.

I took it out and powered on, but there is a password set and so I
Do you mean that the BIOS has a password or that the OperatingSystem has a
password ?
 
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P

Paul

Patrick said:
That's a battery with a "pig tail". They spot weld contacts onto
the CR2032, so it doesn't heat up too much, and attach leads to it.
On the other end, is some kind of standard, two pin connector (likely
with a metric pin spacing). You might find other battery products,
with the same style connector on the end. You would want to locate
the motherboard connector and verify it wasn't damaged at all, just
in case.

The battery is usually covered with a heat shrink (polyolefin) tubing,
to prevent the CR2032 from coming in contact with other conductors
inside the computer. For an Ebay vendor, that also allows them
to hide the brand of battery they actually included.

The connector on the end, could have a "positive retention" feature.
And that's why it wouldn't come loose with mere wiggling. You have
to look carefully at the connector, to see if there is something
that needs to be pressed or tugged on, to release the connector.
(I have a connector like that, positive retention, for my car tail lights,
and it's a bear to get apart. My car trunk is full of swear words now.)
Positive retention prevents the connector from falling off on its own.

http://i.ebayimg.com/t/1-IBM-Thinkpad-T20-T21-T22-T23-T30-CMOS-Battery-02k6541-/02/!B(HDLKgBGk~$(KGrHgoH-CYEjlLl9odTBK,oBLuolQ~~_12.JPG

Paul
 
P

Patrick

Hello Paul, I am not the OP !! :)
That's a battery with a "pig tail". They spot weld contacts onto
the CR2032, so it doesn't heat up too much, and attach leads to it.
On the other end, is some kind of standard, two pin connector (likely
with a metric pin spacing). You might find other battery products,
with the same style connector on the end. You would want to locate
the motherboard connector and verify it wasn't damaged at all, just
in case.

The battery is usually covered with a heat shrink (polyolefin) tubing,
to prevent the CR2032 from coming in contact with other conductors
inside the computer. For an Ebay vendor, that also allows them
to hide the brand of battery they actually included.

The connector on the end, could have a "positive retention" feature.
And that's why it wouldn't come loose with mere wiggling. You have
to look carefully at the connector, to see if there is something
that needs to be pressed or tugged on, to release the connector.
(I have a connector like that, positive retention, for my car tail
lights, and it's a bear to get apart. My car trunk is full of swear
words now.) Positive retention prevents the connector from falling
off on its own.
http://i.ebayimg.com/t/1-IBM-Thinkpad-T20-T21-T22-T23-T30-CMOS-Battery-02k6541-/02/!B(HDLKgBGk~$(KGrHgoH-CYEjlLl9odTBK,oBLuolQ~~_12.JPG

Paul
 
S

Searcher7

Do you mean that the BIOS has a password or that the OperatingSystem has a

password ?
I'm guessing the BIOS.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
 
P

Patrick

I'm guessing the BIOS.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
So what error report do you get when you turn it on, do you perhaps get a
blank screen or a screen with a single '-' cursor flashing in the top-left,
or;
Do you get this screen;
https://www.dropbox.com/home?select=DCP00610.JPG#!/lightbox/home?select=DCP00610.JPG

I have just been messing with mine and the CPU-fan is now working, I am
running on AC (Mains).
I have disconnected the CMOS-battery to see if it still boots and it does
and I get the above Screen.
If I press F1 to go into the BIOS, it complains but goes into the BIOS.
 
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P

Patrick

Thanks.

Now all I have to do if hope enough of the laptop comes apart so I
can get to that connector when I take out all the screws in the
bottom.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
The CMOS-battery in it's holder is supposed to just push-on, however it
actually consists of the plug just hanging out the end of the holder so it
can be quite difficult to get-in (not to mention getting it out).

So if you are wanting (or needing) to be able to see what you are doing,
then see page 88 (94/182) of 62p9631.pdf (your referenced pdf).
 
S

Searcher7

Sorry, I gave a wrong link, heres the right one !

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1tp845a98m8u2jq/DCP00610.JPG?m
Yes. I get that screen.

I decided to pull some more and this time the connector came out with the red wire.

I put the main battery back in and powered up. But for some reason I still need a password regardless of whether I wait, press F1 or F12.

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/IBM1_zps9303f75f.jpg
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/IBM2_zpsd628a163.jpg
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/IBM3_zpsd152c60c.jpg
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/IBM4_zpsdeb9a7f6.jpg

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
 
P

Patrick

Yes. I get that screen.

I decided to pull some more and this time the connector came out with
the red wire.

I put the main battery back in and powered up. But for some reason I
still need a password regardless of whether I wait, press F1 or F12.

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/IBM1_zps9303f75f.jpg
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/IBM2_zpsd628a163.jpg
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/IBM3_zpsd152c60c.jpg
Looks bad, apparently if it's a 'Supervisor Password' the only option is the
right PW or a new Mobo.
Heres a link to a 'Lenova' T2X forum anyway;
http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewforum.php?f=28

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/IBM4_zpsdeb9a7f6.jpg
 
P

Paul

Patrick said:
Looks bad, apparently if it's a 'Supervisor Password' the only option is the
right PW or a new Mobo.
Heres a link to a 'Lenova' T2X forum anyway;
http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewforum.php?f=28

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/IBM4_zpsdeb9a7f6.jpg
There are two kinds of hardware implementations.

1) Trivial kind. Both passwords are stored in CMOS RAM. Pull
the battery, and "poof!", no more password. Low security
computers use this method. I like this implementation,
because the user is not lulled into a false sense of security.

2) Business people expect high security ( :) ) computers.
For this purpose, some of the business laptops, use a
separate 2K EEPROM to hold the password. You can pull
the CMOS battery all you want, and you aren't going to
erase that one. For the wily hacker, this is no problem at all.
For the end user, it's a disaster.

So that's the challenge you could be facing, depending
on the situation. The password can be hiding in an EEPROM.

And when hacking computers like that, remember that some
of them are wired to self-destruct. For example, some
computer hard drives, the contents are encrypted, and
are *relying* on TPM information to work properly.
If, in your ultimate cleverness, you decide to reset the TPM,
you could forever lose access to the encrypted information.
So some of the implementations in modern computers, if you
"reset them", it could lead to data loss. (The owner of the
computer, was probably too stupid to make the "key disk" to
recover the data in an emergency. Usually situations like that,
the manufacturer provides a second method so there won't be
data loss. You have to prepare the recovery floppy or USB
key in advance.)

There are even a few computers, where you can't add hard drives
to the computer, without the drive being "branded". So something
is written to the disk, to make it "acceptable" to the computer.
If the end-user goes to Walmart and buys a hard drive, they
discover it just won't work.

While for the most part, modern computers are "open" systems,
you will occasionally run into surprises. And the "I can't
erase the password" problem, is one of the more common
surprises. And a business-class laptop, is more likely
to use the EEPROM method. All my computers I have here,
are the low security kind - pulling the battery, is the
only procedure I need.

Paul
 
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S

Searcher7

There are two kinds of hardware implementations.



1) Trivial kind. Both passwords are stored in CMOS RAM. Pull

the battery, and "poof!", no more password. Low security

computers use this method. I like this implementation,

because the user is not lulled into a false sense of security.



2) Business people expect high security ( :) ) computers.

For this purpose, some of the business laptops, use a

separate 2K EEPROM to hold the password. You can pull

the CMOS battery all you want, and you aren't going to

erase that one. For the wily hacker, this is no problem at all.

For the end user, it's a disaster.



So that's the challenge you could be facing, depending

on the situation. The password can be hiding in an EEPROM.



And when hacking computers like that, remember that some

of them are wired to self-destruct. For example, some

computer hard drives, the contents are encrypted, and

are *relying* on TPM information to work properly.

If, in your ultimate cleverness, you decide to reset the TPM,

you could forever lose access to the encrypted information.

So some of the implementations in modern computers, if you

"reset them", it could lead to data loss. (The owner of the

computer, was probably too stupid to make the "key disk" to

recover the data in an emergency. Usually situations like that,

the manufacturer provides a second method so there won't be

data loss. You have to prepare the recovery floppy or USB

key in advance.)



There are even a few computers, where you can't add hard drives

to the computer, without the drive being "branded". So something

is written to the disk, to make it "acceptable" to the computer.

If the end-user goes to Walmart and buys a hard drive, they

discover it just won't work.



While for the most part, modern computers are "open" systems,

you will occasionally run into surprises. And the "I can't

erase the password" problem, is one of the more common

surprises. And a business-class laptop, is more likely

to use the EEPROM method. All my computers I have here,

are the low security kind - pulling the battery, is the

only procedure I need.



Paul
Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to locate the chip.

And while we're on the subject of Lenovo PCs, I'll check out that forum Patrick mentioned.

BTW. I have some disks. Does anyone know what PC uses these?:
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/LenovoRescueandRecoveryDiscXP_zps1c781109.jpg
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/LenovoProductRecoverydiscXPSP31_zpsdcfac635.jpg
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/LenovoProductRecoverydiscXPSP32_zps2d00385b.jpg

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
 
P

Paul

Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to locate the chip.

And while we're on the subject of Lenovo PCs, I'll check out that forum Patrick mentioned.

BTW. I have some disks. Does anyone know what PC uses these?:
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/LenovoRescueandRecoveryDiscXP_zps1c781109.jpg
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/LenovoProductRecoverydiscXPSP31_zpsdcfac635.jpg
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/Statenislander/Computer/LenovoProductRecoverydiscXPSP32_zps2d00385b.jpg

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Discs like that, could be used on more than one model of computer.

The software is activated by the presence of "SLIC" info in the
Lenovo BIOS. The idea is, if I try to install that disc on my
Asus motherboard, then the OS shouldn't activate. Whereas, if
a Lenovo BIOS is present on the motherboard, the OS should be
activated immediately.

Whether that disc works on everything, may depend on drivers.
If the BIOS, IDE interfaces are set to Compatible or Enhanced,
then the default disk drivers may work immediately. And perhaps
you'd need to add video drivers, to make the installation complete
(if the computer is different than the one it was intended for).

If you were using a newer computer, with the interface jammed
into AHCI mode, then maybe it wouldn't boot after installation.

I've even heard of a few discs, older ones, where they work with
any motherboard (when really, they shouldn't).

Undoubtedly, someone out there knows all the ins and outs of those
things, where they'll work and won't work. If they're Lenovo
branded, then try them on a Lenovo computer.

See the "SLIC" section here for more details.
SLIC is for "branded OEM" discs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BIOS#SLIC

Paul
 
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P

Patrick

Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally
overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to
locate the chip.
I have found this;
http://sodoityourself.com/hacking-ibm-thinkpad-bios-password/

Hardware-wise it requires a few Resistors and Diodes, another PC with a
SerialPort and a plug to go into said SerialPort.

Here is the address to get the required Software;
http://www.allservice.ro/store/utils/

Or download the two ZIP files from DropBox where I have copied them
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fqrhlue845iruwg/r24rf08_setup.zip?m
https://www.dropbox.com/s/rapgeymaduvewre/setup_ibmpass21.zip?m
 

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