I think I've solved my Spin Retry Count problem

[Arno]

AIUI, all drives spin up as soon as power is applied, unless you have
enabled PUIS (power up in standby), in which case the BIOS or the OS
could stagger the spinup. But I still can't see how either scenario
could affect the spin retry count.

Maybe warmer weather has made the fluid bearing a little less viscous
???

Hehe, possible.

But my theory would be auto-spin and if a command arrives before
spin-up is complete, have the spin-problem. It may just be that
it now has more time to complete spin-up before it needs to
answer requests.

Arno

 

[Arno]

I think the change in behaviour won't have anything to do with the
cables. A dodgy IDE cable is going to affect a lot more than the Spin
Retry count.

It's probably more to do with the fact hat you have now converted the
drive to SATA. Those plug-in converters are notoriously unreliable
(especially if you buy the ebay cheapo ones). I've used several
different ones with mixed results. How do you know the SMART data is
getting through from the drive correctly, if at all?

I have had reliability problems and compatibility problems
with these things, but never wrong SMART reports (I have tried
5 different ones). I would say if Yousuf gets SMART values
that they should be authentic.

Arno

 

[YKhan]

But my theory would be auto-spin and if a command arrives before
spin-up is complete, have the spin-problem. It may just be that
it now has more time to complete spin-up before it needs to
answer requests.

Arno

Exactly what I was thinking.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Rod Speed]

YKhan wrote

Exactly what I was thinking.

Thats still not going to result in an extra spin retry in the SMART stats.

 

[Waz Medano]

There
are good reasons for non-case-mod-doodz to use rounded cables too:
they are more flexible, and they allow better airflow.

Yousuf Khan

I've used rounded cables in the past and I found their benefits
negligible.

*----------------------------------------------------------------------*
"A good neighbor is one who stays on their side of the ****ING fence."
*----------------------------------------------------------------------*

 

[Daniel Prince]

the reason this change was done was to eventually upgrade the
motherboard and processor down the road -- it's extremely difficult to
find new motherboards with more than one IDE channel anymore, so I am
preparing for the next generation.

I have a SIIG controller card with two IDE connections on it. My
brother has one too. Both work well. They are still available but
cost over $42.

http://3btech.net/siimsipciati.html

has a Silicon Image Sil0680 PCI ATA/133 IDE RAID Controller Card
with two IDE connections for $13.97 with free shipping.

If you do not have a free PCI slot for a SIIG controller, I have
seen a PCI-E card with one IDE connection, one SATA and one E-SATA
for $13.98 delivered.

http://www.microbarn.com/details.aspx?rid=102430&source=pricewatch

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Yousuf Khan wrote


The raw numbers for that particular drive dont support those 40% and 52%
claims, particularly with a parameter like spin retry count thats much more
likely to be a problem external to the drive than internal to the drive.

Well, HD Sentinel uses some kind of proprietary internal rating
equation, which seems to be logarithmic (slows down as it gets closer to
zero). I don't concern myself too much with the absolute values they
come up with, just with the relative values. In this case the relative
values has indicated an improvement in health has been noted.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Rod Speed]

Yousuf Khan wrote

Rod Speed wrote

Well, HD Sentinel uses some kind of proprietary internal rating equation, which seems to be logarithmic (slows down as
it gets closer to zero).

Its clearly terminally stupid to give that particular drive either
of those numbers to that particular drive when the bulk of
the causes for spin retry counts are external to the drive.

I don't concern myself too much with the absolute values they come up with, just with the relative values.

It makes a lot more sense to do that with the raw SMART numbers instead.

In this case the relative values has indicated an improvement in health has been noted.

But there isnt a shred of evidence that the health of the drive has changed one iota.

 

[Yousuf Khan]

I have a SIIG controller card with two IDE connections on it. My
brother has one too. Both work well. They are still available but
cost over $42.

Well, thanks, but obviously I already have my solutions in place.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Yousuf Khan]

YKhan wrote


Thats still not going to result in an extra spin retry in the SMART stats.

And why not?

Yousuf Khan

 

[Rod Speed]

Yousuf Khan wrote

Rod Speed wrote

And why not?

Because spin retry counts are THE DRIVE trying to the spin up the
drive and finding that the drive doesnt spin up when its supposed to.

The bios seeing that the drive isnt ready doesnt result in
an increase in the spin retry count in the SMART stats.

 

[Yousuf Khan]

They were around 20 inches long, from the furthest ends.

Now, they were rounded cables in both cases. I had thought of using flat
cables, but in the crowded conditions in my case it was pretty difficult
to use them without moving a lot of stuff around. Plus the rounded
cables gave better cooling.

Just an update on this old issue. I finally got a chance to try the same
drives with the flat IDE cables, and the results were the same as when
using the rounded ones. Still no spin retry problem when using the SATA
converters and cables, but the problem always crops up when using any
sort of IDE cable.


Yousuf Khan

 

[Rod Speed]

Just an update on this old issue. I finally got a chance to try the
same drives with the flat IDE cables, and the results were the same
as when using the rounded ones. Still no spin retry problem when
using the SATA converters and cables, but the problem always crops up
when using any sort of IDE cable.

Something very strange going on there. Most dont get spin retrys with IDE cables.

 

[Daniel Prince]

what I did recently was that I converted two of those old
IDE drives into SATA drives using an IDE-to-SATA converter board that
fits right onto the back of the drives themselves.

What brand(s) of converters did you use? Did you try any of them on
optical drives?

I am having problems with my IDE cables AGAIN. I would like to get
rid of all of them.

 

[Yousuf Khan]

What brand(s) of converters did you use? Did you try any of them on
optical drives?

No specific brand, just bought some generic stuff off of Ebay. They are
still working great. In fact, the drive that was showing spin retry
problems has been upgraded in HD Sentinel's health ratings from 40% all
of the way upto 76% now.

I didn't try them on optical drives, just hard drives. I don't
anticipate that there would be any special issues with optical drives
though. I'm actually still running all of my optical drives off of IDE
cables though.

I am having problems with my IDE cables AGAIN. I would like to get
rid of all of them.

It's probably a good idea. The units cost less than $10 each (actually
usually you'll find them under $5 including shipping), so even if they
don't fix your problem, it's not a huge expense. Just make sure you get
the right type, some are for SATA devices to IDE cable, whereas others
are for IDE devices to SATA cable.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Rod Speed]

Yousuf Khan wrote

Daniel Prince wrote

No specific brand, just bought some generic stuff off of Ebay. They are still working great. In fact, the drive that
was showing spin retry problems has been upgraded in HD Sentinel's health ratings from 40% all of the way upto 76%
now.

I didn't try them on optical drives, just hard drives. I don't
anticipate that there would be any special issues with optical drives though. I'm actually still running all of my
optical drives off of IDE cables though.

It's probably a good idea. The units cost less than $10 each (actually
usually you'll find them under $5 including shipping), so even if they
don't fix your problem, it's not a huge expense. Just make sure you
get the right type, some are for SATA devices to IDE cable, whereas
others are for IDE devices to SATA cable.

And some can be used either way.