Heat and chips

[AC]

Hi All

I have a PC (HP Pavilion 430.uk) from a friend (no, really) that was riddled
with malware and was running incredible slowly and doing all sorts of scary
things.

Having spent a day cleaning up the machine it still seems slow. Next up I
opened up the machine to add a network card so I could get the latest
updates for all the anti malware software and re-run all the scans. On
opening it up I found a heat sink sitting at the bottom the case. It had
fallen of what must be one of the important chipset chips. The heat sink was
held on by a clip that went over the heatsink and clipped in to two loops
soldered in to the motherboard. Unfortunatly one of the loops is missing.
This is why the heatsink fell off. It is also why I can't refit it.

Since discovering that, with the knowledge that the machine had been running
with out the heatsink, I continued to update and rescanned the machine.
Accoring to all the scanners the machine should be clean, yet its still
slow.

So, a few questions questions

1) Is it possible that the missing heat sink is the reason for it being
slow?
2) Since the machine still runs, is it safe to still run it with out the
heatsink being there?
3) Any ideas as to how to refit the heatsink with out the loops?

Cheers
AC

 

[GT]

Hi All

I have a PC (HP Pavilion 430.uk) from a friend (no, really) that was
riddled with malware and was running incredible slowly and doing all sorts
of scary things.

Having spent a day cleaning up the machine it still seems slow. Next up I
opened up the machine to add a network card so I could get the latest
updates for all the anti malware software and re-run all the scans. On
opening it up I found a heat sink sitting at the bottom the case. It had
fallen of what must be one of the important chipset chips. The heat sink
was held on by a clip that went over the heatsink and clipped in to two
loops soldered in to the motherboard. Unfortunatly one of the loops is
missing. This is why the heatsink fell off. It is also why I can't refit
it.

Since discovering that, with the knowledge that the machine had been
running with out the heatsink, I continued to update and rescanned the
machine. Accoring to all the scanners the machine should be clean, yet its
still slow.

So, a few questions questions

1) Is it possible that the missing heat sink is the reason for it being
slow?

Yes - possibly throttling itself, but I have only heard of this on CPUs
before - its not the CPU, right?

2) Since the machine still runs, is it safe to still run it with out the
heatsink being there?

No - get a replacement one. Zalman do fanless heatsinks for chipsets - check
out the QuietPC website.

3) Any ideas as to how to refit the heatsink with out the loops?

The new one will come with new pins / heatsink glue

 

[AC]

Yes - possibly throttling itself, but I have only heard of this on CPUs
before - its not the CPU, right?

Definatly not the CPU.

No - get a replacement one. Zalman do fanless heatsinks for chipsets -
check out the QuietPC website.


The new one will come with new pins / heatsink glue

Ah, so I can avoid the old loops and just glue one on? Cant I just get the
glue and stick the old one back? Obviously after cleaning the heat transfer
paste off.

Cheers

AC

 

[AC]

do your self a favour reinstall the os and reformat the whole hard drive.

thats if you have an installation software

have you defragged the hard drive

Absolutely, under normal circumstances I would. But there is so much
software with out the original disks and user data is scattered all over the
place I thought I'd have a go at cleaning the malware out. Plus, I've never
seen a PC with so much malware on it I wanted to treat it as a challenge.

Funnily enough I completely forgot about a simple defrag. This PC hasn't had
any maintenance since it was bought so the file system must be all over the
place. Cheers for the reminder.

AC

 

[Grinder]

Definatly not the CPU.


Ah, so I can avoid the old loops and just glue one on? Cant I just get the
glue and stick the old one back? Obviously after cleaning the heat transfer
paste off.

That should work. Here's a candidate product:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835100013

 

[Lord Turkey Cough]

Hi All

I have a PC (HP Pavilion 430.uk) from a friend (no, really) that was
riddled with malware and was running incredible slowly and doing all sorts
of scary things.

Having spent a day cleaning up the machine it still seems slow. Next up I
opened up the machine to add a network card so I could get the latest
updates for all the anti malware software and re-run all the scans. On
opening it up I found a heat sink sitting at the bottom the case. It had
fallen of what must be one of the important chipset chips. The heat sink
was held on by a clip that went over the heatsink and clipped in to two
loops soldered in to the motherboard. Unfortunatly one of the loops is
missing. This is why the heatsink fell off. It is also why I can't refit
it.

Since discovering that, with the knowledge that the machine had been
running with out the heatsink, I continued to update and rescanned the
machine. Accoring to all the scanners the machine should be clean, yet its
still slow.

So, a few questions questions

1) Is it possible that the missing heat sink is the reason for it being
slow?
2) Since the machine still runs, is it safe to still run it with out the
heatsink being there?
3) Any ideas as to how to refit the heatsink with out the loops?

Cheers
AC

 

[Lord Turkey Cough]

Hi All

I have a PC (HP Pavilion 430.uk) from a friend (no, really) that was
riddled with malware and was running incredible slowly and doing all sorts
of scary things.

Having spent a day cleaning up the machine it still seems slow. Next up I
opened up the machine to add a network card so I could get the latest
updates for all the anti malware software and re-run all the scans. On
opening it up I found a heat sink sitting at the bottom the case. It had
fallen of what must be one of the important chipset chips. The heat sink
was held on by a clip that went over the heatsink and clipped in to two
loops soldered in to the motherboard. Unfortunatly one of the loops is
missing. This is why the heatsink fell off. It is also why I can't refit
it.

Since discovering that, with the knowledge that the machine had been
running with out the heatsink, I continued to update and rescanned the
machine. Accoring to all the scanners the machine should be clean, yet its
still slow.

You should run a suitable benchmark to see if it running slow.

So, a few questions questions

1) Is it possible that the missing heat sink is the reason for it being
slow?

I would say not, it will either work or it won't, no halfwayhouse.

2) Since the machine still runs, is it safe to still run it with out the
heatsink being there?

Might be, as long as you smell no burning.

 

[Paul]

Hi All

I have a PC (HP Pavilion 430.uk) from a friend (no, really) that was riddled
with malware and was running incredible slowly and doing all sorts of scary
things.

Having spent a day cleaning up the machine it still seems slow. Next up I
opened up the machine to add a network card so I could get the latest
updates for all the anti malware software and re-run all the scans. On
opening it up I found a heat sink sitting at the bottom the case. It had
fallen of what must be one of the important chipset chips. The heat sink was
held on by a clip that went over the heatsink and clipped in to two loops
soldered in to the motherboard. Unfortunatly one of the loops is missing.
This is why the heatsink fell off. It is also why I can't refit it.

Since discovering that, with the knowledge that the machine had been running
with out the heatsink, I continued to update and rescanned the machine.
Accoring to all the scanners the machine should be clean, yet its still
slow.

So, a few questions questions

1) Is it possible that the missing heat sink is the reason for it being
slow?
2) Since the machine still runs, is it safe to still run it with out the
heatsink being there?
3) Any ideas as to how to refit the heatsink with out the loops?

Cheers
AC

According to the picture here, the jokers at FIC (FIC VC35) only installed
one of the two loops on the heatsink. It took some tracking down, but the
motherboard is a "Budapest" with 845 Northbridge.

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/...7231&cc=us&dlc=en&lc=en&jumpid=reg_R1002_USEN

(430.uk has different mobo than 430.es and 430.fr - some other web pages
at HP even listed a S370 motherboard.)
http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/Document.jsp?objectID=nph07836

There are a couple documents for 845 family at Intel, and the chips are
somewhere in the ~5W power dissipation range. Maximum "case" temp of the
Northbridge is 92C. The drawing shows the Northbridge as having a bare
silicon die, like an Athlon.

Just a matter of finding a loop to replace it. Or a "loop compatible"
heatsink like this one. Click the "loops type" button on the
upper right of this Flash movie. Since the arms are a fixed length,
there is no way of knowing whether this will fit or not. Product
comes with thermal paste.

http://www.zalman.co.kr/DataFile/Product/Setup/ZM-NBF47(1).swf
http://www.zalman.co.kr/ENG/product/Product_Read.asp?Idx=133

Paul

 

[Paul]

?

Looked like two to me. Zoomed in:
http://69.36.166.207/usr_1034/loops.jpg

Normally, there would be four pins and two pieces of wire.
One piece of wire like this.

X
|
|
+------------+
|
|
X

The second piece of wire like this.

X
|
|
+------------+
|
|
X

In the picture, I only see one of the two possible
pieces of springy wire.

Paul

 

[Paul]

Paul, is that fact, urban myth or just humour?

I was given two redundant pcs which used the FIC VC35 motherboard and both
had only two of the loops shown, the chipset heatsink hanging on by one
loop. As I found a loop loose in both of the cases I was baffled as to the
reason and had presumed that this was someones attempt at making the pcs
unworkable before they were disposed of.

These desktop pcs were 4 years old and were/are still working fine.

I'm no dab hand with the soldering iron and after my first attempt the loop
pulled out within a couple of hours. The second attempt was successful after
positioning the legs through the holes and bending them gently in different
directions before resoldering.

I'm not sure that you would be able to use two clips at the same time. If
you look at the angle of the heatsink in the photo you can see that it's not
square to the motherboard and it has to be twisted even further to get the
hooks through the loops. A second clip would require the heatsink to be
twisted in the opposite direction and the first clip would seem to prevent
this or perhaps the judicious use of a pair of long nose pliers is warranted
and hope that the 'spring' isn't taken out of the clip.

However as you have much more practical experience I must bow to your
superior knowledge.

One last point, although I managed to find bios, sound and motherboard
drivers when I reinstalled the o/s none of them were needed, XP SP2 found
all the devices and supplied its own drivers.

You can see an 845PE board here (about the same generation, more or less), and
this one uses two loops to hold the Northbridge heatsink in place. For some
reason, the parts here look like they were meant for one another.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/mainboards/i845pe-roundup/asus.jpg

Paul

 

[AC]

?

Looked like two to me. Zoomed in:
http://69.36.166.207/usr_1034/loops.jpg

Thats exactly it.

AC

 

[AC]

Hi All

I have a PC (HP Pavilion 430.uk) from a friend (no, really) that was
riddled with malware and was running incredible slowly and doing all sorts
of scary things.

Having spent a day cleaning up the machine it still seems slow. Next up I
opened up the machine to add a network card so I could get the latest
updates for all the anti malware software and re-run all the scans. On
opening it up I found a heat sink sitting at the bottom the case. It had
fallen of what must be one of the important chipset chips. The heat sink
was held on by a clip that went over the heatsink and clipped in to two
loops soldered in to the motherboard. Unfortunatly one of the loops is
missing. This is why the heatsink fell off. It is also why I can't refit
it.

Since discovering that, with the knowledge that the machine had been
running with out the heatsink, I continued to update and rescanned the
machine. Accoring to all the scanners the machine should be clean, yet its
still slow.

So, a few questions questions

1) Is it possible that the missing heat sink is the reason for it being
slow?
2) Since the machine still runs, is it safe to still run it with out the
heatsink being there?
3) Any ideas as to how to refit the heatsink with out the loops?

Cheers
AC

Many thanks for all the replies. Good stuff

Looks like I have 2 choices, solder in a new loop or epoxy and heat paste.
Not sure which I will go with, I'll have the mobo out and decide then.

To the guy who recommended the extra RAM: you are right the PC does only
have 256Mb. I will recommend the owner gets more!! Actually, thinking about
it, I think I have aother PC with the same RAM so I'll see if I can
demonstrate a difference.

Cheers all,

AC