Fuzzy Still Pictures

[Guest]

I am trying to make a slide show for my wedding. I have scanned in the
pictures and the slide show looks clear in preview (i'm sure you're tired of
hearing this) and fuzzy in full screen. I have saved it to my computer under
different resolutions, but everytime I play it in Media Player, it is still
fuzzy. It is not so bad when I watch it small in Media Player, but when I go
full screen, you can't hardly see anything. I am going to burn it to a DVD to
play at the wedding, problem is I have to play it through the computer at the
church. Do you think it will be ok, or does anyone have any suggestions?

 

[Bob [MVP]]

Try using Photo Story 3, instead of Movie Maker.

http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=37345

--
-Bob
_______________________________
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP Media Center Edition
http://www.microsoft.com/ehome

 

[Bob [MVP]]

If you've already invested a lot of time editing your
slide show, and you want to stick with Movie Maker,
take a look at www.papajohn.org for instructions for
creating a custom profile for saving movies. Then
you can save your finished movie at a higher resolution.

--
-Bob
_______________________________
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP Media Center Edition
http://www.microsoft.com/ehome

 

[Al Stu]

What resolution did you save the scanned pictures at? If too low of a
resolution they will not display clearly at full screen.

What resolution did you save the movie at? If too low of a resolution it
will not display clearly at full screen.

Preferred movie resolution for displaying full screen would be DV-AVI, and
the scanned pictures used in the movie should be a minimum of 1024 x 768 BMP
or JPEG with minimal compression.

 

[Rehan]

If you want to save the slideshow in higher resolution then use 1024x768
profile from www.papajohn.org > Saving Movies > Custom WMV profiles.

Windows Movie Maker resizes the input images to output "display" size before
internal processing starts. Best would be to use images of exact same size
as the output display size (640x480 or 1024x768). Dont use DV AVI since it
distorts pixels to non-square size. Dont apply any effects.

 

[Al Stu]

"Dont use DV AVI since it distorts pixels to non-square size."

Are you sure about that? Isn't pixel aspect specific to the display device,
not the file format? Photos in my DV-AVI movies turn out fine with proper
H/V aspect ratio.

 

[John Kelly]

Hello,

For best quality when using still images with Movie Maker.

1) Crop all images so that their aspect ratio matches the target video
ratio
2) Resample each clip so that its width matches the width of your target
video

You should NOT use any of the microsoft tools for doing the above...they
make a serious pigs-ear out of it. I use Adobe Photoshop which has a very
convenient option...it allows you to place a cropping rectangle of any
actual size on your still. Then when you select Crop you end up with that
part of your image that you want to retain (Its not always the biggest
rectangle you can make that is the best choice). Still using Adobe I then
resample the image to the target size. The result is always acceptable and
I find no variation between the stand alone image and the same image in the
final movie maker DV-AVI file (I dont have a need for the smaller/lower
quality formats)

I have never counted how many button clicks are involved but I guess its
something around 5 or 6. (In other words its quick and easy with pretty
good results, and more importantly there is no need to learn any
programming techniques or how to create special control files
--
John Kelly
www.the-kellys.org
Truthfully, I am not an Instant Expert, But I know someone who is going to
have to try a LOT harder
\|||/
(oo)
----------ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------
All material gained from other sources is duly acknowledged. No Value is
obtained by publishing in any format other peoples work

 

[Al Stu]

I don't do any of all that and it works fine for me.

 

[John Kelly]

Hello,

Well, I always convert to wide screen from my 4:3 ratio stills. and those
who use APS film would also need to crop or they will get black bars top
and bottom. I had my film scanner returned the other day by a friend who
has scanned in all of his daughters shots from an APS camera. He is a
professional Photographer, makes you think

It is accepted that Movie Maker makes a pigs ear out of resampling down to
the required size especially if your pictures are from the higher megapixel
cameras, and its an absolute no no when working with very small pictures
that have a pixel height and width less than the target size. Its much
better to use a program {like Adobe if you have it) to resize the still and
for any other correction the still might need.

--
John Kelly
www.the-kellys.org
Truthfully, I am not an Instant Expert, But I know someone who is going to
have to try a LOT harder
\|||/
(oo)
----------ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------
All material gained from other sources is duly acknowledged. No Value is
obtained by publishing in any format other peoples work

 

[Rehan]

Hi Al

Are you sure about that? Isn't pixel aspect specific to the display
device, not the file format? Photos in my DV-AVI movies turn out fine
with proper H/V aspect ratio.

DV AVI uses non-square pixels because thats how the standard is specified.
This works perfectly for a captured video as that is also encoded with the
same standard. Thus working all the way in DV AVI makes sense as it keeps
the footage in the same pixel encoding from start to end.

However for a slideshow made using still images, this isn't the case. Movie
Maker treats the input still images to always be square pixels. So saving a
still image in DV AVI format would always change the pixel aspect ratio.
(note 720x480 is 3:2 for square pixels)

There was a mojor hot discussion on this topic earlier in March resulting in
much bitter arguments unfortunately.

However here is the gist of the discussion covered by Dean Rowe in one of
his blog entry:

http://blogs.msdn.com/deanro/archive/2005/04/19/409563.aspx

 

[Al Stu]

So I just made a short little flick the other day using both video and
photos. The video was shot as wide screen (16:9, 1.77778 ratio), and
imported from camera as NTSC DV-AVI (720 x 480). The photos where shot with
digital still camera (3:2, 2160 x 1440, 1.5 ratio).



Without modification to either, video or photos, they all come out of WMM
with the correct H/V proportions, the photos being letter boxed left and
right. If I wish for the photos to fill the screen I just crop them.



http://www.supermotors.org/vehicles/registry/showmedia.php?id=232548

 

[Rehan]

Excellent video but not a control experiment to prove the point one way or
the other. I would suggest try the following experiment:

Use the following two images to make a quick slideshow. Save the slideshow
as DV AVI first. Then save the same slideshow as WMV ("best quality for
playback..." would do).

http://www.rehanfx.org/A.png (720x480, 3:2)
http://www.rehanfx.org/B.png (720x480, 3:2)


Inspect the quality of the two videos saved and post your comments.

 

[Rehan]

Ahmm... copy paste problem:

http://www.rehanfx.org/A.png (720x480, 3:2)
http://www.rehanfx.org/B.png (720x480, 3:2)

should be:

http://www.rehanfx.org/A.png (720x480, 3:2)
http://www.rehanfx.org/B.png (640x480, 4:3)

 

[Al Stu]

If DV-AVI changes pixel aspect ratio then why are the H/V proportions
maintained correctly? I'm suspicious there may be something more in play
here.

 

[John Kelly]

Yes, and as a result you are the subject of a complaint.

WILL TRY HARDER NEXT TIME

and, the advice given is still correct and your "advice" is still part of
your WILL TRY HARDER NEXT TIME

--
John Kelly
www.the-kellys.org
Truthfully, I am not an Instant Expert, But I know someone who is going to
have to try a LOT harder
\|||/
(oo)
----------ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------
All material gained from other sources is duly acknowledged. No Value is
obtained by publishing in any format other peoples work

 

[John Kelly]

Hello,

If I wish for the photos to fill the screen I just crop them.

Yes that's what I said. . Thanks for confirming it though.
--
John Kelly
www.the-kellys.org
Truthfully, I am not an Instant Expert, But I know someone who is going to
have to try a LOT harder
\|||/
(oo)
----------ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------
All material gained from other sources is duly acknowledged. No Value is
obtained by publishing in any format other peoples work

 

[John Kelly]

Here we go again, REHAN (WILL TRY HARDER NEXT TIME) and his
experiments....he will start shouting about COM objects any time soon and
then some one will shut him up...and he may even visit the topic of formats
that can be put on a DVD, until someone shuts him up...and as he did last
time when spouting about pixel sizes, he will finally admit that he is quote
"Talking out of his ass" just do a search for those words...its easy to
spot.

REHAN (WILL TRY HARDER NEXT TIME) the Flame Starter

--
John Kelly
www.the-kellys.org
Truthfully, I am not an Instant Expert, But I know someone who is going to
have to try a LOT harder
\|||/
(oo)
----------ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------
All material gained from other sources is duly acknowledged. No Value is
obtained by publishing in any format other peoples work

 

[John Kelly]

Hello

All you need do Al is create a still image of 4:3 and another of 16:9 In
two separate projects create a DV-AVI video. Afterwards use windows media
player to determine the properties....you will find that they both conform
to the expected Width and Height my

Lets do one of REHAN (WILL TRY HARDER NEXT TIME) experiments
===================================================

Take any picture and reduce to exactly 720 x 540 (I'm using PAL remember)

Import that picture to Movie Maker

In the Collection read the properties for that picture, mine says 720 x 540

At this point REHAN (WILL TRY HARDER NEXT TIME) argued that Movie Maker is
now telling you a LIE LOL

Drag still to timeline and create a 4:3 short video

Play in media Player and read properties.....mine says...768 x 576 and that
is EXACTLY a 4:3 ratio picture

You can do exactly the same again but create a 768 x 576 picture, import
that etc....it never fails...but REHAN (WILL TRY HARDER NEXT TIME) insisted
that the properties displayed in Media Player were WRONG !!!! If you
require proof of that I can always do a scan for those two
messages...should not take long.

With regard to the 16:9 ratio, I think it was Jen Rowe who eventually
stepped in and put him right, his reply was along the lines of "Ok I was
talking out of my ass" That message can also be seen if you want it.

Just in case there are any doubts, My statement was and remains...create a
still image that has the correct ratio AND resample to the target size. You
will find that advice from me in may places in this newsgroup

--
John Kelly
www.the-kellys.org
Truthfully, I am not an Instant Expert, But I know someone who is going to
have to try a LOT harder
\|||/
(oo)
----------ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------
All material gained from other sources is duly acknowledged. No Value is
obtained by publishing in any format other peoples work

 

[Al Stu]

"DV AVI uses non-square pixels because thats how the standard is specified."

Do you have a source for the above mentioned standard specification please?

TIA

 

[John Kelly]

Not Correct. it resample's using the palette placed before it to make an
image that has the correct physical ratio and pixel aspect. You were
corrected on this very subject by Jen Rowe some time ago. Your response was
that you were talking out of your ass.

Exactly now, why do you keep referring to the HOTLY ARGUED messages of the
past? Was that the bait???? We are all aware that this is one of the famous
engineered flame wars started by the MVP's to make themselves look
good...you will have to try one hell of a lot harder, just the way you
boasted in the moviemaker forum that your intention was to do this...you
know, the BOAST that Eddy will not deal with. Thank You for bringing the
issue to the front again.

Will we have Mr Brown and Eddy join in I wonder? I wish they would

--
John Kelly
www.the-kellys.org
Truthfully, I am not an Instant Expert, But I know someone who is going to
have to try a LOT harder
\|||/
(oo)
----------ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------
All material gained from other sources is duly acknowledged. No Value is
obtained by publishing in any format other peoples work