Full or OEM?

[Ron O'Brien]

As someone who has built his own systems for many years Someone told me I
was wasting money paying for the full retail version of Vista (especially at
UK prices) and that I can't do a clean install with the up-grade, they
suggested I buy an OEM version.
I've always regarded OEM versions as software specific to a particular
manufacturer and don't want to boot up and find a 'Dell' splash screen, for
example.

Exactly what consititutes an OEM version and are there real differences?

Ron

 

[Scott]

Ron O'Brien spake thusly on 2/23/2007 5:06 AM:

As someone who has built his own systems for many years Someone told me I
was wasting money paying for the full retail version of Vista (especially at
UK prices) and that I can't do a clean install with the up-grade, they
suggested I buy an OEM version.

Good advice.

I've always regarded OEM versions as software specific to a particular
manufacturer and don't want to boot up and find a 'Dell' splash screen, for
example.

No. The only thing that's different is the license and the packaging.
The DVD is otherwise identical. The key is ...well the product key. It
will be OEM which won't allow it to be installed on any other computer
than the original (first) one it's installed on.

Exactly what consititutes an OEM version and are there real differences?

In the case of Windows, there is no difference. In answer to the rest
of your question , see this :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Original_equipment_manufacturer#Software

 

[Scott]

And one more thing I forgot to mention.

This is your "official tech support". ;-)

In other words, you get no tech support if you purchase an OEM version
as typically it's provided by the ....OEM or VAR (Dell, HP, the local
custom computer shop down the street...).

 

[Andy Snook]

It will be OEM which won't allow it to be installed on any other computer

than the original (first) one it's installed on.

Yes it will, but you would have to phone up Microsoft and explain you have
transferred your license which is perfectly legal. It happens with retail
versions exactly the same.

Why pay £200 or so more in the UK for Retail for "90 days" of help from
Microsoft, when half the problems you have they refuse to resolve and claim
is down to your hardware. Like my issue of the Performance Control Panel
disappearing, apprantly thats due to hardware... Yeah sure it is.

While your there, vote at:
http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/VistaOvercharge/

Its ridclous how Microsoft thinks British Citizens should pay double what
they charge there own... Or then again vote with your pocket.

 

[Mike Brannigan]

Yes it will, but you would have to phone up Microsoft and explain you have
transferred your license which is perfectly legal. It happens with retail
versions exactly the same.

Why pay £200 or so more in the UK for Retail for "90 days" of help from
Microsoft, when half the problems you have they refuse to resolve and
claim is down to your hardware. Like my issue of the Performance Control
Panel disappearing, apprantly thats due to hardware... Yeah sure it is.

While your there, vote at:
http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/VistaOvercharge/

Its ridclous how Microsoft thinks British Citizens should pay double what
they charge there own... Or then again vote with your pocket.

Actually you may not TRANSFER an OEM license it is irrevocably tied to the
first device it is installed to.
If you change components within that device you can telephone activate but
if you are trying to transfer an OEM copy to another machine even in the
event of the first machine being destroyed this is not allowed.
Read the OEM EULA again it covers this.

As regards the cost; the economics are far more complex then just a double
price. Look at the cost as a percentage of the salary of lets say an IT
person in the UK vs. the same job in the US and now the same job in India.
It is not just one price set and converted at exchange rates world wide.
There is very little point in going on about the price - if you don;t like
your local pricing shop elsewhere for your goods. This is just as true for
software as a DVD movie , a pair of jeans or a car.

 

[Paul Smith]

As someone who has built his own systems for many years Someone told me I
was wasting money paying for the full retail version of Vista (especially
at UK prices) and that I can't do a clean install with the up-grade, they
suggested I buy an OEM version.
I've always regarded OEM versions as software specific to a particular
manufacturer and don't want to boot up and find a 'Dell' splash screen,
for example.

Exactly what consititutes an OEM version and are there real differences?

Dell and others customize their OEM versions with their logos and stuff, but
if you just go and buy an OEM version from a computer supplier it will look
just like the retail version. You won't have a Dell logo on it. <g>

OEM versions can't be transferred onto a different machine than they're
originally installed on.

OEM versions can't do upgrades, only clean install (by default they're not
destructive and move the old files to windows.old).

OEM versions get no support directly from Microsoft.

I told my friends to get the OEM version. £120.23 vs. £318.99. Easy
choice.

--
Paul Smith,
Yeovil, UK.
Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User.
http://www.windowsresource.net/

*Remove nospam. to reply by e-mail*

 

[Keith]

You can do a "clean install" from an OEM or Retail Upgrade Vista version. I
have the OEM Business version ($149 US from Newegg.com) that I installed
clean using the instructions in the link below.

http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/winvista_upgrade_clean.asp

The above link doesn't specify that one needs Retail -vs- OEM upgrade
versions. You'll notice the pictures show a Retail upgrade version that he
used.

Keith

 

[Ron O'Brien]

As regards the cost; the economics are far more complex then just a double
price. Look at the cost as a percentage of the salary of lets say an IT
person in the UK vs. the same job in the US and now the same job in India.
It is not just one price set and converted at exchange rates world wide.
There is very little point in going on about the price - if you don;t like
your local pricing shop elsewhere for your goods. This is just as true
for software as a DVD movie , a pair of jeans or a car.

That is true...a colleague of mine is going to New York in a couple of weeks
and claims he could buy me a full retail version over there at a similar
price to the OEM offered in the UK

I do disaggree with you on your supposition that it is cheaper to produce
for retail a product in USA. Marketing alone is a lot more expensive in the
USA, so to advertsing (especially TV), salaries to IT staff in New York I do
know are a lot more than UK and cost of just opening and running a retail
premises in New York, considerably more expensive that London. Talking to
the guy to advised me to go the OEM route (he's a small-ish retail outfit)
he claims profit margins on Microsoft Vista are at very best 17%, so
Microsofts assertion that UK retails demand more profit margins are also
unfounded. As for volume sales, well of course USA is likely to sell more
copies, but still via hundreds of thousands of retails and when you are
distributing huge quantities and having to ship them to the UK, well, the
law of dimminished returns kicks in and the shipping cost becomes
negligable. Microssoft also claim there are 'fundamental differences'
between the USA and European version, but have never actually said what
these differences are. I doubt they exist. I saw a USA sold retail version
of XP Pro, it looked exactly yhe same to the UK version I have, not even a
difference in the box. The only way they could get away with such a claim to
if the language and dictionary was different but, as we all know the product
ships with all major languages installed. No, it's just rip off Britain!

 

[Saucy]

As someone who has built his own systems for many years Someone told me I
was wasting money paying for the full retail version of Vista (especially
at UK prices) and that I can't do a clean install with the up-grade, they
suggested I buy an OEM version.
I've always regarded OEM versions as software specific to a particular
manufacturer and don't want to boot up and find a 'Dell' splash screen,
for example.

Exactly what consititutes an OEM version and are there real differences?

Ron

What you were told is incorrect.

1. You can do a clean install of an upgrade version. Of course, it is up to
you to make sure your use of Vista's upgrade is legitimate i.e. that one has
previously purchased a 'full' license (which is clear for use on the
computer) or an 'oem' license (to pair with the computer).

2. OEM software *is not* specific to the manufacturer unless the
manufacturer has worked the ISO/Install files etc. to their liking.
Otherwise, a generic OEM disc is "all Microsoft" so to speak - what installs
is virtually the same as the full retail.

Generic OEM discs are used by many computer shops to build computers. It
usually is had at a lower price than full retail. It comes with a System
Builders License (pairs the copy to the computer) for the system builder and
an EULA for the buyer of the computer.

See Paul Thurrott's article and PDFs for licensing terms. Watch the long
URLs:

[How to Clean Install Windows Vista with Upgrade Media]
http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/winvista_upgrade_clean.asp

[Microsoft's System Builders License - link to PDF file]
http://oem.microsoft.com/downloads/Public/sblicense/English_SB_License.pdf

[Vista Home Basic / Home Premium / Ultimate EULA - link to PDF file]
http://download.microsoft.com/docum...lish_2cd69850-7680-4987-8b1e-59a3d405c074.pdf


Saucy

 

[ray]

As someone who has built his own systems for many years Someone told me I
was wasting money paying for the full retail version of Vista (especially at
UK prices) and that I can't do a clean install with the up-grade, they
suggested I buy an OEM version.
I've always regarded OEM versions as software specific to a particular
manufacturer and don't want to boot up and find a 'Dell' splash screen, for
example.

Exactly what consititutes an OEM version and are there real differences?

Ron

Frankly, I think you'd be ahead to wait for SP1, anyway.

 

[Mellowed]

Yes it will, but you would have to phone up Microsoft and explain you have
transferred your license which is perfectly legal. It happens with retail
versions exactly the same.

Why pay £200 or so more in the UK for Retail for "90 days" of help from
Microsoft, when half the problems you have they refuse to resolve and
claim is down to your hardware. Like my issue of the Performance Control
Panel disappearing, apprantly thats due to hardware... Yeah sure it is.

While your there, vote at:
http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/VistaOvercharge/

Its ridclous how Microsoft thinks British Citizens should pay double what
they charge there own... Or then again vote with your pocket.

I thought that I read that the EU required that MS make changes for product
sold in the EU. Also, what about the fines that MS had to pay to the EU?
Where was that money coming from? If it is more expensive to sell any
product in the EU, then the product sales must pay for the extra expenses.

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

For all practical purposes, fines such as that are another tax.
Like any other expenses, the fines are ultimately passed on to the consumer.

But that goes a long way from explaining the price differences between US
and the EU.
However it seems many products, not just Microsoft are similarly higher
priced than in the US.

Instead of looking at just Microsoft since they have a new product
highlighting the price inequity, determine exactly what affects the wider
market causing higher prices on many products.
Work to find that solution, if it exists and solve price problems beyond
Microsoft.

 

[Opinicus]

For all practical purposes, fines such as that are another tax.

In Arabic the words for "tax" and "fine" are the same. (Something like
"djetha" if I recall correctly).

I remember being tremendously amused when I first learned this: A tax is a
fine you pay for being subject to a government.

 

[Andy Snook]

I've transfered OEM licenses in the past, when an old PC dies, say one that
I own I'm not going to forget about the OS I forked out money on and reuse
it, ring up to activate explain my old PC died and I am installing its copy
of XP and they have given me the code, no problem.

So I dont know where you got this idea that they wont let you transfer
from....

 

[Paul Smith]

I've transfered OEM licenses in the past, when an old PC dies, say one
that I own I'm not going to forget about the OS I forked out money on and
reuse it, ring up to activate explain my old PC died and I am installing
its copy of XP and they have given me the code, no problem.

So I dont know where you got this idea that they wont let you transfer
from....

Read the EULA.

--
Paul Smith,
Yeovil, UK.
Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User.
http://www.windowsresource.net/

*Remove nospam. to reply by e-mail*

 

[D. Spencer Hines]

Microsoft changed all that -- in the wake of the Anti-Trust Decisions and
Subsequent Court Cases that have cost Microsoft billions.

Blame the Pre-Bush Supreme Court for your dilemma.

DSH

 

[Mike Brannigan]

Microsoft changed all that -- in the wake of the Anti-Trust Decisions and
Subsequent Court Cases that have cost Microsoft billions.

Blame the Pre-Bush Supreme Court for your dilemma.

DSH

No the changes were about the sale of generic OEM software to home builders.
The EULA still clearly states the software is NOT transferable.

Lets look at the EULA from an OEM Windows Vista Home Premium
EULAID:VISTA_RM.0_CONSUMER_OEM_en-US

First and most important point, the one where your OEM software is tied to
the device.

2. INSTALLATION AND USE RIGHTS. The software license is permanently
assigned to the device with which you acquired the software. That device is
the "licensed device."
a. Licensed Device. You may install one copy of the software on the
licensed device. You may use the software on up to two processors on that
device at one time. You may not use the software on any other device.


So there you have it - ties to the licensed device.

Now let's look at the transfer rights.

15. TRANSFER TO A THIRD PARTY. You may transfer the software directly to a
third party only with the licensed device. You may not keep any copies of
the software or any earlier version. Before any permitted transfer, the
other party must agree that this agreement applies to the transfer and use
of the software. The transfer must include the Certificate of Authenticity
label.

So you cannot transfer the software to another device or resell it in any
way other then on the original "licensed device".

This is really very simple stuff that you agree to abide by during install.

 

[Mike Brannigan]

I've transfered OEM licenses in the past, when an old PC dies, say one
that I own I'm not going to forget about the OS I forked out money on and
reuse it, ring up to activate explain my old PC died and I am installing
its copy of XP and they have given me the code, no problem.

So I dont know where you got this idea that they wont let you transfer
from....

See my response to D.Spencer Hine below where you can clearly see this is
the case from your License Agreement for OEM Windows Vista.
As another poster said - read your EULA

 

[Gary VanderMolen]

See my response to D.Spencer Hine below where you can clearly see this is
the case from your License Agreement for OEM Windows Vista.
As another poster said - read your EULA

Apparently Microsoft's telephone support for re-activations doesn't
follow the EULA. Also, what's in the EULA won't necessarily stand up
in court. Courts tend to go by what a reasonable person would expect
(aka consumer rights).

Gary VanderMolen

 

[Kerry Brown]

Apparently Microsoft's telephone support for re-activations doesn't
follow the EULA. Also, what's in the EULA won't necessarily stand up
in court. Courts tend to go by what a reasonable person would expect
(aka consumer rights).

Gary VanderMolen

Activating and the EULA don't have anything to do with one another other
than activation is one one of the stipulations in the EULA. Just because it
activates doesn't mean you have a valid license. If you break one of the
stipulations in the EULA you don't have a valid license.