"Force shutdown from a remote system"

[Guest]

What do they really mean by this? I was able to shut down a server with no
users having this user right, using terminal services. I took everyone out
of this user right, and I refreshed the policy then connected to the server
via terminal services, and proceeded to shut it down, no problem. What kind
of tool does this policy expect the remote user is going to be using to
accomplish the shutdown? 'Cuz it sure ain't terminal services.

Any ideas appreciated.

 

[Shenan Stanley]

What do they really mean by this? I was able to shut down a server
with no users having this user right, using terminal services. I
took everyone out of this user right, and I refreshed the policy
then connected to the server via terminal services, and proceeded
to shut it down, no problem. What kind of tool does this policy
expect the remote user is going to be using to accomplish the
shutdown? 'Cuz it sure ain't terminal services.
Any ideas appreciated.

Who are 'they" and where are you getting this from?
IE: methinks you left out a few details.

 

[Roger Abell [MVP]]

Generally speaking a terminal services login is considered
to be a local login as there is a winstation session.
Remote login is via such as a WMI shutdown command,
which is a small network transmission.

 

[Roger Abell [MVP]]

Who are 'they" and where are you getting this from?
IE: methinks you left out a few details.

I believe the "they" is MSFT when "this" user right
was given a descriptive name, which differs in XP
where it is "Force shutdown from a remote system"

Roger

 

[Shenan Stanley]

What do they really mean by this? I was able to shut down a
server with no users having this user right, using terminal
services. I took everyone out of this user right, and I
refreshed the policy then connected to the server via terminal
services, and proceeded to shut it down, no problem. What kind
of tool does this policy expect the remote user is going to be
using to accomplish the shutdown? 'Cuz it sure ain't terminal
services. Any ideas appreciated.

Who are 'they" and where are you getting this from?
IE: methinks you left out a few details.

I believe the "they" is MSFT when "this" user right
was given a descriptive name, which differs in XP
where it is "Force shutdown from a remote system"

Ah.. Thanks Roger.
I appreciate the clarification.

 

[James Saveker]

I think you are refering to a GP setting and this can override someone with
local admin privs on a box from executing a remote shut down with the
"shutdown" command.

e.g.

shutdown /s /m \\jimbo /e "I am being annoying and shutting down Jimbo's
workstation"

Kind regards,

Jimbo.

 

[Roger Abell [MVP]]

I think you are refering to a GP setting and this can override someone with
local admin privs on a box from executing a remote shut down with the
"shutdown" command.

e.g.

shutdown /s /m \\jimbo /e "I am being annoying and shutting down Jimbo's
workstation"

Ummm . . . no, this user right grants that capability,
not denies it, so it certainly cannot be used to prevent
an account from using their capabilities.

 

[Guest]

But, in terms of the _method_ of shutdown, the shutdown.exe command is the
only method this policy addresses?

 

[Roger Abell [MVP]]

No.

shutdown.exe is just a little exe MS made available at one time that has
stuck

I have spent a little time trying to see whether I can find a statement as
to just
exactly what APIs, what providers, what namespace classes' methodes are
covered by this settings.

Hoevers, all that I have found just says, as this from the W2k3 Security
Guide
<quote>
This policy setting determines whether users can shut down computers from
remote locations on the network. Any user who can shut down a computer could
cause a DoS condition. Therefore, this user right should be tightly
restricted.

</quote>

In other words, the statements I have seen just make unconditional statement
that this allows use of remote means for shutdown, from which it seems that
all available ways are wired to obey thius right.

I know that when I use Wmi it is a requirement that one specify the shutdown
right when initially instancing the objects one uses (and of course this
explicit
request is only honored if it is granted to the account in use) because
otherwise
this is not enabled on the object obtained even when allowed to the account
used.

 

[Guest]

So, what exactly is the point of this policy, it doesn't really seem to do
anything.

 

[Jimmy Brush]

This policy sets which user accounts can gain the "shutdown computer"
privilege, which is required to shutdown the computer. This is handled at
the authentication level.

Whenever a user logs into the system, whether from over the network or
locally at the computer, the system assigns that user login with a set of
privileges. Any program that user runs can only do what those privileges
allow for that user.

It should be impossible to shutdown the system unless you have this shutdown
privilege, regardless of which API or command is used.

When a user logs in from a network location, as is the case with say typing
\\computername into an explorer window, using the computer administrator or
other mmc console to remotely administrate another computer, using one of
the many command-line tools available to remotely administrate a remote
computer such as the NET and SHUTDOWN command, etc, the system that you are
connecting to realizes that this is a network login and either assigns or
unassigns the shutdown privilege based on that policy setting.

In short:

"Force shutdown from a remote system" controls who gets the system shutdown
privilege when logged in via networking services.

"Shut down the system" controls who gets the system shutdown privilege when
logged in interactively.

This last statement is the kicker - When you connect to a computer using
Remote Desktop, as was mentioned in another reply, you are given a desktop
as if you were physically at the computer; this is considered an
"interactive" login, and NOT a network login, so the second policy setting
is used in this case to determine whether to assign the shutdown privilege.

 

[Guest]

Thanks Jimmy,

That really does clarify it. Fortunately for us, the only way we shut down
or reboot DC's is from Remote Desktop, or that rare instance in which we are
physically at the box. It also illuminates why it was recommended to us to
have the DC policy not have anyone have this right.