Floppy Boot Disk

[Guest]

I searched the ms knolwedge base and found that to make a boot disk for win
xp I was to format a floppy disk ntfs( system would not allow) copy the files
ntldr, ntdetect, and boot.ini fro working machine. Disk would not boot.
Thought maybe the boot.ini file needed modification? Found info that required
using bootcfg.exe. This file, program, bat is not on my version of xp home?
No info on syntax if modificatiopn is required
Do I need a boot disk or is the installation disk always used?

 

[Will Denny]

Hi

Why do you need a floppy to boot your system with? The XP CD is bootable,
but you may have to alter the boot sequence in the BIOS.

 

[CZ]

I searched the ms knowledge base and found that to make a boot disk forxp I was to format a floppy disk ntfs( system would not allow) copy the
files
ntldr, ntdetect, and boot.ini fro working machine. Disk would not boot.

rebiggs:

It works.
I have done it via XP Pro with SP2 as follows:
1) Insert floppy
2) Open Explorer; click on Start (accept the defaults)
3) Copy ntldr, ntdetect, and boot.ini files from C:\ to the floppy
4) Reboot on the floppy


Note: the floppy will have a FAT file system

 

[CZ]

Why do you need a floppy to boot your system with? The XP CD isbut you may have to alter the boot sequence in the BIOS.

Will:

XP CD disc does not boot into the op system on the hard disk, whereas the
floppy does.
Actually, the XP CD disc does not boot into a usable XP op system period, it
is useful for performing certain repair/diagnostic functions only.

The bootable floppy provides a bootup system if the following on the hard
disk become unusable:
MBR boot code
boot.ini
ntldr
ntdetect.com
bootsec.dos

 

[Will Denny]

Hi

What kind of XP CD have you got? A bootable floppy will have a FAT file
system - not usable on a NTFS system.

 

[Alex Nichol]

I searched the ms knolwedge base and found that to make a boot disk for win
xp I was to format a floppy disk ntfs( system would not allow) copy the files
ntldr, ntdetect, and boot.ini fro working machine. Disk would not boot.
Thought maybe the boot.ini file needed modification? Found info that required
using bootcfg.exe. This file, program, bat is not on my version of xp home?
No info on syntax if modificatiopn is required
Do I need a boot disk or is the installation disk always used?

You use the installation disk. A simple boot floppy is *Never* NTFS and
unless you get expensive third party software is unable to see NTFS. A
'boot floppy'. is only good for initiating a boot of an XP on a hard
disk which for some reason the BIOS cannot boot. And then only on a
machine incapable of booting a CD so as to use that to repair. For
which occasion you can download a program that generates a set of six
floppies that does provide NTFS support from
http://support.microsoft.com/?scid=kb;en-us;310994

You can make a very basic boot floppy in My Computer - r-click the
drive, format, check the MSDOS startup box. But it is only useful if
you have need to boot DOS so as to run a specific real mode program, eg
a BIOS flash

 

[CZ]

What kind of XP CD have you got? A bootable floppy will have a FAT file
system - not usable on a NTFS system.

Will:

All NT based op systems can use two vols: the system vol will have the basic
boot files, and the boot vol will have the op system files.
Generally, either vol can use a FAT file system (NTFS is not required).

My hard disk:
C: is FAT16
Other vols/op systems are:
FAT32 for Win98 SE
NTFS for NTWS, Win2k Pro, XP Home, XP Pro, Win2k3 server, SBS2k3 with ISA.

A bootup bypass floppy (has a FAT file system) will load any of these op
systems on my hard disk.

Try it and post your results.
To create a bootup bypass floppy:
1) Insert floppy
2) Open Explorer, right mouse button click on the floppy line, select
Format, click on Start (accept the defaults)
3) Copy ntldr, ntdetect, boot.ini, and bootsect.dos files from C:\ to the
floppy
4) Reboot on the floppy

 

[CZ]

Alex:

True, except we are discussing loading the most basic boot files via a FAT
file system, not accessing the NTFS file system from the floppy directly.
disk which for some reason the BIOS cannot boot.

The boot floppy also works if the following on the hard disk are not usable:
MBR boot code
boot.ini
ntldr
ntdetect.com
bootsec.dos

Not true.
If the boot.ini file on the hard disk becomes unusable, you could boot from
the bootup bypass floppy into XP on the hard disk and then copy the boot.ini
file from the floppy.
This is much quicker than using the CD approach. Also, bootcfg cmd will not
find Win9x vols and is limited to finding only 3 or 4 installed op systems.

 

[Ken Blake]

In

I searched the ms knolwedge base and found that to make a boot
disk
for win xp I was to format a floppy disk ntfs

There's no such thing as an NTFS floppy disk. All standard
diskettes are FAT12.

( system would not
allow) copy the files ntldr, ntdetect, and boot.ini fro working
machine. Disk would not boot.

Exactly how did you make this floppy disk? When you say "Disk
would not boot," exactly what happened? If you got an error
message, please quote it verbatim.

Thought maybe the boot.ini file needed
modification? Found info that required using bootcfg.exe. This
file,
program, bat is not on my version of xp home? No info on syntax
if
modificatiopn is required
Do I need a boot disk or is the installation disk always used?

Most people don't need a boot diskette because the XP
installation CD is bootable. Moreover, if your hard drive is
NTFS, it will be invisible to the boot diskette (at least without
special software), and not generally useful.

 

[CZ]

if your hard drive is NTFS, it will be invisible to the boot diskette (atspecial software), and not generally useful.

Ken:

Will you make a bootup bypass floppy and post the results?

To create a bootup bypass floppy:
1) Insert floppy
2) Open Explorer, right mouse button click on the floppy line, select
Format, click on Start (accept the defaults)
3) Copy ntldr, ntdetect.com, boot.ini, and bootsect.dos files from C:\ to
the
floppy
4) Reboot on the floppy

 

[Ken Blake]

Sure, I'd be haapy toIn

special software), and not generally useful.

Ken:

Will you make a bootup bypass floppy and post the results?

Sure, I'd be happy to. What am I looking for? Are you suggesting
that it *will* see an NTFS drive?

To create a bootup bypass floppy:
1) Insert floppy
2) Open Explorer, right mouse button click on the floppy line,
select
Format, click on Start (accept the defaults)
3) Copy ntldr, ntdetect.com, boot.ini, and bootsect.dos files
from
C:\ to the
floppy

There was no bootsect.dos file. I did everything else.

4) Reboot on the floppy

I'll do that and post back, but not right now.

 

[CZ]

Will you make a bootup bypass floppy and post the results?

Sure, I'd be happy to. What am I looking for? Are you suggesting
that it *will* see an NTFS drive?

Ken:

No, but it will boot into the op system on the hard disk.
Effectively, the floppy bypasses the following on the hard disk:
MBR boot code
boot.ini
ntldr
ntdetect.com
bootsec.dos

If any of the above are damaged or "missing" on the hard disk, the floppy
can be very useful.
Also, the floppy booting into the op system on the hard disk, is not
something that the XP CD disc can do.

 

[Ken Blake]

In

Sure, I'd be happy to. What am I looking for? Are you
suggesting
that it *will* see an NTFS drive?

Ken:

No, but it will boot into the op system on the hard disk.
Effectively, the floppy bypasses the following on the hard
disk:
MBR boot code
boot.ini
ntldr
ntdetect.com
bootsec.dos

If any of the above are damaged or "missing" on the hard disk,
the
floppy can be very useful.
Also, the floppy booting into the op system on the hard disk,
is not
something that the XP CD disc can do.

OK, thanks. I haven't tried the floppy yet, but I will--probably
tomorrow morning.

As I said ,I don't have bootsec.dos on my drive and therefore
didn't copy it to the floppy. I'm not familiar with this file,
but googling for it, I found a source which said it's only needed
on a dual-boot system (which this isn't). I assume therefore that
the boot diskette should work as you describe without it.
Correct?

 

[CZ]

As I said ,I don't have bootsec.dos on my drive and therefore
didn't copy it to the floppy. I'm not familiar with this file,
but googling for it, I found a source which said it's only needed
on a dual-boot system (which this isn't). I assume therefore that
the boot diskette should work as you describe without it.
Correct?

Ken:

Yes.
Per MS for the NT product:
Bootsect.dos is created by Windows NT Setup. The boot sector found in sector
0 of drive C is copied into Bootsect.dos before Setup writes the Windows NT
boot sector. (Setup will not overwrite an existing Bootsect.dos.) If you
choose a previous operating system, Windows NT executes Bootsect.dos,
simulating the previous operating system's normal boot procedure.
Bootsect.dos is created by Windows NT Setup. The boot sector found in sector
0 of drive C is copied into Bootsect.dos before Setup writes the Windows NT
boot sector. (Setup will not overwrite an existing Bootsect.dos.) If you
choose a previous operating system, Windows NT executes Bootsect.dos,
simulating the previous operating system's normal boot procedure.

 

[Ken Blake]

In

Sure, I'd be happy to. What am I looking for? Are you
suggesting
that it *will* see an NTFS drive?

Ken:

No, but it will boot into the op system on the hard disk.

I tried it this morning. It did *not* do this, but booted
normally to the diskette.

 

[CZ]

Sure, I'd be happy to. What am I looking for? Are you suggesting that it
*will* see an NTFS drive?

No, but it will boot into the op system on the hard disk.

I tried it this morning. It did *not* do this, but booted normally to the
diskette.

Ken:

Strange.
1) As a new test, I just did it on a Dell portable that only had one op
system on it:
Booting from the floppy, boots into XP Pro SP2 on the hard disk.
Then I renamed boot.ini, ntldr, and ntdetect.com on the hard disk, and used
the floppy to boot into XP on the hard disk.
Then I removed all files on the floppy, booted from the floppy, and got an
error message.

2) Not sure why it does not work for you. This has been a normal concept
since NT 3.51, and can be a life saver in certain situations.

3) You might try again, as I have never had it fail to work since NT v3.51.

Thanks for trying it.

My previous post:
Will you make a bootup bypass floppy and post the results?

To create a bootup bypass floppy:
1) Insert floppy
2) Open Explorer, right mouse button click on the floppy line, select
Format, click on Start (accept the defaults)
3) Copy ntldr, ntdetect.com, boot.ini, and bootsect.dos files from C:\ to
the floppy
4) Reboot on the floppy

 

[Ken Blake]

In

Ken:

Strange.
1) As a new test, I just did it on a Dell portable that only
had one
op system on it:
Booting from the floppy, boots into XP Pro SP2 on the hard
disk.
Then I renamed boot.ini, ntldr, and ntdetect.com on the hard
disk,
and used the floppy to boot into XP on the hard disk.
Then I removed all files on the floppy, booted from the floppy,
and
got an error message.

2) Not sure why it does not work for you. This has been a
normal
concept since NT 3.51, and can be a life saver in certain
situations.

3) You might try again, as I have never had it fail to work
since NT
v3.51.
Thanks for trying it.

You're welcome, and yes, I'll try it again tomorrow.

 

[Ken Blake]

In

In CZ <[email protected]> typed:


You're welcome, and yes, I'll try it again tomorrow.

I tried it again. It still didn't work. I'll try looking into
this more deeply, but I have no time now and may not get to it
for a week or two.