FAT32 and NTFS question, considering upgrading from win98se

N

niteowl

Hi all,

I have a 4 station LAN, all machine have win98se, all shared drives,
and remote access to each one using Timbuktu software.

My question is concerning upgrading one of the machines to win2kPro or
win2kserver. (I don't really know the difference)

Since the win2k is NTFS will I have any problems still "seeing" the
files on the FAT32 systems, and visa versa? or will I have to
upgrade all stations to win2k at once?

I'm a little apprehensive about this, as I have 7 years of programs
saved that I fear won't be compatible any longer with the new O/S.

I have limited experience with win2k, a friend runs it and I do
troubleshooting for them occasionally, but all her machines are NTFS,
and I'm wondering what challenges I"ll have leaving at least one of
mine as win98se for gaming and still shared with the other units.

This is my first baby step towards XP... I know I'll probably do that
eventually, but this seems a major first step to me. My machines are
all to old to run XP and I don't have the money to buy new hardware in
order to accommodate it at this time. So I thought win2k would at
least get me familiar with the NT stuff.

I will most likely do a clean install rather than an upgrade, I have
always done so, with any O/S, it seems it would be more stable doing
it that way.

thanks for any information,

niteowl
 
N

niteowl

Hi all,

I have a 4 station LAN, all machine have win98se, all shared drives,
and remote access to each one using Timbuktu software.

My question is concerning upgrading one of the machines to win2kPro or
win2kserver. (I don't really know the difference)

Since the win2k is NTFS will I have any problems still "seeing" the
files on the FAT32 systems, and visa versa? or will I have to
upgrade all stations to win2k at once?

I'm a little apprehensive about this, as I have 7 years of programs
saved that I fear won't be compatible any longer with the new O/S.

I have limited experience with win2k, a friend runs it and I do
troubleshooting for them occasionally, but all her machines are NTFS,
and I'm wondering what challenges I"ll have leaving at least one of
mine as win98se for gaming and still shared with the other units.

This is my first baby step towards XP... I know I'll probably do that
eventually, but this seems a major first step to me. My machines are
all to old to run XP and I don't have the money to buy new hardware in
order to accommodate it at this time. So I thought win2k would at
least get me familiar with the NT stuff.

I will most likely do a clean install rather than an upgrade, I have
always done so, with any O/S, it seems it would be more stable doing
it that way.
Click to expand...

oh, I forgot to ask, each machine has 2 hard drives, will I be able
to put win2k on my C: drive, and leave the other partitions (D: thru
K:) alone or do I have to convert everything to NTFS?
 
P

Pegasus \(MVP\)

niteowl said:
Hi all,

I have a 4 station LAN, all machine have win98se, all shared drives,
and remote access to each one using Timbuktu software.

My question is concerning upgrading one of the machines to win2kPro or
win2kserver. (I don't really know the difference)

Since the win2k is NTFS will I have any problems still "seeing" the
files on the FAT32 systems, and visa versa? or will I have to
upgrade all stations to win2k at once?

I'm a little apprehensive about this, as I have 7 years of programs
saved that I fear won't be compatible any longer with the new O/S.

I have limited experience with win2k, a friend runs it and I do
troubleshooting for them occasionally, but all her machines are NTFS,
and I'm wondering what challenges I"ll have leaving at least one of
mine as win98se for gaming and still shared with the other units.

This is my first baby step towards XP... I know I'll probably do that
eventually, but this seems a major first step to me. My machines are
all to old to run XP and I don't have the money to buy new hardware in
order to accommodate it at this time. So I thought win2k would at
least get me familiar with the NT stuff.

I will most likely do a clean install rather than an upgrade, I have
always done so, with any O/S, it seems it would be more stable doing
it that way.

thanks for any information,

niteowl
Click to expand...

The file system used by networked drives is irrelevant. A Win9x
can access any type of file system if it is made available by a
networking protocol.
 
D

Dave Patrick

When sharing drives/ files over a network connection, the pc's don't read
each other's file system format. They simply present a list of files for the
other to see and use, hence the pc or operating system's file system format
makes no difference.

--
Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect

:
| Hi all,
|
| I have a 4 station LAN, all machine have win98se, all shared drives,
| and remote access to each one using Timbuktu software.
|
| My question is concerning upgrading one of the machines to win2kPro or
| win2kserver. (I don't really know the difference)
|
| Since the win2k is NTFS will I have any problems still "seeing" the
| files on the FAT32 systems, and visa versa? or will I have to
| upgrade all stations to win2k at once?
|
| I'm a little apprehensive about this, as I have 7 years of programs
| saved that I fear won't be compatible any longer with the new O/S.
|
| I have limited experience with win2k, a friend runs it and I do
| troubleshooting for them occasionally, but all her machines are NTFS,
| and I'm wondering what challenges I"ll have leaving at least one of
| mine as win98se for gaming and still shared with the other units.
|
| This is my first baby step towards XP... I know I'll probably do that
| eventually, but this seems a major first step to me. My machines are
| all to old to run XP and I don't have the money to buy new hardware in
| order to accommodate it at this time. So I thought win2k would at
| least get me familiar with the NT stuff.
|
| I will most likely do a clean install rather than an upgrade, I have
| always done so, with any O/S, it seems it would be more stable doing
| it that way.
|
| thanks for any information,
|
| niteowl
|
|
 
B

Bruce Chambers

The file systems on the various computers communicating over a
network are completely irrelevant, as none of the individual
computers' operating systems ever directly access the other computers'
hard drives. Instead, a computer sends a "request," if you will, for
the desired data, and the operating system of the host ("receiving")
computer accesses its own hard drive (whose file system it obviously
can read) and then sends that data back to the requesting computer as
neutral packets of information that are completely independent of the
file systems on the respective computers. After all, don't you use a
Windows-based PC (whether it's FAT32 or NTFS) to access data stored on
the Internet's mostly Unix servers, which use a completely different
file system?


--

Bruce Chambers

Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on
having both at once. - RAH
 
N

niteowl

is that the same for the second drive on the same machine??

that's not a "networked" drive, is it?

niteowl

]
 
N

niteowl

The file system used by networked drives is irrelevant. A Win9x
can access any type of file system if it is made available by a
networking protocol.
Click to expand...

what about HD's on the same machine?

niteowl
 
N

niteowl

Thanks for the info... is what that article describes what happens
automatically when a dual boot is setup?

during setup of win2k is there an offer to setup a dual boot system,
or to setup a FAT32 partition? If yes, does it matter if I am
installing clean or upgrading an existing O/S whether I get that
option or not?

Just so I am clear on how to do this, I have 2 - 60G HD's in each
machine (that's the limit for my systems), 1st is partitioned into 3
drives, C:, D:, and E:, 2nd is partitioned into F:, G:, H:, and
I:.... if I format C: and install win2kpro, will the installation try
to convert the other drives (D thru I) to NTFS or will it only change
the C: drive? And then I would have to run the sysinternals "NTFS for
Windows98" to access the files and programs on the other drives?

Since I install most programs to the D: drive, I'm guessing those
would have to be all installed again anyway...

mmmm, C: and D: are my two 'active' drives (C: is the O/S, D: is the
programs partition) .. all the rest are for storing data, so C: and D:
would be the partitions I'd want to convert to NTFS correct? or would
I be better off just having all of them converted during setup? I
think I'm just confusing myself here....

What I'm afraid of is losing all those archived files on the rest of
the drives when win2k is installed. I don't have the room to move
them off and then move them back after the file system is changed..

thanks for helping me understand this.

niteowl
 
N

niteowl

The file systems on the various computers communicating over a
network are completely irrelevant, as none of the individual
computers' operating systems ever directly access the other computers'
hard drives. Instead, a computer sends a "request," if you will, for
the desired data, and the operating system of the host ("receiving")
computer accesses its own hard drive (whose file system it obviously
can read) and then sends that data back to the requesting computer as
neutral packets of information that are completely independent of the
file systems on the respective computers. After all, don't you use a
Windows-based PC (whether it's FAT32 or NTFS) to access data stored on
the Internet's mostly Unix servers, which use a completely different
file system?
Click to expand...

well, that's true, ;-)

thanks,
niteowl
 
D

Dave Patrick

:
| Thanks for the info... is what that article describes what happens
| automatically when a dual boot is setup?
|
| during setup of win2k is there an offer to setup a dual boot system,
* No offer it just happens when setup detects another Windows OS already
installed.


| or to setup a FAT32 partition?
* Yes you'll be given the choice here.


If yes, does it matter if I am
| installing clean or upgrading an existing O/S whether I get that
| option or not?
* Makes no difference. If you upgrade and choose NTFS then convert.exe is
used. The downside to this is you'll end up with 512 byte clusters which is
pretty inefficient, slow, and more prone to fragmentation. The overhead of
traversing a greater number of clusters to retrieve and commit data will
result in a degradation in file system (or disk I/O) performance. Best to
choose NTFS at the time of install.



| Just so I am clear on how to do this, I have 2 - 60G HD's in each
| machine (that's the limit for my systems), 1st is partitioned into 3
| drives, C:, D:, and E:, 2nd is partitioned into F:, G:, H:, and
| I:.... if I format C: and install win2kpro, will the installation try
| to convert the other drives (D thru I) to NTFS
* No


or will it only change
| the C: drive? And then I would have to run the sysinternals "NTFS for
| Windows98" to access the files and programs on the other drives?
* You haven't mentioned Win98 up to this point. When is it going to be
installed and to where? The system partition (usually C:\) must be a common
file system for the native boot loader to function. So in your case it must
be fat file system. Much easier to install Win98 first. While we're on the
subject why are you planning to reinstall Win98?


| Since I install most programs to the D: drive, I'm guessing those
| would have to be all installed again anyway...
* You'll always want to install programs separately for each OS


| mmmm, C: and D: are my two 'active' drives (C: is the O/S, D: is the
| programs partition) .. all the rest are for storing data, so C: and D:
| would be the partitions I'd want to convert to NTFS correct? or would
| I be better off just having all of them converted during setup? I
| think I'm just confusing myself here....
|
| What I'm afraid of is losing all those archived files on the rest of
| the drives when win2k is installed.
* Burn them to CD-Rom. If you can't afford to lose them then you must have a
backup plan in place.

I don't have the room to move
| them off and then move them back after the file system is changed..
|
| thanks for helping me understand this.
|
| niteowl

--
Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 
N

niteowl

:
| Thanks for the info... is what that article describes what happens
| automatically when a dual boot is setup?
|
| during setup of win2k is there an offer to setup a dual boot system,
* No offer it just happens when setup detects another Windows OS already
installed.


| or to setup a FAT32 partition?
* Yes you'll be given the choice here.


If yes, does it matter if I am
| installing clean or upgrading an existing O/S whether I get that
| option or not?
* Makes no difference. If you upgrade and choose NTFS then convert.exe is
used. The downside to this is you'll end up with 512 byte clusters which is
pretty inefficient, slow, and more prone to fragmentation. The overhead of
traversing a greater number of clusters to retrieve and commit data will
result in a degradation in file system (or disk I/O) performance. Best to
choose NTFS at the time of install.



| Just so I am clear on how to do this, I have 2 - 60G HD's in each
| machine (that's the limit for my systems), 1st is partitioned into 3
| drives, C:, D:, and E:, 2nd is partitioned into F:, G:, H:, and
| I:.... if I format C: and install win2kpro, will the installation try
| to convert the other drives (D thru I) to NTFS
* No


or will it only change
| the C: drive? And then I would have to run the sysinternals "NTFS for
| Windows98" to access the files and programs on the other drives?
* You haven't mentioned Win98 up to this point. When is it going to be
installed and to where? The system partition (usually C:\) must be a common
file system for the native boot loader to function. So in your case it must
be fat file system. Much easier to install Win98 first. While we're on the
subject why are you planning to reinstall Win98?
Click to expand...

Actually I wasn't going to, I guess I don't really understand - if I
install win2k on C: and leave the other drives as FAT32 will it
funciton okay?
 
D

Dave Patrick

Yes no problem....... confusing about all the win9x questions but no
problem.

--
Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect

:
<snip>
| Actually I wasn't going to, I guess I don't really understand - if I
| install win2k on C: and leave the other drives as FAT32 will it
| funciton okay?
<snip>
 
N

niteowl

Yes no problem....... confusing about all the win9x questions but no
problem.
Click to expand...

well, I guess I am equating FAT32 with Win9x... like it has to be used
together, but apparently it's a separate thing... win2k will convert
if I let it, or I can leave it as FAT32, correct? or does the win2k
partition HAVE to be NTFS, but the rest can be either one...

If I understand now, the only limitation will be that I won't be able
to "see" the NTFS drive with the other win9x machines unless I install
that sysinternal thing on the win9x machines, right?


If the above is correct thenI think it's getting clearer.....

thanks,
niteowl
 
D

Dave Patrick

:
| well, I guess I am equating FAT32 with Win9x... like it has to be used
| together, but apparently it's a separate thing...
* Yes separate thing.

win2k will convert
| if I let it, or I can leave it as FAT32, correct?
* Yes correct.

or does the win2k
| partition HAVE to be NTFS, but the rest can be either one...
* No but NTFS is the native file system of Windows 2000 and is always
recomended.


| If I understand now, the only limitation will be that I won't be able
| to "see" the NTFS drive with the other win9x machines unless I install
| that sysinternal thing on the win9x machines, right?
* Back to my original reply; when sharing drives/ files over a network
connection, the pc's don't read each other's file system format. They simply
present a list of files for the other to see and use, hence the pc or
operating system's file system format makes no difference. So no you won't
need anything no matter the file system.

If you're planning on upgrading from win9x to Windows 2000 .... then don't.
It simply isn't worth the trouble and migrant corruption you'll almost
certainly experience.

--
Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 
N

niteowl

hmmm, okay, I get it now.. (I think) thanks for explaing this to
me.....

Now that I finally worked up the courage to upgrade, you've talked me
out of it.. LOL

my reason for wanting to upgrade was challenges I'm having with
resource usage.. this win9x is constantly freezing up or giving me low
resource errors, probably because of all the stuff I run on it.. and I
was told win2k handled things better...

oh well, I just removed some of the programs that ran on startup and
it seems to have helped a bit... guess it's time for a new computer...

have to start saving my money. ;-)

thanks again for all the time you spent spoon feeding me.

regards,
niteowl
 
D

Dave Patrick

I think we're on the same page here but I hope I didn't give this impression
of a clean install. A clean install would be rock solid and is what I always
recommend.

To do a clean install, either boot the Windows 2000 CD-Rom or setup disks.
The set of four install disks can be created from your Win2k CD-rom; change
to the \bootdisk directory on the cd-rom and execute makeboot.exe (from dos)
or makebt32.exe (from 32 bit) and follow the prompts.

When you get to the point, delete the existing NTFS and or other partitions
found. After you delete the partition(s) abort the install, then again
restart the pc booting the CD-Rom or setup disks to avoid unexpected drive
letter assignments with your new install. ( in your case you'll probably
just want to format the partition not delete)

During Windows 2000 setup, at some point, will want to confirm the previous
operating system for the upgrade; at that point you'll simply insert the
qualified product install CD for it to verify. Then the install will
proceed.

Check the pc, mb or hardware manufacturer's web site for the latest bios and
or Windows 2000 drivers for your devices.

--
Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect

:
| hmmm, okay, I get it now.. (I think) thanks for explaing this to
| me.....
|
| Now that I finally worked up the courage to upgrade, you've talked me
| out of it.. LOL
|
| my reason for wanting to upgrade was challenges I'm having with
| resource usage.. this win9x is constantly freezing up or giving me low
| resource errors, probably because of all the stuff I run on it.. and I
| was told win2k handled things better...
|
| oh well, I just removed some of the programs that ran on startup and
| it seems to have helped a bit... guess it's time for a new computer...
|
| have to start saving my money. ;-)
|
| thanks again for all the time you spent spoon feeding me.
|
| regards,
| niteowl
 

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