DVD-making "capture" questions...

[George]

I'm just ramping up (pls excuse newbie questions) and want to basically get
all my video (source code so to speak) onto a PC (and save it to media like
a hard drive to keep in safe deposit box while I'm at it).

Then, I'd like to put all this video onto a series of DVD discs, organizing
it by subjects or times (like "1996 Olympics", "1999 Family Movies", "2000
in Florida", etc.) so I can play them in a HOME DVD player (and also
duplicate/send/share with family).

Still need to keep raw digital data (right?), because things change,
"everything" might someday be ultra HDTV and wide screen in the future... so
with raw data I could go back and re-cut the DVDs with newer tools and
playback formats, right?

Ok, so wondered if someone might offer suggestions on the "capture" process
to get going. Here's the hardware/software setup, then after that, the
capture question(s), thanks

HARDWARE/SOFTWARE SETUP. Most of the components are in place... Nothing
"pro" grade or even brand new, but like most people, I accumulated stuff
over the years.... Sony digital8 camcorder (3 yrs old), Sony DVD home player
(~5 yrs old), Win XP PC with speakers and basic CD/DVD (+/-RW?) burner,
FireWire card, spiffy ATI Radeon video card (even has RCA component
video/audio [red/white/yellow inputs] and S-video, simple Sonic MyDvd
freebie from Dell, MS Movie Maker (really like), and Roxio Easy Media
Creator 8 to arrive this week hopefully. Anything else I need?

CAPTURE QUESTIONS. Is there a "uniform" file format I need to (or should do
to) get everything into the PC as the raw "source" files. I'd like to
capture 100% of the digital data (not compress, or do anything that throws
out data or drops resolutions, etc.). What I'm seeing in various capture
software are a multitude of choices, like...

1) Medium. ATI VCR (assume file= .vcr) 480.x480 NTSC, 4mb/sec
2) VGA Res. file= .avi 640x480 29.9 fps
3) Qtr VGA file= .avi 320x240 29.9 fps
4) AVI Recording, file =.avi, 80x30 ~29.9fps
5) VGA res. mpeg2 640x480 NTSC. 6mb/sec
6) Many others...

Is there "one" file format I can (should) choose for capturing "everything",
or do I choose different formats to "capture" for each of these sources?...

a) VCR tapes. Got a few dozen, basic home movies... Capture
format?_________

b) 8MM DIGITAL VIDEOTAPE. The Sony camcorder records and plays these
digital tapes, got maybe 8. Plus it 'plays' the old 8mm analog ones made
with a prior camcorder. It should output both to Firewire, right? Capture
format?_________

c) MPEGS. These aren't the driving factor, but got maybe 50 fun clips,
about 15-seconds each (that's all my camcorder does), from the Sony digital
camcorder. Why not zip them all onto a DVD for playback, right? Capture
format?________

d) TV. This PC has a TV-card. Suppose I knew a relative was going to be on
the news a few seconds one night. Is there a "format" to record that clip
for max resolution? Capture format?_________

e) DIGITAL STILL CAMERA. Got a deal on one of these. It records 640x480
10fps movies, not exactly Hollywood grade, but these ___.avi files might be
useful if we forgot the camcorder that day. Do we keep "as is", or upload
them in some other format? Capture format?_________

f) DVDs. Suppose Uncle Elmer gives me a DVD movie and I want to upload it
onto video collection on my PC. Capture format?_________

g) ANYTHING ELSE? Are there any other prevailing formats out there that we
need to convert for any reason?

h) ONE MORE...SOFTWARE. For capture, does it really matter if I use
WinMovieMaker, Roxio, SonicMyDvd, etc. and change to something else later?
I'm assuming that what WOULD matter would be if I EDIT a movie in one of
these...them I'm stuck with that brand forever, right? That is, to change
brands would mean I'd have to start over and re-edit with the new software,
right?

Anyway, thanks for patience, just getting going here, will try to ask
smarter questions in future...

George

 

[Wojo]

Hi George,
Answers "inline" below ->

I'm just ramping up (pls excuse newbie questions) and want to basically
get all my video (source code so to speak) onto a PC (and save it to media
like a hard drive to keep in safe deposit box while I'm at it).

Then, I'd like to put all this video onto a series of DVD discs,
organizing it by subjects or times (like "1996 Olympics", "1999 Family
Movies", "2000 in Florida", etc.) so I can play them in a HOME DVD player
(and also duplicate/send/share with family).

Still need to keep raw digital data (right?), because things change,
"everything" might someday be ultra HDTV and wide screen in the future...
so with raw data I could go back and re-cut the DVDs with newer tools and
playback formats, right?

Absolutely. My camera records to DV tapes. I capture them to my harddrive
and save the important captured videos "As Is" on DVDRW disks as well as
saving the DV Tapes. I designate "impotant" to those videos that can't be
recreated such as events or family stuff.

Ok, so wondered if someone might offer suggestions on the "capture"
process to get going. Here's the hardware/software setup, then after
that, the capture question(s), thanks

HARDWARE/SOFTWARE SETUP. Most of the components are in place... Nothing
"pro" grade or even brand new, but like most people, I accumulated stuff
over the years.... Sony digital8 camcorder (3 yrs old), Sony DVD home
player (~5 yrs old), Win XP PC with speakers and basic CD/DVD (+/-RW?)
burner, FireWire card, spiffy ATI Radeon video card (even has RCA
component video/audio [red/white/yellow inputs] and S-video, simple Sonic
MyDvd freebie from Dell, MS Movie Maker (really like), and Roxio Easy
Media Creator 8 to arrive this week hopefully. Anything else I need?

CAPTURE QUESTIONS. Is there a "uniform" file format I need to (or should
do to) get everything into the PC as the raw "source" files. I'd like to
capture 100% of the digital data (not compress, or do anything that throws
out data or drops resolutions, etc.). What I'm seeing in various capture
software are a multitude of choices, like...

1) Medium. ATI VCR (assume file= .vcr) 480.x480 NTSC, 4mb/sec
2) VGA Res. file= .avi 640x480 29.9 fps
3) Qtr VGA file= .avi 320x240 29.9 fps
4) AVI Recording, file =.avi, 80x30 ~29.9fps
5) VGA res. mpeg2 640x480 NTSC. 6mb/sec
6) Many others...

Is there "one" file format I can (should) choose for capturing
"everything", or do I choose different formats to "capture" for each of
these sources?...

a) VCR tapes. Got a few dozen, basic home movies... Capture format?

Since this is a Movie Maker NG I will give you the WMM answer. You have no
choice here but to save as a WMV for these files because you can only hook
the VCR to the computer via USB.

b) 8MM DIGITAL VIDEOTAPE. The Sony camcorder records and plays these
digital tapes, got maybe 8. Plus it 'plays' the old 8mm analog ones made
with a prior camcorder. It should output both to Firewire, right?
Capture format?_________

Yes if you have a firewire port then you certainly want to use it and
capture with WMM as a DV-AVI file.

c) MPEGS. These aren't the driving factor, but got maybe 50 fun clips,
about 15-seconds each (that's all my camcorder does), from the Sony
digital camcorder. Why not zip them all onto a DVD for playback, right?
Capture format?________

Not capturing these, they are already clips on the computer apparently. If
they are MPG files you "may" get lucky and get them to work with WMM. If
they are MPEG2 then they will have to be converted. Personally I make it a
point to always convert MPG files to AVI regardless of the type so I don't
have to worry about having issues down the road.

d) TV. This PC has a TV-card. Suppose I knew a relative was going to be
on the news a few seconds one night. Is there a "format" to record that
clip for max resolution? Capture format?_________

You would want to use the capture software that came with the cord for this
one. If you want to be able to edit it with WMM then capture as an AVI or,
if by chance the option is available, a WMV. Ususlly you don't have a choice
here with TV capture cards, they usually save as MPG automatically so you
would need to convert.

e) DIGITAL STILL CAMERA. Got a deal on one of these. It records 640x480
10fps movies, not exactly Hollywood grade, but these ___.avi files might
be useful if we forgot the camcorder that day. Do we keep "as is", or
upload them in some other format? Capture format?_________

DV-AVI is still the best way to go but if they are simply going to be stored
for future use and as they aren't really high quality to begin with then
High Qualty NTSC will do the trick and save you a lot of harddrive spce.

f) DVDs. Suppose Uncle Elmer gives me a DVD movie and I want to upload it
onto video collection on my PC. Capture format?_________

They need to bw "ripped" from the DVD which will again give you an MPG file
which you should convert to AVI.

g) ANYTHING ELSE? Are there any other prevailing formats out there that
we need to convert for any reason?

As a general rule you want to use these formats with Movie Maker:
Video: WMV or AVI
Audio: WMA or WAV
Images: BMP or GIF (I use JPG quite often but some have reported issues with
JPG)

h) ONE MORE...SOFTWARE. For capture, does it really matter if I use
WinMovieMaker, Roxio, SonicMyDvd, etc. and change to something else later?
I'm assuming that what WOULD matter would be if I EDIT a movie in one of
these...them I'm stuck with that brand forever, right? That is, to change
brands would mean I'd have to start over and re-edit with the new
software, right?

Well if you edit and save the project with one piece of software you would
NOT be able to open it and do more editing with another if that's what you
mean.

Anyway, thanks for patience, just getting going here, will try to ask
smarter questions in future...

George

Hope that gets you started, we look forward to the "smart" questions.

 

[Guest]

Well, if this isn't a classic example of a "paper" that's way beyond the
scope of this WMM discussion group..........

Having said that, here are some points to consider..........

Since your ultimate goal is to get "everything" onto DVD's that will play in
"set top" DVD players hooked up to a TV, you don't want to use WMM for any of
this. To make DVD's that will play in "set top" players, you need DVD
authoring/editing software. (no idea whether MyDVD or Roxio8 are capable of
making more than just "data" DVD's?). The authoring/editing software converts
the source files (eg: .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc.) into files that have
instructions that set top DVD players understand (eg: VOB IFO). You won't
find any .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc. files on any DVD that will play in a set top
player, the software converts them to .VOB .IFO etc. then burns those files
to the DVD. For Uncle Elmers DVD's, to extract/convert the .VOB IFO's into
MPEG etc for editing, you'll need further software that can do this (rip). If
you just want to copy the DVD, you may already have that software. If you
just want to store your "clips" on a DVD but don't want to play them in a
"set top" player (just on your PC), then you only have to make a "data" DVD.
This simply copies the .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc. files to a DVD. Nothing is
rendered or converted. When making DVD's for set top players, check the
manual of the player to see what type of media it will play. Not all players
will play all types. If the player will only play +R and +RW, then you will
waste time and money making -R or -RW DVD's.

To "capture" from camera's, utilize firewire, the file will automatically be
saved in uncompressed .AVI format.

To "capture" (record) VHS tapes, use the ATI card and the RCA connections,
(Y-Video R&W-audio). If space isn't an issue, capture using NTSC DV (.AVI).
If you want to capture at NTSC DVD spec, choose MPEG2, 29.97fps, 720 X 480,
8,000 kbps, variable bit rate (VBR), audio at 48 Khz. When you render (make
your movie), for NTSC progressive scan choose "field order" "lower field
first".

Getting external video into a PC then onto a DVD that will play in a set top
player is extremely time consuming. If you have a ton of video, you will need
a ton of time and patience.

Having said all that, consider this.........................

In 2006, both Panasonic and Sony will/have released DVD players/recorders
with HDD's that will upconvert any DVD to 720P or 1080I. Players only that
will upconvert have been out for a while. They have also released VCR/DVD
combo's that supposedly will "enhance" the VHS picture when it records to
DVD.

I doubt any "affordable" video authoring/editing software (now or down the
road) will be capable of "upconverting" your original files to a quality that
matches what these players will (now or in the future). Since non of your
files are Hi-Def (HD), I would suggest making the best quality DVD you can
from what you've got, then investigate buying a quality DVD player that will
enhance the video (upconvert) much better than any consumer priced software
will be able to.

NOTEKY

Hi George,
Answers "inline" below ->

I'm just ramping up (pls excuse newbie questions) and want to basically
get all my video (source code so to speak) onto a PC (and save it to media
like a hard drive to keep in safe deposit box while I'm at it).

Then, I'd like to put all this video onto a series of DVD discs,
organizing it by subjects or times (like "1996 Olympics", "1999 Family
Movies", "2000 in Florida", etc.) so I can play them in a HOME DVD player
(and also duplicate/send/share with family).

Still need to keep raw digital data (right?), because things change,
"everything" might someday be ultra HDTV and wide screen in the future...
so with raw data I could go back and re-cut the DVDs with newer tools and
playback formats, right?

Absolutely. My camera records to DV tapes. I capture them to my harddrive
and save the important captured videos "As Is" on DVDRW disks as well as
saving the DV Tapes. I designate "impotant" to those videos that can't be
recreated such as events or family stuff.

Ok, so wondered if someone might offer suggestions on the "capture"
process to get going. Here's the hardware/software setup, then after
that, the capture question(s), thanks

HARDWARE/SOFTWARE SETUP. Most of the components are in place... Nothing
"pro" grade or even brand new, but like most people, I accumulated stuff
over the years.... Sony digital8 camcorder (3 yrs old), Sony DVD home
player (~5 yrs old), Win XP PC with speakers and basic CD/DVD (+/-RW?)
burner, FireWire card, spiffy ATI Radeon video card (even has RCA
component video/audio [red/white/yellow inputs] and S-video, simple Sonic
MyDvd freebie from Dell, MS Movie Maker (really like), and Roxio Easy
Media Creator 8 to arrive this week hopefully. Anything else I need?

CAPTURE QUESTIONS. Is there a "uniform" file format I need to (or should
do to) get everything into the PC as the raw "source" files. I'd like to
capture 100% of the digital data (not compress, or do anything that throws
out data or drops resolutions, etc.). What I'm seeing in various capture
software are a multitude of choices, like...

1) Medium. ATI VCR (assume file= .vcr) 480.x480 NTSC, 4mb/sec
2) VGA Res. file= .avi 640x480 29.9 fps
3) Qtr VGA file= .avi 320x240 29.9 fps
4) AVI Recording, file =.avi, 80x30 ~29.9fps
5) VGA res. mpeg2 640x480 NTSC. 6mb/sec
6) Many others...

Is there "one" file format I can (should) choose for capturing
"everything", or do I choose different formats to "capture" for each of
these sources?...

a) VCR tapes. Got a few dozen, basic home movies... Capture format?

Since this is a Movie Maker NG I will give you the WMM answer. You have no
choice here but to save as a WMV for these files because you can only hook
the VCR to the computer via USB.

b) 8MM DIGITAL VIDEOTAPE. The Sony camcorder records and plays these
digital tapes, got maybe 8. Plus it 'plays' the old 8mm analog ones made
with a prior camcorder. It should output both to Firewire, right?
Capture format?_________

Yes if you have a firewire port then you certainly want to use it and
capture with WMM as a DV-AVI file.

c) MPEGS. These aren't the driving factor, but got maybe 50 fun clips,
about 15-seconds each (that's all my camcorder does), from the Sony
digital camcorder. Why not zip them all onto a DVD for playback, right?
Capture format?________

Not capturing these, they are already clips on the computer apparently. If
they are MPG files you "may" get lucky and get them to work with WMM. If
they are MPEG2 then they will have to be converted. Personally I make it a
point to always convert MPG files to AVI regardless of the type so I don't
have to worry about having issues down the road.

d) TV. This PC has a TV-card. Suppose I knew a relative was going to be
on the news a few seconds one night. Is there a "format" to record that
clip for max resolution? Capture format?_________

You would want to use the capture software that came with the cord for this
one. If you want to be able to edit it with WMM then capture as an AVI or,
if by chance the option is available, a WMV. Ususlly you don't have a choice
here with TV capture cards, they usually save as MPG automatically so you
would need to convert.

e) DIGITAL STILL CAMERA. Got a deal on one of these. It records 640x480
10fps movies, not exactly Hollywood grade, but these ___.avi files might
be useful if we forgot the camcorder that day. Do we keep "as is", or
upload them in some other format? Capture format?_________

DV-AVI is still the best way to go but if they are simply going to be stored
for future use and as they aren't really high quality to begin with then
High Qualty NTSC will do the trick and save you a lot of harddrive spce.

f) DVDs. Suppose Uncle Elmer gives me a DVD movie and I want to upload it
onto video collection on my PC. Capture format?_________

They need to bw "ripped" from the DVD which will again give you an MPG file
which you should convert to AVI.

g) ANYTHING ELSE? Are there any other prevailing formats out there that
we need to convert for any reason?

As a general rule you want to use these formats with Movie Maker:
Video: WMV or AVI
Audio: WMA or WAV
Images: BMP or GIF (I use JPG quite often but some have reported issues with
JPG)

h) ONE MORE...SOFTWARE. For capture, does it really matter if I use
WinMovieMaker, Roxio, SonicMyDvd, etc. and change to something else later?
I'm assuming that what WOULD matter would be if I EDIT a movie in one of
these...them I'm stuck with that brand forever, right? That is, to change
brands would mean I'd have to start over and re-edit with the new
software, right?

Well if you edit and save the project with one piece of software you would
NOT be able to open it and do more editing with another if that's what you
mean.

Anyway, thanks for patience, just getting going here, will try to ask
smarter questions in future...

George

Hope that gets you started, we look forward to the "smart" questions.
--
-Wojo

Wojo's Web:
http://www.Wojos-web.co.nr

 

[Wojo]

ummm, subject line "DVD-making "capture" questions
Capture being the operative word.
What exactly is wrong with using WMM to capture and edit and then using the
DVD Authoring software to author your DVD?
Yes MyDVD and Roxio8 are capable of making more than just data DVD's.
And of course there aren't any DVD players that play MPEG WMV or AVI nobody
said there were.
Nor did anybody dispute that you need a DVD Authoring program to convert the
imported files (Whether they be MPEG, WMV, or AVI) to VOB and IFO files for
the DVD player.

I realize the question was a long winded one but the answer was fine. No
flame war intended here but if your post wasn't to dispute mine in some way
(which I haven't grasped yet anyway) but merely to attempt to answer
George's (which to be honest it really didn't do) then please reply to his
post instead of mine.

Thanks, Wojo

Well, if this isn't a classic example of a "paper" that's way beyond the
scope of this WMM discussion group..........

Having said that, here are some points to consider..........

Since your ultimate goal is to get "everything" onto DVD's that will play
in
"set top" DVD players hooked up to a TV, you don't want to use WMM for any
of
this. To make DVD's that will play in "set top" players, you need DVD
authoring/editing software. (no idea whether MyDVD or Roxio8 are capable
of
making more than just "data" DVD's?). The authoring/editing software
converts
the source files (eg: .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc.) into files that have
instructions that set top DVD players understand (eg: VOB IFO). You won't
find any .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc. files on any DVD that will play in a set
top
player, the software converts them to .VOB .IFO etc. then burns those
files
to the DVD. For Uncle Elmers DVD's, to extract/convert the .VOB IFO's into
MPEG etc for editing, you'll need further software that can do this (rip).
If
you just want to copy the DVD, you may already have that software. If you
just want to store your "clips" on a DVD but don't want to play them in a
"set top" player (just on your PC), then you only have to make a "data"
DVD.
This simply copies the .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc. files to a DVD. Nothing is
rendered or converted. When making DVD's for set top players, check the
manual of the player to see what type of media it will play. Not all
players
will play all types. If the player will only play +R and +RW, then you
will
waste time and money making -R or -RW DVD's.

To "capture" from camera's, utilize firewire, the file will automatically
be
saved in uncompressed .AVI format.

To "capture" (record) VHS tapes, use the ATI card and the RCA connections,
(Y-Video R&W-audio). If space isn't an issue, capture using NTSC DV
(.AVI).
If you want to capture at NTSC DVD spec, choose MPEG2, 29.97fps, 720 X
480,
8,000 kbps, variable bit rate (VBR), audio at 48 Khz. When you render
(make
your movie), for NTSC progressive scan choose "field order" "lower field
first".

Getting external video into a PC then onto a DVD that will play in a set
top
player is extremely time consuming. If you have a ton of video, you will
need
a ton of time and patience.

Having said all that, consider this.........................

In 2006, both Panasonic and Sony will/have released DVD players/recorders
with HDD's that will upconvert any DVD to 720P or 1080I. Players only that
will upconvert have been out for a while. They have also released VCR/DVD
combo's that supposedly will "enhance" the VHS picture when it records to
DVD.

I doubt any "affordable" video authoring/editing software (now or down the
road) will be capable of "upconverting" your original files to a quality
that
matches what these players will (now or in the future). Since non of your
files are Hi-Def (HD), I would suggest making the best quality DVD you can
from what you've got, then investigate buying a quality DVD player that
will
enhance the video (upconvert) much better than any consumer priced
software
will be able to.

NOTEKY

Hi George,
Answers "inline" below ->

I'm just ramping up (pls excuse newbie questions) and want to basically
get all my video (source code so to speak) onto a PC (and save it to
media
like a hard drive to keep in safe deposit box while I'm at it).

Then, I'd like to put all this video onto a series of DVD discs,
organizing it by subjects or times (like "1996 Olympics", "1999 Family
Movies", "2000 in Florida", etc.) so I can play them in a HOME DVD
player
(and also duplicate/send/share with family).

Still need to keep raw digital data (right?), because things change,
"everything" might someday be ultra HDTV and wide screen in the
future...
so with raw data I could go back and re-cut the DVDs with newer tools
and
playback formats, right?

Absolutely. My camera records to DV tapes. I capture them to my harddrive
and save the important captured videos "As Is" on DVDRW disks as well as
saving the DV Tapes. I designate "impotant" to those videos that can't be
recreated such as events or family stuff.

Ok, so wondered if someone might offer suggestions on the "capture"
process to get going. Here's the hardware/software setup, then after
that, the capture question(s), thanks

HARDWARE/SOFTWARE SETUP. Most of the components are in place...
Nothing
"pro" grade or even brand new, but like most people, I accumulated
stuff
over the years.... Sony digital8 camcorder (3 yrs old), Sony DVD home
player (~5 yrs old), Win XP PC with speakers and basic CD/DVD (+/-RW?)
burner, FireWire card, spiffy ATI Radeon video card (even has RCA
component video/audio [red/white/yellow inputs] and S-video, simple
Sonic
MyDvd freebie from Dell, MS Movie Maker (really like), and Roxio Easy
Media Creator 8 to arrive this week hopefully. Anything else I need?

CAPTURE QUESTIONS. Is there a "uniform" file format I need to (or
should
do to) get everything into the PC as the raw "source" files. I'd like
to
capture 100% of the digital data (not compress, or do anything that
throws
out data or drops resolutions, etc.). What I'm seeing in various
capture
software are a multitude of choices, like...

1) Medium. ATI VCR (assume file= .vcr) 480.x480 NTSC, 4mb/sec
2) VGA Res. file= .avi 640x480 29.9 fps
3) Qtr VGA file= .avi 320x240 29.9 fps
4) AVI Recording, file =.avi, 80x30 ~29.9fps
5) VGA res. mpeg2 640x480 NTSC. 6mb/sec
6) Many others...

Is there "one" file format I can (should) choose for capturing
"everything", or do I choose different formats to "capture" for each of
these sources?...

a) VCR tapes. Got a few dozen, basic home movies... Capture format?

Since this is a Movie Maker NG I will give you the WMM answer. You have
no
choice here but to save as a WMV for these files because you can only
hook
the VCR to the computer via USB.

b) 8MM DIGITAL VIDEOTAPE. The Sony camcorder records and plays these
digital tapes, got maybe 8. Plus it 'plays' the old 8mm analog ones
made
with a prior camcorder. It should output both to Firewire, right?
Capture format?_________

Yes if you have a firewire port then you certainly want to use it and
capture with WMM as a DV-AVI file.

c) MPEGS. These aren't the driving factor, but got maybe 50 fun clips,
about 15-seconds each (that's all my camcorder does), from the Sony
digital camcorder. Why not zip them all onto a DVD for playback,
right?
Capture format?________

Not capturing these, they are already clips on the computer apparently.
If
they are MPG files you "may" get lucky and get them to work with WMM. If
they are MPEG2 then they will have to be converted. Personally I make it
a
point to always convert MPG files to AVI regardless of the type so I
don't
have to worry about having issues down the road.

d) TV. This PC has a TV-card. Suppose I knew a relative was going to
be
on the news a few seconds one night. Is there a "format" to record
that
clip for max resolution? Capture format?_________

You would want to use the capture software that came with the cord for
this
one. If you want to be able to edit it with WMM then capture as an AVI
or,
if by chance the option is available, a WMV. Ususlly you don't have a
choice
here with TV capture cards, they usually save as MPG automatically so you
would need to convert.

e) DIGITAL STILL CAMERA. Got a deal on one of these. It records
640x480
10fps movies, not exactly Hollywood grade, but these ___.avi files
might
be useful if we forgot the camcorder that day. Do we keep "as is", or
upload them in some other format? Capture format?_________

DV-AVI is still the best way to go but if they are simply going to be
stored
for future use and as they aren't really high quality to begin with then
High Qualty NTSC will do the trick and save you a lot of harddrive spce.

f) DVDs. Suppose Uncle Elmer gives me a DVD movie and I want to upload
it
onto video collection on my PC. Capture format?_________

They need to bw "ripped" from the DVD which will again give you an MPG
file
which you should convert to AVI.

g) ANYTHING ELSE? Are there any other prevailing formats out there
that
we need to convert for any reason?

As a general rule you want to use these formats with Movie Maker:
Video: WMV or AVI
Audio: WMA or WAV
Images: BMP or GIF (I use JPG quite often but some have reported issues
with
JPG)

h) ONE MORE...SOFTWARE. For capture, does it really matter if I use
WinMovieMaker, Roxio, SonicMyDvd, etc. and change to something else
later?
I'm assuming that what WOULD matter would be if I EDIT a movie in one
of
these...them I'm stuck with that brand forever, right? That is, to
change
brands would mean I'd have to start over and re-edit with the new
software, right?

Well if you edit and save the project with one piece of software you
would
NOT be able to open it and do more editing with another if that's what
you
mean.

Anyway, thanks for patience, just getting going here, will try to ask
smarter questions in future...

George

Hope that gets you started, we look forward to the "smart" questions.

--
-Wojo

Wojo's Web:
http://www.Wojos-web.co.nr

 

[Guest]

Wojo,

Didn't dispute your post, was simply providing George with additional
information to think about. Obviously he's got a ton of work ahead of him,
and with every conceivable type of media, he may want to consider all his
alternatives.

Your post provided specific comments, (looked at the trees), mine was to
provide some alternatives, to look at the big picture (look at the forest).
If someone else can offer more, better still.

Get over youself and your insecurities pal, you're only a legend in your own
mind.

No flame intended ( | )

NOTEKY

ummm, subject line "DVD-making "capture" questions
Capture being the operative word.
What exactly is wrong with using WMM to capture and edit and then using the
DVD Authoring software to author your DVD?
Yes MyDVD and Roxio8 are capable of making more than just data DVD's.
And of course there aren't any DVD players that play MPEG WMV or AVI nobody
said there were.
Nor did anybody dispute that you need a DVD Authoring program to convert the
imported files (Whether they be MPEG, WMV, or AVI) to VOB and IFO files for
the DVD player.

I realize the question was a long winded one but the answer was fine. No
flame war intended here but if your post wasn't to dispute mine in some way
(which I haven't grasped yet anyway) but merely to attempt to answer
George's (which to be honest it really didn't do) then please reply to his
post instead of mine.

Thanks, Wojo

Well, if this isn't a classic example of a "paper" that's way beyond the
scope of this WMM discussion group..........

Having said that, here are some points to consider..........

Since your ultimate goal is to get "everything" onto DVD's that will play
in
"set top" DVD players hooked up to a TV, you don't want to use WMM for any
of
this. To make DVD's that will play in "set top" players, you need DVD
authoring/editing software. (no idea whether MyDVD or Roxio8 are capable
of
making more than just "data" DVD's?). The authoring/editing software
converts
the source files (eg: .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc.) into files that have
instructions that set top DVD players understand (eg: VOB IFO). You won't
find any .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc. files on any DVD that will play in a set
top
player, the software converts them to .VOB .IFO etc. then burns those
files
to the DVD. For Uncle Elmers DVD's, to extract/convert the .VOB IFO's into
MPEG etc for editing, you'll need further software that can do this (rip).
If
you just want to copy the DVD, you may already have that software. If you
just want to store your "clips" on a DVD but don't want to play them in a
"set top" player (just on your PC), then you only have to make a "data"
DVD.
This simply copies the .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc. files to a DVD. Nothing is
rendered or converted. When making DVD's for set top players, check the
manual of the player to see what type of media it will play. Not all
players
will play all types. If the player will only play +R and +RW, then you
will
waste time and money making -R or -RW DVD's.

To "capture" from camera's, utilize firewire, the file will automatically
be
saved in uncompressed .AVI format.

To "capture" (record) VHS tapes, use the ATI card and the RCA connections,
(Y-Video R&W-audio). If space isn't an issue, capture using NTSC DV
(.AVI).
If you want to capture at NTSC DVD spec, choose MPEG2, 29.97fps, 720 X
480,
8,000 kbps, variable bit rate (VBR), audio at 48 Khz. When you render
(make
your movie), for NTSC progressive scan choose "field order" "lower field
first".

Getting external video into a PC then onto a DVD that will play in a set
top
player is extremely time consuming. If you have a ton of video, you will
need
a ton of time and patience.

Having said all that, consider this.........................

In 2006, both Panasonic and Sony will/have released DVD players/recorders
with HDD's that will upconvert any DVD to 720P or 1080I. Players only that
will upconvert have been out for a while. They have also released VCR/DVD
combo's that supposedly will "enhance" the VHS picture when it records to
DVD.

I doubt any "affordable" video authoring/editing software (now or down the
road) will be capable of "upconverting" your original files to a quality
that
matches what these players will (now or in the future). Since non of your
files are Hi-Def (HD), I would suggest making the best quality DVD you can
from what you've got, then investigate buying a quality DVD player that
will
enhance the video (upconvert) much better than any consumer priced
software
will be able to.

NOTEKY

Hi George,
Answers "inline" below ->

I'm just ramping up (pls excuse newbie questions) and want to basically
get all my video (source code so to speak) onto a PC (and save it to
media
like a hard drive to keep in safe deposit box while I'm at it).

Then, I'd like to put all this video onto a series of DVD discs,
organizing it by subjects or times (like "1996 Olympics", "1999 Family
Movies", "2000 in Florida", etc.) so I can play them in a HOME DVD
player
(and also duplicate/send/share with family).

Still need to keep raw digital data (right?), because things change,
"everything" might someday be ultra HDTV and wide screen in the
future...
so with raw data I could go back and re-cut the DVDs with newer tools
and
playback formats, right?

Absolutely. My camera records to DV tapes. I capture them to my harddrive
and save the important captured videos "As Is" on DVDRW disks as well as
saving the DV Tapes. I designate "impotant" to those videos that can't be
recreated such as events or family stuff.


Ok, so wondered if someone might offer suggestions on the "capture"
process to get going. Here's the hardware/software setup, then after
that, the capture question(s), thanks

HARDWARE/SOFTWARE SETUP. Most of the components are in place...
Nothing
"pro" grade or even brand new, but like most people, I accumulated
stuff
over the years.... Sony digital8 camcorder (3 yrs old), Sony DVD home
player (~5 yrs old), Win XP PC with speakers and basic CD/DVD (+/-RW?)
burner, FireWire card, spiffy ATI Radeon video card (even has RCA
component video/audio [red/white/yellow inputs] and S-video, simple
Sonic
MyDvd freebie from Dell, MS Movie Maker (really like), and Roxio Easy
Media Creator 8 to arrive this week hopefully. Anything else I need?

CAPTURE QUESTIONS. Is there a "uniform" file format I need to (or
should
do to) get everything into the PC as the raw "source" files. I'd like
to
capture 100% of the digital data (not compress, or do anything that
throws
out data or drops resolutions, etc.). What I'm seeing in various
capture
software are a multitude of choices, like...

1) Medium. ATI VCR (assume file= .vcr) 480.x480 NTSC, 4mb/sec
2) VGA Res. file= .avi 640x480 29.9 fps
3) Qtr VGA file= .avi 320x240 29.9 fps
4) AVI Recording, file =.avi, 80x30 ~29.9fps
5) VGA res. mpeg2 640x480 NTSC. 6mb/sec
6) Many others...

Is there "one" file format I can (should) choose for capturing
"everything", or do I choose different formats to "capture" for each of
these sources?...

a) VCR tapes. Got a few dozen, basic home movies... Capture format?

Since this is a Movie Maker NG I will give you the WMM answer. You have
no
choice here but to save as a WMV for these files because you can only
hook
the VCR to the computer via USB.


b) 8MM DIGITAL VIDEOTAPE. The Sony camcorder records and plays these
digital tapes, got maybe 8. Plus it 'plays' the old 8mm analog ones
made
with a prior camcorder. It should output both to Firewire, right?
Capture format?_________

Yes if you have a firewire port then you certainly want to use it and
capture with WMM as a DV-AVI file.


c) MPEGS. These aren't the driving factor, but got maybe 50 fun clips,
about 15-seconds each (that's all my camcorder does), from the Sony
digital camcorder. Why not zip them all onto a DVD for playback,
right?
Capture format?________

Not capturing these, they are already clips on the computer apparently.
If
they are MPG files you "may" get lucky and get them to work with WMM. If
they are MPEG2 then they will have to be converted. Personally I make it
a
point to always convert MPG files to AVI regardless of the type so I
don't
have to worry about having issues down the road.


d) TV. This PC has a TV-card. Suppose I knew a relative was going to
be
on the news a few seconds one night. Is there a "format" to record
that
clip for max resolution? Capture format?_________

You would want to use the capture software that came with the cord for
this
one. If you want to be able to edit it with WMM then capture as an AVI
or,
if by chance the option is available, a WMV. Ususlly you don't have a
choice
here with TV capture cards, they usually save as MPG automatically so you
would need to convert.


e) DIGITAL STILL CAMERA. Got a deal on one of these. It records
640x480
10fps movies, not exactly Hollywood grade, but these ___.avi files
might
be useful if we forgot the camcorder that day. Do we keep "as is", or
upload them in some other format? Capture format?_________

DV-AVI is still the best way to go but if they are simply going to be
stored
for future use and as they aren't really high quality to begin with then
High Qualty NTSC will do the trick and save you a lot of harddrive spce.


f) DVDs. Suppose Uncle Elmer gives me a DVD movie and I want to upload
it
onto video collection on my PC. Capture format?_________

They need to bw "ripped" from the DVD which will again give you an MPG
file
which you should convert to AVI.


g) ANYTHING ELSE? Are there any other prevailing formats out there
that
we need to convert for any reason?

As a general rule you want to use these formats with Movie Maker:
Video: WMV or AVI
Audio: WMA or WAV
Images: BMP or GIF (I use JPG quite often but some have reported issues
with
JPG)


h) ONE MORE...SOFTWARE. For capture, does it really matter if I use
WinMovieMaker, Roxio, SonicMyDvd, etc. and change to something else
later?
I'm assuming that what WOULD matter would be if I EDIT a movie in one
of
these...them I'm stuck with that brand forever, right? That is, to
change
brands would mean I'd have to start over and re-edit with the new
software, right?

Well if you edit and save the project with one piece of software you
would
NOT be able to open it and do more editing with another if that's what
you
mean.

Anyway, thanks for patience, just getting going here, will try to ask
smarter questions in future...

George


Hope that gets you started, we look forward to the "smart" questions.

--
-Wojo

Wojo's Web:
http://www.Wojos-web.co.nr

 

[Wojo]

Actually I apologize for my post.
I was tired and yours, as I didn't see how it answered the question at all,
struck a nerve so I apologize for even writing it.
-Wojo

Wojo,

Didn't dispute your post, was simply providing George with additional
information to think about. Obviously he's got a ton of work ahead of him,
and with every conceivable type of media, he may want to consider all his
alternatives.

Your post provided specific comments, (looked at the trees), mine was to
provide some alternatives, to look at the big picture (look at the
forest).
If someone else can offer more, better still.

Get over youself and your insecurities pal, you're only a legend in your
own
mind.

No flame intended ( | )

NOTEKY

ummm, subject line "DVD-making "capture" questions
Capture being the operative word.
What exactly is wrong with using WMM to capture and edit and then using
the
DVD Authoring software to author your DVD?
Yes MyDVD and Roxio8 are capable of making more than just data DVD's.
And of course there aren't any DVD players that play MPEG WMV or AVI
nobody
said there were.
Nor did anybody dispute that you need a DVD Authoring program to convert
the
imported files (Whether they be MPEG, WMV, or AVI) to VOB and IFO files
for
the DVD player.

I realize the question was a long winded one but the answer was fine. No
flame war intended here but if your post wasn't to dispute mine in some
way
(which I haven't grasped yet anyway) but merely to attempt to answer
George's (which to be honest it really didn't do) then please reply to
his
post instead of mine.

Thanks, Wojo

Well, if this isn't a classic example of a "paper" that's way beyond
the
scope of this WMM discussion group..........

Having said that, here are some points to consider..........

Since your ultimate goal is to get "everything" onto DVD's that will
play
in
"set top" DVD players hooked up to a TV, you don't want to use WMM for
any
of
this. To make DVD's that will play in "set top" players, you need DVD
authoring/editing software. (no idea whether MyDVD or Roxio8 are
capable
of
making more than just "data" DVD's?). The authoring/editing software
converts
the source files (eg: .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc.) into files that have
instructions that set top DVD players understand (eg: VOB IFO). You
won't
find any .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc. files on any DVD that will play in a
set
top
player, the software converts them to .VOB .IFO etc. then burns those
files
to the DVD. For Uncle Elmers DVD's, to extract/convert the .VOB IFO's
into
MPEG etc for editing, you'll need further software that can do this
(rip).
If
you just want to copy the DVD, you may already have that software. If
you
just want to store your "clips" on a DVD but don't want to play them in
a
"set top" player (just on your PC), then you only have to make a "data"
DVD.
This simply copies the .MPEG, .WMV, .AVI etc. files to a DVD. Nothing
is
rendered or converted. When making DVD's for set top players, check the
manual of the player to see what type of media it will play. Not all
players
will play all types. If the player will only play +R and +RW, then you
will
waste time and money making -R or -RW DVD's.

To "capture" from camera's, utilize firewire, the file will
automatically
be
saved in uncompressed .AVI format.

To "capture" (record) VHS tapes, use the ATI card and the RCA
connections,
(Y-Video R&W-audio). If space isn't an issue, capture using NTSC DV
(.AVI).
If you want to capture at NTSC DVD spec, choose MPEG2, 29.97fps, 720 X
480,
8,000 kbps, variable bit rate (VBR), audio at 48 Khz. When you render
(make
your movie), for NTSC progressive scan choose "field order" "lower
field
first".

Getting external video into a PC then onto a DVD that will play in a
set
top
player is extremely time consuming. If you have a ton of video, you
will
need
a ton of time and patience.

Having said all that, consider this.........................

In 2006, both Panasonic and Sony will/have released DVD
players/recorders
with HDD's that will upconvert any DVD to 720P or 1080I. Players only
that
will upconvert have been out for a while. They have also released
VCR/DVD
combo's that supposedly will "enhance" the VHS picture when it records
to
DVD.

I doubt any "affordable" video authoring/editing software (now or down
the
road) will be capable of "upconverting" your original files to a
quality
that
matches what these players will (now or in the future). Since non of
your
files are Hi-Def (HD), I would suggest making the best quality DVD you
can
from what you've got, then investigate buying a quality DVD player that
will
enhance the video (upconvert) much better than any consumer priced
software
will be able to.

NOTEKY

:

Hi George,
Answers "inline" below ->

I'm just ramping up (pls excuse newbie questions) and want to
basically
get all my video (source code so to speak) onto a PC (and save it to
media
like a hard drive to keep in safe deposit box while I'm at it).

Then, I'd like to put all this video onto a series of DVD discs,
organizing it by subjects or times (like "1996 Olympics", "1999
Family
Movies", "2000 in Florida", etc.) so I can play them in a HOME DVD
player
(and also duplicate/send/share with family).

Still need to keep raw digital data (right?), because things change,
"everything" might someday be ultra HDTV and wide screen in the
future...
so with raw data I could go back and re-cut the DVDs with newer
tools
and
playback formats, right?

Absolutely. My camera records to DV tapes. I capture them to my
harddrive
and save the important captured videos "As Is" on DVDRW disks as well
as
saving the DV Tapes. I designate "impotant" to those videos that can't
be
recreated such as events or family stuff.


Ok, so wondered if someone might offer suggestions on the "capture"
process to get going. Here's the hardware/software setup, then
after
that, the capture question(s), thanks

HARDWARE/SOFTWARE SETUP. Most of the components are in place...
Nothing
"pro" grade or even brand new, but like most people, I accumulated
stuff
over the years.... Sony digital8 camcorder (3 yrs old), Sony DVD
home
player (~5 yrs old), Win XP PC with speakers and basic CD/DVD
(+/-RW?)
burner, FireWire card, spiffy ATI Radeon video card (even has RCA
component video/audio [red/white/yellow inputs] and S-video, simple
Sonic
MyDvd freebie from Dell, MS Movie Maker (really like), and Roxio
Easy
Media Creator 8 to arrive this week hopefully. Anything else I
need?

CAPTURE QUESTIONS. Is there a "uniform" file format I need to (or
should
do to) get everything into the PC as the raw "source" files. I'd
like
to
capture 100% of the digital data (not compress, or do anything that
throws
out data or drops resolutions, etc.). What I'm seeing in various
capture
software are a multitude of choices, like...

1) Medium. ATI VCR (assume file= .vcr) 480.x480 NTSC, 4mb/sec
2) VGA Res. file= .avi 640x480 29.9 fps
3) Qtr VGA file= .avi 320x240 29.9 fps
4) AVI Recording, file =.avi, 80x30 ~29.9fps
5) VGA res. mpeg2 640x480 NTSC. 6mb/sec
6) Many others...

Is there "one" file format I can (should) choose for capturing
"everything", or do I choose different formats to "capture" for each
of
these sources?...

a) VCR tapes. Got a few dozen, basic home movies... Capture
format?

Since this is a Movie Maker NG I will give you the WMM answer. You
have
no
choice here but to save as a WMV for these files because you can only
hook
the VCR to the computer via USB.


b) 8MM DIGITAL VIDEOTAPE. The Sony camcorder records and plays
these
digital tapes, got maybe 8. Plus it 'plays' the old 8mm analog ones
made
with a prior camcorder. It should output both to Firewire, right?
Capture format?_________

Yes if you have a firewire port then you certainly want to use it and
capture with WMM as a DV-AVI file.


c) MPEGS. These aren't the driving factor, but got maybe 50 fun
clips,
about 15-seconds each (that's all my camcorder does), from the Sony
digital camcorder. Why not zip them all onto a DVD for playback,
right?
Capture format?________

Not capturing these, they are already clips on the computer
apparently.
If
they are MPG files you "may" get lucky and get them to work with WMM.
If
they are MPEG2 then they will have to be converted. Personally I make
it
a
point to always convert MPG files to AVI regardless of the type so I
don't
have to worry about having issues down the road.


d) TV. This PC has a TV-card. Suppose I knew a relative was going
to
be
on the news a few seconds one night. Is there a "format" to record
that
clip for max resolution? Capture format?_________

You would want to use the capture software that came with the cord for
this
one. If you want to be able to edit it with WMM then capture as an AVI
or,
if by chance the option is available, a WMV. Ususlly you don't have a
choice
here with TV capture cards, they usually save as MPG automatically so
you
would need to convert.


e) DIGITAL STILL CAMERA. Got a deal on one of these. It records
640x480
10fps movies, not exactly Hollywood grade, but these ___.avi files
might
be useful if we forgot the camcorder that day. Do we keep "as is",
or
upload them in some other format? Capture format?_________

DV-AVI is still the best way to go but if they are simply going to be
stored
for future use and as they aren't really high quality to begin with
then
High Qualty NTSC will do the trick and save you a lot of harddrive
spce.


f) DVDs. Suppose Uncle Elmer gives me a DVD movie and I want to
upload
it
onto video collection on my PC. Capture format?_________

They need to bw "ripped" from the DVD which will again give you an MPG
file
which you should convert to AVI.


g) ANYTHING ELSE? Are there any other prevailing formats out there
that
we need to convert for any reason?

As a general rule you want to use these formats with Movie Maker:
Video: WMV or AVI
Audio: WMA or WAV
Images: BMP or GIF (I use JPG quite often but some have reported
issues
with
JPG)


h) ONE MORE...SOFTWARE. For capture, does it really matter if I use
WinMovieMaker, Roxio, SonicMyDvd, etc. and change to something else
later?
I'm assuming that what WOULD matter would be if I EDIT a movie in
one
of
these...them I'm stuck with that brand forever, right? That is, to
change
brands would mean I'd have to start over and re-edit with the new
software, right?

Well if you edit and save the project with one piece of software you
would
NOT be able to open it and do more editing with another if that's what
you
mean.

Anyway, thanks for patience, just getting going here, will try to
ask
smarter questions in future...

George


Hope that gets you started, we look forward to the "smart" questions.

--
-Wojo

Wojo's Web:
http://www.Wojos-web.co.nr

 

[George]

Wojo and NOTEKY,

Thank you both for taking the time to reply, both posts were 'extremely'
helpful, and provided great perspectives also. I learned a lot, and I'm
thinking these will also be useful to many other visitors who are looking
for real insights like these.

....Now, if only there was a way to reduce all the hours it looks like it's
going to take to get all these movies into the PC....

Thanks again,
George

 

[Wojo]

Your welcome George. Ignore my bitterness from my one "weak moment" and all
is good in the thread.
-Wojo