DOS Woes

[Craig N.]

Ok, hopefully someone can help me out here. I have a client, running in a
dos based environment with novel. The systems are packard bell 486 25 Mhz.
And, they are a CAD design firm, sad.

Ok, here is the deal, the server doesn't back-up anymore, and they have tons
of money on the file server, which they cant loose. How do I move this data
off the network so I can transfer it into a new XP environment? I threw a
hard drive into a workstation, and the smallest I could get was a 40 gb, it
recognized it as a 260 Mb drive, and I copied the data over, when I plugged
it into my XP machine, it didn't recognize a partition or anything. I am
attempting to do a recovery on the drive, but so far it's not going to well.

Anyone have any suggestions? CD-Burning isn't an option, at least not with a
system from '93, and I cant connect into the network with my XP machine or a
mac, even tried the novel clients. So, Ideas?

 

[Haggis]

Ok, hopefully someone can help me out here. I have a client, running in a
dos based environment with novel. The systems are packard bell 486 25 Mhz.
And, they are a CAD design firm, sad.

Ok, here is the deal, the server doesn't back-up anymore, and they have
tons
of money on the file server, which they cant loose. How do I move this
data
off the network so I can transfer it into a new XP environment? I threw a
hard drive into a workstation, and the smallest I could get was a 40 gb,
it
recognized it as a 260 Mb drive, and I copied the data over, when I
plugged
it into my XP machine, it didn't recognize a partition or anything. I am
attempting to do a recovery on the drive, but so far it's not going to
well.

Anyone have any suggestions? CD-Burning isn't an option, at least not with
a
system from '93, and I cant connect into the network with my XP machine or
a
mac, even tried the novel clients. So, Ideas?

you could use the old laplink way with a parallel cable ...don't know how
well XP would like that tho..

the old 486 will not recognise the new 'large' HD ...but XP should have no
trouble reading the old small HD out of the 486 <hint> :>

 

[Test User]

Ok, hopefully someone can help me out here. I have a client, running in a
dos based environment with novel. The systems are packard bell 486 25 Mhz.
And, they are a CAD design firm, sad.

Ok, here is the deal, the server doesn't back-up anymore, and they have tons
of money on the file server, which they cant loose. How do I move this data
off the network so I can transfer it into a new XP environment? I threw a
hard drive into a workstation, and the smallest I could get was a 40 gb, it
recognized it as a 260 Mb drive, and I copied the data over, when I plugged
it into my XP machine, it didn't recognize a partition or anything. I am
attempting to do a recovery on the drive, but so far it's not going to well.

Anyone have any suggestions? CD-Burning isn't an option, at least not with a
system from '93, and I cant connect into the network with my XP machine or a
mac, even tried the novel clients. So, Ideas?

I'm not sure I follow what you've done, but you might just have tried the
drive-copy backwards. It sounds like you are trying to install new drives
in old machines that have very limited drive tables.

Take the server down, remove its drive and install it in another *new*
machine as a secondary drive (or in an external case). Adjust jumpers as
needed. Now just copy all the files, and when done, put the jumpers back
where they were and reassemble the server.

HTH
-pk

 

[Steve N.]

Ok, hopefully someone can help me out here. I have a client, running in a
dos based environment with novel. The systems are packard bell 486 25 Mhz.
And, they are a CAD design firm, sad.

Ok, here is the deal, the server doesn't back-up anymore, and they have tons
of money on the file server, which they cant loose. How do I move this data
off the network so I can transfer it into a new XP environment? I threw a
hard drive into a workstation, and the smallest I could get was a 40 gb, it
recognized it as a 260 Mb drive, and I copied the data over, when I plugged
it into my XP machine, it didn't recognize a partition or anything. I am
attempting to do a recovery on the drive, but so far it's not going to well.

Anyone have any suggestions? CD-Burning isn't an option, at least not with a
system from '93, and I cant connect into the network with my XP machine or a
mac, even tried the novel clients. So, Ideas?

What version of Novell Netware is the server running?

If prior to Netware 4.x you can use the Microsoft Client for Netware
Networks that ships with Windows. If later than 4.x you will need NW
Client 4.91 avaialble from Novell (www.novell.com) for proper access to
NDS tree. The Microsoft Client Service for Novell Networks does not work
properly unless its a flat NDS tree with everything in one context.

Steve

 

[David H. Lipman]

From: "Craig N." <[email protected]>

| Ok, hopefully someone can help me out here. I have a client, running in a
| dos based environment with novel. The systems are packard bell 486 25 Mhz.
| And, they are a CAD design firm, sad.
|
| Ok, here is the deal, the server doesn't back-up anymore, and they have tons
| of money on the file server, which they cant loose. How do I move this data
| off the network so I can transfer it into a new XP environment? I threw a
| hard drive into a workstation, and the smallest I could get was a 40 gb, it
| recognized it as a 260 Mb drive, and I copied the data over, when I plugged
| it into my XP machine, it didn't recognize a partition or anything. I am
| attempting to do a recovery on the drive, but so far it's not going to well.
|
| Anyone have any suggestions? CD-Burning isn't an option, at least not with a
| system from '93, and I cant connect into the network with my XP machine or a
| mac, even tried the novel clients. So, Ideas?

Load NDIS2 or Crynwr Packet Driver NIC drivers and load a TCP/IP and NetBIOS stack and map
to a NT Share of a server where the server does regular backups. Just make sure the NT
Share conforms to 8.3 convention or the DOS TCP/IP wwith NetBIOS stack will not see it
properly.

 

[Craig N.]

Well, logically, taking the drive out and into an xp machine would be good,
however this drive has been running since '93, the server has not been
turned off, so my issue here, is what happens when I turn that server off...
If I loose data in any way, I am screwed.

As far as networking into it, I don't know what version of netware, but
whatever was popular in 93/94. Once again, the server doesn't have a monitor
and keyboard, so I would need to reboot it, and find a keyboard it has the
BIG plug, hehe. Once again, as mentioned above, I am prohibited from turning
off that server.

So, really, getting my XP laptop onto that network would be the best,
however I am lost with an old version of netware. It is running a login
script. Now, don't I need an IP address and all that, like with all other
types of networking & how do I find the ip of those machines.

OHHHHH, I didn't mention, the servers are on coax, not cat-5.

 

[Steve N.]

I'm not sure I follow what you've done, but you might just have tried the
drive-copy backwards. It sounds like you are trying to install new drives
in old machines that have very limited drive tables.

Take the server down, remove its drive and install it in another *new*
machine as a secondary drive (or in an external case). Adjust jumpers as
needed. Now just copy all the files, and when done, put the jumpers back
where they were and reassemble the server.

HTH
-pk

Won't work. You can only access Netware volumes from inside Netware OS.

Steve

 

[Steve N.]

Well, logically, taking the drive out and into an xp machine would be good,

It will not work, you cannot mount a Netware volume with anything but
Netware.

however this drive has been running since '93, the server has not been
turned off, so my issue here, is what happens when I turn that server off...
If I loose data in any way, I am screwed.

As far as networking into it, I don't know what version of netware, but
whatever was popular in 93/94. Once again, the server doesn't have a monitor
and keyboard, so I would need to reboot it, and find a keyboard it has the
BIG plug, hehe. Once again, as mentioned above, I am prohibited from turning
off that server.

Probably Netware 3.x.

So, really, getting my XP laptop onto that network would be the best,
however I am lost with an old version of netware. It is running a login
script. Now, don't I need an IP address and all that, like with all other
types of networking & how do I find the ip of those machines.

Netware 3.x does not use IP it uses IPX and frame type 802.2. In many
cases you'll have to tell the IPX network components to use 802.2
specifically, not auto. You may also have to set the NIC properties to
use 802.2 for the IPX logical board.

So you get a login script processing when you login to the server or are
you able to login to the server at all?

Steve

 

[Don Taylor]

Ok, hopefully someone can help me out here. I have a client, running in a
dos based environment with novel. The systems are packard bell 486 25 Mhz.
And, they are a CAD design firm, sad.

Ok, here is the deal, the server doesn't back-up anymore, and they have tons
of money on the file server, which they cant loose. How do I move this data
off the network so I can transfer it into a new XP environment? I threw a
hard drive into a workstation, and the smallest I could get was a 40 gb, it
recognized it as a 260 Mb drive, and I copied the data over, when I plugged
it into my XP machine, it didn't recognize a partition or anything. I am
attempting to do a recovery on the drive, but so far it's not going to well.

Anyone have any suggestions? CD-Burning isn't an option, at least not with a
system from '93, and I cant connect into the network with my XP machine or a
mac, even tried the novel clients. So, Ideas?

Since the data on the hard drive is so mission critical I would
recommend you NOT try "install this new software" or "make that
change to the system" to try to back this up. As I imagine you
know, any change has a chance of failure and I don't think you
want a failure about this time.

SewellDirect.com has a solution which I think is cheap and safe.
You don't have to install any new software, you don't have to
make any network changes, you don't have to risk catastrophic
failure swapping drives in and out, etc, etc, etc.

You boot their little floppy, it doesn't install anything,
and it can use a parallel data cable or even a serial cable,
the program on the floppy just talks to the installed version
of software off on your XP machine somewhere and with a couple
of mouse clicks you just ask it to clone the whole 486 system
into an itty bitty little folder on the XP machine. Watch
it for a little while to see the copies being sent and then
leave it to finish the job. Come back when it is done, unplug
the cable, take out the floppy, reboot and you have your original
machine plus a backup.

You can even try their free version first, to make sure it works.
It will let you copy 10 files or 10 megabytes per run, and it
nags you to buy the unlimited version.

I don't get paid to say this, it just saved my ass once.

 

[Steve N.]

steve wrote:

I am not the OP, why reply to my reply?

I would suggest in this case that you need to use somebody that is
experienced with novell servers,

Yes, specifically someone experienced with Netware 3.x, current Netware
OS's are nothing like the old NOS and many Netware admins have no clue
about the older NOS's these days.

you will need a novell client installed,

Yes. Already stated. You should read the thread.

you
need to know what domain server etc you need to attach to,

Netware 3.x has nothing to do with domains.

you will also need
a valid user account to connect to the server, simply connecting a keyboard
and monitor should give you access to the server

Access to the server console but not to the file system without tools
that Netware 3.x does not include natively but can be obtained from
Novell (toolbox.nlm). Besides, where would he copy the files to? Either
floppy disk which may not be sufficient or practical, or another Novell
server and what good would that do? He'd be back to square one.

Also, you cannot connect a keyboard to a 486 MB hot, it will damage the
KB input circuit on the MB.

but it is likely to be
password locked and you will need the admin password

Not likely. Netware server console is not password protected unless the
console monitor is loaded with a password on its screensaver.

Steve

 

[Al Dykes]

Ok, hopefully someone can help me out here. I have a client, running in a
dos based environment with novel. The systems are packard bell 486 25 Mhz.
And, they are a CAD design firm, sad.

Ok, here is the deal, the server doesn't back-up anymore, and they have tons
of money on the file server, which they cant loose. How do I move this data
off the network so I can transfer it into a new XP environment? I threw a
hard drive into a workstation, and the smallest I could get was a 40 gb, it
recognized it as a 260 Mb drive, and I copied the data over, when I plugged
it into my XP machine, it didn't recognize a partition or anything. I am
attempting to do a recovery on the drive, but so far it's not going to well.

Anyone have any suggestions? CD-Burning isn't an option, at least not with a
system from '93, and I cant connect into the network with my XP machine or a
mac, even tried the novel clients. So, Ideas?

What's wrong with the backup ?

Why isn't an XP machine talking to your NW server ? If it'a an oldie
it's probably IPX and XP doesn't install IPX by detault. If you
installed the NW clinet it may expect a modern IP version of NW
server. IMO you need to read the release notes for the NV version and
NW clinet for XP to see what's required. You might look at Novell's
XP client, if they make one and see what the requirements are. There
are a zillion little reasons why you can't talk.

A google for "ipx xp netware client" comes up with lots of hits
that may give a clue.

As a last resort if you can get a copy of NT4 install it with the NW
client and it will probabably talk to any NW server NW5 or earlier.
You can put a burner on it and make some backups.

 

[Al Dykes]

Well, logically, taking the drive out and into an xp machine would be good,
however this drive has been running since '93, the server has not been
turned off, so my issue here, is what happens when I turn that server off...
If I loose data in any way, I am screwed.

As far as networking into it, I don't know what version of netware, but
whatever was popular in 93/94. Once again, the server doesn't have a monitor
and keyboard, so I would need to reboot it, and find a keyboard it has the
BIG plug, hehe. Once again, as mentioned above, I am prohibited from turning
off that server.

So, really, getting my XP laptop onto that network would be the best,
however I am lost with an old version of netware. It is running a login
script. Now, don't I need an IP address and all that, like with all other
types of networking & how do I find the ip of those machines.

OHHHHH, I didn't mention, the servers are on coax, not cat-5.

I assume it's Thinwire ethernet. If there is _NO_ CAT3/5 hub in the
shop you've got to make one. This will do:
http://www.alliedtelesyn.com/products/details.aspx?141
(about $20 the last time I bought one. Maybe a decade ago.)

If you don't know how to hook this up you're in over your head.

This is beginning to sound like a troll. Too vague. Open
ended. What's next?

 

[Steve N.]

I assume it's Thinwire ethernet. If there is _NO_ CAT3/5 hub in the
shop you've got to make one. This will do:
http://www.alliedtelesyn.com/products/details.aspx?141
(about $20 the last time I bought one. Maybe a decade ago.)

That's an RJ45 to AUI transceiver, he'll need RJ45 to BNC balun
converting thinnet coax to CAT5:

http://www.connecttech.net/product_info.php?products_id=1117

If you don't know how to hook this up you're in over your head.

This is beginning to sound like a troll. Too vague. Open
ended. What's next?

So, because someone doesn't know enough about what he needs to ask
concerning an unfamiliar situation that makes him sound like a troll?
What a crock.

Steve

 

[Steve N.]

What's wrong with the backup ?

Why isn't an XP machine talking to your NW server ? If it'a an oldie
it's probably IPX and XP doesn't install IPX by detault. If you
installed the NW clinet it may expect a modern IP version of NW
server. IMO you need to read the release notes for the NV version and
NW clinet for XP to see what's required. You might look at Novell's
XP client, if they make one and see what the requirements are. There
are a zillion little reasons why you can't talk.

A google for "ipx xp netware client" comes up with lots of hits
that may give a clue.

As a last resort if you can get a copy of NT4 install it with the NW
client and it will probabably talk to any NW server NW5 or earlier.
You can put a burner on it and make some backups.

The Novell Netware client supports IP, IPX or IP and IPX and will work
under XP. For NW 3.x (which is what he's probably got) you also need to
set IPX frame type to 802.2 in both the IPX stacks and the NIC binding
to the IPX logical board. Auto will not work. However, the Microsoft
Client for Netware (NOT the Microsoft Client Service for Netware) will
also work to connect to a NW 3.x server. The same 802.2 frame settings
have to be applied.

If the NW server happens to be Netware 2.x then the frame type will have
to be set to 802.3 instead.

Steve

 

[Plato]

Ok, hopefully someone can help me out here. I have a client, running in a
dos based environment with novel. The systems are packard bell 486 25 Mhz.
And, they are a CAD design firm, sad.

Why sad? That's all you need for curbs and sidewalks

Since you claim to be in the pc business, use one of shop pcs like an
p400 or so. Put dos on it, use laplink and copy the data over to the
shop pc via the parallel port. No need to reboot or whatever on the
server.

Ok, here is the deal, the server doesn't back-up anymore, and they have tons
of money on the file server, which they cant loose. How do I move this data
off the network so I can transfer it into a new XP environment? I threw a
hard drive into a workstation, and the smallest I could get was a 40 gb, it
recognized it as a 260 Mb drive, and I copied the data over, when I plugged

Again, if you really are in the repair busniness, you'd have a nice
collection of 2, 4, and 8 gig hard drives laying around. If not, seek
help from a real repair/network business.