Confused with UAC (User Account Control)... best article I've seen on it yet.

  • Thread starter Thread starter Adam Albright
  • Start date Start date
Useful info, but if it really is a pain, and you're sure you will be safe
without it, just disable it....

Control Panel//User Accounts//"Turn User Account Control on or off". Uncheck
'User Account Control Box'. You will need to restart.

Ed
 
Great Adam, write up, a bit long winded, but well worth the reading, most
probably the best explanation on the function of UAC written.
 
Hi Adam,
If you do not like it, then why don't you just disable it ?
Doing so you wouldn't have to waste our time with your nagging about it :-)
 
Useful info, but if it really is a pain, and you're sure you will be safe
without it, just disable it....

Control Panel//User Accounts//"Turn User Account Control on or off". Uncheck
'User Account Control Box'. You will need to restart.

I think there's some little back office somewhere in Microsoft's
Redmond campus where software engineers go out of their way to try to
annoy users with "features" nobody asked for or wants. <wink>
 
Hi Adam,
If you do not like it, then why don't you just disable it ?
Doing so you wouldn't have to waste our time with your nagging about it :-)

You are wasting your own time since I have no control over which posts
you or anybody else click on. In other words; grow up. Please.
 
Grow up yourself grumpy !


Adam Albright said:
You are wasting your own time since I have no control over which posts
you or anybody else click on. In other words; grow up. Please.
 
Adam Albright said:
I think there's some little back office somewhere in Microsoft's
Redmond campus where software engineers go out of their way to try to
annoy users with "features" nobody asked for or wants. <wink>

Yeah, I'm surprised they didn't bring back Clippy...
 
Soooo, you seem to think UAC is clumsy. How would you implement it hmm? Lets
hear it. I see everyone complaining about how its a good idea, but how MS
implemented it wrong. They gave the option to turn it off. Yet you still
harp on about it like its the worst thing in the world. But most haven't had
a problem with it because.... they disabled it!

So Mr Adam "I'm smarter than everyone" Albright, lets hear it... How should
it be implemented?
 
Julie said:
Soooo, you seem to think UAC is clumsy. How would you implement it hmm? Lets
hear it. I see everyone complaining about how its a good idea, but how MS
implemented it wrong. They gave the option to turn it off. Yet you still
harp on about it like its the worst thing in the world. But most haven't had
a problem with it because.... they disabled it!

So Mr Adam "I'm smarter than everyone" Albright, lets hear it... How should
it be implemented?
hahaha...good one! :-)
Frank
 
Soooo, you seem to think UAC is clumsy.

Don't just think it, KNOW it.
How would you implement it hmm? Lets hear it. I see everyone complaining
about how its a good idea, but how MS implemented it wrong. They gave the option
to turn it off. Yet you still harp on about it like its the worst thing in the
world. But most haven't had a problem with it because.... they disabled it!
So Mr Adam "I'm smarter than everyone" Albright, lets hear it... How should
it be implemented?

Smarter than everyone? Hell no, but for sure way smarter than the
typical fanboy that worships at the Microsoft alter and doesn't really
have a clue.

With a rules list. Which is what most firewalls use. The point being
UAC is so dumb it doesn't remember what you tell it. That is what can
drive you up a wall if you're busy or chasing deadlines. So if you
leave UAC on, you can repeat the same action that causes a UAC prompt
to appear and dumb old Vista will pop up the same warning, a dozen
times, a hundred times, ten thousands times and never learn a damn
thing.

That's extremely stupid since we're talking about a computer that can
easily be programmed to REMEMBER what you told it do to the last time
you did event X and LEARN from past experience. So while it may nag
about you deleting a shortcut or copying some file to a folder it's
trying to protect the first time, it could be taught to say oh, that
operation is ok, because MY BOSS, you the USER told me it was ok to
allow it.

What bugs more experienced users is you either have to put up with
endless nag screens or invest countless hours if you have some complex
system changing all kinds of permissions and then if you do all that
UAC often still won't function well or worse won't always let you make
changes. I could write a book on all the times I've seen grayed out
security options that Vista simply refuses to allow to be changed.
That Julie is just sloppy programming.
 
I can see your point of view. And btw, I'm not an MS fanboi (or fangirl).

However, logically looking at what UAC is and what its used for, the
deletion of a file (like in your example) and allowing UAC to always ignore
it would be defeating the purpose of what it is used for. If a mal user were
to access the pc and start to delete files, but you have 'always' allowed
the deletion of files, then UAC would not prompt the user to allow this. So
basically, UAC is worthless, it may as well be disabled.

Lets say I like to run notepad by manually executing it (notepad.exe), and
I've told UAC to always allow the execution of this app. Some loser sends me
an email (I'm a dumb user in this scenario) saying "Updated notepad!
Improved and better!" with notepad.exe attached. Sounds great, I'll execute
it... Whoops no UAC prompt. But in this scenario, a dumb user would just
execute it anyway.

What I'm trying to say is, I think UAC is designed to give more control to
the user, but at the same time, you're right... It is annoying, but thats
why I disabled it. And yes, it would be nice to have a rules list like
firewalls have. In the end, why complain about it when you can have the best
rule, disable it completely rule.

You have to admit, software design is difficult at the best of times. No
organisation can jump that hurdle everytime. Especially MS. More especially
linux distros (Yes, bring it on Alias :-)).

While I'm at it (this is for all the Vista complainers), sure, vista could
have stayed in beta for another year, but everyone would still have
complained. And take a look at apple, delaying their "great" new MacOS
'revision', and charging money for it. If apple had not released their os in
revisions, mac users would all still be waiting as well (and they have
specific hardware to develop for, MS has thousands).

Anyway, sorry for my rant :-) Hope everyone has a nice day :-)
 
I can see your point of view. And btw, I'm not an MS fanboi (or fangirl).

However, logically looking at what UAC is and what its used for, the
deletion of a file (like in your example) and allowing UAC to always ignore
it would be defeating the purpose of what it is used for. If a mal user were
to access the pc and start to delete files, but you have 'always' allowed
the deletion of files, then UAC would not prompt the user to allow this. So
basically, UAC is worthless, it may as well be disabled.

Not deletion of files, deletion of desktop shortcuts which can't pose
any threat since they are nothing but a link to a file, not the file
itself. This is what I mean by not being well implemented. There
simply is no intelligence behind what UAC warns you about in many
cases. As far as deleting files themselves, UAC is all over the map.
I've seen in nag for no reason when I try to delete some files, then
let the next ones with the same file permissions and ownership in the
same folder slip past without nagging about them at all.

My biggest beef is UAC is a phony as a three dollar bill and can be
easily tricked or bypassed. Classic example I've mentioned before are
applications that bypass normal Windows calls and just do their own
thing. Case in point; Bounce Back, a backup utility that use to come
with Seagate external drives. I can fire Bounce Back up, it will scan
my entire system, all 3 TBs of it, compile a detailed list of what
files have changed, then blow out any file I tell it to delete or copy
those that haven't been copied yet regardless what file permissions
are set Vista doesn't utter a peep. So it other words it is totally
fooled and therefore USELESS as far as providing any real security.

I would assume any hacker worth being called a hacker could easily
write similar code to quickly, easily and without Vista even knowing
what was going on do the same kind of file handling with little
effort. So again I got to wonder, why so many seemed fooled by
so-called "security" that is little more than window dressing.
Lets say I like to run notepad by manually executing it (notepad.exe), and
I've told UAC to always allow the execution of this app. Some loser sends me
an email (I'm a dumb user in this scenario) saying "Updated notepad!
Improved and better!" with notepad.exe attached. Sounds great, I'll execute
it... Whoops no UAC prompt. But in this scenario, a dumb user would just
execute it anyway.

What I'm trying to say is, I think UAC is designed to give more control to
the user, but at the same time, you're right... It is annoying, but thats
why I disabled it. And yes, it would be nice to have a rules list like
firewalls have. In the end, why complain about it when you can have the best
rule, disable it completely rule.

Because I expert MORE from Microsoft as the world's biggest software
developer. They made a big deal about offering more security and it
boils down to being mostly a sham. This is dangerous in that less
experienced users may let their guard down thinking Vista is
protecting them when it isn't really.
You have to admit, software design is difficult at the best of times.

Actually it becomes difficult when you take the I've got an army of
programmers approach that don't have a clue what the guy in the next
cubicle is doing. That's the Microsoft way. Heck, they got employees
roaming around on campus just looking for the right building let alone
trying to find the right person to question about a problem. That
explains why Windows is now a bloated 50 million lines. Gee wiz that's
nuts. At that size no human has a clue how all that cutter reacts with
other sections of code. Windows has got to the point where you have a
bunch of people that know how a little piece of code works down to the
nth degree but have little or no knowledge how the rest of it works or
doesn't with what they've written. That's a blueprint for disaster and
sadly that is what Windows has evolved or devolved into.
 
The worst part of it all, is if MS decided to start it all from scratch...
Compatability issues would never end, then we'd have everyone in a newsgroup
like this, complaining about how their software does not work.

I read a post on a site the other day (anti-ms article of some sort by some
linux loser), and someone said something that would be a good idea... "why
don't you losers go out and make your own OS that fixes all the problems
with all the other OS's"... Not a bad idea I thought. Will never happen tho.

Linux also has become bloated and extremely complex to learn. People will
argue against what I just said, but anyone who has to drop into user level 3
to install a video card driver wouldn't find that "easy". And then, the
driver installer couldn't a net connection, so it wanted to compile the
driver itself... I mean, give me a break!

I see what you mean tho. What I would love to see is a windows installer
that asks which features you want to install. Win2008B3 does it, why can't
Vista! But then again, looking at my linux complexity example above, MS is
trying to keep it very simple for users.
 
Julie

There is many posters on these Vista and other newsgroups asking what UAC is about ,why you need it, why you don't,etc.
That article that Adam posted from the MS TechNet site explains it extremely well. It is most helpful for people that ask about UAC to read and understand.

There was no mal intent on Adams part for posting that link and as a matter of fact it was and will be helpful to many.

Although Adam goes off the deep end occasionally he is very knowledgeable about computers. Just read some of his posts where he is posting about actual issues and you will see.

I am not defending Adam but when someone is right and posts something very usefully then answers like what you gave is not warranted

When someone goes off the deep end and instigates a post that causes many to jump in and attack that is something else. This was not one of them
 

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