Apple Dumps IBM/ Does Apple Have A Secret Plan?

[Seydou Bangoura]

I might also suggest a bit of massaging of your text to make it clearer
why you are saying what you are saying, and to add a bit more analysis
and support for your contentions. At this point, much of what you have
said is just a restatement of other web sites, along with some slightly
fuzzy text assigning motives. For example, "It is Jobs belief that" is
making a statement of SJ's opinions, and we do not really know them.
What we _do_ know is what he said on stage, so say "At WWDC 2005, he
said ...", then follow it with "At this point, Apple is shipping a 1.67
GHz powerbook, which competes with Intel products at 3.something GHz.
Benchmarks indicate that the gap is narrower than this might indicate
<reference here>, but the gap between desktop and laptop Macintosh
speeds is widening. <timeline here>"

This then gives people something specific to argue with. Essentially,
without that, and without hard, practical statements to back those
arguments up, people will not see things worth debating. (In other
words, while you 'agree on some aspects of the switch', the previous
paragraph consists only of potential problems, all of which have been
debated already.)

I understand what you are saying, providing hard facts to back up
statements. There is a lot of hard facts to back up statements, via
bench marks etc., like say an AMD vs Intel discussion. However you have
to consider the nature of this topic. Right now it's all speculation
but in a few years the real reasons why the switch was done will
probably be revealed. For our report we decided that the "hard facts"
was what CEO of Apple said at his recent keynote conference. We did not
make up anything. After that it was followed by speculation of the
implications of the switch. Our main purpose was to create a healthy
discussion. You do not need to be an expert. For example there could
have been something that we missed or said incorrectly.

quoting Ward McFarlane on my other thread:
The one reason I see rarely mentioned that I think was the critical one
for Jobs is that Intel offers hardware DRM. Apple's success with its
music download business and Job's contacts with the movie industry
means
to me that he wants to pioneer the legitimate movie download business
as
well. The movie industry would likely love such a thing, but would
*absolutely* require a really solid DRM system to permit it. Plus, it
gives Apple another competitive advantage for enhancing their music
business.

-- w

This comment makes a lot of sense. Apple's success with Itunes,
actually getting people to buy music rather than steal it is
unbelievable. If they use the same model for movies, it could change
the movie industry forever. However software DRM has not been received
kindly kindly by consumers, and hardware DRM is another story.

Seydou Bangoura
Robert Sones

 

[nobody]

Shouldn't you know that from your course?

To aggravate even further the issue, Windows (certain versions of
Windows, at least) run on a variety of hardware that goes beyond
the PC/Intel architecture.

So no, saying a "machine that traditionally runs Windows" doesn't
solve the problem.

I think the term "PC" (or "PC architecture") reflects what you were
trying to say -- saying Intel, or x86 architecture may be misleading
nowadays, given that AMD jumped in with their AMD64 architecture,
which fits with the PC.

Carlos

AMD64, aka x86-64, aka EM64T, aka iAMD64 ;-) , is an extension of x86
architecture, and, as such, a part of x86 family.

 

[nobody]

On 23 Jun 2005 21:50:00 -0700, "Seydou Bangoura" <[email protected]>
wrote:

....snip...

Which viewpoint do you agree with, if any? Please provide appropriate
criticisms and arguments, as this assignment will be evaluated based on
the quality of discussion and feedback.

Seydou Bangoura
Robert Sones

And what if you find my comments inappropriate? What you gonna do?
Hack me? Wipe out my hard drive? Go ahead, try it. I can even
provide my IP address for that purpose - it is 127.0.0.1 ;-)

 

[RobertS]

Robert Myers et al:

Thank you for your time and comments.

Robert Meyers: eWeek, CNET and many others were the main sources of our
research, as Carlos (out teacher) pointed out.

----------------------

John Biltz: "It's hardware not software where they make their
money."

True enough, especially with the iPod taking off, as it has. However
how do you separate hardware and software when it comes to Apple? They
are so closely tied together - boxes people can't clone and an OS
dependant on that box. One of the reasons that OS X works so well is
that "they" have control over the hardware.

--------------------------

notdisputandum.com:

I am personally not worried at all about the switch. I also use both
Macs and PCs. The problem many people seem to fear is the future
direction of Apple. Does it compete head to head, OS X with Windows?
Do they open up and allow cloning of their hardware? Do they allow
Windows to be put on an Apple box. Do they modify OS X so it can be
installed on any PC? Right now it is all speculation.

--------------------------

Carlos: You are correct about Intel/AMD and part of our presentation
will be about AMD. We kept it out of the original posting & paper only
because we were limited in size.

--------------------------

Norm: In reference to Balderstone: Although there is much more
"chaff" than substance, we have learned a lot. This is very
interesting, informative and definitely educational.

--------------------------

Tom Stiller: Thanks for the financial data - very interesting.

--------------------------

Scott Ellsworth: Like I said earlier, this is all new to us. Your
points about "messaging your text" are well taken. At this point
java.net & orerilly.net are not part of our assignment, since the
purpose of this was to post on newsgroups such as this. That said
however, I will definitely check them out.

--------------------------

Ward McFarland (from the other thread): That's an interesting point
about Apple moving over to the movie industry. In all the research we
did on this subject, you are the first to mention this as a possibility
and it seems to make good business sense. Most of the speculation has
been about the possibility of sharing platforms/apps with Windows (and
Linux).


Seydou Bangoura
Robert Sones

 

[Yousuf Khan]

<What's a "Windows machine" ?

I'm glad you pointed that out Grumble. That was one of our concerns
when we were writing this paper. What term do you use for a computer
that runs Windows? You can't use the term IBM compatible or IBM clone
anymore. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Yeah, recently (in the last several years) they've taken to calling what
they used to call IBM PC-compatibles as Wintel machines. Then the Linux
advocates objected saying Linux also runs on these machines, so the term
Lintel was born. AMD supporters are also correct in saying that the *tel
part (referring to Intel) is not accurrate either. There really is only
one common denominator amongst all of these machines and that is that it
includes an x86-compatible processor, either from AMD or Intel or
somebody else. So the most generic and accurate term is x86 computer.

Even with the addition of the 64-bit extensions to x86, it would still
be considered part of the x86 family. If however you want to refer to
just the 64-bit extensions in isolation of the rest of x86, then you can
call it generically x64 (which is short for x86-64).

Yousuf Khan

 

[keith]

iPods and iTunes Store

....and cell phones are about to take away the MP3 player market. The iPod
is last-year's news. What's next?

 

[michael]

cell phones are about to take away the MP3 player market. The iPod
is last-year's news. What's next?

Apple have iPhone sitting there ...
http://www.iphone.org/

m-

 

[keith]

Apple have iPhone sitting there ...
http://www.iphone.org/

Do you really think they can be competative in this market? I don't.

 

[michael]

Do you really think they can be competative in this market? I don't.

I was sceptical about iTunes but that's turned out a big money earner ...

My choice would be a wireless A4 tablet with handwriting/speech
recognition - I notice Tiger has a 'portrait' option for the Desktop so
that must be there for some reason ..

m-

 

[Randall Ainsworth]

...and cell phones are about to take away the MP3 player market. The iPod
is last-year's news. What's next?

I wouldn't bet on that just yet. And I'm probably one of the few people
on the planet that refuses to have a cell phone.

 

[michael]

I wouldn't bet on that just yet. And I'm probably one of the few people
on the planet that refuses to have a cell phone.

http://www.iphone.org/ = Apple's web site ...

m-

 

[Steve Hix]

Do you really think they can be competative in this market? I don't.

Why not?

 

[michael]

Why not?

If they partner with Motorola or Nokkia (both rumoured) and they produce
a cool device that works with iSync, iTunes and delivers H264 iChat then
it could be a killer.

 

[ward mcfarland]

This comment makes a lot of sense. Apple's success with Itunes,
actually getting people to buy music rather than steal it is
unbelievable. If they use the same model for movies, it could change
the movie industry forever. However software DRM has not been received
kindly kindly by consumers, and hardware DRM is another story.

It is not up to the consumers - Intel IS putting it into new high-end
hardware and Microsoft IS planning to incoroprate it into Windows.
Lobbyists (mostly from the entertainment market) seem to be making
headway into pushing legislation that may require it.

Besides the issue of preventing illegal copying of music and movies, it
would also address the issues of warez software, and possibly allow an
effective way of tracking email.

Pushed along by the patriot Act and fears of terrorists, the criminal
activity behind trojans and Internet scams, as well as economic
pressures to limit spam and protect intellectual property, my crystal
ball predicts the imminent end of our anonymous Internet playground.
Just like the "wild West" got tamed and civilized, so will the Internet.

If you and I and most everyone else like it or not.

-- w

 

[Tony Lawrence]

It is not up to the consumers - Intel IS putting it into new high-end
hardware and Microsoft IS planning to incoroprate it into Windows.
Lobbyists (mostly from the entertainment market) seem to be making
headway into pushing legislation that may require it.

And that could spell trouble for open source: I wrote about this before
at http://aplawrence.com/Opinion/licensedos.html and
http://aplawrence.com/Opinion/ipvsopensource.html but DRM is a related
issue. It's not inconceivable that Microsoft et al. would argue that
because open source exposes the enforcement mechanism of DRM, it should
be banned. Yes, I know the argument is ridiculous, but remember that
they'd be making this pitch to Congress-critters who aren't technically
savvy and whose pockets are well lined by people with reasons to want to
see open source squashed.

 

[keith]

I was sceptical about iTunes but that's turned out a big money earner ...

I wasn't skeptical about iTunes. I was skeptical about XMRadio and
Sirius, but there are ~5M people coughing up $13/mo to listen to the
radio (I'm one). People are willing to pay for service. It's just
got to be at the right point. XMSR and SIRI's recent successes made me
less skeptical about iTunes. Add in the iPod... Steve simply figured out
what no one else in RIAA-land could.

My choice would be a wireless A4 tablet with handwriting/speech
recognition - I notice Tiger has a 'portrait' option for the Desktop so
that must be there for some reason ..

Hmm, 210x297mm is a little big for my pocket, or ear.

 

[keith]

If they partner with Motorola or Nokkia (both rumoured) and they produce
a cool device that works with iSync, iTunes and delivers H264 iChat then
it could be a killer.

Perhaps, though I'm not sure why either company would want to. ISTM that
they'd want to keep the high-value property.

 

[keith]

I wouldn't bet on that just yet. And I'm probably one of the few people
on the planet that refuses to have a cell phone.

I've only had one (two actually) for a year and a half. They got cheaper
than land-lines, so I dumped the land-lines. I despise phone calls
and rarely use the phone, other than to talk to my mother once a
week or so. Our prime-time minutes are in the single-digits per month (one
in January, three in Feb . The two of us notwithstanding, there are a
few hundred million cell phones out there that are in a big need of
replacement (according to Moto, Nokia, etc.) and no one wants to carry a
second device. It's the obvious place to put the MP3 player. All the
phone is lacking is storage.

 

[Tony Lawrence]

I've only had one (two actually) for a year and a half. They got cheaper
than land-lines, so I dumped the land-lines. I despise phone calls
and rarely use the phone, other than to talk to my mother once a
week or so. Our prime-time minutes are in the single-digits per month (one
in January, three in Feb . The two of us notwithstanding, there are a
few hundred million cell phones out there that are in a big need of
replacement (according to Moto, Nokia, etc.) and no one wants to carry a
second device. It's the obvious place to put the MP3 player. All the
phone is lacking is storage.

I wonder how many are like me, hanging on to an ancient Nokia because it
works, seems to be almost indestructible (I've sent it bouncing across
parking lots more then once by overenthusiastic arm waving) and because
we just don't care about music, cameras, etc.

For me, the cell phone is just a phone. I don't need or want anything
else.

Of course, I'm not a music fan, not a sports fan, and don't take
pictures. I imagine most folks would match at least two of those, so
I'm surely a tiny minority.

Now, if and when it gets to the point where I can magically have a full
size virtual keyboard and screen projected from it, and the storage that
you note, maybe then I'll feel differently about it.

 

[YKhan]

<What's a "Windows machine" ?

I'm glad you pointed that out Grumble. That was one of our concerns
when we were writing this paper. What term do you use for a computer
that runs Windows? You can't use the term IBM compatible or IBM clone
anymore. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Yeah, recently (in the last several years) they've taken to calling
what they used to call IBM PC-compatibles as Wintel machines. Then the
Linux advocates objected saying Linux also runs on these machines, so
the term Lintel was born. AMD supporters are also correct in saying
that the *tel part (referring to Intel) is not accurrate either. There
really is only one common denominator amongst all of these machines and
that is that it includes an x86-compatible processor, either from AMD
or Intel or somebody else. So the most generic and accurate term is x86
computer.

Even with the addition of the 64-bit extensions to x86, it would still
be considered part of the x86 family. If however you want to refer to
just the 64-bit extensions in isolation of the rest of x86, then you
can call it generically x64 (which is short for x86-64).

Yousuf Khan