An amusing example of Vista's cleverness

[Qu0ll]

I have a folder on a partition where I store disk images created by Acronis
True Image (.tib files). For some reason, Vista in its infinite wisdom has
decided that this folder contains "picture" type images and has presented me
with columns such as "Date Taken" and "Rating" along with a "Slide Show"
option above. I guess it's trying to be smart with a file type that
includes the word "Image". There's nothing but .tib files in this folder
and there are no images anywhere on the partition. If I click on "More" to
try to select the correct columns I am presented with options such as "Frame
width" and "Camera model" all of which have little relevance to disk images.

I know I can ignore all the amusing options and just select the correct
columns but I thought it was an interesting example of how "smart" Vista
tries to be...

--
And loving it,

-Q
_________________________________________________
(e-mail address removed)
(Replace the "SixFour" with numbers to email me)

 

[Richard Urban]

Conversely, I have a partition on my 4th hard drive where I have about 15
various .tib images stored for three different operating systems that have
just plain yellow folder icons. If you create a folder within Documents, I
believe that the O/S tries to guess what is there and applies a template.

Again, one of the reasons that I do virtually ALL of my disk maintenance
from within Total Commander. I rarely, if ever, use Explorer for "anything".

--


Regards,

Richard Urban
Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User
(For email, remove the obvious from my address)

Quote from George Ankner:
If you knew as much as you think you know,
You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!

 

[Adam Albright]

I have a folder on a partition where I store disk images created by Acronis
True Image (.tib files). For some reason, Vista in its infinite wisdom has
decided that this folder contains "picture" type images and has presented me
with columns such as "Date Taken" and "Rating" along with a "Slide Show"
option above. I guess it's trying to be smart with a file type that
includes the word "Image". There's nothing but .tib files in this folder
and there are no images anywhere on the partition. If I click on "More" to
try to select the correct columns I am presented with options such as "Frame
width" and "Camera model" all of which have little relevance to disk images.

I know I can ignore all the amusing options and just select the correct
columns but I thought it was an interesting example of how "smart" Vista
tries to be...

One of Microsoft's biggest problems they've ALWAYS had is their
endless attempts to write "smart" code that ends up being stupid and
either insults the end user's intelligence or slows their system down
for no good reason.

Microsoft still don't get it is MY computer (and YOUR computer), not
their computers. I decide (you decide) where, if, how to move copy,
delete, rename files. I (you decide) decide if or not I want their
klunky defrag crap running in the background, if I want files indexed,
thumbnails created, column headings added, changed, etc.. I'm sick and
tired of some bubble headed geek sitting in some cubicle in Redmond
trying to decide what's best for me with useless garbage like UAC or
sniffing my files for DRM violations and all the other behind your
back crap Vista now does without telling you or asking you. I CAN
DECIDE FOR MYSELF!

 

[Qu0ll]

Conversely, I have a partition on my 4th hard drive where I have about 15
various .tib images stored for three different operating systems that have
just plain yellow folder icons. If you create a folder within Documents, I
believe that the O/S tries to guess what is there and applies a template.

Vista had it right in regard to this folder for weeks in that the correct
columns were displayed. It's just today that it's decided to be a bit
"clever".

Again, one of the reasons that I do virtually ALL of my disk maintenance
from within Total Commander. I rarely, if ever, use Explorer for
"anything".

Good tip.

--
And loving it,

-Q
_________________________________________________
(e-mail address removed)
(Replace the "SixFour" with numbers to email me)

 

[Adam Albright]

Conversely, I have a partition on my 4th hard drive where I have about 15
various .tib images stored for three different operating systems that have
just plain yellow folder icons. If you create a folder within Documents, I
believe that the O/S tries to guess what is there and applies a template.

Again, one of the reasons that I do virtually ALL of my disk maintenance
from within Total Commander. I rarely, if ever, use Explorer for "anything".

Yet you and other MVPs are seen almost daily singing the praises of
Microsoft. Do you have a dictionary? Please look up the word
hypocrite.

Here, I'll save you the bother:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...ypocrite&sa=X&oi=glossary_definition&ct=title

What I find deliciously funny is most MVPs while staunchly defending
Microsoft, when pushed they admit they don't use many of Vista's core
features themselves, like basic file copying/moving which is at the
heart of ANY operating system's main features, yet they are seen here
constantly whining every time somebody dares to be critical of
Microsoft about anything.

Classic example of do as I say, not as I do.

 

[Nick Mason]

Microsoft still don't get it is MY computer (and YOUR computer), not
their computers. I decide (you decide) where, if, how to move copy,
delete, rename files. I (you decide) decide if or not I want their
klunky defrag crap running in the background, if I want files indexed,
thumbnails created, column headings added, changed, etc.. I'm sick and
tired of some bubble headed geek sitting in some cubicle in Redmond
trying to decide what's best for me with useless garbage like UAC or
sniffing my files for DRM violations and all the other behind your
back crap Vista now does without telling you or asking you. I CAN
DECIDE FOR MYSELF!

I have a lot of sympathy with your view but you are a user who knows what
he's doing and what he wants from his computer.

Most of the people I deal with know little or nothing about their computer.
They want it to behave like any other bit of consumer hardware they own,
computer or toaster, they don't care how it works and they don't want to get
involved. Many of them don't don't move files about and they only delete
stuff when they run out of space, then they start deleting stuff they
shouldn't.

How many 'users' do you know with state of the art PCs who only use them for
email, browsing, a bit of on-line shopping and to write the occasional
document?

I'm amazed by the number of people who ask me to 'Get rid of the Start
button and tool bar.' All they want is a blank desktop with three icons,
email, word processor and browser.

 

[Not Me]

And there should be a way to set it up as a power user wants, not locked
down & unconfigurable.
If I wanted a toaster, I'd get a MAC.
To have to hack the registry & use third party software to make it work
anywhere close to the way you want is silly.
You can do that with free software...look at AOL.
They tried to make it as easy as possible for beginners, locked down
software, no customizing available.
Now they are giving their service away and still declining.
I like the Ditech commercial (even if it's only HALF true)
People are smart...
MS is treating us like dummies.

 

[Don Varnau]

Hi,
You can get Vista to leave your column settings alone...

To set columns for a folder, right-click in the folder >Customize this
folder> What kind of folder do you want? Use this folder as a template>
select "All Items." Vista should stop changing columns for that folder.

Hope this helps,
Don
[MS MVP- IE]

 

[Tom Lake]

Microsoft still don't get it is MY computer (and YOUR computer), not
their computers.

Not any more it isn't! "My Computer" has become "Computer".

They're slowly getting us used to the fact that, in the future, we won't own
the computer, just license it. To buy a license to use a computer, you'll
have to agree to a EULA. No software will run on the machine until you do
and even then the software will be on the Web rather than resident on the
machine you're using. After we're used to that model, they'll start
charging
a subscription fee to allow us to use the computers in our home. If you
don't
pay, you'll have a nice piece of useless hardware. No software will run on
it
until you "re-up" and pay the fee.

8^) (At least I *hope* it's only a joke!)

Tom Lake

 

[Nick Mason]

And there should be a way to set it up as a power user wants, not
locked down & unconfigurable.
If I wanted a toaster, I'd get a MAC.
To have to hack the registry & use third party software to make it
work anywhere close to the way you want is silly.
You can do that with free software...look at AOL.
They tried to make it as easy as possible for beginners, locked down
software, no customizing available.
Now they are giving their service away and still declining.
I like the Ditech commercial (even if it's only HALF true)
People are smart...
MS is treating us like dummies.

You miss the point, most PC users are dummies and MS caters for the
majority, that's just good business sense.

It isn't silly to have to set it up as we want. You use the tool MS gave
power users, regedit and the administrative tools that allow you to start
and stop services, set policies and generaly configure windows to do what
you want it to the way you want it to. That's what being a power user is.

You seem to confusing the way you want Windows to work with the way other
users want it to work. I bet what I want differs from what you want, we each
have our own idea of what it should be like. MS have to start somewhere,
there has to be an out of the box set up and they've gone for one that the
majority are happy with. You, me and the other power users need to put in a
little effort to get things right for us. It isn't a problem for me and many
others.

Being smart has nothing to do with it. My wife is smart, she speaks five
languages and has two degrees but she knows nothing about computers. She can
do email, create documents and spreadsheets and that's all she needs.

 

[theclyde]

Not any more it isn't! "My Computer" has become "Computer".

They're slowly getting us used to the fact that, in the future, we won't own
the computer, just license it. To buy a license to use a computer, you'll
have to agree to a EULA. No software will run on the machine until you do
and even then the software will be on the Web rather than resident on the
machine you're using. After we're used to that model, they'll start
charging
a subscription fee to allow us to use the computers in our home. If you
don't
pay, you'll have a nice piece of useless hardware. No software will run on
it
until you "re-up" and pay the fee.

8^) (At least I *hope* it's only a joke!)

Tom Lake

Might be a joke, but it seems true. What seems even more true is the
disconnect between people and their data. Total abstraction between
the app, os and filesystem might be a wonderful thing for the ultimate
end user. But not being able to reliably find and use your files makes
life hard for anybody doing anything more sophisticated than browsing
and email.

 

[Les]

I have a lot of sympathy with your view but you are a user who knows what
he's doing and what he wants from his computer.

Most of the people I deal with know little or nothing about their
computer. They want it to behave like any other bit of consumer hardware
they own, computer or toaster, they don't care how it works and they don't
want to get involved. Many of them don't don't move files about and they
only delete stuff when they run out of space, then they start deleting
stuff they shouldn't.

How many 'users' do you know with state of the art PCs who only use them
for email, browsing, a bit of on-line shopping and to write the occasional
document?

I'm amazed by the number of people who ask me to 'Get rid of the Start
button and tool bar.' All they want is a blank desktop with three icons,
email, word processor and browser.

I fully agree with the OP, but also agree with your point about the 'three
icons' approach. This is what MS don't get. Even the lowest of their Vista
(and XP) is still way above what the average user wants or needs.

If MS were to produce a very basic OS which had none of the corporate junk
included, which offered a platform with a file system and the means to use
programs of choice, which didn't have anything other than the OS itself.
Then I and I suspect many others would be perfectly happy with that. Never
mind the included email/browser, there are plenty available if needed. Even
a word processor is not needed by many users.

Plain and simple is my preference. An OS which doesn't need a degree in IT
would be a winner.

 

[Dave Cox]

I fully agree with the OP, but also agree with your point about
the 'three icons' approach. This is what MS don't get. Even the
lowest of their Vista (and XP) is still way above what the average
user wants or needs.

If MS were to produce a very basic OS which had none of the
corporate junk included, which offered a platform with a file
system and the means to use programs of choice, which didn't have
anything other than the OS itself. Then I and I suspect many
others would be perfectly happy with that. Never mind the included
email/browser, there are plenty available if needed. Even a word
processor is not needed by many users.

Plain and simple is my preference. An OS which doesn't need a
degree in IT would be a winner.

Microsoft has developed a very basic OS

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_CE

 

[Richard Urban]

If MS were to produce a very basic OS which had none of the corporate junk
included, which offered a platform with a file system and the means to use
programs of choice, which didn't have anything other than the OS itself.
Then I and I suspect many others would be perfectly happy with that. Never
mind the included email/browser, there are plenty available if needed.
Even a word processor is not needed by many users.

**************************************************************


I would guess that 75-80% of the people would NOT know where to go to find
what they want. I would further venture that a great majority don't know
what they want. If they are not presented with an option to perform video
editing (included with the O/S) they would not know that their computer was
capable of doing so.

Remember, the computer is designed, along with the operating system, for the
average to below average user. That is the main reason that so much is
included by default. Some people never knew that they should defrag their
computer once in a while. Some never did, even after years of use. Now Vista
does it automatically for you, in the background. The average, below
average, user doesn't even know it is doing so.

 

[Adam Albright]

**************************************************************


I would guess that 75-80% of the people would NOT know where to go to find
what they want. I would further venture that a great majority don't know
what they want. If they are not presented with an option to perform video
editing (included with the O/S) they would not know that their computer was
capable of doing so.

Baloney. It is exactly because of people like you that Microsoft dumb
down their software to the lowest common denominator and forces THEIR
WAY on the masses. I have more faith in the human race. People aren't
as stupid as you want to make them. If this was the late 1970's you
comments may have some merit. Personal computers were just coming on
the scene. Get up to speed Richie, this is 2007. People know how to
use computers. It is just another accepted tool that most people have
and know how to use at least at a basic level. Granted, some people
are better with computers than others. Ditto for anything. I suck at
car repair for example.

Remember, the computer is designed, along with the operating system, for the
average to below average user.

Because you say so? More rubbish.

News Flash, Microsoft doesn't make computers. It makes software.

That is the main reason that so much is
included by default. Some people never knew that they should defrag their
computer once in a while. Some never did, even after years of use. Now Vista
does it automatically for you, in the background. The average, below
average, user doesn't even know it is doing so.

Let me guess, little Richie of course considers himself an above
average user.

ROTFLMAO!

Software is nothing more than instructions to get your computer to do
some task. Good software is intuitive. Bad software is pushy, in your
face, bloated, slow, clumsy and forces you to do things a certain way,
becomes a nag. Guess what kind of software Microsoft writes?

The point is a operating system should stick to just operating your
other software in conjunction with your hardware and perform some
basic housekeeping tasks like file copying/moving/deleting. Aside from
that it should be and REMAIN in the background. Non intrusive, not a
net nanny, not a nag or a pest or pain in the ass. Again I'm of course
describing what Vista has become. I as a user should be able to REMOVE
or totally disable things I don't want like a badly designed and
obviously broken Media Player. You can't. I should be able to ONCE set
up my folders how I want them and Vista should leave it alone,
remembering how I set things up. It won't or can't. I should be able
to decide what level of "security" I want, Vista wants to decide for
me preferring instead to endlessly nag about things I've told it not
to worry about endless times; UAC.

The bottom line is Microsoft knows how to do marketing but does a piss
ass poor job at writing software. The developers of Linux don't know
squat about marketing, but write clever software. Mac does both pretty
good, but the company is run by an arrogant SOB and therefore I and
many others refuse to buy it. Besides, it is way over priced.

 

[KristleBawl]

I agree! Mom was a high school dropout and got her GED when I was in my
early teens. She then got a better job, was eventually promoted, and learned
how to do business accounting, reports, payroll, taxes, etc., self-taught on
an IBM with DOS, by reading the manual! Now she's semi-retired and handles
outsourced payroll for several local small businesses, part-time.

Children have computers in school, a laptop is nearly required for
college/university, and now an entire generation has grown up with Internet
access. You can find personal web pages for babies and pets. People are
learning. AOL used to be a good place to start until you got savvy enough
for a *real* ISP. Some people used to say the same about a Mac. ;-)

User/Admin accounts are ok for other people, on a network at work, but I
don't need it or want it at home just to share the DSL connection and
printer. Four flavors of Vista I can understand, but the ability to more
easily customize everything from menu bars and buttons to the taskbar and
start menu on Vista, and programs running on it, are important, too.

Every new OS is at least a little different from all the others before it,
we will get used to Vista, too, but I still want to be able to set it up
with my own personal preferences. I want to be able to set up others with
more locked or hidden settings I can control quickly and easily, for less
experienced users to use certain programs (documents, drafting, photo
editing, whatever) and get the basic internet services (email, browsing, IM,
etc.) and set the updates, defrag, etc. on *my* schedule.

OEM or Full Retail, it doesn't matter, we should be able to choose much more
settings, options and behaviors than Vista includes.

Please forgive my rant, I'm just a bit irritated with looking for
settings/options that do not exist.

KB

"Adam Albright" wrote in message

<snip> Microsoft dumb
down their software to the lowest common denominator and forces THEIR
WAY on the masses. I have more faith in the human race. People aren't
as stupid as you want to make them. If this was the late 1970's you
comments may have some merit. Personal computers were just coming on
the scene. Get up to speed Richie, this is 2007. People know how to
use computers. It is just another accepted tool that most people have
and know how to use at least at a basic level. Granted, some people
are better with computers than others. Ditto for anything. I suck at
car repair for example.

 

[NotMe]

It's like MS has adopted the old 20/60/20 training class rule.
The top 20% will figure it out with or without instruction.
The bottom 20% won't be able to figure it out no matter how much
training/instruction they get.
The training is aimed at the 60% in the middle that will become at least
somewhat proficient with minimal training.

AOL wrote their software that way for years, and just look at how quickly
they have overtaken MS as the leading software provider...

 

[Charles W Davis]

I fully agree with the OP, but also agree with your point about the 'three
icons' approach. This is what MS don't get. Even the lowest of their Vista
(and XP) is still way above what the average user wants or needs.

If MS were to produce a very basic OS which had none of the corporate junk
included, which offered a platform with a file system and the means to use
programs of choice, which didn't have anything other than the OS itself.
Then I and I suspect many others would be perfectly happy with that. Never
mind the included email/browser, there are plenty available if needed.
Even a word processor is not needed by many users.

Plain and simple is my preference. An OS which doesn't need a degree in IT
would be a winner.

There are so many complaints about the vast number of different versions of
Vista. What I seem to read, is that some want a version "sliced" this a-way.
Others want a version sliced that a-way. As soon as they get the one
taylored to their specifications, their hobby (or business) changes, now
they must get the version sliced another way.

I teach a couple of classes for our Computer Club each month. One is titled
"Considerations in buying a Computer." During the three hours session, I see
many blank looks when some particular item is mentioned. I try to spot these
and ask the member to explain their confusion. Most of the time: "Geeeeze, I
didn't know a computer could to that!" Consider this, the computer that they
are considering to replace is 8 years old, and even it will do "that." Our
Question & Answer session each Thursday morning is filled with similat
events. To join our Computer Club one must be a resident of an age
restricticted community. Many have never seen a computer until their kids
bought them one when they moved from "somewhere" so that they could send
pictures attached to e-mail. Others are former CEOs that always had someone
else tend to the computer "bit." Needless to say our initial class is known
as "Mouse & Keyboard" Even experienced users, find many interesting facts
about the keyboard.

I have a 1999 Buick Regal GS. I have never used the CD player that came with
it. But I do use the supercharger when cruising throughout the West. My wife
doesn't even know what a supercharger is, but I've seen her use it.