All MS updates since SP3??

[Ken]

I have a church group that wants to reload Windows XP to a group of
computers for instructional purposes. Is there a single download that
is perhaps in an ISO form or can be put on a disk that contains most of
the MS hot fixes etc. issued since SP3 was issued? I realize that once
the computers are loaded they will be seeking to download all those
updates, but inserting a disk containing them would sure be faster than
downloading the updates for each computer. Thanks.

 

[philo]

I have a church group that wants to reload Windows XP to a group of
computers for instructional purposes. Is there a single download that
is perhaps in an ISO form or can be put on a disk that contains most of
the MS hot fixes etc. issued since SP3 was issued? I realize that once
the computers are loaded they will be seeking to download all those
updates, but inserting a disk containing them would sure be faster than
downloading the updates for each computer. Thanks.

You can create an off-line archive using this:


http://download.wsusoffline.net/

 

[Ken]

You can create an off-line archive using this:


http://download.wsusoffline.net/

Thanks for the link, but I am not sure I understand how it works. Does
this download (I have tje zip file wsusoffline89) have an executable
file that retrieves all the updates since SP3, or do I need to do that
manually? (I see several executable files, but I am not sure which if
any start the process.) I can live with a program that will download
one file after another and save them in a directory, but not doing it
manually.

If there was a download where someone had already accumulated these
files, that would be even better.

 

[Ken]

You can create an off-line archive using this:


http://download.wsusoffline.net/

Thanks for the link, but I am not sure I understand how it works. Does
this download (I have the zip file wsusoffline89) have an executable
file that retrieves all the updates since SP3, or do I need to do that
manually? (I see several executable files, but I am not sure which if
any start the process.) I can live with a program that will download
one file after another and save them in a directory, but not doing it
manually.

If there was a download where someone had already accumulated these
files, that would be even better.

 

[Ken]

Thanks for the link, but I am not sure I understand how it works. Does
this download (I have the zip file wsusoffline89) have an executable
file that retrieves all the updates since SP3, or do I need to do that
manually? (I see several executable files, but I am not sure which if
any start the process.) I can live with a program that will download
one file after another and save them in a directory, but not doing it
manually.

If there was a download where someone had already accumulated these
files, that would be even better.

Wait a minute, I think I found it. UpdateGenerator.exe ??

 

[BillW50]

In Ken typed:

I have a church group that wants to reload Windows XP to a group of
computers for instructional purposes. Is there a single download that
is perhaps in an ISO form or can be put on a disk that contains most
of the MS hot fixes etc. issued since SP3 was issued? I realize that
once the computers are loaded they will be seeking to download all
those updates, but inserting a disk containing them would sure be
faster than downloading the updates for each computer. Thanks.

There is even a far easier way. If you are installing XP from scratch on
a bunch of computers. Then you can create an install disc with all of
the current updates as well. You can also throw some applications on it
too. This method is called slipstreaming. So when you install Windows,
all updates and applications are installed too.

Another similar method is taking one computer that has all of the
updates and applications and you back it up with a special version of
Acronis or Paragon. Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s).

 

[Motor T]

Thanks for the link, but I am not sure I understand how it works. Does
this download (I have the zip file wsusoffline89) have an executable
file that retrieves all the updates since SP3, or do I need to do that
manually? (I see several executable files, but I am not sure which if
any start the process.) I can live with a program that will download
one file after another and save them in a directory, but not doing it
manually.

If there was a download where someone had already accumulated these
files, that would be even better.

Look for videos of wsusoffline on YouTube. Some pretty good ones.

 

[Ken]

Look for videos of wsusoffline on YouTube. Some pretty good ones.

Ran the program and created an ISO file. It worked just fine. I guess
I was expecting to see some directions on the page I first visited as to
how to run it. The instructions were on another page labeled
"Documentation."

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

In message <[email protected]>, BillW50 <[email protected]>
writes:
[]

There is even a far easier way. If you are installing XP from scratch on
a bunch of computers. Then you can create an install disc with all of
the current updates as well. You can also throw some applications on it
too. This method is called slipstreaming. So when you install Windows,
all updates and applications are installed too.

Another similar method is taking one computer that has all of the
updates and applications and you back it up with a special version of
Acronis or Paragon. Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s).

But how do those restores get on with regitration/activation/whatever? I
presume there is something to stop this method being used to create
multiple PCs that appear as "legal", or at least working, XP machines.

 

[BillW50]

There is even a far easier way. If you are installing XP from scratch on
a bunch of computers. Then you can create an install disc with all of
the current updates as well. You can also throw some applications on it
too. This method is called slipstreaming. So when you install Windows,
all updates and applications are installed too.

Another similar method is taking one computer that has all of the
updates and applications and you back it up with a special version of
Acronis or Paragon. Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s).

But how do those restores get on with regitration/activation/whatever? I
presume there is something to stop this method being used to create
multiple PCs that appear as "legal", or at least working, XP machines.[/QUOTE]

Many OEM like Dell, Gateway, etc use preactivated installs. If you
install them on machines they are meant for, they use a generic key and
it is already activated. If it isn't meant for that computer, it will
ask you for a key. Or some others may refuse to install.

But if you use a non-OEM install and you used the slipstreaming method
to install applications and updates, then you have to enter a key and
activate every install.

How Acronis and Paragon method works is by replacing the drivers with
generic drivers. And when you boot up for the first time on a different
machine, Windows will say found new hardware and replace those generic
drivers with other ones. And since the new machine is probably much
different than the original machine, thus it will trip the many hardware
change and tell you that you have to reactivate it again.

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

But how do those restores get on with regitration/activation/whatever? I
presume there is something to stop this method being used to create
multiple PCs that appear as "legal", or at least working, XP machines.

Many OEM like Dell, Gateway, etc use preactivated installs. If you
install them on machines they are meant for, they use a generic key and
it is already activated. If it isn't meant for that computer, it will
ask you for a key. Or some others may refuse to install.

But if you use a non-OEM install and you used the slipstreaming method
to install applications and updates, then you have to enter a key and
activate every install.

How Acronis and Paragon method works is by replacing the drivers with
generic drivers. And when you boot up for the first time on a different
machine, Windows will say found new hardware and replace those generic
drivers with other ones. And since the new machine is probably much
different than the original machine, thus it will trip the many
hardware change and tell you that you have to reactivate it again.
[/QUOTE]
Ah, so when you said "Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s)", you meant restoring to a state that still needs
activation. I misunderstood; I'd assuming "restoring" meant to a working
state.

 

[micky]

[]
There is even a far easier way. If you are installing XP from scratch on
a bunch of computers. Then you can create an install disc with all of
the current updates as well. You can also throw some applications on it
too. This method is called slipstreaming. So when you install Windows,
all updates and applications are installed too.

Another similar method is taking one computer that has all of the
updates and applications and you back it up with a special version of
Acronis or Paragon. Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s).

But how do those restores get on with regitration/activation/whatever? I
presume there is something to stop this method being used to create
multiple PCs that appear as "legal", or at least working, XP machines.

Many OEM like Dell, Gateway, etc use preactivated installs. If you
install them on machines they are meant for, they use a generic key and
it is already activated. If it isn't meant for that computer, it will
ask you for a key. Or some others may refuse to install.

But if you use a non-OEM install and you used the slipstreaming method
to install applications and updates, then you have to enter a key and
activate every install.

How Acronis and Paragon method works is by replacing the drivers with
generic drivers. And when you boot up for the first time on a different
machine, Windows will say found new hardware and replace those generic
drivers with other ones. And since the new machine is probably much
different than the original machine, thus it will trip the many
hardware change and tell you that you have to reactivate it again.

Ah, so when you said "Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s)", you meant restoring to a state that still needs
activation. I misunderstood; I'd assuming "restoring" meant to a working
state.

If your set of computers are all the same brand and model, there
hardware will be the same as the first one and they won't need changes.
It also won't need activation if there are few hardware changes.

And if the computer models are not the same, IIRC, even with generic
drivers, the computer is in a working state. The correct driver is
usually found within XP and installed almost automatically, but if it
hasn't happened yet, or if one says No to changing the driver, IIRC,
things will work, but in some cases not as well as with the proper
driver. Especially the monitor may not have as high a resolution as it
could. If activation is required, that doesn't take long.

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

On 1/17/2014 4:55 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
There is even a far easier way. If you are installing XP from scratch on
a bunch of computers. Then you can create an install disc with all of
the current updates as well. You can also throw some applications on it
too. This method is called slipstreaming. So when you install Windows,
all updates and applications are installed too.

Another similar method is taking one computer that has all of the
updates and applications and you back it up with a special version of
Acronis or Paragon. Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s).

But how do those restores get on with regitration/activation/whatever? I
presume there is something to stop this method being used to create
multiple PCs that appear as "legal", or at least working, XP machines.

Many OEM like Dell, Gateway, etc use preactivated installs. If you
install them on machines they are meant for, they use a generic key and
it is already activated. If it isn't meant for that computer, it will
ask you for a key. Or some others may refuse to install.

But if you use a non-OEM install and you used the slipstreaming method
to install applications and updates, then you have to enter a key and
activate every install.

How Acronis and Paragon method works is by replacing the drivers with
generic drivers. And when you boot up for the first time on a different
machine, Windows will say found new hardware and replace those generic
drivers with other ones. And since the new machine is probably much
different than the original machine, thus it will trip the many
hardware change and tell you that you have to reactivate it again.

Ah, so when you said "Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s)", you meant restoring to a state that still needs
activation. I misunderstood; I'd assuming "restoring" meant to a working
state.

If your set of computers are all the same brand and model, there
hardware will be the same as the first one and they won't need changes.
It also won't need activation if there are few hardware changes.

I clearly misunderstood "totally different computer" - you meant
different in serial number. (I guess it was the word "totally" that
threw me.)

And if the computer models are not the same, IIRC, even with generic
drivers, the computer is in a working state. The correct driver is
usually found within XP and installed almost automatically, but if it

I agree, that is my experience.

hasn't happened yet, or if one says No to changing the driver, IIRC,
things will work, but in some cases not as well as with the proper

(Is it likely to be the case that saying no to driver changes is likely
to reduce the chance of activation being needed?)

driver. Especially the monitor may not have as high a resolution as it
could. If activation is required, that doesn't take long.

If Microsoft allows it?

I've not yet heard any even hints as to how long XP activation will be
provided. It could cease on x April, of course, though I'd have thought
that if that was planned, we'd have heard at least rumours by now. Of
course, the best outcome - for users! - would be for MS to release code
for activation servers after April, but I don't expect that to happen!

 

[BillW50]

In J. P. Gilliver (John) typed:

If Microsoft allows it?

I've not yet heard any even hints as to how long XP activation will be
provided. It could cease on x April, of course, though I'd have
thought that if that was planned, we'd have heard at least rumours by
now. Of course, the best outcome - for users! - would be for MS to
release code for activation servers after April, but I don't expect
that to happen!

While XP was the first Microsoft product that I could recall that
usually requires activation (some don't). But there has been other
Microsoft products since then that has been long discontinued. Yet they
still can be activated. MS Flight Simulator X is one example. And so can
be all Office versions that requires activation is another.

 

[micky]

In message <[email protected]>, BillW50 <[email protected]>
writes:
On 1/17/2014 4:55 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
[]
There is even a far easier way. If you are installing XP from scratch on
a bunch of computers. Then you can create an install disc with all of
the current updates as well. You can also throw some applications on it
too. This method is called slipstreaming. So when you install Windows,
all updates and applications are installed too.

Another similar method is taking one computer that has all of the
updates and applications and you back it up with a special version of
Acronis or Paragon. Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s).

But how do those restores get on with regitration/activation/whatever? I
presume there is something to stop this method being used to create
multiple PCs that appear as "legal", or at least working, XP machines.

Many OEM like Dell, Gateway, etc use preactivated installs. If you
install them on machines they are meant for, they use a generic key and
it is already activated. If it isn't meant for that computer, it will
ask you for a key. Or some others may refuse to install.

But if you use a non-OEM install and you used the slipstreaming method
to install applications and updates, then you have to enter a key and
activate every install.

How Acronis and Paragon method works is by replacing the drivers with
generic drivers. And when you boot up for the first time on a different
machine, Windows will say found new hardware and replace those generic
drivers with other ones. And since the new machine is probably much
different than the original machine, thus it will trip the many
hardware change and tell you that you have to reactivate it again.

Ah, so when you said "Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s)", you meant restoring to a state that still needs
activation. I misunderstood; I'd assuming "restoring" meant to a working
state.

If your set of computers are all the same brand and model, there
hardware will be the same as the first one and they won't need changes.
It also won't need activation if there are few hardware changes.

I clearly misunderstood "totally different computer" - you meant
different in serial number. (I guess it was the word "totally" that
threw me.)

It was BillW, not me, who wrote the posts before yours. I can't find
"totally different computer" but I took computer "much different from
the original" to mean a Dell instead of a Compaq, with different video
cards (plug-in or built-in) or different sound cards, etc, not just the
serial number. In fact if two serial numbers were 1 apart from each
other, I'd expect the machines likely to be the same.

I agree, that is my experience.


(Is it likely to be the case that saying no to driver changes is likely
to reduce the chance of activation being needed?)

I believe so, though I have no experience doing that . What I wonder
is, if you allow one change, like the video driver, and hold off for a
few months for the next change, will it forget that that makes 2
changes, or will it keep a cumulative list and require activation at a
certain point.

If Microsoft allows it?

Again I have no experience with other products, like BillW does, but I
think the whole idea of "not supporting" is exaggerated in people's
minds. I think it only means that they will not write fixes for
problems noticed in the future, not that they will keep people from
downloading fixes already written. And now that you mention it, not
that they will not permit activation. A lot of people would be angry
to learn, in many casesl, at the last minute, that they can't reactivate
their windows.

I've not yet heard any even hints as to how long XP activation will be
provided. It could cease on x April, of course, though I'd have thought
that if that was planned, we'd have heard at least rumours by now. Of

I woudl expect it to be announced by MS at the same time lack of support
was announced.

course, the best outcome - for users! - would be for MS to release code
for activation servers after April, but I don't expect that to happen!

Why would MS have to release more code? What's wrong with the code that
exists?

 

[micky]

In message <[email protected]>, micky
On Sat, 18 Jan 2014 09:47:20 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"

In message <[email protected]>, BillW50 <[email protected]>
writes:
On 1/17/2014 4:55 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message <[email protected]>, BillW50 <[email protected]>
writes: []
There is even a far easier way. If you are installing XP from
scratch on
a bunch of computers. Then you can create an install disc with all
of
the current updates as well. You can also throw some applications on
it
too. This method is called slipstreaming. So when you install
Windows,
all updates and applications are installed too.

Another similar method is taking one computer that has all of the
updates and applications and you back it up with a special version
of
Acronis or Paragon. Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s).

But how do those restores get on with
regitration/activation/whatever? I
presume there is something to stop this method being used to create
multiple PCs that appear as "legal", or at least working, XP
machines.

Many OEM like Dell, Gateway, etc use preactivated installs. If you
install them on machines they are meant for, they use a generic key
and
it is already activated. If it isn't meant for that computer, it will
ask you for a key. Or some others may refuse to install.

But if you use a non-OEM install and you used the slipstreaming method
to install applications and updates, then you have to enter a key and
activate every install.

How Acronis and Paragon method works is by replacing the drivers with
generic drivers. And when you boot up for the first time on a
different
machine, Windows will say found new hardware and replace those generic
drivers with other ones. And since the new machine is probably much
different than the original machine, thus it will trip the many
hardware change and tell you that you have to reactivate it again.

Ah, so when you said "Which allows restoring to a totally different
computer(s)", you meant restoring to a state that still needs
activation. I misunderstood; I'd assuming "restoring" meant to a
working
state.

If your set of computers are all the same brand and model, there
hardware will be the same as the first one and they won't need changes.
It also won't need activation if there are few hardware changes.

I clearly misunderstood "totally different computer" - you meant
different in serial number. (I guess it was the word "totally" that
threw me.)

It was BillW, not me, who wrote the posts before yours. I can't find
"totally different computer" but I took computer "much different from
the original" to mean a Dell instead of a Compaq, with different video
cards (plug-in or built-in) or different sound cards, etc, not just the
serial number. In fact if two serial numbers were 1 apart from each
other, I'd expect the machines likely to be the same.

And if the computer models are not the same, IIRC, even with generic
drivers, the computer is in a working state. The correct driver is
usually found within XP and installed almost automatically, but if it

I agree, that is my experience.

hasn't happened yet, or if one says No to changing the driver, IIRC,
things will work, but in some cases not as well as with the proper

(Is it likely to be the case that saying no to driver changes is likely
to reduce the chance of activation being needed?)

I believe so, though I have no experience doing that . What I wonder
is, if you allow one change, like the video driver, and hold off for a
few months for the next change, will it forget that that makes 2
changes, or will it keep a cumulative list and require activation at a
certain point.

driver. Especially the monitor may not have as high a resolution as it
could. If activation is required, that doesn't take long.

If Microsoft allows it?

Again I have no experience with other products, like BillW does, but I
think the whole idea of "not supporting" is exaggerated in people's
minds. I think it only means that they will not write fixes for
problems noticed in the future, not that they will keep people from
downloading fixes already written.

I suspect that they will remove most, if not all, of the patches and fixes
for XP, as I think they have done for Win98 and the earlier OS versions.

I was under the impression that fixes for win98 were still there. Or
at least there for years after there was "no support". But I could be
wrong.

I am also under the impression that older OSes have most of the flaws
found and fixed, so few if any fixes are still necessary. Compared to
new OSes with much code that hasn't been field-tested. Is this
paragraph true?

And why would they do that? Because they don't want to support it anymore,
and that includes any phone calls or emails with people having any issues

Yes, I forgot about emails and phone calls, because I never sent or made
any to them. I got, I'm sure, much better support on newsrgroups.
<smile>

Yes, they woudl stop that too when support ended. They could be more of
a pain than writing fixes. Even if they charge, they'd have to have
people who knew win98.

with XP. As far as MS is concerned, it's a dead horse, and they've moved on
So I can see why they do this, as customer service can be an expensive
PIA.

Still, it would be nice if MS left some files up there, and just stated that
"you're on your own now", as we (MS) will not offer any support on this, or

Like Eudora did. Of course they abandoned writing new versions (the
new versions are written by others and not based on version 7, the last
real version) Eudora gave permission for everyone to dl Eudora and
activate it, without paying. So far it's needed no updates.

anything else related to XP, period. But I guess the simplest and cleanest
approach from their point of view is simply to remove it all and nip it in
the bud.

Is there a way to avoid the reactivation problem?

 

[BillW50]

On Sun, 19 Jan 2014 18:19:01 -0700, "Bill in Co"


I was under the impression that fixes for win98 were still there. Or
at least there for years after there was "no support". But I could be
wrong.

Yes Microsoft did have the updates for Windows 98 for many years after
support had stopped. And you can still get them today on many reliable
sites.

I am also under the impression that older OSes have most of the flaws
found and fixed, so few if any fixes are still necessary. Compared to
new OSes with much code that hasn't been field-tested. Is this
paragraph true?

Yes for the most part. Although some newer Windows gets some security
patches that sometimes even effects older unsupported Windows too that
you will never see a patch for. But I don't think it matters much as
long as you have a real time AV that scans anything first before
launching it anyway.

Yes, I forgot about emails and phone calls, because I never sent or made
any to them. I got, I'm sure, much better support on newsrgroups.
<smile>

Yes, they woudl stop that too when support ended. They could be more of
a pain than writing fixes. Even if they charge, they'd have to have
people who knew win98.

Yup, help from others are far better support than you can get from
Microsoft anyway.

Like Eudora did. Of course they abandoned writing new versions (the
new versions are written by others and not based on version 7, the last
real version) Eudora gave permission for everyone to dl Eudora and
activate it, without paying. So far it's needed no updates.

There are tons of abandon software out there that they released now for
free. The last version of MS Money for example, Microsoft released it
for free too.

Is there a way to avoid the reactivation problem?

I believe it was Microsoft who said they would issue a patch that gets
around the activating if they ever did stop. That is what they did with
the last MS Money too. As originally you had to activate it. Then later,
they issued a patch to bypass activation. And they gave a date in the
future when their servers won't activate Money anymore. I think it was
like a 2 year or more warning when it would happen.

Also a lot of those branded XP OEM disc doesn't require activating
anyway. Many of my XP discs are like this. Even some of my Windows 7
discs are too. I suppose some Windows 8 discs are the same. I think they
work by checking your BIOS to see if you qualify for that version.

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

On Sun, 19 Jan 2014 14:30:34 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"


I believe so, though I have no experience doing that . What I wonder
is, if you allow one change, like the video driver, and hold off for a
few months for the next change, will it forget that that makes 2
changes, or will it keep a cumulative list and require activation at a
certain point.

If it works at all, I'd guess it would be the latter case.

Again I have no experience with other products, like BillW does, but I
think the whole idea of "not supporting" is exaggerated in people's
minds. I think it only means that they will not write fixes for
problems noticed in the future, not that they will keep people from

That is my feeling too of what the main effect will be, to start with ..

downloading fixes already written. And now that you mention it, not

... though I think they'll gradually start removing the necessary files:
either deliberately, or just making links to them harder to find so
they're only findable to those who know where they are.

that they will not permit activation. A lot of people would be angry

See later posting.

to learn, in many casesl, at the last minute, that they can't reactivate
their windows.

Well, are they much different to the quite a lot of people who are angry
that XP support is ending? I suppose you said *re*activate, but still,
we are talking of an OS that's - for most practical purposes - not been
_buyable_ for a while, so it would only be people who've broken - in one
sense or another - their system.

I woudl expect it to be announced by MS at the same time lack of support
was announced.

I guess I would as well, and we haven't - but I don't expect it to be
provided indefinitely.

Why would MS have to release more code? What's wrong with the code that
exists?

See next post.

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

On Sun, 19 Jan 2014 18:19:01 -0700, "Bill in Co"


Like Eudora did. Of course they abandoned writing new versions (the
new versions are written by others and not based on version 7, the last

(If you mean Eudora OSE - "open source edition" - that is indeed not
based on the old Eudora: it's basically a version of Thunderbird tricked
out to _look_ like Eudora. Unfortunately it's a very old version of
Thunderbird - 1.x I think - and not being upgraded.)

real version) Eudora gave permission for everyone to dl Eudora and
activate it, without paying. So far it's needed no updates.

Is that Eudora 7? If so, my (blind) friend has it, and it installed OK
under Windows 7 (despite what we'd seen somewhere). But after a while,
it asked if we wanted to continue using the limited version we were
using, to upgrade to the better version for free but ad-supported, or
upgrade to the better version and pay. Since the ad.s are small and
graphical, he wouldn't be bothered by them (his blind wife has that
version), so we elected to go for that, but unfortunately the server
that was hard-coded into it no longer responds.[]

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

I believe it was Microsoft who said they would issue a patch that gets
around the activating if they ever did stop. That is what they did with

I don't suppose you have a reference for that? One would hope they do,
but I can't see any reason for them to do so (other than good PR), and a
good reason for them not to (basically the knowledge that activation
will eventually be available would stop a, diminishing but still
sizeable, number of people from buying a new Windows).

the last MS Money too. As originally you had to activate it. Then
later, they issued a patch to bypass activation. And they gave a date
in the future when their servers won't activate Money anymore. I think
it was like a 2 year or more warning when it would happen.

I know Adobe released (they may still be available) unlocked version of
one of their suites - Photo Elements was it? - when they wanted to turn
off their activation servers. They stressed that they were only for
people who'd bought the original product, and of course I'm sure that
only those people downloaded the unlocked versions ... (-: