All in Ones Lexmark, Brother, Canon

[JXStern]

Time to upgrade a couple of healthy print-only's to All-in-Ones, to
get the ability to copy (monochrome) a dozen pages a week, send and
receive faxes maybe once a month. Print load on one is typically a
few pages a day mostly text, the other maybe twenty pages a day, 99%
text. Basically no hi-resolution photo printing on either.

Local Staples has Canon MP780 for $199 (after rebate), Lexmark X8350
for $199, and some crazy-cheap Brother models MFC-210C for $69 (after
rebate), MFC-5440 for $109, same unit with a copy-feeder.

Just all friggin' amazing values, assuming they work, and keep
working, and are software-compatible for a couple of aging XP
workstations. I see the Brother wants 128mb, have to check one of the
PCs for that, may be a problem. Can't seem to find the memory
requirement for the Lexmark, anybody know? It's not the cost of the
memory, of course, just the hassle of upgrading.

I like Canon products, but see these little Brothers (!) also use
separate ink cartridges, an idea I like. The Lexmark runs black and
then three-color, or black+photo + three-color.

The Lexmark is just unbelievable, it has a little graphic screen to
give you instructions, not so many years ago this was a high-end
feature on $25,000 office copiers!

Any advice on these models?

Oh, and a question - can you leave any or all of these in fax-receive
mode on a line that also has a voice answering machine on it and
active and still have everything work correctly?

At these prices, does anybody buy straight printers anymore?

Thanks.

Josh

 

[RRR_News]

1. I would recommend that you stay far away from the Lexmark. having own two
myself, the 1100 & X73 models. The major reason, that it seems an unbelievable
values, is that Lexmark, prefers to make the profit on the sale of replacement
cartridges for its printers. Look at the prices of their replacement cartridges,
usually in the $ 30.00 or more range, for each cartridge.

2. If you need the multifunctional, to make copies in B/W (monochrome), consider
a laser printer instead, that uses a toner cartridge. You can always buy a HP
photo printer if you need to do photos. Canon Laser printer, imageCLASS® MF3110
may be what you need. Replacement toner cartridges start at about $40.00, and
have a capacity of 2500 pages.

http://consumer.usa.canon.com/ir/controller?act=ModelDetailAct&fcategoryid=124&modelid=10519

--

Have a Good Day,
Rich/rerat

(RRR News) <message rule>
<<Previous Text Snipped to Save Bandwidth When Appropriate>>

Time to upgrade a couple of healthy print-only's to All-in-Ones, to
get the ability to copy (monochrome) a dozen pages a week, send and
receive faxes maybe once a month. Print load on one is typically a
few pages a day mostly text, the other maybe twenty pages a day, 99%
text. Basically no hi-resolution photo printing on either.

Local Staples has Canon MP780 for $199 (after rebate), Lexmark X8350
for $199, and some crazy-cheap Brother models MFC-210C for $69 (after
rebate), MFC-5440 for $109, same unit with a copy-feeder.

Just all friggin' amazing values, assuming they work, and keep
working, and are software-compatible for a couple of aging XP
workstations. I see the Brother wants 128mb, have to check one of the
PCs for that, may be a problem. Can't seem to find the memory
requirement for the Lexmark, anybody know? It's not the cost of the
memory, of course, just the hassle of upgrading.

I like Canon products, but see these little Brothers (!) also use
separate ink cartridges, an idea I like. The Lexmark runs black and
then three-color, or black+photo + three-color.

The Lexmark is just unbelievable, it has a little graphic screen to
give you instructions, not so many years ago this was a high-end
feature on $25,000 office copiers!

Any advice on these models?

Oh, and a question - can you leave any or all of these in fax-receive
mode on a line that also has a voice answering machine on it and
active and still have everything work correctly?

At these prices, does anybody buy straight printers anymore?

Thanks.

Josh

 

[Tron]

Time to upgrade a couple of healthy print-only's to All-in-Ones, to
get the ability to copy (monochrome) a dozen pages a week, send and
receive faxes maybe once a month. Print load on one is typically a
few pages a day mostly text, the other maybe twenty pages a day, 99%
text. Basically no hi-resolution photo printing on either.

Local Staples has Canon MP780 for $199 (after rebate), Lexmark X8350
for $199, and some crazy-cheap Brother models MFC-210C for $69 (after
rebate), MFC-5440 for $109, same unit with a copy-feeder.

Just all friggin' amazing values, assuming they work, and keep
working, and are software-compatible for a couple of aging XP
workstations. I see the Brother wants 128mb, have to check one of the
PCs for that, may be a problem. Can't seem to find the memory
requirement for the Lexmark, anybody know? It's not the cost of the
memory, of course, just the hassle of upgrading.

I like Canon products, but see these little Brothers (!) also use
separate ink cartridges, an idea I like. The Lexmark runs black and
then three-color, or black+photo + three-color.

The Lexmark is just unbelievable, it has a little graphic screen to
give you instructions, not so many years ago this was a high-end
feature on $25,000 office copiers!

Any advice on these models?

Oh, and a question - can you leave any or all of these in fax-receive
mode on a line that also has a voice answering machine on it and
active and still have everything work correctly?

At these prices, does anybody buy straight printers anymore?

Thanks.

Josh

I personally have never thought all-in-one machines made much sense.
My reasoning is that, if one of the functions glitches and goes down,
you loose it all when it goes to the rapair facility because they are
all housed in the same machine.

Consider that a perfectly good printer can be had these days for $70
to $100 depending on your needs. You already have fax capabilities
built into Windows XP for free. A great little Canon Lide scanner can
be found for less than $70. There are some freeware software packages
that allow your computer to function as a full function answering
machine. And best of all, if one element goes on the fritz, it can be
replaced for a fraction of what one of the better all-in-ones would
cost you to replace.

Although you may choose to not heed my advice on the wisdom of
all-in-ones, you'd best take my advice on the following: When it
comes to Lexmark ... be afraid .. be very afraid. They are crap.

 

[measekite]

I personally have never thought all-in-one machines made much sense.
My reasoning is that, if one of the functions glitches and goes down,
you loose it all when it goes to the rapair facility because they are
all housed in the same machine.

TOTALLY AGREE

Consider that a perfectly good printer can be had these days for $70
to $100 depending on your needs. You already have fax capabilities
built into Windows XP for free. A great little Canon Lide scanner can
be found for less than $70. There are some freeware software packages
that allow your computer to function as a full function answering
machine. And best of all, if one element goes on the fritz, it can be
replaced for a fraction of what one of the better all-in-ones would
cost you to replace.

Although you may choose to not heed my advice on the wisdom of
all-in-ones, you'd best take my advice on the following: When it
comes to Lexmark ... be afraid .. be very afraid. They are crap.

THEY ARE NOT AS GOOD AS CRAP

 

[Tron]

TOTALLY AGREE

THEY ARE NOT AS GOOD AS CRAP

Jesus, Measekite says he agrees with my post. What's wrong with me?
I feel like I need a bath.

 

[measekite]

CANON IS VERY GOOD. LEXMARK IS TOTAL GARBAGE. AND THE BROTHER IS INBETWEEN

 

[Arthur Entlich]

Lexmark all in one has a bad reputation for very difficult to install
drivers which often do not work properly. Lexmark printers are cheap to
encourage purchase because they make their money on very costly ink
cartridges.

When considering any inkjet printer, look closely at the cost of
consumables before deciding which is a deal.

Art

 

[measekite]

Lexmark all in one has a bad reputation for
EVERYTHING

very difficult to install drivers which often do not work properly.
Lexmark printers are cheap to encourage purchase because they make
their money on very costly ink cartridges.

When considering any inkjet printer, look closely at the cost of
consumables before deciding which is a deal.

Art

 

[Sam Grant]

Oh, and a question - can you leave any or all of these in fax-receive
mode on a line that also has a voice answering machine on it and
active and still have everything work correctly?

At these prices, does anybody buy straight printers anymore?

Thanks.

Josh

I like my MP780, and yes, you can leave it in fax-receive mode with
your answering machine. I have to set the answering machine to 2
rings, but it all works together.

Sam

 

[JXStern]

I like my MP780, and yes, you can leave it in fax-receive mode with
your answering machine. I have to set the answering machine to 2
rings, but it all works together.

Thanks to you and all.

So how does that fax/answering thing work, the fax picks up first,
hears only a voice line, then fakes another ring so the answering
machine will pick up? Do you have to plug the answering machine into
the MP780, in series?

Yow.

Not the most important factor, but have long wondered. Guess I should
risk $200 (or $69 for the smallest Brother) and just find out!

J.

 

[measekite]

Thanks to you and all.

So how does that fax/answering thing work, the fax picks up first,
hears only a voice line, then fakes another ring so the answering
machine will pick up? Do you have to plug the answering machine into
the MP780, in series?

Yow.

YOU SAID YOW WITHOUT KNOWING THE HOLE TING.

IF YOU GET A BUNCH OF JUNK FAXES AND THEN A COUPLE OF GOOD ONES AND THEN
A NOTHER BUNCH OF JUNK FAXES INTERMINGLED WITH A FEW GOOD ONES YOU WILL
NOT BE ABLE TO DELETE THE BAD ONES OR SLEECTIVELY PRINT THE GOOD ONES.
YOU WILL HAVE TO WASTE ALL THE INK AND PAPER TO GET A FEW PRINTOUTS.

AND TO THAT YOU CAN SAY WOWEE I SAID YOW TO EARLY

 

[David Chien]

Local Staples has Canon MP780 for $199 (after rebate), Lexmark X8350

I'd go with the MP780 which we've got over here. Superb printer,
very high quality photo prints and very quiet and fast text prints.
Multiple paper feed paths, easy to setup and use, and it's a blast all
around.

The text printing is particularly fast and speedy, and has multiple
paper paths in case you need to feed envelopes or letterhead.

Friend has a Brother slim all-in-one MFC similar/same as the MFC-210C
(they've got many similar models), but definitely at least the MFC-210C
model since it's the lowest in line with fax. Honestly, not even
close - slower, noisier, photo prints aren't anywhere as nice, and it
simply too far too many steps to setup! (Look at their quick start
guide and you'll see - how many steps?!?)

Absolute performance in color copying, speed, print quality between
the two, the Canon is the winner here. I would not consider the Brother
for yet another important reason - cartridges are much harder to find in
stores than Canon inks.

(The Canon does use individual ink tanks as well.)

Given the choice between the MFC listed, I'd even start paying you
just to own the Canon. The others simply aren't in the same class, IMO.

You can see the print speeds here:
http://reviews.cnet.com/Canon_Pixma_MP780/4505-3181_7-31090955-5.html?tag=toc

(search for the other printers)

Note how the Canon is printing 2x faster at 6ppm vs. 3ppm for a
similar Brother (higher model number even!).

(Ignore the part about text quality on paper - CNET is a bit dumb!
They should know that you can easily find papers that are fully
optimized for superior plain paper inkjet printing today from Xerox and
other paper manufacturers. They can easily pick the 'wrong' type of
plain paper and complain all day about poor print quality from any
printer brand tested. For example, the HP advanced paper is particularly
nice to start with:
http://www.shopping.hp.com/webapp/shopping/product_detail.do?product_code=INP160300)

----

Finally take a look at the cartridge prices at www.shopper.com for
each brand. The printer might be cheap, but the cartridges might kill!
Canon has typically had very affordable cartridges for us ($11 or less
each).

 

[measekite]

Sounds like good advice.

I'd go with the MP780 which we've got over here. Superb printer,
very high quality photo prints and very quiet and fast text prints.
Multiple paper feed paths, easy to setup and use, and it's a blast all
around.

The text printing is particularly fast and speedy, and has multiple
paper paths in case you need to feed envelopes or letterhead.

Friend has a Brother slim all-in-one MFC similar/same as the
MFC-210C (they've got many similar models), but definitely at least
the MFC-210C model since it's the lowest in line with fax. Honestly,
not even close - slower, noisier, photo prints aren't anywhere as
nice, and it simply too far too many steps to setup! (Look at their
quick start guide and you'll see - how many steps?!?)

Absolute performance in color copying, speed, print quality between
the two, the Canon is the winner here. I would not consider the
Brother for yet another important reason - cartridges are much harder
to find in stores than Canon inks.

(The Canon does use individual ink tanks as well.)

Given the choice between the MFC listed, I'd even start paying you
just to own the Canon. The others simply aren't in the same class, IMO.

You can see the print speeds here:
http://reviews.cnet.com/Canon_Pixma_MP780/4505-3181_7-31090955-5.html?tag=toc

(search for the other printers)

Note how the Canon is printing 2x faster at 6ppm vs. 3ppm for a
similar Brother (higher model number even!).

(Ignore the part about text quality on paper - CNET is a bit dumb!
They should know that you can easily find papers that are fully
optimized for superior plain paper inkjet printing today from Xerox
and other paper manufacturers. They can easily pick the 'wrong' type
of plain paper and complain all day about poor print quality from any
printer brand tested. For example, the HP advanced paper is
particularly nice to start with:
http://www.shopping.hp.com/webapp/shopping/product_detail.do?product_code=INP160300)


----

Finally take a look at the cartridge prices at www.shopper.com for
each brand. The printer might be cheap, but the cartridges might
kill! Canon has typically had very affordable cartridges for us ($11
or less each).

 

[zakezuke]

I'd go with the MP780 which we've got over here. Superb printer,
very high quality photo prints and very quiet and fast text prints.
Multiple paper feed paths, easy to setup and use, and it's a blast all
around.

The text printing is particularly fast and speedy, and has multiple
paper paths in case you need to feed envelopes or letterhead.

Spiffy and the price is good. I have the mp760 my self. I must point
out that there is a replacement for the mp780 on the way, the mp830.
Just like the mp760 was replace with a newer model with higher
resolution and smaller drop size canon finally announced a replacement
for the mp780 with the same advantage.

http://consumer.usa.canon.com/ir/controller?act=ModelDetailAct&fcategoryid=116&modelid=12804

It's selling on amazon.com for $289.99, MSRP is $300. $200 is a good
deal less for the mp780, and you might find it for less with a rebate
elsewhere. It's a good deal so long as you are aware of the choice.
Text output near as i'm aware hasn't improved on the newer model, but I
lack any hard copy of them to see this personaly. Good time to buy
even if your primary application is photo printing, though one shoudl
consider the newer model for that. If photo printing isn't a factor,
no reason to bother paying extra.

--------------------

The fax features AFAIK on the mp780 were quite limited.

That being said, my last AIO, the hp950 was spiffy in this regard. You
could share a line without a problem. So long as you had users press a
user defined code to cause the fax machine to pick up... the hp950
would accept a fax no matter what. It was a great feature. That being
said... often fax modems and the software that comes out of the box are
often nicer than AIO fax printer scanner units... they are just more
complex and are more prone to downtime.
---------------

 

[JXStern]

Spiffy and the price is good. I have the mp760 my self. I must point
out that there is a replacement for the mp780 on the way, the mp830.
Just like the mp760 was replace with a newer model with higher
resolution and smaller drop size canon finally announced a replacement
for the mp780 with the same advantage.

http://consumer.usa.canon.com/ir/controller?act=ModelDetailAct&fcategoryid=116&modelid=12804

I have an i550 that's still fine for printing. In draft mode it's
very zippy indeed.

It's selling on amazon.com for $289.99, MSRP is $300. $200 is a good
deal less for the mp780, and you might find it for less with a rebate
elsewhere. It's a good deal so long as you are aware of the choice.
Text output near as i'm aware hasn't improved on the newer model, but I
lack any hard copy of them to see this personaly. Good time to buy
even if your primary application is photo printing, though one shoudl
consider the newer model for that. If photo printing isn't a factor,
no reason to bother paying extra.

Thanks, explains the special pricing.

--------------------

The fax features AFAIK on the mp780 were quite limited.

That being said, my last AIO, the hp950 was spiffy in this regard. You
could share a line without a problem. So long as you had users press a
user defined code to cause the fax machine to pick up...

Nice feature, and I can even understand how it works!

the hp950
would accept a fax no matter what. It was a great feature. That being
said... often fax modems and the software that comes out of the box are
often nicer than AIO fax printer scanner units... they are just more
complex and are more prone to downtime.
---------------

Fax use should be minimal, won't even turn it on except on special
occassions (and for occassional outgoing, few pages, point to point),
but then, it will still be nice if it's robust and easy.

Josh

 

[Frank]

Finally take a look at the cartridge prices at www.shopper.com for
each brand. The printer might be cheap, but the cartridges might kill!
Canon has typically had very affordable cartridges for us ($11 or less
each).

$11 each for 8 oem carts = $88 plus tax & shipping.
Hobbicolor $28 plus shipping + tax = #35. Enough for 5 refills of each
color. 5 x 8 = 40 refills. 40 oem carts @ $11 per = $440!!!
Lets be very clear about this ok?

$440 (plus tax & shipping) says it equals about $475 total versus $35.
You need not be a mental giant to figure this one out!
Or just maybe you do.
Frank

 

[zakezuke]

Fax use should be minimal, won't even turn it on except on special

occassions (and for occassional outgoing, few pages, point to point),
but then, it will still be nice if it's robust and easy.

My info on the mp780 is 2nd hand. As I said I have the mp760 which
lacks fax and the sheet feeder. Based on what I read the fax support
is very minimal, basicly being a box with the ability to fax from paper
or from the pc.

In that case the HP OfficeJet 6210 series for example as it turns out
has the same feature as my old PSC 950. If for example I picked up the
phone and heard fax tones I could press 123 on my telephone (a detail I
didn't remember before) and it would pickup and answer the fax. This
could be any phone in the house not even hooked up to the printer.
Looks like the 7200 shares this feature as well. Both are about $200
and $300ish respectivly. IIRC the 7200 series offers a network
adapter, super handy feature if you have a network.

The mp780 "might" share this feature.... I do read that you can set a
remote receive ID, and the default is 25, but I have no personal
experence with the printer so if you like the idea of being able to
tell the printer "pickup the phone damn it" better check. I've at least
used the feature on the older PSC950 but not on any HP more current.

My info is limited as I switched to a fax modem. Anything I want
hardcopy of I can print, but fax is not often used these days now that
most AIOs and scanners offer scan to PDF.

I have no doubt that the canon would be cheaper to operate than the hp
6210 or 7200 series. Simply put the canon bci-3ebk black is rated at
about 500p @ $13ish a cart, where the #94 is rated at 450p at $20/cart
for the 6210, 800p @ $30/cart for the #96 (7200 series). Canon simply
offers one of the cheapest cost per page for their black text cartridge
that i'm personaly aware of in an inkjet. Some of the other HP
printers offer a better deal for ink, I simply don't know the model
numbers off the top of my head but canon's bci-3e is hard to beat.
Features HP is hard to beat.

The big selling point for me was cd printing, not a feature officaly
offered in the USA but one which can easily be added with a cd tray
from e-bay fetching $30ish or so and a bunch of button presses which
are very well documented by this point. Epson in many ways was
"better" in my experence but I found the $100 r200 printer to be
totally unreliable and this is not a feature offered on any AIO epson
offers except one of the more spendy ones.

 

[David Carmichael]

Time to upgrade a couple of healthy print-only's to All-in-Ones, to
get the ability to copy (monochrome) a dozen pages a week, send and
receive faxes maybe once a month. Print load on one is typically a
few pages a day mostly text, the other maybe twenty pages a day, 99%
text. Basically no hi-resolution photo printing on either.

Local Staples has Canon MP780 for $199 (after rebate), Lexmark X8350
for $199, and some crazy-cheap Brother models MFC-210C for $69 (after
rebate), MFC-5440 for $109, same unit with a copy-feeder.

From personal experience with the Brother machines.. ... if you are planning
on using on older machines.. while they claim to work with Win'98se w/USB
drivers... they will not print multi page documents in Win'98se w/USB
drivers ..even if you had did a fresh format of the harddrive and reinstall
only 'Word'98' and the printer drivers.. all other USB devices loaded and
function correctly.