Advice on Windows Boot Manager

[Guest]

I have XP installed on a partition on 1 HDD and Vista Ultimate installed on a
separate Drive. The thing is I do not have the Windows Boot Manager when I
boot up with the OS options. I can only achieve this by changiing the Boot
Device in Bios, so I don't think any boot files are damaged. In Startup and
Recovery on both systems only one OS is recognised and when I tried Third
Party software like VistaBootPro or Easy BCD I can only find one OS also.
I will probably have to reinstall anyway as when I now enter Vista I get a
Black Screen with My Documents open and I have to start Win Explorer Manually
in Task Manager.
Is It important to leave the XP installed Drive connected to the Motherboard
when installing Vista. Is this necessary for the Windows Boot Manager Option
or will Vista install Drivers etc on the XP drive causing both Drives to run
on Boot up.
Is there another way I can find the Windows Boot Manager.
Thanx for any Help

 

[peter]

If you disconnect the XP drive Vista cannot overwrite the XP bootmanager
with its own....maybe thats how you got here in the 1st place.
A disconnected drive cannot be seen.Vista will install its boot manager on
the drive labeled System Boot under Comp Management/disk management.
Which of the partitions on that 1 HDD is labeled as such???
peter

 

[Guest]

I had Vista installed first. Then to obtain a Dual Boot I did a complete
reinstall by first installing XP on a drive that already had two Partitions.
In Disk Management in XP, XP is installed on one partition labelled Healthy
(Boot) and the other Partition on that Drive is labelled Healthy (System)
In Vista, The Drive Vista is on is Labelled Healthy (System Boot)

 

[Andy]

The drive partition that is identified as System, Boot under Vista
contains the Vista boot manager files.
The drive partition that is identified as System under XP contains the
boot files for XP.
If you want dual boot to occur, the disk containing the XP system
partition must be connected when Vista is installed.

 

[John Barnes]

The drive labeled 'system' is the first hard drive in boot priority in your
bios and the active primary partition on that drive. (If you change the boot
priority at post time, it can change which is the system drive, but ONLY for
that boot, not for an install) All system files will be installed there.
The system you are running will always be labeled 'boot', since you are
booted into it. If you want Vista to set up the dual boot, you have to have
the XP system visible at install time, otherwise, you can add the legacy
system to your boot using EasyBCD or VistaBootPro, at a later time.

 

[Guest]

Thanks for the replies . As I satated "when I tried Third
Party software like VistaBootPro or Easy BCD I can only find one OS". I cant
find or add a Legacy or an Earlier Version of Windows. I have had The Drive
with XP installed on connected when I installed Vista. I can Dual Boot(via
Bios) but I was looking for the Choice of OS when I boot up(i.e. Windows Boot
Manager welcome Screen).
I think the problem maybe, although XP Drive is connected It has two
Partitions with XP on the second partition (D) and the First Partion(C) is
labelled (System) in Disk Management. Is this the problem. I was really
hoping not to have to reinstall XP but if this is the issue I will.
Thanx again for the help.

 

[John Barnes]

You have to ADD the legacy drive.

 

[John Barnes]

What do you mean by you can't add it. You can't find the place to add, you
can't figure out how to use it, you get an error message when you boot after
adding (which I assume isn't the problem).

 

[Guest]

When I add Windows Legacy and I locate the Drive with XP Boot files and then
I reboot I get the choice of OS but when I choose XP I always get
File: \ntldr
Status 0xc000000f
The selected entry could not be loaded because the application is missing
or corrupt.
This is when I add in VistaBootPro or EasyBCD

 

[John Barnes]

Copy the ntldr ntdetect.com and boot.ini files from your XP drive to the
vista boot manager drive (system) change the boot.ini file to point to the
proper rdisk (if you have only 2 drives, change to the other (0 or 1)

 

[R. C. White]

Hi, John.

The problem is that he also needs the WinXP-style BOOT SECTOR, which is not
a file and can't be copied or otherwise manipulated like a file. It is
written to the System Partition by WinXP Setup - and never touched again by
WinXP, usually.

When Vista's Setup sees that WinXP boot sector, it copies it to a FILE named
C:\BOOTSECT.BAK before overwriting it with the Vista-style boot sector.
Vista Setup also leaves C:\NTLDR, etc., intact, while writing its own
bootmgr file and \Boot folder to the System Volume. The WinXP boot sector
has instructions to look in the Root of the System Partition for the file
NTLDR. The Vista boot sector has instructions to look there for the file
bootmgr. (Whichever boot sector is in place at power-on, if it can't find
the file it is looking for, it can't boot.)

Later, after full installation is complete, whenever the computer is booted,
the Vista boot sector is read, bootmgr is started, and the OS menu is
presented to the user. If "Previous operating system" is selected, Bootmgr
forgets Vista and reads BootSect.bak and executes it. This WinXP-style
boot-up code finds NTLDR and Boot.ini and loads the old familiar WinXP OS
menu. But if the user doesn't choose "Previous", then the old BootSect.bak
is ignored and the user sees only the Vista options.

This elegant Vista Setup behavior works fine if WinXP is already installed
and is left in place during Vista Setup. And WinXP should be in place, even
if Vista is installed by booting from the DVD, rather than from within
WinXP. But if the WinXP HD is out of service during Vista Setup, then the
boot sector never gets saved because Vista Setup can't even see it. Then we
have to go through the often-lengthy rigmarole to get BootSect.bak and the
other WinXP startup files onto the System Partition with the Vista boot
sector and startup files. (It might work to simply find the System, Hidden,
Read-only file BOOTSECT.BAK, if there is one, on the other HD's active
primary partition and copy it along with NTLDR, NTDETECT.COM and Boot.ini to
the System Partition, but I've never tried that fix.)

The partition labeled "System" in Disk Management is the one that the
computer started from for THIS session. If you boot (either WinXP or Vista)
from the other HD, then its active partition will be the System Partition
for that session. And the volume that hold the Boot Folder (\Windows) for
whichever OS is running will be labeled "Boot" for that session. The System
and Boot volumes may be the same volume - or not.

The Golden Rule of dual-booting: Always install the newest OS last.
(Usually - but NOT always - the same as install the oldest first.)

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP
(Running Windows Live Mail beta 2 in Vista Ultimate x64 SP1 beta v.275)

 

[John Barnes]

I have had at least 25 post back that this has worked for them. I also have
used it maybe 10-15 times myself and it works every time. Nothing I have
read indicates that the bootmgr would read the .bak file, which makes no
sense as there is a record in the BCD store that points to where to find the
ntldr file.

 

[R. C. White]

Hi, John.

Hmmm... Well, then, why does Vista Setup create the .bak file?

Not doubting you, John. Just wondering. And trying to reconcile it with
what I thought I knew about this multi-boot process, which I've been using
since Win95/NT4.

As I understand the process, it's more than a question of where to find
NTLDR. The WinXP-style boot sector also has a few bytes of code to set up
the system before loading NTLDR. Does the bootsect.bak file exist at all in
your multi-booting system volume? Or in a single-Vista-only system volume?
Perhaps the Vista BCD now includes code to allow it to switch to the WinXP
startup without that small file.

I just took a look at bootsect.bak with Notepad. I expected to see a few
bytes spelling out "NTLDR" - but I didn't. I DID see text for an error
message: "BOOTMGR is missing". So now I'm confused. I'm pretty sure that
I looked at this during the Vista beta and it said NTLDR, but the BCD and
related processes changed several times during the beta, so I must have just
missed the new way that the boot sector is handled. And I've recently
posted advice based on my out-of-date understanding, so I need to try to
correct that.

Thanks for pointing this out, John. I'll have to do some research on this
now. Any idea where to start? I have Vista Inside Out, but it does not
seem to cover this subject. "Bootsect" Is not even in the index. :>(

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP
(Running Windows Live Mail beta 2 in Vista Ultimate x64 SP1 beta v.275)

 

[Guest]

I believe that for Dual Boot with Vista and XP-PRO you must install XP first
then install Vista. Or the boot manager is not configured, and written over
in Vista by installing XP-PRO after installing Vista.

Bcarn

 

[Merv]

I believe that for Dual Boot with Vista and XP-PRO you must install XP first
then install Vista. Or the boot manager is not configured, and written over
in Vista by installing XP-PRO after installing Vista.

Bcarn

 

[malphig]

Vista on an XP machine, keeping both --
Start with an XP computer, make sure all hard disk drives are connected and
all traces of Vista have been removed. Create a clean partion formatted with
NTFS to hold Vista. With the computer still running XP, run the setup
program from a FULL VERSION Vista distribution disc. Choose Custom
installation after reading the license, and install Vista into the new
partition. After installation is finished, you
will be able to choose between Vista and XP by hitting the F8 key when the
computer starts.

XP on a Vista machine keeping both --
Start with a Vista computer that has plenty of memory, preferably 3
gigabytes. It will need to be able to provide the resources needed by both
operating systems at the same time. Download the free Virtual PC 2007, and
install it. With your FULL version XP distribution disc ready, run Virtual
PC on your Vista computer and choose your XP operating system as the guest
O.S.

 

[harikeo]

UPDATE

I have gotten past the bootmgr problem. Now it locks up everytime I
try to do anything i.e. right before I'm asked to enter the Serial
number. The furthest it's gotten was to where it's actually unpacking
items, it got to 9% and then froze. This is very frustrating, and any
help you can give would be very greatful. Thank you.

I had something similar once with a Vista install and the only way I got
round it was to delete, recreate and format the partition during the
installation. Vista installed perfectly after that.

 

[Rick Rogers]

Hi,

The installation volume is damaged. Remove and rebuild it, and restart the
installation. If it still fails, get a hdd diagnostic from the drive
manufacturer and check that the drive is not damaged.

--
Best of Luck,

Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP

Windows help - www.rickrogers.org
My thoughts http://rick-mvp.blogspot.com

 

[Rick Rogers]

Hi,

During the initial stage of setup, where you choose the installation
location, you can remove and rebuild it using the advanced tools.

--
Best of Luck,

Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP

Windows help - www.rickrogers.org
My thoughts http://rick-mvp.blogspot.com