Vista or Linux. Doesn't matter.

[ceed]

Hi,

I am running Vista and Linux Mint on my laptop. They share a data
partition they can both read from, so it's really easy to switch. The
thing is that the two are so similar now I do not even notice which one
I'm on. The main (relatively few) differences are what you can run and how
things run: Not many games on Linux and not very good fast Internet
connection on Vista. When it comes to installing them on my HP laptop they
came out about the same. Vista took a little longer to install than Linux
Mint, but other than that they both had a couple of hurdles I had to get
across but they were minor. On Vista I had to install a lot of HP drivers
to get things to work like multimedia buttons, wireless Internet and built
in multi-card readers. On Linux these things simply worked out of the
box. I've been using Windows and Linux on and off for more than ten
years. Sometines Linux is my preference, sometimes Windows. I reallly like
Vista and think it's the best OS from Microsoft ever, so these days I am
keeping both and can not decide which one is my favorite.

Oh, one thing: The "Up" button is gone from Windows Explorer. Why on earth
did they remove such an intuitive feature from the main file manager?
People tell me I do not need it, but I do, and that in itself is one
reason to spend some more time on Linux: The up button for file
management. As you can see I have to really look hard to find a reason to
use one over the other!

 

[Ollis]

Oh, one thing: The "Up" button is gone from Windows Explorer. Why on earth
did they remove such an intuitive feature from the main file manager?
People tell me I do not need it, but I do, and that in itself is one
reason to spend some more time on Linux: The up button for file
management. As you can see I have to really look hard to find a reason to
use one over the other!

What's wrong with the forward and back buttons at the top left hand side of
the Explore screen? Are they not like the up and down arrows for folder
movement? There is also a "Recent Folder" down arrow next to them.

 

[ceed]

What's wrong with the forward and back buttons at the top left hand side
of
the Explore screen? Are they not like the up and down arrows for folder
movement? There is also a "Recent Folder" down arrow next to them.

There's nothing wrong with the "Forward" and "Back" buttons, but they are
doing a competely different thing: You are going back to the directory you
were in before. It's based on history. However, the "Up" button takes you
up one level in your folder hierachy which makes it very easy to browse
(in my opinion). Since this button is gone in Vista I now use Free
Commander for file management. Free Commander (and most other third party
file managers) has the "Up" button intact.

I just do not see the reason why Microsoft would remove a function which
has been there since the "dawn of graphical file managers"! Maybe it was
because they had to add some much crap (like UAC!) that they felt they had
to remove something?

 

[fatsteve]

Oh, one thing: The "Up" button is gone from Windows Explorer. Why on
earth did they remove such an intuitive feature from the main file
manager? People tell me I do not need it, but I do, and that in itself
is one reason to spend some more time on Linux: The up button for file
management. As you can see I have to really look hard to find a reason
to use one over the other!

Use the address bar

 

[Ollis]

There's nothing wrong with the "Forward" and "Back" buttons, but they are
doing a competely different thing: You are going back to the directory you
were in before. It's based on history. However, the "Up" button takes you
up one level in your folder hierachy which makes it very easy to browse
(in my opinion). Since this button is gone in Vista I now use Free
Commander for file management. Free Commander (and most other third party
file managers) has the "Up" button intact.
OK

I just do not see the reason why Microsoft would remove a function which
has been there since the "dawn of graphical file managers"! Maybe it was
because they had to add some much crap (like UAC!) that they felt they had
to remove something?

I myslef wouldn't turn UAC off.

But maybe MS is more concerned with the kernel, UAC and secuirty, instaed of
up/down buttons.

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/cc162494.aspx

 

[Gordon]

Oh, one thing: The "Up" button is gone from Windows Explorer. Why on earth
did they remove such an intuitive feature from the main file manager?

Because you don't need it. Click on the parent folder in the address
bar.....

 

[dave griffiths]

Doesn't this give you the same flexibility?

http://www.howtohaven.com/system/missing-up-arrow-button-vista-explorer.s
html

 

[D. Eth]

non intuitive and stupid... I know all about the breadcrumb but how many
others poor windows users don’t know what the breadcrumb is
and how to use it? Its NON INTUITIVE

We want a frikin UP button OK? I also want a DELETE button...

Hey I want to customize the toolbar EXACTLY like I want it OK?

MS was VERY stupid to disable the customization

A Guy made a simple add on for explorer that adds an up button. He sells
the button for $5

thousands have downloaded it...

The breadcrumb feature is very intuitive.
It gives instant access to the entire tree.
People just need to get used to it, then it replaces the up, down, left,
right, and home buttons.
Little things seem to bug people.

 

[Gordon]

non intuitive and stupid... I know all about the breadcrumb but how many
others poor windows users don’t know what the breadcrumb is
and how to use it? Its NON INTUITIVE

We want a frikin UP button OK?

Why? Click on the parent folder in the Addressbar. Why DUPLICATE
functionality?

 

[Gordon]

Vista is stupid

Another reasoned, logical response. NOT.

 

[ceed]

Doesn't this give you the same flexibility?

http://www.howtohaven.com/system/missing-up-arrow-button-vista-explorer.s
html

Interesting that there's a web page describing work arounds for the
missing up button. Thank you for the link, but there's much easier using a
file manager which still has a vertical navigation.

 

[ceed]

I myslef wouldn't turn UAC off.
But maybe MS is more concerned with the kernel, UAC and secuirty,
instaed of
up/down buttons.
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/cc162494.aspx

Actually, I think MS has been really concerned with the kernel in Vista.
The whole OS works much better than any MS OS I have used. However, UAC is
just annoying to me since it tries to prevent me from moving files where I
want them, and ask me the same questions over and over. I have never had
any of the problems UAC clamis to solve ever on any OS, so I simply do not
need and want it. This is a personal preference, I fully respect and
aknowledge that UAC represent security for a lot of people.

 

[ceed]

The breadcrumb feature is very intuitive.
It gives instant access to the entire tree.
People just need to get used to it, then it replaces the up, down, left,
right, and home buttons.
Little things seem to bug people.

Maybe little things that seems to bug people bugs them because to them it
is not little? Breacrumb, arrows, it's all good. But I still want my up
button back, and I have it in other file managers and on Linux! Isn't
having alternatives and options a great thing?

 

[ggull]

Why? Click on the parent folder in the Addressbar. Why DUPLICATE
functionality?

1) "Why duplicate functionality?" a strange question to ask about Windows
where there are so often several different ways to do something or get to
somewhere. Are you saying MS should NOT have introduced the other new way to
go up a level, the alt-uparrow shortcut? That certainly duplicates
functionality.
The new ways are good, but so was the old way and people were used to it...
if it ain't broke, don't take it away.

2) I'd be more impressed if MS had decided to just eliminate the toolbar to
save space (or for design clarity or whatever), but to put a big honkin'
hardwired bar there with such wonderful and universally necessary
options-that-everybody-uses-every-day as "burn" and not let us customize it
to include the functionality we're used to (and to make the menu bar
something you have to dig for, instead of default) adds insult to injury.

It's not the end of the world, but it is indicative of the disdain in which
Microsoft holds its mere users. I.e. customers.

 

[Steve Thackery]

I just do not see the reason why Microsoft would remove a function which

has been there since the "dawn of graphical file managers"! Maybe it was
because they had to add some much crap (like UAC!) that they felt they had
to remove something?

They haven't really removed it. They've actually improved the whole thing
by showing you the "breadcrumb trail".

You just click at the appropriate point in the breadcrumb trail and you can
go up one, two or as many levels as you like with one click. Better, in my
opinion.

Did you really not know about this?

SteveT

 

[Steve Thackery]

Interesting that there's a web page describing work arounds for the

missing up button.

It's not a workaround!! It's deliberate, and Vista's new way of doing it.

SteveT

 

[Alias]

Hi,

I am running Vista and Linux Mint on my laptop. They share a data
partition they can both read from, so it's really easy to switch. The
thing is that the two are so similar now I do not even notice which one
I'm on. The main (relatively few) differences are what you can run and
how things run: Not many games on Linux and not very good fast Internet
connection on Vista. When it comes to installing them on my HP laptop
they came out about the same. Vista took a little longer to install than
Linux Mint, but other than that they both had a couple of hurdles I had
to get across but they were minor. On Vista I had to install a lot of HP
drivers to get things to work like multimedia buttons, wireless Internet
and built in multi-card readers. On Linux these things simply worked out
of the box. I've been using Windows and Linux on and off for more than
ten years. Sometines Linux is my preference, sometimes Windows. I
reallly like Vista and think it's the best OS from Microsoft ever, so
these days I am keeping both and can not decide which one is my favorite.

Oh, one thing: The "Up" button is gone from Windows Explorer. Why on
earth did they remove such an intuitive feature from the main file
manager? People tell me I do not need it, but I do, and that in itself
is one reason to spend some more time on Linux: The up button for file
management. As you can see I have to really look hard to find a reason
to use one over the other!

I thought you said Linux was off topic here.

Alias

 

[ceed]

I thought you said Linux was off topic here.

Read my response in the other thread: I did not say that Linux was
off-topic as long as it has a Windows Vista angle. However, a listing of
Ubuntu or Mac OSX features would, in my opinion, be ioff topic.

 

[ceed]

They haven't really removed it. They've actually improved the whole
thing by showing you the "breadcrumb trail".
You just click at the appropriate point in the breadcrumb trail and you
can go up one, two or as many levels as you like with one click.
Better, in my opinion.
Did you really not know about this?
SteveT

I did know about it and have tried using it, but can not see how having to
do several operations which in the past only required one is an
improvement. It's just that having access to plain vertical navigation is
something I have used since I started using computers. Microsoft even had
that in the first UI based file manager in DOS! I even prefer to have an
"up" eleemnt above the the folder listing so I can navigate vertially
using the keyboard. You can see how that's done in Total Commander (a
popular file manager for Windows):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Total_Commander.gif

If you notice the arrows on top of each pane, they take you up one level.
Makes navigation really fast. Windows Explorer doesn't have effcient
vertical navigatin in Vista at all anymore. Mac OSX and it's Next like
approach also has very efficient vertical navigation.

 

[ceed]

It's not a workaround!! It's deliberate, and Vista's new way of doing
it.

SteveT

If I need to read pages of "how to" just to move up and down in a file
system the procedures are not intuitive and efficient in my opinion. One
button pointing up is. I have no problems with you prefering to do it the
new improved way, but you (and Microsoft who otherwise did such a great
job on Vista) seem to think that should be the only way. I do not see it
that way, and want my up button back.

You know, I am almost willing to bet on it being back in the next version
of Windows!