That's okay - I need some straws to clutch at ! ;-)
Yes - that's the frustrating thing. If I could pin this problem down to one
particular thing, and demonstrate that it was faulty, then I could do
something about getting it replaced. I agree that all we seem to be able to
say is that there is something in the difference between Windows 2000 and
Windows Me which won't work correctly with the combination of XP2400 and
GA-7VRXP, and yet is fine with a Duron 650 in the GA-7VRXP.
The logical inference is that either the XP2400 or Windows 2000 is faulty,
but I cannot determine which.
Given the complexities of making a 'slipstreamed' install CD, it strikes me
that I could use a simpler method. I can install Windows 2000 and run it
fine with the Duron 650, but then when I switch over to the XP2400 it hangs.
So I guess I could install a Service Pack with the Duron 650 then switch to
the XP2400 to see if the Service pack had 'corrected a fault' in Windows
2000 ? Given that there are four sevice packs, then I suppose I could cycle
through this procedure four times.
The GA-7VRXP is Revision 1.1 and came with the F12 BIOS fitted - this is the
same as the latest BIOS for the board available from the Gigabyte web site,
so I have no updating or flashing to do. I think that BIOS corruptions can
be ruled out as the board has 'Dual BIOS technology'.
If the vital clue to the problem lies in the difference between a
thunderbird-core Duron 650 and a thoroughbred-core XP2400, then there are
two differences - SSE instructions and level 2 cache. If Windows 2000 has a
problem with either of these two, then I would expect that one of the
Service Packs would directly address that problem. Microsoft do not appear
to have documented this, but would they ?
Kevin.
DL <> wrote:
| The problem lies with the cpu, mobo and win2k interacting with both
| Its more likely to be the first two combination.
| As for what/why???
| You could I guess, try creating a new slipstreamed win2k install cd.
| Though I confess I doubt it would make any difference
| Another thing I notice there are three revisions of this mobo, you
| updated correct drivers / bios for your revision?
| -clutching at straws here?-
|
| "Kevin Lawton" <> wrote in message
| || Oh dear - no hope for me then ! :-(
|| All the various bits for this new PC were gradually purchased last
|| Autumn. I was then busy working away from home over the winter so I
|| only got the time to try putting everything together about 3 weeks
|| ago.
|| Logically, I find it difficult to understand why one build using a
|| set of components might work while another build using identical
|| components might fail. I can accept that it might happen
|| occasionally but, in the absence of an actual fault somewhere, I
|| can't understand it.
|| Given that all other parts have been swapped, the logical conclusion
|| is that the problem lies between the CPU and Windows 2000. Either
|| the XP2400 is unable to work in some way that only Windows 2000 (and
|| no other op system) requires, or Windows 2000 is trying to do
|| something with the XP2400 (and not with other processors) which the
|| XP2400 should not be doing. The problem lies in proving which one -
|| the XP2400 or Windows 2000 - is faulty. In the absence of decent
|| diagnostics from Windows 2000, and comprehendsive CPU test and
|| diagnostic software, this is pretty much impossible.
|| Purchasing either another XP2400 CPU, or another copy of Windows
|| 2000, is not a financially viable option for me.
|| The one thing I think I need now is some way forward. By all
|| accounts an XP2400 on a GA-7VRXP should be able to run Windows 2000,
|| so it is case of pin-pointing the problem.
|| Very gratefull for all the help received so far, I'm hoping that
|| somebody has a good idea.
|| TIA
|| Kevin.
||
|| DL <> wrote:
||| I mention BT merely as an example of my experience with a piece of
||| hardware not functioning, whilst on an identical setup it was ok.
||| I'm trying to point out; that there are occasions when with
||| identical setups one will work and the other will not.
||| The likelyhood is that if you were able to swap out the mobo and cpu
||| for identical products it would be OK.
||| The only hope for this is if you bought at same time from same
||| supplier
|||
||| "Kevin Lawton" <> wrote in message
||| |||| DL <> wrote:
||||| BT? - your ISP is BT
||||
|||| Well yes, my ISP is BT but I don't think they'd want to get
|||| involved with a hardware or software problem on a machine which
|||| hasn't got as far as being 'connected' yet. It can be bad enough
|||| (and very time-consuming) trying to get BT to help when there's a
|||| connection problem, or their DNS servers are down. Their
|||| expensive-to-call helpdesk staff just follow a 'script' of
|||| inappropriate questions and misleading suggestions (like insisting
|||| that I should re-install all
|||| my software and buy a new router when they have a DNS problem !). I
|||| can imagine they'd probably have me going out buying a new monitor,
|||| or removing the HSF to see if the XP2400 gets warm enough ! Their
|||| support is worse than useless - the only reason I stick with them
|||| is because it would be too much hassle if I lost this e-mail
|||| address as
|||| I use it to get work.
|||| I've already tried swapping out the m/board for another identical
|||| one - and the problem was identical too. I could have a shot at
|||| trying to return the CPU, but I'd need to show that it is faulty
|||| first. As it will merrily run Windows Me (or several other op
|||| systems I've tried) with no problem then that is going to be
|||| difficult. I could counter that with saying that a Duon 650 does
|||| run everything fine.
|||| The one variable I haven't tried in this 'equation' yet is a
|||| completely different m/board. It might just be that the combination
|||| of GA-7VRXP, XP2400 and Windows 2000 are incompatible. At the
|||| moment, I can swap the XP2400 for a Duron 650, or swap Windows 2000
|||| for Windows Me and get a result. What I haven't tried is some
|||| different m/board. The main barrier with this is that a new m/board
|||| is just as inaffordable as a new CPU.
|||| I think my PC is bad for my mental health !
|||| Kevin.
||||
||||| I spoke with them because I was able to identify the initial
||||| problem as been with their hardware.
||||| The problem is that you have at least three pieces of kit, any of
||||| which could be the problem, though its more likely to be hardware
||||| than software. If you recently purchased mobo or cpu are you able
||||| to exchange ?
|||||
||||| "Kevin Lawton" <> wrote in message
||||| |||||| DL <> wrote:
||||||| Nothing special as far as I'm aware, I only had the problem with
||||||| one AMD cpu, never cured it and I did swap it for another
||||||| identical cpu, gave up, upgraded mobo and cpu.
||||||| There have been reports of the occasional problems with various
||||||| hardware and AMD, though this was some years ago, where
||||||| seemingly with identical hardware one would have a conflict and
||||||| the other wouldnt.
||||||| I got into some deep conversations with BT and AMD over this
||||||| issue.
||||||
|||||| BT ? - who are they ?
|||||| I would really like for MS to be involved. After all, it is
|||||| Windows 2000 which is going wrong and failing to provide an
|||||| error message. I'll certainly have words with AMD support, who I
|||||| expect will refer me to Gigabyte, who in turn will either ignore
|||||| me or refer me elsewhere.
|||||| The question is: if I were to go out and buy another GA-7VRXP
|||||| m/board, AMD XP2400 processor, and a fresh shrink-wrapped copy of
|||||| Windows 2000 would it all work ?
|||||| Kevin.
||||||
||||||| "Kevin Lawton" <> wrote in message
||||||| |||||||| DL <> wrote:
||||||||| I've changed mobo's and cpu's on many Win2K setups the only
||||||||| one
||||||||| I had trouble with was a1.3Duron, and that was an heat
||||||||| problem, even using OTT coolers - never got to the bottom of
||||||||| it!!
|||||||||
||||||||| When I mentioned entering the bios I meant was the new cpu
||||||||| being correctly identified
||||||||
|||||||| Yes - the BIOS identifies both the Duron 650 and the XP2400
|||||||| correctly. In the Windows Me installation which works with
|||||||| either processor (I swap HDs) I have a few utilities which can
|||||||| run
|||||||| system identification and
||||||| benchmarking -
|||||||| everything shows up correctly with all of them. What I don't
|||||||| have is any software to fully test out a CPU. I can identify
|||||||| it, burn it in and benchmark it - but not fully test it, the
|||||||| whole works - all instructions, caches, pipelines, everything.
|||||||| I think that
|||||||| this would have to be my next step short of actually buying
|||||||| another XP2400 (ouch - my poor wallet). I guess there isn't a
|||||||| special way you have
|||||||| to install Windows 2000 on an XP processor because of the SSE
|||||||| instructions, is there ?
|||||||| TIA
|||||||| Kevin.
||||||||
||||||||| "Kevin Lawton" <> wrote in message
||||||||| |||||||||| DL <> wrote:
||||||||||| Sorry missed the line about mobo;
|||||||||| No worries, mate, it was early on in the thread. ;-)
||||||||||| With mobo switches on auto, Boots/Runs OK with Duran. - yes?
|||||||||| Oh yes, yes, yes. I can even play around with the FSB and
|||||||||| multiplier switches and overclock the Duron 650 up to 897 MHz
|||||||||| and it still
|||||||||| works fine. Solid processor, that Duron.
||||||||||| Matrox drivers installed for win2k? - yes?
|||||||||| Well, no they weren't. Matrox cards do the standard VESA
|||||||||| modes properly so they are fine with Windows 'generic VGA
|||||||||| card' drivers.
|||||||||| I have now tried installing the latest Matrox drivers and
|||||||||| guess what ? - no change.
||||||||||| Change the cpu, restart, enter the bios and check settings,
||||||||||| eg cpu.
|||||||||| I've tried this, with the settings on auto and with the
|||||||||| settings forcing the correct FSB and multiplier. I've even
|||||||||| tried underclocking the XP2400 a bit. Still no change - works
|||||||||| fine in Windows Me and hangs at Windows 2000 startup.
||||||||||| If OK reboot from win2k installation disk ( you may have to
||||||||||| enable boot from cd in bios) and repair.
|||||||||| Tried this and of course the repair installation hangs after
|||||||||| the 'Starting Windows' progress bar again. Had to swap back
|||||||||| to the Duron 650 to get that to finish again.
||||||||||| Other than that you appear to have covered everything.
|||||||||| That's what I thought, but there is still a problem. The way
|||||||||| things are going I might be better off using this PC as
|||||||||| landfill and 'cover everything' with concrete !
||||||||||| Good luck
|||||||||| I think I need more than luck - I need a miracle. At least, I
|||||||||| could do with some decent diagnostics out of Windows 2000. I
|||||||||| don't really want to have to spend the rest of my life trying
|||||||||| to edit video on a Duron 650.
|||||||||| Thanks for the help.
|||||||||| Kevin.
||||||||||
||||||||||| "Kevin Lawton" <> wrote in message
||||||||||| |||||||||||| Sorry- I though that was known. The motherboard is a
|||||||||||| Gigabyte GA-7VRXP (I have tried two samples) Rev1.1, as
|||||||||||| staed in my original post which is still at the foot of
|||||||||||| this thread. Originally I left the m/board switches for
|||||||||||| FSB and multiplier in the 'auto' setting, as was the
|||||||||||| memory bus clock. Since
|||||||||||| then I've tried slowing things down from 133 MHz to 100 MHz
|||||||||||| on the FSB (effectively 266 -> 200 due to DDR), and from
|||||||||||| 166 MHz to 133 MHz then 100 MHz on the memory bus clock
|||||||||||| (DDR = 333 -> 266 -> 200). Same result every time - problem
|||||||||||| persists.
|||||||||||| M/board BIOS is 'F12', which is the latest on the Gigabyte
|||||||||||| web site. Not too sure what else I can adjust without doing
|||||||||||| damage. Kevin.
||||||||||||
|||||||||||| DL <> wrote:
||||||||||||| If I understand correctly;
||||||||||||| Using Duran, win2k installed and booted correctly
||||||||||||| With XP2400 it wouldnt boot ( Win98 is I believe slightly
||||||||||||| more hardware 'fault' tolerant)
||||||||||||| If this is the case might suggest a mobo setting, with
||||||||||||| this cpu, or possibly bios update required.
||||||||||||| What is the mobo?
|||||||||||||
||||||||||||| "Kevin Lawton" <> wrote in message
||||||||||||| |||||||||||||| I'm on about as mininal as the system can go anyway, the
|||||||||||||| only card being the Matrix G400 graphics card.
|||||||||||||| I've tried swapping every system component individually
|||||||||||||| for a replacement - except for the processor (expensive
|||||||||||||| !). The
|||||||||||||| same result every time - the system hangs when the
|||||||||||||| 'Starting Windows' progress bar completes. With a fresh
|||||||||||||| install, this
|||||||||||||| is as far as I can get - the install
|||||||||||||| hasn't completed sufficiently to give me any 'recovery'
|||||||||||||| options.
|||||||||||||| I did try swapping out the XP2400 processor for an old
|||||||||||||| Duron 650 - and it worked fine ! Problem with that is
|||||||||||||| that the Duron 650 doesn't give enough performance for
|||||||||||||| the video editing I'm
|||||||||||||| planning to do.
|||||||||||||| After the system was fully working with the Duron 650 I
|||||||||||||| went back to the XP2400 and the problem re-emerged just
|||||||||||||| the same.
|||||||||||||| I also tried installing Windows Me and that runs on the
|||||||||||||| XP2400 fine, so I'm not inclined to blame the processor.
|||||||||||||| Could there be something which Windows 2000 is doing with
|||||||||||||| the XP2400 which doesn't happen with a different
|||||||||||||| processor or op system ?
|||||||||||||| I'm really confused with this - any help gratefully
|||||||||||||| appreciated. Kevin.
||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||| DL <> wrote:
||||||||||||||| Tried installing to min sys, Monitor, KeyB, mouse,cd -
||||||||||||||| no cards, extra hardware
||||||||||||||| and or with a single DDR?
|||||||||||||||
||||||||||||||| "Kevin Lawton" <> wrote in message
||||||||||||||| |||||||||||||||| I've just installed Windows 2000 onto a new machine and
|||||||||||||||| it hangs indefinitely when the 'Starting Windows'
|||||||||||||||| progress bar completes. No error messages or re-boots -
|||||||||||||||| it just hangs. Machine spec:
|||||||||||||||| AMD XP2400 processor,
|||||||||||||||| Gigabyte GA-7VRXP m/board,
|||||||||||||||| 2 x 256 Mb DDR PC2700 RAM,
|||||||||||||||| 330w PSU,
|||||||||||||||| Seagate 60 Gb HDD.
|||||||||||||||| The m/board, memory and HDD have been swapped-out with
|||||||||||||||| no change in result. The system can boot into DOS, from
|||||||||||||||| either floppy or HD fine.
|||||||||||||||| I think I might have seen similar problems reported
|||||||||||||||| before, but don't recall seeing any solution.
|||||||||||||||| Please help.
|||||||||||||||| Regards,
|||||||||||||||| Kevin.
