Linux Freeware

[Kevin Davis³]

Yep. It is a work in progress and is honestly presented as such,
unlike your friendly Trustworthy Computing organisation.

Linux doesn't have the security problems of Win2k which is the most
important aspect.

The "work in progress" claim is a cop out to own up to the flaws.
Funny how people on one hand are pushing Linux to be the
desktop/server/enterprise replacements for Windows *NOW*, but when the
flaws are mentioned, the "work in progress" excuse is made which
somehow does not apply to the others. Can't have it both ways.

I want Linux to succeed and present stiff competition to Microsoft,
but no double-standards, please.

 

[Kevin Davis³]

You guys need to reconsider and try a recent distro. Mandrake installs
flawlessly for most people (I am sure no harder then Lindows) and is
point and clik if you want it and yet it moves you away from the
monoculture that is Windows.

Since RedHat dumped their free desktop distro (to Fedora, which I hear
has it's problems now), I reformatted one of my RedHat systems to
install Mandrake. This was Mandrake 9.2. I was a little disappointed
that it did not automatically detect my very basic Sound Blaster card.
I have also yet to get VNC to run properly on the system, even though
the service manager says it is running.

I have yet to see a Linux distro (tried the latest RedHat, Mandrake,
Debian) that is intuitive and easy to use as Windows. There's been a
lot of improvement in the last 5 years (but not that much in the last
year) but there's a ways to go, IMO.

To see what your missing grab one of the bootable distros, Texstar
recently released a bootable Mandrake 9.2 distro with all the goodies

Can you provide a link?

Thanks

 

[SINNER]

* Kevin Davis³ Wrote in alt.comp.freeware, on Sat, 22 Nov 2003 02:32:29 GMT:

On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 18:30:20 GMT, SINNER

Since RedHat dumped their free desktop distro (to Fedora, which I hear
has it's problems now), I reformatted one of my RedHat systems to
install Mandrake. This was Mandrake 9.2. I was a little disappointed
that it did not automatically detect my very basic Sound Blaster card.
I have also yet to get VNC to run properly on the system, even though
the service manager says it is running.

I have yet to see a Linux distro (tried the latest RedHat, Mandrake,
Debian) that is intuitive and easy to use as Windows. There's been a
lot of improvement in the last 5 years (but not that much in the last
year) but there's a ways to go, IMO.

MDK 9.1 flawlessly installed on a laptop with a wireless network card
and an AMD desktop with soundblaster live, geforce2mx, network etc..

It really is about checking hardware compatibility before installing. I
have installed XP on both of those boxes and it took at least 2x as long
to get everything configured. I have been running linux only @ home for
about 15 months.

Can you provide a link?

http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/linux/distributions/contrib/texstar/pclinuxos/live-cd/english/preview-3/

http://tinyurl.com/veuj

Or Knoppix (Which I reccomend trying first as it is nothinig short of
amazing and is quite a bit more mature then the above mandrake release:

http://www.knoppix.net/

 

[SINNER]

* Kevin Davis³ Wrote in alt.comp.freeware, on Sat, 22 Nov 2003 02:26:20 GMT:

The "work in progress" claim is a cop out to own up to the flaws.
Funny how people on one hand are pushing Linux to be the
desktop/server/enterprise replacements for Windows *NOW*, but when the
flaws are mentioned, the "work in progress" excuse is made which
somehow does not apply to the others. Can't have it both ways.

I want Linux to succeed and present stiff competition to Microsoft,
but no double-standards, please.

None necessary.

It's no more a work in progress then Windows, the only difference is the
support of hardware manufacturers. Linux is a huge feat considering the
hardware list it supports out of the box. Windows didnt support my
wireless network card, linux did right from the install. It even
supports most basic functionality of a new HP multifunction device
without additional drivers, also a pretty impressive feat.

 

[Joachim Ziebs]

Hi!

But I really don't want to learn another system.
I want to point & click and get the job done. I have other priorities.

Stick to Windows.

Call me brain dead but Linux in it's various forms has been around as
long as it took M$ to get to the Win95 stage and Linux still don't
seem to have reached that point.

Luckily. No virusses, worms or other nasty critters.

If Mandrake, Suse, Debian or whoever, can do what Lindows is doing,
then I'll consider buying them. No offence to you because I know you
mean well.

Any Linux will do what you want, how you want it done. You only have to
learn how to make it do what and how you want it.

Greetings,

Joachim

 

[Christopher Jahn]

Hi!



Do yourself a favour and pick a real distribution.
Lindows allows you to run your PC as root, a nono in the
Linux world. Consider Mandrake, Suse or Debian.

Of course, Lindows ALSO allows you to run Windows programs
natively, which is somthing that Mandrake, suse and Debian do
NOT do.



--
Christopher Jahn
:-(

http://mywebpage.netscape.com/xjahn/Main.html

It is the wise bird who builds his nest in a tree.

 

[Onno Tasler]

Of course, Lindows ALSO allows you to run Windows programs
natively, which is somthing that Mandrake, suse and Debian do
NOT do.

Not Lindows is doing the job, but the included WINE - which is available
for other Linux distributions, too. (In neither case it works perfectly)

bye,

Onno

 

[juzme]

But Wine is a pain for some progs.

Of course, Lindows ALSO allows you to run Windows programs
natively, which is somthing that Mandrake, suse and Debian do
NOT do.



--
Christopher Jahn
:-(

http://mywebpage.netscape.com/xjahn/Main.html

It is the wise bird who builds his nest in a tree.

 

[Joachim Ziebs]

Hi Christopher!

Of course, Lindows ALSO allows you to run Windows programs
natively, which is somthing that Mandrake, suse and Debian do
NOT do.

If you plan on running Windows apps, STICK TO WINDOWS.
Apart from that, man Wine (available to all Linux variants.)

Greetings,

Joachim

 

[Kevin Davis³]

* Kevin Davis³ Wrote in alt.comp.freeware, on Sat, 22 Nov 2003 02:32:29 GMT:



MDK 9.1 flawlessly installed on a laptop with a wireless network card
and an AMD desktop with soundblaster live, geforce2mx, network etc..

Knoppix (a Debian Live CD) had no problem automatically detecting the
card. In any case, I was able to get the card to work after manually
forcing a redetect using sndconfig.

http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/linux/distributions/contrib/texstar/pclinuxos/live-cd/english/preview-3/

http://tinyurl.com/veuj

Yeah, thanks. I found it on a Google search later on. It looks good,
but I am having a bit of a hard time getting ssh to run. It won't
install from the package manager - probably because it is trying to
write something to an area on the CD ROM. Do I have to do something
like remove and/or redirect symbolic links to get this to work?

Or Knoppix (Which I reccomend trying first as it is nothinig short of
amazing and is quite a bit more mature then the above mandrake release:

http://www.knoppix.net/

Yes, I have been using Knoppix for months now. I agree it is
fantastic particularly for getting others involved with Linux.
Another good one is called Adios which is similar to Knoppix but is
based on a RedHat distro (to be changed to Fedora).

 

[techie]

Not Lindows is doing the job, but the included WINE - which is available
for other Linux distributions, too. (In neither case it works perfectly)

I've always wondered... can you run cygwin under wine?

Never mind why. I just like to do weird things.

 

[Kevin Davis³]

None necessary.

It's no more a work in progress then Windows,

I don't disagree. That's basically my main point. Don't turn a blind
eye to Linux vulnerabilities because they are a supposed "work in
progress" while at the same time pointing out how bad Windows is
because of all their vulnerabilities.

the only difference is the
support of hardware manufacturers. Linux is a huge feat considering the
hardware list it supports out of the box.

Yes, it is a significant accomplishment.

Windows didnt support my
wireless network card, linux did right from the install. It even
supports most basic functionality of a new HP multifunction device
without additional drivers, also a pretty impressive feat.

I've had more the opposite experience. I do feel that hardware
detection/support is much better than it was a few years ago with
Linux but in my experience it hasn't quite caught up with Windows.
But the improvements are promising.

 

[Onno Tasler]

I've always wondered... can you run cygwin under wine?
Never mind why. I just like to do weird things.

Sure, you can. I think that has been even tested by somebody.

bye,

Onno

 

[SINNER]

* Kevin Davis³ Wrote in alt.comp.freeware, on Sun, 23 Nov 2003 01:00:46 GMT:

Yeah, thanks. I found it on a Google search later on. It looks good,
but I am having a bit of a hard time getting ssh to run. It won't
install from the package manager - probably because it is trying to
write something to an area on the CD ROM. Do I have to do something
like remove and/or redirect symbolic links to get this to work?

I havent done much more then boot it to make sure the image was good so
I cant be of any help there, sorry.

 

[D.R]

SuSE 8.1/8.2 will setup up a dual boot
for your nicely and easily. A real no
brainer. It is also very click'n'run
-ish.

However, Debian is the GNU/Linux OS of
choice. Lindows is based on it, but they
have perverted it and are charging for
what people can download for free anyways.

 

[Wald]

Go back & read my original post.

Sigh... never mind.

 

[Richard Steven Hack]

Call me brain dead but Linux in it's various forms has been around as
long as it took M$ to get to the Win95 stage and Linux still don't
seem to have reached that point.

Linux at this point is FAR more powerful than Windows 95 would ever
dream of being.

As for ease of use, Linux at this point is quite easy to use if your
hardware is at all standard. Mind you, there are differences in
behavior and the applications are different. But the basic concepts
of GUI use are virtually the same.

You can also (off-topic) buy Crossover Office and run Microsoft Office
on top of Linux if you need to.

 

[Richard Steven Hack]

Of course, Lindows ALSO allows you to run Windows programs
natively, which is somthing that Mandrake, suse and Debian do
NOT do.

WINE runs on any Linux distro and will allow this to some degree. If
you want to run Microsoft Office, the (off-topic fee-paid) Crossover
Officer product will allow you to do that.

Many Windows programs run okay on WINE - such as Free Agent.

 

[Richard Steven Hack]

Actually, it does. There are many security holes being found in Linux
on a regular basis.

Most of the security holes "in Linux" are in the various UNIX
applications that run on top of the Linux kernel. The kernel itself
rarely has security problems (though it has had them). There is no
comparison to Windows which allows apps deep access to the kernel.

In any event, while Linux has security problems, they are fixed much
more quickly than Microsoft security holes, and there certainly is not
anywhere near as many malware programs running around. There are no
more than ten or twenty worms and less than ten viruses, IIRC.
Compare that to several score thousand trojans and viruses for
Windows. While that is no guarantee that viruses won't pick up on
Linux once the virus writers start targeting it, it is MUCH harder to
write a virus for Linux because you have to include a root exploit to
make the virus able to spread across permission boundaries. Linux is
significantly more secure than Windows now and for the foreseeable
future.

 

[Richard Steven Hack]

The biggest hurdle for most beginners to Linux is doing the partitioning
Use Partition Magic in Windows and most installs are as easy as Windows to
install

Apropos my posting on this subject...Yes, I agree wholeheartedly.

If you're going to have a dual boot system, please DO pay attention to
the Partition Magic manual though, ESPECIALLY this:

"WARNING! If
you are using a boot utility like Boot Magic [included with PM, and
which I recommend], LILO (Linux Loader) must be installed to the Linux
partition containing the root directory and not installed to the master
boot record."

During mandrake install you get prompted, so make the right choice

If you don't do this, and subsequently decide to remove linux, you
probably won't be able to boot the other OS :-(

Of course, you're not obliged to use Partition Magic (even though there
/are/ freeware versions around of v5.0 AFAIK, and they will do fine for
dual boot win98se/linux) and Boot Magic, but it will make your life SO
easy.

Be VERY careful with Partition Magic V5.0. I got this off a magazine
CD and have had nothing but trouble with it. Recently I resized my C:
partition with parted, the Linux partition manager, and now Partition
Magic claims it can't read the Windows partition. Windows, needless
to say, is running fine. Partition Magic is constantly complaining
about the drive geometry of my drives, too, and frequently hoses
itself so badly it gives me an "Error 105" - which is Partition
Magic's way of saying, "I have NO CLUE WHAT I'M DOING!"

If you are going to use Partition Magic, use the latest version which
might be more bug-free. Version 5 in my opinion is utterly
unreliable.

Partitioning really isn't that big a deal. Virtually every Linux
install will partition your drives for you in some default manner and
even if you do it yourself, the partitioning tool is entirely
adequate. I have had problems with an older Compaq machine which none
of the distros could read a partition table from even after they had
created it themselves. But Red Hat 7.3 has no problems with my current
machine. Partition Magic is only necessary if you have to MERGE one
partition with another - that doesn't seem to be possible with any of
the Linux partition managers yet. They can create, delete, copy, and
resize partitions fairly easily, however.