Inconsistent loading of Systray programs

[KenV]

Has anyone figured out yet why various programs in the Startup group which
should end up in the Systray sometimes load and sometimes do not? There is
no particular pattern to this, although some programs fail to load more
often than others.

For example, Windows Live OneCare has a service connected with it, and about
a third of the time I cold boot the computer OneCare doesn't start, gives me
a message that the service hasn't started, and I have to go to Services and
start it manually. This isn't a problem, but it is an inconvenience. (The
OneCare Live support people tell me to go through the process of disabling
all the startup programs and non-Microsoft services and add them in, one by
one to see which one is interfering. Besides being cumbersome and tedious,
this process probably wouldn't solve a problem that is somewhat random.)

There are other programs that don't load from time to time, but they are
different each time. I may have from 5 to 10 program icons in the SysTray on
any given boot.

How do you troubleshoot an issue like this? Or is it just something that is
characteristic of XP?

Ken

 

[Rock]

Has anyone figured out yet why various programs in the Startup group which
should end up in the Systray sometimes load and sometimes do not? There is
no particular pattern to this, although some programs fail to load more
often than others.

For example, Windows Live OneCare has a service connected with it, and
about a third of the time I cold boot the computer OneCare doesn't start,
gives me a message that the service hasn't started, and I have to go to
Services and start it manually. This isn't a problem, but it is an
inconvenience. (The OneCare Live support people tell me to go through the
process of disabling all the startup programs and non-Microsoft services
and add them in, one by one to see which one is interfering. Besides being
cumbersome and tedious, this process probably wouldn't solve a problem
that is somewhat random.)

There are other programs that don't load from time to time, but they are
different each time. I may have from 5 to 10 program icons in the SysTray
on any given boot.

How do you troubleshoot an issue like this? Or is it just something that
is characteristic of XP?

It's an issue of the combination of programs that are loading and the timing
of them. It can vary from boot to boot, so that's why you see the problems
occurring at different times.

Here is a link to a thread about startup order for programs/services. See
the post by Wesley Vogel. It is a very interwoven process.

http://groups.google.com/group/micr...94c88?lnk=st&q=&rnum=1&hl=en#c4cef0ccf8b94c88

One thing to try is to wait longer at the Welcome Screen before logging into
the computer. I have one system where if I don't wait long enough the 3rd
party firewall service, Kerio PF, won't load, and it has to be started
manually after login. After waiting at the login screen (using the classic
login rather than the welcome screen) for about 30 seconds or so the wait
hourglass pops up, disappears, pops up again a few seconds later and then
disappears for the final time. Logging in after that results in all
services loading as they should.

Another thing to try is to disable one or both of these services from Start
| Run | Services.msc:
SSDP Discovery Service
UPnp Service

If neither of these things resolve the issue then the next step is clean
boot troubleshooting to see if the you can pinpoint where the problem lies.
Then comes the issue of how to resolve it.

Clean Boot Troubleshooting

How to Troubleshoot By Using the Msconfig Utility in Windows XP
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=310560

How to perform advanced clean-boot troubleshooting in Windows XP
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=316434

How to perform a clean boot in Windows XP
http://support.microsoft.com/?id=310353

 

[Guest]

Has anyone figured out yet why various programs in the Startup group which
should end up in the Systray sometimes load and sometimes do not? There is
no particular pattern to this, although some programs fail to load more
often than others.

For example, Windows Live OneCare has a service connected with it, and about
a third of the time I cold boot the computer OneCare doesn't start, gives me
a message that the service hasn't started, and I have to go to Services and
start it manually. This isn't a problem, but it is an inconvenience. (The
OneCare Live support people tell me to go through the process of disabling
all the startup programs and non-Microsoft services and add them in, one by
one to see which one is interfering. Besides being cumbersome and tedious,
this process probably wouldn't solve a problem that is somewhat random.)

There are other programs that don't load from time to time, but they are
different each time. I may have from 5 to 10 program icons in the SysTray on
any given boot.

How do you troubleshoot an issue like this? Or is it just something that is
characteristic of XP?

Ken

checkout windows eventvwr (run from the run command) probably they are
crashing on bootup.

Flamer.

 

[KenV]

Another thing to try is to disable one or both of these services from
Start | Run | Services.msc:
SSDP Discovery Service
UPnp Service

Thanks very much--I'm going to try these first, one at a time.

I've looked up these services and can't tell if they are necessary--one or
both--for normal operation of XP. Do I lose anything by disabling these?

Ken

 

[Rock]

Thanks very much--I'm going to try these first, one at a time.

I've looked up these services and can't tell if they are necessary--one or
both--for normal operation of XP. Do I lose anything by disabling these?

No, not for most users. I have them disabled. I don't have any UPnp
devices. See this:
http://www.jsifaq.com/SF/Tips/Tip.aspx?id=8208

 

[KenV]

No, not for most users. I have them disabled. I don't have any UPnp
devices. See this:
http://www.jsifaq.com/SF/Tips/Tip.aspx?id=8208

Interesting follow-up, sort of.

I disabled both the services and all the system tray items came up after
reboot except for Windows Live OneCare.

So I looked at the OneCare service dependencies, and one was the RPC
service, which was running. But the RPC service was set to logon to NT
AUTHORITY\NetworkService with a password, etc. instead of to local system
account. The Microsoft default for that logon is "local system account"
according to the MS Kb, so I changed the RPC logon to local system account.
(The logon for RPC Locator service, on the other hand, should be NT
AUTHORITY\NetworkService, which it already was, so I left it alone.)

I then rebooted, and every startup program loaded this time, including
OneCare.

Of course, I don't know if the problem is permanently solved yet. You never
do know, with Windows.

Ken

 

[Rock]

Nice work Ken. Yep if not this one reappearing for sure it will be
something else at some point. Are SSDP Discovery Service and UPnp Service
still disabled?

 

[KenV]

Nice work Ken. Yep if not this one reappearing for sure it will be
something else at some point. Are SSDP Discovery Service and UPnp Service
still disabled?

Rock,

Thanks.

Yes, both services are still disabled. So far, everything is loading and
running well.

I suppose to be scientific about it I should enable each of the two
services, one at a time, to see if the problem reappears. It /could/ have
been due entirely to the incorrect logon of the RPC service.

Ken

 

[KenV]

Nice work Ken. Yep if not this one reappearing for sure it will be
something else at some point. Are SSDP Discovery Service and UPnp Service
still disabled?

In the interest of science I re-enabled in manual mode first SSDP,
rebooted, then UPnP, rebooted, and each time the service in question started
and all the System Tray icons appeared, including OneCare.

My tentative conclusion is that it was the RPC logon issue that was causing
the loading problem all along, but we'll see. If the loading problem recurs,
I'll disable the UPnP and SSDP services, again, one by one.

Ken

 

[Rock]

In the interest of science I re-enabled in manual mode first SSDP,
rebooted, then UPnP, rebooted, and each time the service in question
started and all the System Tray icons appeared, including OneCare.

My tentative conclusion is that it was the RPC logon issue that was
causing the loading problem all along, but we'll see. If the loading
problem recurs, I'll disable the UPnP and SSDP services, again, one by
one.

Ok, I have seen systems where everything was fine then there was some
change, new software or otherwise, and the icons not loading problem then
shows up. So yes it could happen some time down the road. Thanks for
posting back.

 

[KenV]

Ok, I have seen systems where everything was fine then there was some
change, new software or otherwise, and the icons not loading problem then
shows up. So yes it could happen some time down the road. Thanks for
posting back.

Final (?) post on this topic:

Again, I had trouble loading the programs today with both UPnP and SSDP
started. I disabled UPnP first and for a couple of boots it was fine. Then.
after installing a new program, the problem showed up again, just as you
say. So I disabled the SSDP service as well, and now it seems to be working.

The strangeness of Windows....

Ken

 

[Rock]

Final (?) post on this topic:

Again, I had trouble loading the programs today with both UPnP and SSDP
started. I disabled UPnP first and for a couple of boots it was fine.
Then. after installing a new program, the problem showed up again, just as
you say. So I disabled the SSDP service as well, and now it seems to be
working.

The strangeness of Windows....

Yep, this I have seen before. I'm guessing it will stay stable with both of
them disabled.