hate and ur OS

[Charlie Tame]

"how about MS designing..."
AFAIK all Microsoft operating systems as well as most other operating
systems "actually works with hardware"

Windows Vista works with a great deal of hardware.
More and more manufacturers are doing what they can to make their
hardware compatible with Windows Vista.

Do you expect an operating system to work with all hardware regardless
the intentions of the hardware manufacturer or the age of the hardware?

If you have hardware issues, what have the hardware manufacturers said
when you asked about Windows Vista compatibility?

I haven't had to ask thank you, I am quite able to find my own answers
to all but a few problems, but sadly this is not so for many users.

I just thought that your expression about designing hardware that works
with AN operating system is somewhat putting the cart before the horse.

On a more serious not I most certainly do not expect any OS to work with
all hardware, however the fact that Vista was released as a user
installable CD/DVD based OS without some sort of compatibility warning
was, IMHO, somewhat remiss.

To Microsoft's credit W95/98 and XP will run on a great deal of old
hardware, Vista OTOH has problems with both older and very new systems.
This fact however is very poorly understood until AFTER the user has
bought it.

I have no problem at all with MS breaking the compatibility chain, in
many ways that chain has been a bad thing because IMHO again it has
somewhat stifled progress, but the so has the PC architecture generally.
However "Windows" in one form or another has been successful because of
it's previous "Universality" and right or wrong users expected that to
continue. I think before being unveiled as the great replacement for
everything MS should have taken the initiative by making sure that more
drivers were ready and being a bit more honest with users of older
equipment.

 

[Mike Glenn]

why type so many words? 2 words "Vista Sucks" is enough to explain the
situation

 

[Spanky daMonkey]

The Mike Glenn Syndrome is a term used when a person has certain
limitations in mental functioning and in skills such as communicating,
taking care of him or herself, and social skills. These limitations will
cause a poster to learn and develop more slowly than a typical poster.
Brain dead morons with Mike Glenn Syndrome may take longer to learn
to speak, walk, and take care of their personal needs such as dressing or
eating. They are likely to have trouble learning in school, and posting to
Microsoft newsgroups. They will learn, but it will take them longer. There
may be some things they cannot learn. They keep trying. Make sure to
continue your Meds.

 

[Spanky daMonkey]

The Mike Glenn Syndrome is a term used when a person has certain
limitations in mental functioning and in skills such as communicating,
taking care of him or herself, and social skills. These limitations will
cause a poster to learn and develop more slowly than a typical poster.
Brain dead morons with Mike Glenn Syndrome may take longer to learn
to speak, walk, and take care of their personal needs such as dressing or
eating. They are likely to have trouble learning in school, and posting to
Microsoft newsgroups. They will learn, but it will take them longer. There
may be some things they cannot learn. They keep trying. Make sure to
continue your Meds.

I cannot agree with you more!!

Since this is the case, I think Frank and Bill Yanair deserve the
insulting title of MVP....


Franky Poo MVP
Bill Yanair MVP

We got the title because we are stupid enough to deserve it! lol

 

[Charlie Tame]

why type so many words? 2 words "Vista Sucks" is enough to explain the
situation

You know I wasn't overly impressed with the installer screens, first
impressions was that it didn't look "Finished".

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

"I just thought that your expression about designing hardware"
Ideally they should both happen concurrently.
To a large degree it did as many manufacturers used the Betas of Vista
to start developing their hardware.
At RTM, the manufacturers had about an additional 2 months to make the
final tweaks on their hardware drivers already in As for "cart before
the horse", remember they are together if they do their job best.

A nearly 6 year old HP printer worked in Vista for me until a few
months ago when it had a mechanical failure.

The hardware manufacturers had a long time to work on drivers, not
just the 2 months between RTM and the public release of Windows Vista.
Those that were concerned about their customers needs had drivers at
RTM or shortly thereafter.
The hardware without drivers now indicates those manufacturers do not
care for those customers needing to use that hardware with Windows
Vista.
The problem with driver availability is similar with Windows Vista as
with previous operating systems.

"MS should have taken the initiative by making sure that more drivers
were ready"
Possibly but very difficult to do even for Microsoft.
Other than Microsoft hardware, Microsoft has no control over the other
manufacturers.
Some manufacturers were waiting for RTM to start development or
dedicate significant resources since a change in Vista Beta could
negate their work.
Some manufacturers were already waiting for Microsoft.
If then Microsoft waits for the manufacturers, nothing will happen as
long as both are waiting for the other.
Should Microsoft had waited longer in the hopes more manufacturers
would provide drivers?
I do not know, but at some point it is prudent to go ahead regardless
what the manufacturers are doing since waiting forever is not an
option to users or investors..

During the Beta, many bugs were submitted relating to drivers even
though it was clear Microsoft could do little.
My understanding was Microsoft gave that bug information to
appropriate manufacturers.
Additionally I suggested at least a few times, those with hardware
bugs, contact the manufacturer directly.
The current availability of drivers is the response of the
manufacturers to the users from this feedback as well as feedback from
other sources.

Finally we as users need to take responsibility to make sure all our
essential hardware and software is compatible with a new operating
system.
After all, it is their computer.
Windows XP will probably be supported for several more years and the
existence of a new operating system in itself is insufficient reason
to upgrade.
Most should upgrade only when a feature is needed or new hardware or
software demand the upgrade.
Similar practices apply to almost any purchase of a new product, not
just computer related.

 

[Frank]

It wouldn't be manufactured at all if it didn't work with an "Operating
System", how about MS designing an "Operating system" that actually
works with hardware?

That's funny. Hardware it manufactured to fix other hardware. It's the
software drivers that actually make it work. I was in the Vista beta
program for what seemed like yrs and very few (even the big major
companies) drivers would be available from one build to the next for
peripheral hardware. As we got closer to RTM I became painfully aware of
the fact that quite a few companies would not have any good drivers
available for their hardware when we went RTM. Even though MS had been
putting out alpha and beta builds for literally years! I’ve been doing
betas since the ‘90’s and have never seen such a lackadaisical attitude
towards updated drivers. Now we see the results of this attitude. Crappy
Vista drivers from major hardware manufacturers such as Nvidia.
I find that to be simply amazing!
So when you buy brand new hardware and install it on a brand new OS like
Vista and it won't run properly because of crappy drivers who do you
think you should call?
Frank

 

[Mike Glenn]

you are a female that did a s*x change to become a male,
then you became a drag queen.
Then you went and did plastic surgery to implant hair all over your body and
become a monkey..

You are one sick bastard

There is no need to keep posting your trash after each of my post.. I have
just blocked you with a very advance algorithm that detects ip and name
changes. All you are doing is wasting your time..
and of course spanking the monkey.

 

[Mike Glenn]

The problem with driver availability is similar with >Windows Vista as with

previous operating systems

What a big FAT lie....

Misleading with misinformation are you?

Most win95 drivers worked up until winMe
and most win2k drivers worked with XP and server 2003

the only exception was going from 9x to NT that is a different kind of
kernel...

Vista is not a different kind of kernel its NT and should have retained far
more compatibility with 2k and XP...

Vista tried to become longhorn that WOULD be something different.. then they
cut it back to more like an incremental sp3 for xp, but they retained
changes in vista that destroyed backwards driver compatibility and of course
the quality of the product went down the drain...

vista is pathetic and so are you since you support it like you do....

 

[vista terminal ator]

Vista and it won't run properly because of crappy >drivers who do you think

you should call?

Your backward logic is pathetic....

I know driver developers.. vista should not have been so different from XP
in regaurds to driver use...

win2k and xp shared most drivers fine.... but for some reason MS broke
almost everything with vista for no good reason.

vista is a twisted OS, ask some driver delvelopers and they will tell you.

It wouldn't be manufactured at all if it didn't work with an "Operating
System", how about MS designing an "Operating system" that actually works
with hardware?

That's funny. Hardware it manufactured to fix other hardware. It's the
software drivers that actually make it work. I was in the Vista beta
program for what seemed like yrs and very few (even the big major
companies) drivers would be available from one build to the next for
peripheral hardware. As we got closer to RTM I became painfully aware of
the fact that quite a few companies would not have any good drivers
available for their hardware when we went RTM. Even though MS had been
putting out alpha and beta builds for literally years! I’ve been doing
betas since the ‘90’s and have never seen such a lackadaisical attitude
towards updated drivers. Now we see the results of this attitude. Crappy
Vista drivers from major hardware manufacturers such as Nvidia.
I find that to be simply amazing!
So when you buy brand new hardware and install it on a brand new OS like
Vista and it won't run properly because of crappy drivers who do you
think you should call?
Frank

 

[dennis@home]

Your backward logic is pathetic....

I know driver developers.. vista should not have been so different from XP
in regaurds to driver use...

win2k and xp shared most drivers fine.... but for some reason MS broke
almost everything with vista for no good reason.

vista is a twisted OS, ask some driver delvelopers and they will tell you.

Are you saying you know device driver writers that don't know how to write a
driver?
They have had years to do so if they knew what they were doing.
Maybe they thought it was better to use their time writing drivers for
something else?
Linux drivers for old hardware or maybe even Vista drivers for something
new?

 

[Adam Albright]

That's funny. Hardware it manufactured to fix other hardware. It's the
software drivers that actually make it work. I was in the Vista beta
program for what seemed like yrs and very few (even the big major
companies) drivers would be available from one build to the next for
peripheral hardware. As we got closer to RTM I became painfully aware of
the fact that quite a few companies would not have any good drivers
available for their hardware when we went RTM. Even though MS had been
putting out alpha and beta builds for literally years! I’ve been doing
betas since the ‘90’s and have never seen such a lackadaisical attitude
towards updated drivers. Now we see the results of this attitude. Crappy
Vista drivers from major hardware manufacturers such as Nvidia.
I find that to be simply amazing!
So when you buy brand new hardware and install it on a brand new OS like
Vista and it won't run properly because of crappy drivers who do you
think you should call?
Frank

Who should be called? The guys in white coats with big butterfly nets
so they can take you back to the nut house you escaped from.

You are just lying some more. Get help, you mental loon.

 

[Adam 'Geritol' 'n' 'Prune Juice' Albright]

Adam Albright wrote:

Who should be called? The guys in white coats with big butterfly nets
so they can take you back to the nut house you escaped from.

<I guess you can see them when they walk by and you look out of your
little window in your 4*4 padded cell. Sometimes, they even come in and
hook electric pads to your forehead and hit you with some voltage. They
laugh at you why you sallow your tongue, piss and sh*t on yourself while
you shake, rattle, and roll.>

Get help, you mental loon.

<You should follow your own advise.>

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

"What a big FAT lie...."
And you make FALSE statements you can NOT prove since the above is
simply NOT true.


--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org

 

[Paul Randall]

I just thought that your expression about designing hardware that works
with AN operating system is somewhat putting the cart before the horse.

On a more serious not I most certainly do not expect any OS to work with
all hardware, however the fact that Vista was released as a user
installable CD/DVD based OS without some sort of compatibility warning
was, IMHO, somewhat remiss.

To Microsoft's credit W95/98 and XP will run on a great deal of old
hardware, Vista OTOH has problems with both older and very new systems.
This fact however is very poorly understood until AFTER the user has
bought it.

HP cripples their systems to only run one OS. One example is a W98SE system
I bought which could be upgraded to ME, but not WXP, even though it could
handle 768 MB of memory.

Current example:
Compaq SR2170NX
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/softwareCategory?product=3340210&lc=en&cc=us&dlc=en&lang=en&cc=us
No drivers for any OSs other than 32- and 64-bit Vista. Online chat with HP
support about 'how to dual boot with WXP' said BIOS is optimized for Vista
so it can't run any earlier OSs. I have tried my DOS boot disk, which
worked fine to run DOS MBRWizD and DOS Norton Ghost to replicate the hard
drive, but I haven't tried installing WXP to experiment with the system.

How do you tell what is the cart and what is the horse and which should come
first? What is Microsoft's responsibility in making their OS run on
crippled hardware? Who is to say whether the hardware is crippled or
optimized? This is not your Daddy's PC world anymore.

-Paul Randall

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

Exactly what happened when you attempted to install Windows XP?
Memory is only one of the many requirements for installing Windows XP
and I doubt HP deliberately crippled a system not to run Windows XP.

"How do you tell what is the cart and what is the horse."
Doesn't really matter.
As the cart and horse, drivers and operating systems need to go
together or both will fail.

 

[dennis@home]

HP cripples their systems to only run one OS. One example is a W98SE
system I bought which could be upgraded to ME, but not WXP, even though it
could handle 768 MB of memory.

Current example:
Compaq SR2170NX
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/softwareCategory?product=3340210&lc=en&cc=us&dlc=en&lang=en&cc=us
No drivers for any OSs other than 32- and 64-bit Vista. Online chat with
HP support about 'how to dual boot with WXP' said BIOS is optimized for
Vista so it can't run any earlier OSs. I have tried my DOS boot disk,
which worked fine to run DOS MBRWizD and DOS Norton Ghost to replicate the
hard drive, but I haven't tried installing WXP to experiment with the
system.

You can actually get xp drivers for that system if you want.. but not from
hp.
HP don't actually have much control as they don't make the chipsets.. they
don't even make the hardware in the majority of cases.
Most of it is bought in from other vendors and HP just badges the bios and
case.

 

[The poster formerly known as 'The Poster Formerly]

female that did a s*x change to become a male,

<snippage>

What is wrong with that?

--
Priceless quotes in m.p.w.vista.general group:
http://protectfreedom.tripod.com/kick.html

"Fair use is not merely a nice concept--it is a federal law based on
free speech rights under the First Amendment and is a cornerstone of the
creativity and innovation that is a hallmark of this country. Consumer
rights in the digital age are not frivolous."
- Maura Corbett

 

[Frank]

Who should be called? The guys in white coats with big butterfly nets
so they can take you back to the nut house you escaped from.

You are just lying some more. Get help, you mental loon.

You're a wonderfully demented drunken moron who is utterly without a clue.
Oh, did I mention how weak you appear to be.
Ever get that one upgraded install of Vista business to run properly?
Waiting for SP1 are you? I hate to tell you, but MS is not rushing to
get it out as you've lied about so many times in the past.
Frank

 

[Alias]

You're a wonderfully demented drunken moron who is utterly without a clue.

Vista enables you to be able to smell the breath of posters on Usenet?
That's pretty cool. What do I need to configure to get that option?