S
Strings
Your correct quality before misguided ratings
A 350w Enermax has more stability and quality than any 600w $20 junker.
A 350w Enermax has more stability and quality than any 600w $20 junker.
W
Wes Newell
There is no link. This was an email from AMD tech support to an inquiry
about a PSU to use. The person that conducted this transaction posted the
email in one of the AMD newsgroups. I think it was this one, but I don't
recall for sure. It may have been the overclocking group.
This particular 400W PSU would not have been one I would have bought by
itself. It came with a system I bought. And while it's been running my K7
system a few years, it's probaly not really a 400W PSU, as the only label
on it only had 400W on it. No other name, no nothing. At the time, I
wasn't concerned with the PSU. I got the case/psu, ASrock K7S8X MB, 1800+
XP cpu, and a good cooler all new for $50.
W
Wes Newell
I'm not sure what you are trying to say here. You can verify the operation
of this system any time you choose. It's "My server" below.
W
Wes Newell
Well, I'm on it at least 6 hours a day. When Im not on it it's still
running the server below along with an ftp server and other things. It's
never really idle. I never turn it off, not even during thunderstorms
unless we loose power and the UPS battery gets low.
W
Wes Newell
True, but some 300W PSU's won't have more than 12A on the +12v rail. And
that just isn't enough.
S
Strings
Its simple , whenever you watch TV you see loud exaggerated ads for fake
pills or other things that don't work as promoted and in the corner of the
screen almost hidden is a warning "Results not Typical" if people who have
any use their common sense it can be translated to "crap for suckers."
You are obstinate in sticking to your desire to not only defend sub standard
piss poor power supplies as quality with over hyped exaggerated wattage
ratings BUT recommend them as expectable top quality to others, shame one
you.
You seem a knowledgeable guy on some subjects but loose all credibility when
you cross the line and not just recommend a good power supply but insist
with link that people get a $18 power supply as the foundation of their
expensive investment, shame. Just because you have beat the odds should and
does not mean people must follow your lucky example.
People can spend thousands on their systems and you think they should base
the foundation on a sub standard $18 PS, shame
Average spent for a heatsink and fan $35. So what do you think you really
get for the most important complicated part in a PC (PS) for $18 (low
quality junk) Read the links get educated, even one.
read the one its short
http://compreviews.about.com/cs/casesandmods/bb/aabybpsus.htm
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article28-page1.html
http://www.amdboard.com/psu.html
http://www4.tomshardware.com/column/20011012/index.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/20041223/index.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/20040122/index.html
http://www.firingsquad.com/guides/power_supply/
Make sure your supply has
Certified compliant for AMD and Intel
Over Voltage Protection
Under Voltage Protection
Over Load Protection
Over Current Protection
Over Temperature Protection
Short Circuit Protection
Detective sensor output
Low Noise & Ripple
Hi-pot tested
Certified EMI Approvals: FCC, UL, CUL, CSA, CE (Minimum)
pills or other things that don't work as promoted and in the corner of the
screen almost hidden is a warning "Results not Typical" if people who have
any use their common sense it can be translated to "crap for suckers."
You are obstinate in sticking to your desire to not only defend sub standard
piss poor power supplies as quality with over hyped exaggerated wattage
ratings BUT recommend them as expectable top quality to others, shame one
you.
You seem a knowledgeable guy on some subjects but loose all credibility when
you cross the line and not just recommend a good power supply but insist
with link that people get a $18 power supply as the foundation of their
expensive investment, shame. Just because you have beat the odds should and
does not mean people must follow your lucky example.
People can spend thousands on their systems and you think they should base
the foundation on a sub standard $18 PS, shame
Average spent for a heatsink and fan $35. So what do you think you really
get for the most important complicated part in a PC (PS) for $18 (low
quality junk) Read the links get educated, even one.
read the one its short
http://compreviews.about.com/cs/casesandmods/bb/aabybpsus.htm
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article28-page1.html
http://www.amdboard.com/psu.html
http://www4.tomshardware.com/column/20011012/index.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/20041223/index.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/20040122/index.html
http://www.firingsquad.com/guides/power_supply/
Make sure your supply has
Certified compliant for AMD and Intel
Over Voltage Protection
Under Voltage Protection
Over Load Protection
Over Current Protection
Over Temperature Protection
Short Circuit Protection
Detective sensor output
Low Noise & Ripple
Hi-pot tested
Certified EMI Approvals: FCC, UL, CUL, CSA, CE (Minimum)
N
Neil Barras
Strings said:
I'm settled with the stock PSU. If it gives me trouble, I'll buy a 400-500w
one from work.
As for the Hard Drive connector situation, does anyone have an idea if I can
use a normal IDE drive on this board?
Cheers for all help guys,
Neil
D
Derek Baker
Neil Barras said:
Yes.
N
Neil Barras
Derek Baker said:
Thanks Derek...Great news. I can now cut the price down a bit more with an
IDE drive. :-D
To refresh you all of the system, here are the specs:
Novatech AMD 64 Barebones Bundle:
http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/SpecPage.html?BB-6430BUB
40GB Hard Drive: (DiamondMax Plus8 40GB:
http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/specpage.html?MAX-P40)
or
80GB Hard Drive: (DiamondMax Plus9 80GB:
http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/specpage.html?MAX-P80)
DVD-Rom Drive from Work
XFX Nvidia Geforce FX5500 256MB (From current PC. Will be replaced by
Nvidia GeForce FX5200 128MB.)
Novatech 80mm PC Case Fan:
http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/specpage.html?EN-8CMFAN
I am trying to keep the initial price below £300...Hence all the juggling.
Neil
D
Derek Baker
Neil Barras said:
What's the point getting half the capacity to save £4? It's an older drive
as well.
N
Neil Barras
Derek Baker said:
OK...I'll go with the 80Gig DiamondMax. I have realised I can knock it
under £300 by dropping the Novatech PCI Wireless G card, and Case Fan. The
reason I did this was because I remembered Windows XPs built in ICS. If
using a CrossOver Cat5, connected to my wireless laptop and to desktop,
would that suffice as a network connection for the time being?
Cheers for putting up with me
Neil
T
Timbertea
Derek said:
Spent the $7 or so and get the Hitachi 80GB. You will get a lot better
performance out of it. Nothing wrong with going SATA either. The first
ones had a few bugs (in particular many bugs with raid that was due to
the chipsets and Sata being a moving target of a standard for a year and
some), the current crop don't seem to have those problems on current
chipsets.
W
Wes Newell
First, I wish you would learn how to post. I'm tired of removing old
sig lines and correcting your top posting.
Now, I don't TV watch ads. I have several brands of DVR's. The one I like
best was the cheapest, and it isn't my Tivo which cost twice as much.
As for the PSU's. I'm only recounting MY personal experiences. If you
think I'm lying, then there's nothing I can do about it. That's your
problem, not mine. But to call all cheap PSU's crap, is just that crap.
And you spread a lot of it. Sure, there's probably several really bad or
over rated cheap PSU models, Including the one I got in a package deal
mentioned some where else, but that doesn't mean all cheap PSU's are crap.
And for you rto say so without tesing them all is really the crap.
Again, I don't insist shit. I just give my opinion based on the use of
hundreds of PSU's. I've not had one person that bought one come back and
say it didn't work. I' don't know how many people have bought it or other
cheap PSU's and really don't care. I don't have an investment in any way.
In the end, people can take my advice or leave it, I don't care. But I'm
sure getting tired of the crap a few of you are putting out. Did you watch
20/20 compare generics to name brands Friday night? I think the generic
won 4 out of 6 test at a cost of 30% less than the name brands. If you
think there's not hell of a markup on name brand PSU's you're dreaming.
They have lots and lots of overhead compared to a genic part that has
lower manufacturing and no ad cost. A pair of Nike shoes that cost about
$2 to make sells for over $100. Do you reqlly thnik you get a better
product compared to a store brand that sel for $20. Keep dreaming, they
(and Tiger Woods with his $16M share) love you.
Frankly I don't give a shit what they spend their money. I'm just telling
them they don't have to buy a $200 PC Power and Cooling PSU to get the
system running. For comparison sake let's assume the $18 600W PSU is over
rated by 20%. So what as long as it works. And for $36, I can have a
spare. I've got a new 550W spare that's been in the closet for over a year
now and it only cost $15. So if the PSU fails, I'm not down long. And even
though my servers are just personal servers, I don't like them being down
if someone trie to reach them.
That may be your average, but I've never spent that much on a CPU cooler
and anyone that does is just wasting money.. For the K7 line, a TR2-M1 or
-M3 cost about $8 and nothing more than that is needed even if you
overclock and overvolt the cpu to the max. And for the K8 line, the stock
cooler works fine or a TR2-M6 works about as well for $7. I'm using the
stock HS on ym K8, but replaced the rather weak and noisy 70x15mm fan with
an adapter and 80x25mm fan. Works great. fan cost $1.10, adapter cost
$2,99 IIRC.
I get a PSU that works. Most importtant, complicated. ROFLMAO.
Y
Yadayada
Neil Barras said:OK...I'll go with the 80Gig DiamondMax. I have realised I can knock it
under £300 by dropping the Novatech PCI Wireless G card, and Case Fan.
The reason I did this was because I remembered Windows XPs built in ICS.
If using a CrossOver Cat5, connected to my wireless laptop and to desktop,
would that suffice as a network connection for the time being?
Cheers for putting up with me
Yes that will work fine. The only thing is the notebook will have to be on
and awake to get the internet to the desktop of course. And like you said,
for the time being .... you can always add WLAN later.
D
dawg
Don't forget the A64 2800+/512k Clawhammer.
D
dawg
Hmm.I'm using a 300W PS on my A64(K8)overclocked to 2.2ghz,along with a
Geforce FX5900, 1 7200rpm HD,1 CD-RW,1 DVD ROM drive, 512M PC3700 and PCI
sound card.I had to have the vid card on it's own molex power otherwise the
PC would freeze when the CD was accessed.It's stable,but it's also at the
end of it's useful life. A new vid card or another drive will push it over
the edge I'm sure. I certaily wouldn't use a 300W PS if I were staring new.
I found some 500W power supplies at ebay(search for 500W PS) there's a few
that have decent specs and don't cost alot. I think I'll try one.
Geforce FX5900, 1 7200rpm HD,1 CD-RW,1 DVD ROM drive, 512M PC3700 and PCI
sound card.I had to have the vid card on it's own molex power otherwise the
PC would freeze when the CD was accessed.It's stable,but it's also at the
end of it's useful life. A new vid card or another drive will push it over
the edge I'm sure. I certaily wouldn't use a 300W PS if I were staring new.
I found some 500W power supplies at ebay(search for 500W PS) there's a few
that have decent specs and don't cost alot. I think I'll try one.
D
dawg
I've seen the 80GB DiamondMax plus 10 is around $65 at newegg. It's been
rated the fastest 7200 drive recently. That would be my choice.
rated the fastest 7200 drive recently. That would be my choice.
S
Strings
Hello anyone home in there.
NOTE: I Never once said you were lying about your experience with cheep PS,
just that you should not recommend others take the same wild gamble by using
the same junk. I think using one yourself is one thing strongly encourage
others by promoting them is outrageous. You cant seem to grasp the quality
concept you fail to comprehend the fact that wattage and quality are not the
same or that all PS are not the same inside or not all internal parts are
equal. You don't understand the certifications on PS (or the lack) and why
its important. You only understand high wattage and low price. I have tested
hundreds if not thousands of power supplies and there is a reason DELL IBM
HP and all the big boys do not use $18 junk low quality cheep parts thin
wire PS. OPEN some up
You still don't get it because you are too busy blindly supporting those
cheep $18 power supplies to see reason. Those $18 PS use all the lowest
quality parts available so open one up along with a Top brand How about your
enormous 600w and my smaller Enermax 485w as well, note the 2" Large
capacitors then notice how in the poor PS that are 380uf and if lucky 680uf
and in my Enermax they are 1000uf. The quality of manufacture is also poor
in $18 PS not just the poor uf ratings. Also note the amount and quality of
the transformers, switching voltage regulators gauge wire, heat sinks and if
you could read the bands you would see reistors are of the poorest tolerance
20% where the Enermax use top grade tolerance parts from higher quality
manufactures such as nischicon of Japan not ? china. Good heat sinks are
aluminum the poor supplies use white metal or steal the poor fans are sleeve
baring while the top brand use multiple ball barring, wires on the crap are
thin giving of electro magnetic discharge and the quality of copper is thin
and poor. Your theory of 30% price difference between top grade and bottom
made me laugh so that would mean your $18 supply is equal to a $26 supply
also junk. Your attempt to apply the economics of teen trend shoes to
electronics only fools yourself. You gambled on cheep power supplies and got
lucky OK but there is no need to recommend them only or suggest they are of
quality and add a link to a sales site promoting others to take a gamble . I
seen too many of those $18 PS cause too many people problems I suggest a 25%
+ failure rate.
Eyes open
NOTE: I Never once said you were lying about your experience with cheep PS,
just that you should not recommend others take the same wild gamble by using
the same junk. I think using one yourself is one thing strongly encourage
others by promoting them is outrageous. You cant seem to grasp the quality
concept you fail to comprehend the fact that wattage and quality are not the
same or that all PS are not the same inside or not all internal parts are
equal. You don't understand the certifications on PS (or the lack) and why
its important. You only understand high wattage and low price. I have tested
hundreds if not thousands of power supplies and there is a reason DELL IBM
HP and all the big boys do not use $18 junk low quality cheep parts thin
wire PS. OPEN some up
You still don't get it because you are too busy blindly supporting those
cheep $18 power supplies to see reason. Those $18 PS use all the lowest
quality parts available so open one up along with a Top brand How about your
enormous 600w and my smaller Enermax 485w as well, note the 2" Large
capacitors then notice how in the poor PS that are 380uf and if lucky 680uf
and in my Enermax they are 1000uf. The quality of manufacture is also poor
in $18 PS not just the poor uf ratings. Also note the amount and quality of
the transformers, switching voltage regulators gauge wire, heat sinks and if
you could read the bands you would see reistors are of the poorest tolerance
20% where the Enermax use top grade tolerance parts from higher quality
manufactures such as nischicon of Japan not ? china. Good heat sinks are
aluminum the poor supplies use white metal or steal the poor fans are sleeve
baring while the top brand use multiple ball barring, wires on the crap are
thin giving of electro magnetic discharge and the quality of copper is thin
and poor. Your theory of 30% price difference between top grade and bottom
made me laugh so that would mean your $18 supply is equal to a $26 supply
also junk. Your attempt to apply the economics of teen trend shoes to
electronics only fools yourself. You gambled on cheep power supplies and got
lucky OK but there is no need to recommend them only or suggest they are of
quality and add a link to a sales site promoting others to take a gamble . I
seen too many of those $18 PS cause too many people problems I suggest a 25%
+ failure rate.
Eyes open
D
Derek Baker
dawg said:
I don't see that on the site he's buying from.
W
Wes Newell
Sorry I'm not goign to shut down my system and pull the 600W PSU to check
the cap size, so I'll just say this. The cap size doesn't matter as long
as it meets the requirement. As long as you have good power going into the
PSU to begin with, it really doesn't matter that much. My system doesn't
even hiccup when I have a short brown out or power failure due to the UPS
in front of the PSU.
I do have a cheap $15 (shipping includied PSU here, so I check the
resistors in it and guess what, all I saw were gold tolorence bands, Now
that's 5% in case you didn't know. So you're wrong here too. I don't know
why you thought I couldn't read them. I've designed electronics for many
years using both discreet and integrated logic. Actually, that's designed,
manfactured and sold worldwide.
Are you just rattling on to hear yourself talk?
The 30% wasn't my theory, it was fact reported on 20/20 and had nothing to
do with cost differences of PSU's, and the same with Nike It simply shows
that spending more money doesn't mean better quality. And as i stated a
long time ago, I only saw about a 1% failure rate in all the hundreds of
cheap PSU 's I bought with the exception of the batch I bought at $2 each,
which were really crap and even at that only had a 20% failure rate. I
think you're just pulling numbers out of your ass or you had some of the
worst purchasing people around.
But blind, or just stubborn as hell.