FAT to NTFS

B

Bill Ridgeway

I am thinking of ways and means of improving the speed of a Client's
computer. The hard disk is formatted as FAT and there is said to be an
improvement of speed when using NTFS rather than FAT. One way of doing this
would may be to backup, reformat, reinstall Windows and software. However,
although this, together with re-configuring software (including networking)
does take a considerable time.

I was wondering if it may be possible to clone the hard disk, reformat the
original disk and either copy or clone it back (without changing the
format)? This would be considerably quicker (albeit not eliminating the
crap collected over time).

I will also be looking at the possibility of increasing memory but all slots
are filled with what may be the capacity accepted by the motherboard.

Thanks.

Bill Ridgeway
 
M

Malke

Bill said:
I am thinking of ways and means of improving the speed of a Client's
computer. The hard disk is formatted as FAT and there is said to be an
improvement of speed when using NTFS rather than FAT. One way of doing this
would may be to backup, reformat, reinstall Windows and software. However,
although this, together with re-configuring software (including networking)
does take a considerable time.

I was wondering if it may be possible to clone the hard disk, reformat the
original disk and either copy or clone it back (without changing the
format)? This would be considerably quicker (albeit not eliminating the
crap collected over time).

I will also be looking at the possibility of increasing memory but all slots
are filled with what may be the capacity accepted by the motherboard.

Normally one simply converts from FAT32 to NTFS - after taking necessary
precautions to back up data and/or image the system - with no problems.
See this link for more information:

http://aumha.org/win5/a/ntfscvt.htm - Converting FAT32 to NTFS by Alex
Nichol

However, converting from FAT32 to NTFS is unlikely to make any
difference in the speed of your client's computer. You haven't mentioned
any specs for his hardware, but from a hardware standpoint here are a
few bottlenecks:

1. Older, slower processor
2. Older, slower hard drive
3. Not enough RAM (at least 512MB unshared for XP in a normal use situation)
4. Failing hard drive or drive in PIO Mode

From a software standpoint, there are many factors from an overly full
hard drive to malware. See these links for more information:

http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/slowcom.htm
http://aumha.org/a/health.htm - Take Out the Trash


Malke
 
P

Pegasus \(MVP\)

Bill Ridgeway said:
I am thinking of ways and means of improving the speed of a Client's
computer. The hard disk is formatted as FAT and there is said to be an
improvement of speed when using NTFS rather than FAT. One way of doing
this would may be to backup, reformat, reinstall Windows and software.
However, although this, together with re-configuring software (including
networking) does take a considerable time.

I was wondering if it may be possible to clone the hard disk, reformat the
original disk and either copy or clone it back (without changing the
format)? This would be considerably quicker (albeit not eliminating the
crap collected over time).

I will also be looking at the possibility of increasing memory but all
slots are filled with what may be the capacity accepted by the
motherboard.

Thanks.

Bill Ridgeway

As Malke said, you are unlikely to see any improvement in
speed when converting from FAT to NTFS. However, you
would see a small improvement when installing a larger disk.

It is indeed possible to clone one disk to another - just
make sure to remove the original disk on occasion of the
first boot with the new disk.

To get a substantial improvement you need to address
some or all of the four points Malke mentioned.
 
H

HEMI-Powered

Bill Ridgeway added these comments in the current discussion du
jour ...
I am thinking of ways and means of improving the speed of a
Client's computer. The hard disk is formatted as FAT and
there is said to be an improvement of speed when using NTFS
rather than FAT. One way of doing this would may be to
backup, reformat, reinstall Windows and software. However,
although this, together with re-configuring software
(including networking) does take a considerable time.

Let me give you an alternative perspective on the performance
differences I have seen on an older XP Pro SP1 PC with an AMD 1.6
gig CPU and only 512 meg memory and a relatively slow HD and a
newer PC running XP SP2, an AMD Athelon 2.6 GHz, 4 gig memory and
a relatively fast SATA HD. Also, a Maxtor 300 gig USB external.

Once I get the "attention" of an NTFS partition (my HD has a
primary and 2 extended partitions), I believe the sustained
read/write speed is higher than FAT32. However, on both my PCs,
NTFS seems to "forget" its folder tree and wants to reload it
when I haven't accessed the drive for minutes or hours. It is as
if the folder tree, which I would think would be in memory and
mirrored to pagefile.sys either expires or NTFS thinks it should
refresh to ensure no changes took place. The bad side is that
getting it to simply display a folder tree can take 30, 60, 90
seconds, at times many minutes!

I have never been able to track this, and I have experimented on
both boxes by converting back to FAT32. For all of its foibles,
such as less security and limits on maximum partition size, FAT32
is noticeably faster to just get a folder tree up. When I say
"get a folder tree up", I mean in Windows Explorer looking for
the contents of folder(s) to open or copy files around my system,
or simply trying to open an existing file in some app such as a
graphics editor, Word, etc.

I would certainly recommend that any/all of your clients run NTFS
on their C:\ for Windows and apps for the many good reasons we
all know, including security and read/write throughput. I might
suggest, though, that you try some benchmarks with FAT32 vs. NTFS
for various kinds of performance, which seems to be your
question. I imagine I'm going to look at least like a contrarian
on this if not a fool, but what I see is what I see.
I was wondering if it may be possible to clone the hard disk,
reformat the original disk and either copy or clone it back
(without changing the format)? This would be considerably
quicker (albeit not eliminating the crap collected over time).

I will also be looking at the possibility of increasing memory
but all slots are filled with what may be the capacity
accepted by the motherboard.

There are really at least 3 things that affect peformance on any
computer wrt throughput, which would be CPU speed, memory amount
and speed, and HD speed. That said, then the O/S, the app(s) and
the specific task(s) may be CPU intensive, memory intensive, HD
read/write intensive or - gasp! - all 3 at once. So, you won't
automagically see a big bump in throughput by adding memory,
especially if your motherboard's are already full and/or you're
at the XP limit of 5 gig.

As to cloning or imaging your HD(s), there's a number of ways to
do that. One really good one is to acquire a good disk imager
such as Acronis True Image or Norton Ghost. When I went looking
for one 2 years ago, I found True Image to have more supporters
and advocates than Ghost. Few people bashed Ghost but more
praised True Image. Now, however, I hear complaints about TI 10.0
(I'm on 9.0), so I don't know. But, you can image to an external
HD and/or optical with one or more CDs/DVDs and do a full restore
of an entire partition, or buy cloning-specific software. It all
depends. But, imaging is far easier and far faster than doing the
nuke and reinstall shuffle which can take days to rebuild a
system and clearly invites a visit from Murphy.

Good luck, Bill. Hopefully you will glean some benefit from my
ramblings. If you have questions/want clarification, just ask.
 
J

Jerry

Pegasus (MVP) said:
As Malke said, you are unlikely to see any improvement in
speed when converting from FAT to NTFS. However, you
would see a small improvement when installing a larger disk.

It is indeed possible to clone one disk to another - just
make sure to remove the original disk on occasion of the
first boot with the new disk.

To get a substantial improvement you need to address
some or all of the four points Malke mentioned.

What cloning software doesn't also restore the type of file system that was
being used on the cloned disk?
 
P

Pegasus \(MVP\)

Jerry said:
What cloning software doesn't also restore the type of file system that
was being used on the cloned disk?

In the strict sense of the word "cloning": All do (because if the
cloning process changed the file system then the copy would
not be a true clone).

However, if you know how to do it then you can use xcopy.exe
to create a pseudo-clone, with the source being FAT and the
destination being NTFS, for example. This can be useful when
dealing with mild file system corruption or with bad clusters
that trip up cloning program.
 
J

Jerry

It's very relevant when the OP thinks he can use a piece of software to
clone or copy a hard drive, format another and restore or copy the image
back. Every imaging application I've ever used restores everything,
including the file system. I just wanted him to be aware of that fact.
 

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