Dye ink

[Bob Headrick]

Is there anybody out there who knows if pigment ought to work in a die
printer ?

Generally no. Pigment ink requires more servicing, which is generally
controlled by firmware and is not user controllable. Dye inks and pigment
inks will likely have different viscosity and thermal properties, and will
have different color properties.

Regards,
Bob Headrick, MS MVP Printing/Imaging

 

[=?iso-8859-1?B?SGFucyBK+HJnZW4=?=]

Is there anybody out there who knows if pigment ought to work in a die
printer ?

I'm in all sorts of trouble. At the outset I wanted to avoid the many
cleaning cycles when I refilled my cartridges so I bought a continues
ink system and at the same time I changed to pigment ink to avoid
fading pictures. I have had to demount the continues system and return
to refilling cartridges but I have lost the yellow color.

I now use a Cannon Pixma ip5300. I destroyed my Epson Stylus Photo 950
in the process and got upset with the prises and availability of print
heads for Epson. I have also bought a One Eye for making icc profiles
to facilitate the different inks on different types of paper.

 

[=?iso-8859-1?B?SGFucyBK+HJnZW4=?=]

Generally no. Pigment ink requires more servicing, which is generally
controlled by firmware and is not user controllable. Dye inks and pigment
inks will likely have different viscosity and thermal properties, and will
have different color properties.

Regards,
Bob Headrick, MS MVP Printing/Imaging

Thank you for the answer

I don't understand why the yellow is the only color not working.
What raut should I go to continu refill inkcartridges and get lasting
color for a 100th of the price compared to the manufactures solution.
Are there dye inks out there that are color fast and availabel in
bulk ?

 

[babaloo]

It appears that you may have damaged the printhead on your Canon in your
quest to save money on ink.
If you want quality to the point where you are willing to buy a print
profiler why would you skimp on ink?
It is also not clear why you are so concerned about fading prints.
Do you think yours are going to be hanging in the Louvre for the next 200
years?
Pantone used to sell pigment inks for use in the Epson 1280: the Pantone
cartridges cost more than the Epsons and voided the warranty on the printer.
Your quest is making you penny wise and dollar foolish?

 

[Barry Watzman]

You probably ruined the printer. While there are good 3rd party inks,
there are no good "generic inks". The characteristics of printers and
their ink systems are unbelievably complex, and you need an ink that
pretty much exactly matches the original specs (and there is a lot more
to this than just dye vs. pigment). Use of any other ink will normally
ruin the print system. In a printer where the printhead is part of the
cartridge, fine, you just throw it away and start over with a new
cartridge. But in a printer with permanent printheads, use of the wrong
ink usually destroys the printer.

 

[Frank]

It appears that you may have damaged the printhead on your Canon in your
quest to save money on ink.
If you want quality to the point where you are willing to buy a print
profiler why would you skimp on ink?
It is also not clear why you are so concerned about fading prints.
Do you think yours are going to be hanging in the Louvre for the next 200
years?
Pantone used to sell pigment inks for use in the Epson 1280: the Pantone
cartridges cost more than the Epsons and voided the warranty on the printer.
Your quest is making you penny wise and dollar foolish?

No after market ink will ever void any warranty on any printer in the US.
Frank

 

[=?iso-8859-1?B?SGFucyBK+HJnZW4=?=]

It appears that you may have damaged the printhead on your Canon in your
quest to save money on ink.
If you want quality to the point where you are willing to buy a print
profiler why would you skimp on ink?
It is also not clear why you are so concerned about fading prints.
Do you think yours are going to be hanging in the Louvre for the next 200
years?
Pantone used to sell pigment inks for use in the Epson 1280: the Pantone
cartridges cost more than the Epsons and voided the warranty on the printer.
Your quest is making you penny wise and dollar foolish?

You read me like an open book, yes pictures like mine oughtto be saved
for prosterety, could someone correct me in my errand ways and sugest
a dye ink that resist fading or maybe a reputabel compagny.

 

[Barry Watzman]

That is simply not true.

Some inkjet printers have the printhead in the consumable, others have
permanent printheads, the consumable is just an "ink tank" and there are
tubes from the tank to the permanent printhead.

A manufacturer has every right to rightfully void the warranty of a
printer with permanent printheads that are genuinely destroyed by a 3rd
party ink, and they do it. On the other hand, the only permanent damage
that a consumable with a built-in printhead can do is to leak inside the
printer and create a mess, and this doesn't happen often.

 

[Burt]

That is simply not true.

Some inkjet printers have the printhead in the consumable, others have
permanent printheads, the consumable is just an "ink tank" and there are
tubes from the tank to the permanent printhead.

A manufacturer has every right to rightfully void the warranty of a
printer with permanent printheads that are genuinely destroyed by a 3rd
party ink, and they do it. On the other hand, the only permanent damage
that a consumable with a built-in printhead can do is to leak inside the
printer and create a mess, and this doesn't happen often.

Barry - Except for a new model with the printhead in the cartridge (is this
what you reference as the consumable?), Canon printheads are user removable
and replaceable (although sometimes at about the cost of a replacement
printer). The "ink tanks" sit directly on the printhead and feed into it.
No tubes.

I have read that in the US there are laws that prevent a printer company
from voiding a warranty because you used aftermarket inks. Has to do with a
company not forcing you to use their consumables as a condition of honoring
a warranty.

Using the wrong inks could conceivably ruin a permanant printhead. I would
expect that using pigment-based inks in an Epson (printhead not replaceable
by the consumer) that is designed for dye-based inks might permanantly clog
the nozzles and render the printer not economically repairable. Refilling
carts for a Canon dye-based printer with pigment-based inks would probably
cost you an easily replaced printhead. HP printers with the printhead on
the ink cartridge would not be harmed by the use of inks which could damage
the printhead. You would just replace the ink cartridge which comes with a
new printhead.

 

[Frank]

That is simply not true.

Some inkjet printers have the printhead in the consumable, others have
permanent printheads, the consumable is just an "ink tank" and there are
tubes from the tank to the permanent printhead.

A manufacturer has every right to rightfully void the warranty of a
printer with permanent printheads that are genuinely destroyed by a 3rd
party ink, and they do it.

I'd like you to name just one documented case where the printhead was
deemed to have been destroyed by after market ink and was confirmed by
lab analysis (independent lab of course). Simply telling someone over
the phone that their printhead was destroyed by after market ink and
that their warranty was thus voided is simply a market ploy and it's
success depends on the gullibility of the consumer.
Frank

 

[measekite]

You should use what ever the mfg of the printer recommends.

 

[measekite]

It appears that you may have damaged the printhead on your Canon in your
quest to save money on ink.

Thats cool.

If you want quality to the point where you are willing to buy a print
profiler why would you skimp on ink?
Right on
It is also not clear why you are so concerned about fading prints.
Do you think yours are going to be hanging in the Louvre for the next 200
years?
Pantone used to sell pigment inks for use in the Epson 1280: the Pantone
cartridges cost more than the Epsons and voided the warranty on the printer.

Pantone is the only non OEM ink that is any good.

 

[measekite]

You probably ruined the printer. While there are good 3rd party inks,
there are no good "generic inks"

Only Pantone is good.

. The characteristics of printers and their ink systems are
unbelievably complex, and you need an ink that pretty much exactly
matches the original specs (and there is a lot more to this than just
dye vs. pigment). Use of any other ink will normally ruin the print
system. In a printer where the printhead is part of the cartridge,
fine, you just throw it away and start over with a new cartridge. But
in a printer with permanent printheads, use of the wrong ink usually
destroys the printer.

OEM is the way to go.

 

[measekite]

Hans Jørgen wrote:

On 6 Aug., 01:49, "babaloo" <[email protected]> wrote:



It appears that you may have damaged the printhead on your Canon in your quest to save money on ink. If you want quality to the point where you are willing to buy a print profiler why would you skimp on ink? It is also not clear why you are so concerned about fading prints. Do you think yours are going to be hanging in the Louvre for the next 200 years? Pantone used to sell pigment inks for use in the Epson 1280: the Pantone cartridges cost more than the Epsons and voided the warranty on the printer. Your quest is making you penny wise and dollar foolish?



You read me like an open book, yes pictures like mine oughtto be saved for prosterety, could someone correct me in my errand ways and sugest a dye ink that resist fading or maybe a reputabel compagny.


Canon ink.

 

[measekite]

That is simply not true.

Some inkjet printers have the printhead in the consumable, others have
permanent printheads, the consumable is just an "ink tank" and there
are tubes from the tank to the permanent printhead.

A manufacturer has every right to rightfully void the warranty of a
printer with permanent printheads that are genuinely destroyed by a
3rd party ink, and they do it. On the other hand, the only permanent
damage that a consumable with a built-in printhead can do is to leak
inside the printer and create a mess, and this doesn't happen often.

They do it all of the time. They should not have to pay for people who
wilfully destroy their printer.

 

[Frank]

measekite wrote:

They do it all of the time.

Cite one...just one...documented case or else your are a liar.
Well...?
Frank

 

[Frank]

Thats cool. Didn't happen.


Right on Doesn't matter.



Pantone is the only non OEM ink that is any good.

 

[Frank]

Only Pantone is good.

There are dozens of excellent after market inks.

OEM is the way to go.

Excellent after market inks & carts are always available.

 

[Frank]

You should use what ever the mfg of the printer recommends.

User any good quality after market ink. oem is a rip off!

 

[Barry Watzman]

Well, Epson and some HP printers have permanent printheads. They can
only be replaced at a service depot (and shipping round-trip costs as
much as the entire printer). And there are fairly long tubes connecting
stationary ink tanks (the only thing the user replaces) to the moving
printhead. Epson has been this way mostly forever (in some printers,
the tank is mounted on the printhead and moves with it, but the
printhead is still permanent).

The fact is, a non-OEM ink legitimately can destroy a printhead, it
happens, and the manufacturer has every right to void the warranty. Not
because the ink was non-OEM per se, but because it's formulation,
different from the OEMs in significant ways, truly did destroy the
printhead.

There are no laws that prevent a manufacturer from voiding a warranty if
you use a consumable that is both out of spec AND not supplied by the
OEM. Just try putting Crisco cooking oil in your car and getting GM to
replace the engine under warranty when it burns up. It's the exact same
thing. The issue isn't just that you used after-market inks, per se,
it's that you used inks that were grossly out-of-spec for the printer
and that truly did, as a consequence, destroy it.

You seem to be under the impression that all HP printers ... even
low-end ones ... have the printhead on the ink cartridge. That is no
longer true for all of their printers, and in fact I don't think it's
even any longer predominantly true. The primary ink system right now in
current production HP consumer printers is the "02" cartridge set, and
those are stationary tanks with tubes leading to the permanent printheads.