U
Unknown
You sure do make a lot of erroneous assumptions.
Stan Brown said:
U
Unknown
As you often do?
Twayne said:
U
Unknown
You mean 'continue to assume' what the are trying to say?
S
sandy58
You tell them, Twayne. DOS works with XP. If I can move stuff around,
get rid of files etc that won't move in Windows, et al......I have
DOS!!!! Pseudo or whatever the so-called MS fundi's want to call
it.......it's freakin' DOS!! Just because MS used the story as a sales
pitch (people were scared of DOS) "Windows XP has no DOS" these afore-
mentioned fundis use the same dogma, "No such thing as DOS in....."
till they begin to actually believe their chant.
T
Twayne
sandy58 said:
No, I'm afraid I can't abide by that. DOS = Disk Operating System.
Windows used to work through the Disk Operating System. It still does,
but the term "Disk Operating System" is no longer relevent in XP because
the Disk Operating System meant by "DOS" doesn't exits. The "DOS" in
that case becomes something else since that operating system doesn't
exist in XP.
What DOES happen though, is that XP will run most, not all, DOS
COMMANDS such as copy, paste, del, rd, md, etc. etc.. So since it's not
an "operating system" it isn't called DOS but was instead designated as
the Command Prompt.
Not only that, but the Command Prompt, although it includes a subset
of the old DOS commands, has many more added functions and commands than
DOS ever thought of having. A list of the possible commands is actually
a very long list; longer than the old DOS commands were.
OTOH, a command window can still, by Microsoft's reasoning, be called
a DOS prompt because it is for exactly the same presentation and
purpose. You might say that the command prompt window is a DOS window
when you use it to issue DOS commands, otherwise it's a Command Prompt
Window, for issuing any of the full set of possible commands, which
simply includes a bunch of the former DOS comands and a lot more.
Now, to the purists, to say there is no Disk Operating System can be
argued to be silly, that no computer today would function without an
operating system to support the disks, or a disk operating system.
These things can be argued inifitely.
Then you get the egotists and narcissists who simply say "there is no
DOS in XP" or something similar, and then, having spouted their slime,
completely ignore the poster's real question. They had no intent other
than to say "XP doesn't have DOS" and helping anyone was the farthest
thing from their minds. Their interpersonal skills are less than
minimal and their interest in being helpful runs a close race to it.
I might myself comment that there is no real DOS in XP, but it's done as
an aside and without malice, never in a condescending manner and just to
give them a sort of basis for further discussions. And to avoid the
E&Ns of course. If someone says "DOS window", everyone knows that they
mean, and actually it's a perfectly valid term if it's used in the
context of giving DOS commands.
So in essence, I agree with you although the MSDOS Operating System
isn't what's being referred to; plain Disk Operating System is what DOS
means, and that's all.
Oh well; it's been a long day<g>.
HTH,
Twayne`
S
Steve Hayes
DOS stands of "disk operating system".
If your computer has no disks or discs, then no DOS is needed.
But when you see the C:\> prompt (or the A:\> or B:\> or D:\> prompt) you can
then give commands to the disk operating system to perform functions like
copying files from one disk to another, or from one place on a disk to another
place on the same disk, or from a disk to a disk, or to a virtual drive like a
flash drive.
How those commands are carried out depends on the overall operating system.
Windows 98 and below were GUIs that ran on top of an operating system called
MS DOS. Later versions of Windows are operating systems in their own right,
but when you give commands like xcopy at the command promps, you are still
giving commands to the disk operating system to perform operations on the
disks, which is what the original poster wanted to do.
So all the pedantic twaddle to avoid answering the question is just a waste of
space.
Copying files is a Disk Operation, and therefore it is a function of the DOS,
whether that DOS is built in to Windows or whether Windows is a GUI running on
top of it.
H
Hodges
DOS does not work with XP and cannot read NTFS volumes without 3rd-
party applications such as NTFS4DOS. The command prompt is not the
DOS operating system just because it is a command-line interpreter.
This isn't just arguing semantics here, it really is NOT the same as
DOS. It isn't even an emulator. DOS is 16-bit, programs that run
under Windows XP's command line are 32-bit.
By your logic, Windows 95 is the same as XP in the Windows Classic
theme because they look similar.
Calling the command-line interpreter "DOS" is just as ignorant as
calling a computer tower or monitor the CPU.
H
Hodges
"DOS" is a group of similar operating systems, it is not meant to
represent any operating system that can manipulate disks, since that
would include nearly any OS since the 80s. It is generally understood
to mean MS-DOS or PC-DOS. In reference to Windows, it is universally
understood to mean MS-DOS. When referring to Windows, it can be
safely assumed that somebody referring to "DOS" does not mean
AmigaDOS, Commodore DOS, Atari DOS, or any other form of DOS. You
either don't understand what it is, or realize that you are wrong and
are just arguing for the sake of sounding right.
S
Steve Hayes
In reference to Windows XP "DOS" does not refer to MS DOS, since, as you have
pointed outy elsewhere, Windows does not run on MS DOS. But it does have a
command prompt that allows one to perform disk operations, and so say one
can't refer to that as the DOS prompt is just nit picking.
O
Olórin
....until someone requests help in getting a DOS game to run, and the only
solution is DOSBox or similar. Then it becomes a matter of accuracy,
instead.
Still, in my book, the way the OP was phrased meant that further
explanation/education was required:
"How do you leave windows to return to DOS prompt? I need to use DOS XCOPY
command to back up damaged files."
A1) "There's no DOS in XP, end of story" is clearly inadequate and
unhelpful.
A2) "Start > Run > 'cmd'" doesn't address the specifically-stated desire to
"leave windows", let alone "*return* to DOS prompt".
Hopefully if the OP has read right through all responses, he/she will now
have a fuller understanding!
K
Ken Blake, MVP
Sorry, that's wrong. The original post said "leave windows to return
to DOS prompt."
That's very different from going to a command line, and is not
possible. What you suggest *may* work for the OP, but it is certainly
*not* what he asked for.
T
Twayne
Steve Hayes said:
Exactly, and an action that never does the OP any good when it's used in
the method that started this thread; "there is no DOS" unsupported
comments. Since XP doesn't have an OS-DOS, the most one should need to
explain is a possible aside that to get to that DOS window, you use the
Command Prompt. Command Prompt is a nice, generic term for the process.
Thus, the Command Prompt allows you to use it as a DOS window to issue
most of the MSDOS commands. But it allows you to issue a lot of other,
post-DOS commands too that were added to XP for the Command Mode, to be
used in the Command Prompt.
Cheers,
Twayne`
T
Twayne
Olórin said:
All excellent points.
Twayne`
T
Twayne
Ken Blake said:
Once again, the fantASStic MVP stated what was wrong, but not what was
right to do.
To achieve the same affect, one simply opens the Command Prompt, often
referred to as the DOS window as a matter of fact. You're still in XP,
but you're in a mode that may run DOS games, commands, etc., depending
on the game/command etc..
I suspect the OP has left this thread with the firm idea that it's
comprised of nothing but butt-heads, and impossible to tell who to
believe or what to believe, and disgusted thanks to the likes of answers
you often give. He'd be right, too: You and others like you have turned
this into a nearly useless group for anyone lacking the expertise to
phrase things exactly as YOU want to see them phrased. Good evidence of
that is your negative statement and lack of addressing the OP's needs.
You need to return to the Clarification and Verification chapters of
Interpersonal Skills assessment.
I'll bet the OP doesn't even CARE whether he "leaves" XP or not,
that's just the best way he had of explaining what his experience is.
All he wanted to know really is how to use the DOS facilities of XP.
And you never gave a positive response to that question.
HTH,
Twayne`
T
Twayne
Hodges said:
Once again, another post with totally moot points. If you have no room
in your life for newbies who haven't yet gotten hold of the lingo, then
you should go elsewhere to show off your ego. If you aren't going to
address the OP's question somehow, then you have/had no business posting
anything here.
Windows95 is windows.
windows is not necessarily win9x or winXP or ... .
Therefore I could easily say "windows" and mean XP. And since this is
an XP group ...
This post is of no use to anyone.
N
N. Miller
What is right depends upon what is desired. OP indicated, possibly, the
expectation to exit from Windows into MS DOS. Entirely feasible with Windows
98, and earlier; but even with Windows Me, required as special MS DOS boot
disc, or, possibly, modification of the standard Me installation. I never
gave it a thought to try, the EBD worked fine, for me.
It is, however, not possible to exit from Windows XP into MS DOS; because
there is no MS DOS to exit into. With Windows XP, if the intent is to exit
from Windows, then one is going to need an MS DOS boot disk; with the added
issue that MS DOS can't read NTFS volumes.
It is should probably be pointed out to the OP that this is an "effect", but
not the same as actually leaving Windows for MS DOS. Just for the OP's
edification; lest he leave thinking that invoking the command prompt ("DOS
box") is identical to "leaving Windows and dropping into MS DOS (it is most
definitely not).
But you aren't helping matters, much!
What the OP wanted, and what he needed, were two different things. What he
wanted is impossible under Windows XP. What he needed was an education, not
positive reinforcement of an incorrect assumption (that it is possible to
exit Windows XP and enter MS DOS).
When you have done that, yourself, get back to us and report on your
findings!
Now you are making an assumption. And, in case you don't know, "Assume" make
an "Ass" of "u" and "me". You could be just as wrong as you could be right.
Flip a coin: Heads you nailed it, tails you missed it.
P
Peter Foldes
Norman
Planning on becoming a Diplomat anytime soon. LOL
Planning on becoming a Diplomat anytime soon. LOL
N
N. Miller
War is a form of diplomacy. I'll stick with M16s, M60s, and M109s, thank you
(though those are now obsolete).
S
Steve Hayes
Rubbish.
What he wanted to know was how to use the xcopy command.
He didn't say he wanted to "exit" Windows at all.
He wanted to leave the GUI in order to enter the xcopy command at the command
line.
S
Shenan Stanley
<snipped>
navnah;
Click on your start button, find and click on RUN and in the blank, type in
the following:
cmd /k xcopy /?
then you should click the OK button.
This will bring up a command prompt where you can issue all sorts of command
line scripts and use all sorts of command line tools. It will also give you
the HELP for the XCOPY command still built in Windows XP.
If - in the future - you just want the command prompt, the command you type
will be just:
cmd
and a new command prompt will open. You could also look under the
"Accessories" under the "All Programs" of your Start menu and find the
command prompt icon that will do something similar.
Everyone else;
Semantics and religious zealotry when it comes to this particular material?
Really?
Quoting the question word for word...
"How do you leave windows to return to DOS prompt?"
What do you know, the word "exit" was not used. Only the word "leave".
http://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/exit
"exit (verb)" entry...
Meaning: to leave a place often for another
However - this argument is just getting silly now. The original poster is
the only one that could clarify what they meant to say/wanted to do and with
all the ridiculous bickering (yep - I just added to it in fun and to
demonstrate the level this has gotten to... or actually, dropped to) I doubt
that will ever occur. ;-)
What one says and what one means may not be an exact reflection of one
another. Go funhouse mirrors!
Entire conversation:
http://groups.google.com/group/microsoft.public.windowsxp.basics/browse_frm/thread/d51aeca3a701120b/
42 responses for one query and one statement of purpose. Amazing(ly
ridiculous.)
Continue bickering amongst yourselves. I guess better over this than
anything serious. ;-)
Steve said:
navnah;
Click on your start button, find and click on RUN and in the blank, type in
the following:
cmd /k xcopy /?
then you should click the OK button.
This will bring up a command prompt where you can issue all sorts of command
line scripts and use all sorts of command line tools. It will also give you
the HELP for the XCOPY command still built in Windows XP.
If - in the future - you just want the command prompt, the command you type
will be just:
cmd
and a new command prompt will open. You could also look under the
"Accessories" under the "All Programs" of your Start menu and find the
command prompt icon that will do something similar.
Everyone else;
Semantics and religious zealotry when it comes to this particular material?
Really?
Quoting the question word for word...
"How do you leave windows to return to DOS prompt?"
What do you know, the word "exit" was not used. Only the word "leave".
http://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/exit
"exit (verb)" entry...
Meaning: to leave a place often for another
However - this argument is just getting silly now. The original poster is
the only one that could clarify what they meant to say/wanted to do and with
all the ridiculous bickering (yep - I just added to it in fun and to
demonstrate the level this has gotten to... or actually, dropped to) I doubt
that will ever occur. ;-)
What one says and what one means may not be an exact reflection of one
another. Go funhouse mirrors!
Entire conversation:
http://groups.google.com/group/microsoft.public.windowsxp.basics/browse_frm/thread/d51aeca3a701120b/
42 responses for one query and one statement of purpose. Amazing(ly
ridiculous.)
Continue bickering amongst yourselves. I guess better over this than
anything serious. ;-)