Cheap Enclosure for 4 IDE drives?

[p1mp_ju1c3]

I've got 4 80GB Drives that I'd like to redeploy in my house, but my
existing computers don't have any free IDE connexions, PCI slots, or drive
bays. I also don't want to create another complete PC in my house.

I've seen some IDE-raid enclosures, but they are all prohibitively expensive.

I've seen IDE->USB adapters cheap on Ebay (~$12 each). I'm thinking I could
grab 4 of these, connect my drives to a hub, and place them all in a small
PC tower, and connect the hub to one of my computers. It wouldn't be
pretty, but it would be fairly inexpensive.

What are people's thoughts on this? Are there better solutions?


--
..............................................................................

Tell people something they know already and they will thank you for it. Tell
them something new and they will hate you for it.

-George Monbiot

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[CWatters]

I've got 4 80GB Drives that I'd like to redeploy in my house, but my
existing computers don't have any free IDE connexions, PCI slots, or drive
bays. I also don't want to create another complete PC in my house.

I've seen some IDE-raid enclosures, but they are all prohibitively expensive.

I've seen IDE->USB adapters cheap on Ebay (~$12 each). I'm thinking I could
grab 4 of these, connect my drives to a hub, and place them all in a small
PC tower,

Well it would work but.. If you've got a PC standing idle perhaps you could
build a server? Instead of USB adaptors and a hub connect them to the
motherboard and fit a LAN card.

 

[Rod Speed]

I've got 4 80GB Drives that I'd like to redeploy in my house, but my
existing computers don't have any free IDE connexions, PCI slots, or
drive bays. I also don't want to create another complete PC in my house.

I've seen some IDE-raid enclosures, but they are all prohibitively expensive.

I've seen IDE->USB adapters cheap on Ebay (~$12 each). I'm
thinking I could grab 4 of these, connect my drives to a hub, and
place them all in a small PC tower, and connect the hub to one of
my computers. It wouldn't be pretty, but it would be fairly inexpensive.

What are people's thoughts on this? Are there better solutions?

I think another PC for those 4 drives makes more sense.

Or decide that you collection of drives is getting a tad bizarre and
replace the smaller drives with much bigger drives, say 250G drives.

 

[j4m4l_$1xp4ck]

I think another PC for those 4 drives makes more sense.

Thus unnecessarily adding another OS, and additional hardware for me to maintain.

Or decide that you collection of drives is getting a tad bizarre and
replace the smaller drives with much bigger drives, say 250G drives.

Already done. These 80GB are the leftovers, but still have life in them.



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..............................................................................

Even if you do learn to speak correct English, whom are you going
to speak it to?
- Clarence Darrow

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[dg]

I started to reply with another option, but you know what, it seems silly to
put money into using those old drives. I mean, $12 each adapter, a USB hub,
cables, PC case, that adds up to a fair bit of money just to use the old
drives. Sure you may have some of the stuff lying around, but you could put
the money towards a 250GB or larger drive for so cheap its crazy, and it
will have a warranty!

Then after you get the big 250GB+ drive maybe use one of the 80GB drives in
a portable USB enclosure for convenience, if one 80GB drive dies in the
enclosure you have 3 more to replace it with!

--Dan

 

[Dice]

Already done. These 80GB are the leftovers, but still have life in them.

Dan,

I think the USB path isn't a bad idea, but I'll suggest a few things.

1) Buy a separate PCI/USB Controller card (or two) for this, they can be
had as cheap as $30. Because USB is a shared network (and not all that
fast to begin with) spreading the drives across a couple of separate
controllers, or at least dedicating a controller just to this, will
greatly improve the performance. I know that may not be your goal, but
neither is something that is so slow it becomes nearly unusable.

2) Ditch the idea of using a hub, it'll just be a bottleneck.

3) make sure that enclosure has a couple of fans in it besides the power
supply fan, if possible. Hard drive do generate a lot of heat.

4) If you wanted to get real fancy, consider having the drives them
selves in those removable drive bays you can buy, and hook the usb
adapter kits to those. This way you could have the advantages of making
it easy to hot swap drive in and out, and the USB convenience. It would
cost a bunch more money, but it is an interesting idea.

5) If you hook it up to a Linux box, as opposed to a windows one, you
might want to explore using RAID on them to make them appear as a single
larger volume (RAID5). I have no idea how good it would work in
practice, but it might be interesting to play with.

Let us know how it turns out. I'd also be interested in knowing if the
Ebay deal pans out. I have two 40GB USB drives, by Microsolutions which
use their goofy backpack (Colorado) hardware. It is a major pain as you
need special drivers to deal with them. I wouldn't mind retrofitting
them with a real USB/IDE kit of some sort.

 

[Eric Gisin]

I you don't have a case that holds 5 drives, get one for $30.
Far cheaper and safer than USB enclosures without fans.

 

[Neill Massello]

These 80GB are the leftovers, but still have life in them.

Then sell 'em or give 'em away. It sounds like you're casting around for
a way to "use" hardware that you no longer need -- like the people who
set up an old computer to do SETI so they can pretend that they're
putting it to use.

 

[Dice]

Also as an interesting alternative BTW AoE (ATA over Ethernet) has been
getting quite a bit of press recently. It isn't in your price range I
suspect (It really is designed more to be a datacenter solution), but
the technology is interesting. http://www.coraid.com for more information.

 

[Rod Speed]

Thus unnecessarily adding another OS,

Thats a complete yawn in practice.

and additional hardware for me to maintain.

Less maintenance required than your 4*USB2 enclosures, you watch.

Already done. These 80GB are the leftovers, but still have life in them.

Life is irrelevant if you have to cobble up an abortion to use them.
Makes a lot more sense to replace them with a single drive.

 

[Rod Speed]

Also as an interesting alternative BTW AoE (ATA over Ethernet) has been
getting quite a bit of press recently. It isn't in your price range I suspect

Corse it isnt.

(It really is designed more to be a datacenter solution),

And is completely unsuitable for using some 80G discards.

but the technology is interesting. http://www.coraid.com for more information.

A basic obsolete PC makes a lot more sense in his situation.

 

[Tom2Tec]

I've seen IDE->USB adapters cheap on Ebay (~$12 each). I'm thinking I could
grab 4 of these, connect my drives to a hub, and place them all in a small
PC tower, and connect the hub to one of my computers. It wouldn't be
pretty, but it would be fairly inexpensive.

I'm curious, are you planning on using an AT PS? ~ 2tec

 

[J. Clarke]

Thus unnecessarily adding another OS, and additional hardware for me to
maintain.

How much maintenance do you think a server _needs_? A good server is
something that you turn on and forget about.

 

[ch1n0_c0ch1n0]

I'm curious, are you planning on using an AT PS? ~ 2tec

Yep. At least with my current "Design", which is very subject to change.

The USB->IDE adaptors I'm looking at come with 110VAC->12VDC converters
that plug right into the drives, but a PC PS would be more practical
(Less cabling/outlets used).


--
..............................................................................

"The biggest cause of trouble in the world today is that the stupid people
are so sure about things and the intelligent folks are so full of doubts."

-Bertrand Russell

..............................................................................
(e-mail address removed) http://www.memeticcandiru.com

 

[Lil' Dave]

I've got 4 80GB Drives that I'd like to redeploy in my house, but my
existing computers don't have any free IDE connexions, PCI slots, or drive
bays. I also don't want to create another complete PC in my house.

I've seen some IDE-raid enclosures, but they are all prohibitively expensive.

I've seen IDE->USB adapters cheap on Ebay (~$12 each). I'm thinking I could
grab 4 of these, connect my drives to a hub, and place them all in a small
PC tower, and connect the hub to one of my computers. It wouldn't be
pretty, but it would be fairly inexpensive.

What are people's thoughts on this? Are there better solutions?


--
.............................................................................
..

Tell people something they know already and they will thank you for it. Tell
them something new and they will hate you for it.

-George Monbiot

.............................................................................
..
(e-mail address removed)

http://www.memeticcandiru.com

Admittedly, this is probably a bit more expensive than you intended, but
interesting:
http://www.usbgear.com/Dual_bay_firewire_case_enclosure/

http://www.aicmicro.com/productdetail.asp?id=21815

Stay away from hubs, whatever you choose to do.

 

[CWatters]

Admittedly, this is probably a bit more expensive than you intended, but
interesting:
http://www.usbgear.com/Dual_bay_firewire_case_enclosure/

http://www.aicmicro.com/productdetail.asp?id=21815

Stay away from hubs, whatever you choose to do.

Likewise these are smart...
see Sohotank..
http://www.stardom.com.tw/web/product.htm
Any interface you want.

 

[h1dd3n_h4m$73r]

Admittedly, this is probably a bit more expensive than you intended, but
interesting:
http://www.usbgear.com/Dual_bay_firewire_case_enclosure/

I've seen those, but you're right: Too expensive... And no room to expand.
I want my enclosure to have more room so I can add more 80GB drives down the
road as they get cheaper, and expand my raid 5 array.

Stay away from hubs, whatever you choose to do.

Splain? You mean USB hubs?

--
..............................................................................

The search for truth is more precious than its possession.

..............................................................................
(e-mail address removed) http://www.memeticcandiru.com

 

[h1dd3n_h4m$73r]

I started to reply with another option, but you know what, it seems silly to
put money into using those old drives. I mean, $12 each adapter, a USB hub,
cables, PC case, that adds up to a fair bit of money just to use the old
drives. Sure you may have some of the stuff lying around, but you could put
the money towards a 250GB or larger drive for so cheap its crazy, and it
will have a warranty!

Then after you get the big 250GB+ drive maybe use one of the 80GB drives in
a portable USB enclosure for convenience, if one 80GB drive dies in the
enclosure you have 3 more to replace it with!

I already have several higher-capacity drives. I'm looking to create a
poor man's JBOD, and raid-5 it. 80GB extra is useless to me... but 240GB
or more can be used as a backup pool. As 80GB drives get cheaper and
cheaper, it will be pennies to extend my existing raid 5 set.


--
..............................................................................

"After we become a strong force as the result of the creation of the state,
we shall abolish partition and expand to the whole of Palestine. "

- Isreali founding father David Ben-Gurion

..............................................................................
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[h1dd3n_h4m$73r]

[email protected] wrote:

How much maintenance do you think a server _needs_? A good server is
something that you turn on and forget about.

Gross oversimlification. You're not an IT manager, are you?

Any unnecessary complexity introduces more points of failure - Which
inevitably increases the amount of time I will spend maintaining it down the
road.


--
..............................................................................

"Take the Anti-Defamation League [of B'nai B'rith] It's actually an
organization devoted to trying to defame and intimidate and silence people
who criticize current Israeli policies, whatever they may be"

-Noam Chomsky, Language and Politics

..............................................................................
(e-mail address removed) http://www.memeticcandiru.com

 

[h1dd3n_h4m$73r]

Dan,

I think the USB path isn't a bad idea, but I'll suggest a few things.

Dice, yours is easily the most helpful post in this thread. I think you
"get" what I am trying to do.

1) Buy a separate PCI/USB Controller card (or two) for this, they can be
had as cheap as $30. Because USB is a shared network (and not all that
fast to begin with) spreading the drives across a couple of separate
controllers, or at least dedicating a controller just to this, will
greatly improve the performance. I know that may not be your goal, but
neither is something that is so slow it becomes nearly unusable.

No PCI slots on my server, unfortunately.

2) Ditch the idea of using a hub, it'll just be a bottleneck.

What you're saying makes complete sense, but unfortunately, my constraints
rule out multiple USB buses. Thankfully, performance isn't important - As
long as I'm getting reasonable and realiable throughput, that's sufficient.

3) make sure that enclosure has a couple of fans in it besides the power
supply fan, if possible. Hard drive do generate a lot of heat.

Very true, and a point worth emphasising.

4) If you wanted to get real fancy, consider having the drives them
selves in those removable drive bays you can buy, and hook the usb
adapter kits to those. This way you could have the advantages of making
it easy to hot swap drive in and out, and the USB convenience. It would
cost a bunch more money, but it is an interesting idea.

Another excellent idea. Although this increases cost, this will make adding
and replacing disks down the road easier. I'm sure if I keep my eyes open
on ebay, I will find a lot auction for cheap.

5) If you hook it up to a Linux box, as opposed to a windows one, you
might want to explore using RAID on them to make them appear as a single
larger volume (RAID5). I have no idea how good it would work in
practice, but it might be interesting to play with.

That's exactly where I'm headed. My server is Linux, and I want to hook up
this "Poor Man's JBOD", Raid5 it with software, and use it as a backuppool
for TSM.

Let us know how it turns out. I'd also be interested in knowing if the
Ebay deal pans out. I have two 40GB USB drives, by Microsolutions which
use their goofy backpack (Colorado) hardware. It is a major pain as you
need special drivers to deal with them. I wouldn't mind retrofitting
them with a real USB/IDE kit of some sort.

I don't think it'll be hard to get adapters off of Ebay. There're plentiful
and cheap on there already, and I'm sure will get more plentiful and
cheaper down the road.

This thread has helped me cement some of the ideas I was tossing around in
my head. I think the next step for me is to do some napkin-math to figure
out costs and options, and depending on the numbers, start looking for a
cheap 7-bay enclosure. If I pursue it, I'll definitely post the outcome
here.




--
..............................................................................

Even if you do learn to speak correct English, whom are you going
to speak it to?
- Clarence Darrow

..............................................................................
(e-mail address removed) http://www.memeticcandiru.com