A D-Link DWL-G650 Problem

K

Ken

I have successfully used my laptop with a 650 card at my
home location linking to about a 5 year old D-link router
(Sorry, Don't have the model number handy)

I'm now at a different location trying to connect to a
D-Link DIR-615. I get the message ("Windows in unable to
find a certificate to log on to the network"

I was never asked for a certificate at the old location
What's a certificate?
Any idea what I must do? and if I do it will that negate my
ability to connect when I return to my home location?

Thx for the help
 
J

Jack \(MVP-Networking\).

Hi
Apparently the new location is set differently than the one you have at
home.
You have to contact the admin of the new location and ask for the connection
credentials.
It might be that you would have to change the Wireless settings in a way
that would not work at home. Record your current setting so you can switch
back at home.
Jack (MS, MVP-Networking)
 
K

Ken

Jack said:
Hi
Apparently the new location is set differently than the one you have at
home.
You have to contact the admin of the new location and ask for the
connection credentials.
It might be that you would have to change the Wireless settings in a way
that would not work at home. Record your current setting so you can
switch back at home.
Jack (MS, MVP-Networking)
Sorry to be so ignorant. I am the admin. I bought and
installed routers at both locations and setup wep keys.
As happened in location 1, I expected to be asked for the
wep key when connecting to location 2 but received that
"certificate" message instead.
I don't know where to begin to address the situation. Any
clues would be appreciated.
By the way, I now know that the router at location one is a
D-Link DI-624 802.11g
 
J

Jack \(MVP-Networking\).

Hi
Go over the Router's and computer settings and make sure that it is Not set
to corporate/business type of Wireless (AKA 802.11x).
Do not use WEP it is Not safe. Minimum safety starts with WPA (WPA2 even
better).
Jack (MS, MVP-Networking)
 
K

Ken

Jack said:
Hi
Go over the Router's and computer settings and make sure that it is Not
set to corporate/business type of Wireless (AKA 802.11x).
Do not use WEP it is Not safe. Minimum safety starts with WPA (WPA2 even
better).
Jack (MS, MVP-Networking)
I've been away but I'm back to troubleshooting this problem.
My mistake, The router is configured for WPA

I still have the basic question: What's a certificate and
how do I create/obtain one?
 
L

Lem

Ken said:
I've been away but I'm back to troubleshooting this problem.
My mistake, The router is configured for WPA

I still have the basic question: What's a certificate and how do I
create/obtain one?

You don't need a certificate, but if you want to know more, read on.

Wireless network security is effected by use of encryption. In order to
decrypt the encrypted messages, each side of the communication link
(client computer and wireless access point) needs the correct encryption
key.

Today, the best available wireless network encryption standard is known
as "Wi-Fi Protected Access 2" or WPA2. An older but still effective
standard is WPA. The first such standard, Wireless Equivalent Privacy
(WEP) is no longer effective, because it is easily cracked using readily
available tools (this was originally thought to be "equivalent" to a
wired network).

In a typical home or small business wireless network, the encryption key
is "pre-shared" which simply means that after the key is set in the
access point, it is manually transferred to each client computer and
manually stored there. This can be done by writing the key down on a
piece of paper (or just remembering it) or by using something like a USB
flash drive. Because the key is pre-shared in this way, there is the
possibility of some security compromise. This type of encryption is
called WPA2-PSK or WPA-PSK. Sometimes, instead of "PSK" (pre-shared
key), it's called "personal," as in "WPA2-Personal."

In larger businesses, a more secure system is used. This is known as
802.1x, which is the name of the standard adopted by the IEEE. In this
system, the client must present its "credentials" to an "authenticator"
and be "authenticated" before any substantive communication with the
client is permitted. Usually, the wireless access point forwards the
credentials of the connection attempt to a separate authentication
server. Typically, a wireless AP uses the Remote Authentication Dial-In
User Service (RADIUS) protocol to send a connection request message to a
RADIUS server.

In a sequence of back and forth communications known as a "handshake,"
the RADIUS server authenticates the wireless client's credentials. Once
it is satisfied, it sends encryption keys (which themselves are
encrypted using information from the handshake communications) to the
wireless client, which then uses those keys for the remainder of the
session.

One type of credential that may be (and very commonly is) used in the
above system is known as a "digital certificate." A certificate is
obtained from a Certification Authority (CA), which may be a server on
the network or it may be a commercial entity. The certificate is a
"guarantee" by the CA that the public encryption key contained in the
certificate actually belongs to the person (or computer) named in the
certificate.

All of this is a rather long-winded way of saying that a certificate, in
the context of wi-fi security, is only used in connection with an
authentication server, such as a RADIUS server. Because there is no
RADIUS server in your system (if there was, you would know all of the
above and more), you don't need a certificate. More importantly, if you
were to check the box to "Enable IEEE 802.1x authentication for this
network," which is on the "Authentication" tab of the "Properties"
dialog for your wireless network connection, you would be informing your
wireless access point to start the credential authentication handshake
process described above. This process would immediately fail, resulting
in a "Windows in unable to find a certificate to log on to the network"
or similar authentication failure error message.

If you are really masochistic and want to know more, see
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb457016.aspx and/or
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...48-74ec-4ee8-a650-334bb8ec38a9&displaylang=en

--
Lem -- MS-MVP

To the moon and back with 2K words of RAM and 36K words of ROM.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Guidance_Computer
http://history.nasa.gov/afj/compessay.htm
 
K

Ken

Lem said:
You don't need a certificate, but if you want to know more, read on.

Wireless network security is effected by use of encryption. In order to
decrypt the encrypted messages, each side of the communication link
(client computer and wireless access point) needs the correct encryption
key.

Today, the best available wireless network encryption standard is known
as "Wi-Fi Protected Access 2" or WPA2. An older but still effective
standard is WPA. The first such standard, Wireless Equivalent Privacy
(WEP) is no longer effective, because it is easily cracked using readily
available tools (this was originally thought to be "equivalent" to a
wired network).

In a typical home or small business wireless network, the encryption key
is "pre-shared" which simply means that after the key is set in the
access point, it is manually transferred to each client computer and
manually stored there. This can be done by writing the key down on a
piece of paper (or just remembering it) or by using something like a USB
flash drive. Because the key is pre-shared in this way, there is the
possibility of some security compromise. This type of encryption is
called WPA2-PSK or WPA-PSK. Sometimes, instead of "PSK" (pre-shared
key), it's called "personal," as in "WPA2-Personal."

In larger businesses, a more secure system is used. This is known as
802.1x, which is the name of the standard adopted by the IEEE. In this
system, the client must present its "credentials" to an "authenticator"
and be "authenticated" before any substantive communication with the
client is permitted. Usually, the wireless access point forwards the
credentials of the connection attempt to a separate authentication
server. Typically, a wireless AP uses the Remote Authentication Dial-In
User Service (RADIUS) protocol to send a connection request message to a
RADIUS server.

In a sequence of back and forth communications known as a "handshake,"
the RADIUS server authenticates the wireless client's credentials. Once
it is satisfied, it sends encryption keys (which themselves are
encrypted using information from the handshake communications) to the
wireless client, which then uses those keys for the remainder of the
session.

One type of credential that may be (and very commonly is) used in the
above system is known as a "digital certificate." A certificate is
obtained from a Certification Authority (CA), which may be a server on
the network or it may be a commercial entity. The certificate is a
"guarantee" by the CA that the public encryption key contained in the
certificate actually belongs to the person (or computer) named in the
certificate.

All of this is a rather long-winded way of saying that a certificate, in
the context of wi-fi security, is only used in connection with an
authentication server, such as a RADIUS server. Because there is no
RADIUS server in your system (if there was, you would know all of the
above and more), you don't need a certificate. More importantly, if you
were to check the box to "Enable IEEE 802.1x authentication for this
network," which is on the "Authentication" tab of the "Properties"
dialog for your wireless network connection, you would be informing your
wireless access point to start the credential authentication handshake
process described above. This process would immediately fail, resulting
in a "Windows in unable to find a certificate to log on to the network"
or similar authentication failure error message.

If you are really masochistic and want to know more, see
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb457016.aspx and/or
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...48-74ec-4ee8-a650-334bb8ec38a9&displaylang=en
You say "you don't need a certificate". then why does
Windows tell me it's looking for one. I appreciate your
taking the time to explain the inner workings of this stuff
but it's not helping. By the way, There is no
"authentication" tab on the properties dialog of my wireless
connection. Does that mean anything?
 
L

Lem

Ken said:
You say "you don't need a certificate". then why does Windows tell me
it's looking for one. I appreciate your taking the time to explain the
inner workings of this stuff but it's not helping. By the way, There is
no "authentication" tab on the properties dialog of my wireless
connection. Does that mean anything?

Windows is telling you that it's looking for a certificate because your
wireless adapter is incorrectly configured.

If there is no authentication tab, then either you are looking in the
wrong place (easy to do, there are multiple "Properties" pages) or you
are not using Windows to configure your wireless adapter.

If you go to Network Connections and right click on the icon for your
wireless adapter and select "Properties," does what you see look like
this screenshot?
http://screenshots.modemhelp.net/sc..._Connection/Properties/General/Index--2.shtml

If no, then you are using something other than Windows to configure your
wireless adapter. It's probably the utility provided by the manufacturer
of your wireless adapter. Find the user's guide and determine where to
change the configuration so as to NOT use a RADIUS server.

If yes, then click on the "Wireless Networks" tab, then select the name
of your wireless network under the list of Preferred networks and click
the "Properties" button. You should now be looking at the following
screenshot:
http://screenshots.modemhelp.net/sc...ociation/(Auth-Open)--(Encryp-Disabled).shtml

What does it say for Network Authentication and Data Encryption?

Now click the "Authentication" tab. Ensure that the top box to "Enable
IEEE 802.1x authentication for this network" is NOT checked and OK your
way out.


--
Lem -- MS-MVP

To the moon and back with 2K words of RAM and 36K words of ROM.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Guidance_Computer
http://history.nasa.gov/afj/compessay.htm
 
K

Ken

Lem said:
Windows is telling you that it's looking for a certificate because your
wireless adapter is incorrectly configured.

If there is no authentication tab, then either you are looking in the
wrong place (easy to do, there are multiple "Properties" pages) or you
are not using Windows to configure your wireless adapter.

If you go to Network Connections and right click on the icon for your
wireless adapter and select "Properties," does what you see look like
this screenshot?
http://screenshots.modemhelp.net/sc..._Connection/Properties/General/Index--2.shtml


If no, then you are using something other than Windows to configure your
wireless adapter. It's probably the utility provided by the manufacturer
of your wireless adapter. Find the user's guide and determine where to
change the configuration so as to NOT use a RADIUS server.

If yes, then click on the "Wireless Networks" tab, then select the name
of your wireless network under the list of Preferred networks and click
the "Properties" button. You should now be looking at the following
screenshot:
http://screenshots.modemhelp.net/sc...ociation/(Auth-Open)--(Encryp-Disabled).shtml


What does it say for Network Authentication and Data Encryption?

Now click the "Authentication" tab. Ensure that the top box to "Enable
IEEE 802.1x authentication for this network" is NOT checked and OK your
way out.


I appreciate your patience and help.
OK, I found the Authentication tab and unchecked the Enable
IEEE, etc box. Now windows tries real hard to connect but
times out with a message to see my network administrator. (sigh)
 
L

Lem

Ken said:
I appreciate your patience and help.
OK, I found the Authentication tab and unchecked the Enable IEEE, etc
box. Now windows tries real hard to connect but times out with a message
to see my network administrator. (sigh)

You didn't mention what the entries were for Network Authentication and
Data Encryption, but I suspect that there is an incorrect password or
other mismatch between your computer and the router with respect to the
router's security setup. At this point, probably the simplest thing to
do is to "Remove" the entry for this network from the list of Preferred
networks. While you're at it, you probably should remove all the
entries from that list that you don't recognize.

Then go back to the "Choose a wireless network" screen (click "View
wireless networks"), pick the desired network and enter the correct
password when prompted.

Of course, now that I have gone back and re-read your *original* post, I
see that all of these difficulties are at a "different" location than
your home:
- Perhaps, contrary to my earlier assumptions, this different
location does have more sophisticated and/or extensive security than the
typical home wireless network. It may be that there actually *is* a
RADIUS server and thus you *will* need a certificate. If that's the
case, you really *do* need to "see the network administrator."
- Even if the person who set up the wifi network at this location
didn't go so far as to use a RADIUS server, he or she may have set
additional security measures beyond just the password. Again, you'll
have to ask.
- And finally, the DIR-615 is a Wireless-N router while your "650
card" undoubtedly is a Wireless-G device. If, for some peculiar reason,
the owner of the router has set it to "802.11n Only" instead of the more
common "Mixed 802.11n and 802.11g" or "Mixed 802.11n, 802.11b, and
802.11g," you'll have a problem.
Hopefully, however, all you need is the correct password.

And to answer the final question in your original post, as long as the
name of the network at this location is not the same as the name of the
network at your home, you should be able to connect to your home
wireless network with no issues. If the network names are the same
(which means that both of you foolishly didn't change the default name),
then when you get home, delete the network name from the list of
Preferred networks as described above, and reconnect from the "Choose a
wireless network" screen.
--
Lem -- MS-MVP

To the moon and back with 2K words of RAM and 36K words of ROM.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Guidance_Computer
http://history.nasa.gov/afj/compessay.htm
 
K

Ken

Lem said:
You didn't mention what the entries were for Network Authentication and
Data Encryption, but I suspect that there is an incorrect password or
other mismatch between your computer and the router with respect to the
router's security setup. At this point, probably the simplest thing to
do is to "Remove" the entry for this network from the list of Preferred
networks. While you're at it, you probably should remove all the
entries from that list that you don't recognize.

Then go back to the "Choose a wireless network" screen (click "View
wireless networks"), pick the desired network and enter the correct
password when prompted.

Of course, now that I have gone back and re-read your *original* post, I
see that all of these difficulties are at a "different" location than
your home:
- Perhaps, contrary to my earlier assumptions, this different
location does have more sophisticated and/or extensive security than the
typical home wireless network. It may be that there actually *is* a
RADIUS server and thus you *will* need a certificate. If that's the
case, you really *do* need to "see the network administrator."
- Even if the person who set up the wifi network at this location
didn't go so far as to use a RADIUS server, he or she may have set
additional security measures beyond just the password. Again, you'll
have to ask.
- And finally, the DIR-615 is a Wireless-N router while your "650
card" undoubtedly is a Wireless-G device. If, for some peculiar reason,
the owner of the router has set it to "802.11n Only" instead of the more
common "Mixed 802.11n and 802.11g" or "Mixed 802.11n, 802.11b, and
802.11g," you'll have a problem.
Hopefully, however, all you need is the correct password.

And to answer the final question in your original post, as long as the
name of the network at this location is not the same as the name of the
network at your home, you should be able to connect to your home
wireless network with no issues. If the network names are the same
(which means that both of you foolishly didn't change the default name),
then when you get home, delete the network name from the list of
Preferred networks as described above, and reconnect from the "Choose a
wireless network" screen.

I'm at my wits end. As a last resort I asked my neighbor to
let me access his net as a test. I was immediately asked
for a password which he provided and connections was made.
I'm never asked for a PW when connecting to my net.

I checked his setting for authentication, encryption, etc.
and they are identical to the ones I set up on my router.
(NOTE: He uses a Belkin router and mine is a D-Link)

I hate to keep bothering you but is there anything else you
can suggest?
Many Thx,
 
L

Lem

Ken said:
I'm at my wits end. As a last resort I asked my neighbor to let me
access his net as a test. I was immediately asked for a password which
he provided and connections was made.
I'm never asked for a PW when connecting to my net.

I checked his setting for authentication, encryption, etc. and they are
identical to the ones I set up on my router.
(NOTE: He uses a Belkin router and mine is a D-Link)

I hate to keep bothering you but is there anything else you can suggest?
Many Thx,

Let me see if I understand what's happening:

1. You can successfully connect wirelessly "at home" to your D-Link
router. You don't need a password.

2. You can successfully connect wirelessly to your neighbor's Belkin
router. You do need a password.

3. You can't connect wirelessly at some "other location" to a D-Link
DIR-615.

It seems pretty clear that the problem is not with your laptop but with
the configuration of the DIR-615. Talk to the owner of the DIR-615.

If *you* are the owner of the DIR-615 (or at least have unrestricted
access to it):

- make sure that it is not configured as "802.11n only".
- make sure that its encryption is set to WPA2-PSK or WPA-PSK (caveat:
I'm not sure that if DWL-G650 can handle WPA2, especially older
versions; you may need an updated driver; also, if your installation of
Windows XP is not up to date, you may need to download the WPA2 update;
ask your neighbor what level of encryption his network uses; if his
network uses WPA-PSK, set the DIR-615 to that).
- make sure that no other security measures (IP filters, MAC filters)
have been configured in the DIR-615

--
Lem -- MS-MVP

To the moon and back with 2K words of RAM and 36K words of ROM.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Guidance_Computer
http://history.nasa.gov/afj/compessay.htm
 
K

Ken

Lem said:
Let me see if I understand what's happening:

1. You can successfully connect wirelessly "at home" to your D-Link
router. You don't need a password.
No, I did need a PW the first time I accessed. After that it
was "remembered"
2. You can successfully connect wirelessly to your neighbor's Belkin
router. You do need a password. Yes

3. You can't connect wirelessly at some "other location" to a D-Link
DIR-615.

It seems pretty clear that the problem is not with your laptop but with
the configuration of the DIR-615. Talk to the owner of the DIR-615. I am the owner

If *you* are the owner of the DIR-615 (or at least have unrestricted
access to it):

- make sure that it is not configured as "802.11n only". It's not.
- make sure that its encryption is set to WPA2-PSK or WPA-PSK (caveat: WPA-PSK
I'm not sure that if DWL-G650 can handle WPA2, especially older
versions; you may need an updated driver; also, if your installation of
Windows XP is not up to date, you may need to download the WPA2 update; I have all the latest updates
ask your neighbor what level of encryption his network uses; if his
network uses WPA-PSK, set the DIR-615 to that). I did set to WPA-PSK
- make sure that no other security measures (IP filters, MAC filters)
have been configured in the DIR-615 None present
I'll try again... thx
 
L

Lem

Ken said:
No, I did need a PW the first time I accessed. After that it was
"remembered"
I'll try again... thx

Yes, Windows remembers the password.

One thing to try is to disable *all* forms of security on the DIR-615.
Then remove the network from the list of Preferred networks on the
laptop (to avoid the issue of Windows "remembering" an incorrect
security setting) and try to connect to the DIR-615. If you can connect
to the DIR-615 with no security, then re-enable security (e.g., WPA-PSK)
and see if things continue to work or not.

--
Lem -- MS-MVP

To the moon and back with 2K words of RAM and 36K words of ROM.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Guidance_Computer
http://history.nasa.gov/afj/compessay.htm
 
K

Ken

Lem said:
Yes, Windows remembers the password.

One thing to try is to disable *all* forms of security on the DIR-615.
Then remove the network from the list of Preferred networks on the
laptop (to avoid the issue of Windows "remembering" an incorrect
security setting) and try to connect to the DIR-615. If you can connect
to the DIR-615 with no security, then re-enable security (e.g., WPA-PSK)
and see if things continue to work or not.
Yes, I can connect when I remove security. When I add
security, no dice. I'll continue to fool around with it (sigh)
 

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