Strange Shut Down Problems. Any Ideas?

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J

jsorrell84

Hello All

This is my first post to this site and I think this was just GREAT t
stumble on. I'm having a problem thats got me scratching my head, an
honestly, its starting to really annoy me. :-

I have a Gateway 550GR 3.2Ghz P4 running Windows XP. The problem I a
having has to do with Random Shutdowns. These are the weirdest I'v
seen and I've stumped. The computer could just be sitting idle, o
doing an intensive task, but all of a sudden all the open windows
titlebars will flash a couple times, and then all start closing out
and then the computer will go to the shutdown screen and then tur
itself off. Within 10-15 seconds of this happening, the Machine trie
to turn itself back on, but only gets a 5-10 seconds into start up
and it acts like someone pulled the plug on it!?! it will then wait
little bit, and then do it again. The only way to make it stop is t
unplug it. After unplugging it, I'll let it sit for 10-15 mins, the
plug it back in and hit the power button. It will work for a whil
again, then sure enough, shut down and do this all over again. I hav
checked the temps in the BIOS and nothing seems to be overheating. CP
stays in the 50ish range like normal and the other temps stay in th
high 30's (c). I have also tried leaving the side of the case off, n
difference

It did this to me a few months ago, and I took an air can and spraye
the hell out of the case, got all the dust out, and it seemed to b
okay. I've done that again this time, but no dice. I dont' understan
it. I've checked for bad RAM, and tried just booting into the BIOS
where it does the same thing. I'm all out of ideas. Anyone have an
suggestions? I think this is the last Gateway I purchase. Never ha
problems like i've had with this machine with any other manufacture
including my old Power Mac G4 that my grandmother still uses year
after I retired it. lo

Thank you in advance for any assistance
Justi

P.S. - I have already tried disabling the Automatic Restart and th
Automatic shutdown in case of an error in Win XP, plus I doubl
checked to make sure that the BIOS wasn't set to boot for LA
activity or a telephone ring. I've been scouring the search engine
and tried these things. I can't seem to find anyone that has th
exact same problem is me. I've found sites where people complai
about shutdowns and random boots, but they never seem to happe
together like my system does. Any help is appreciated
 
yup. I updated my spyware, virus scanner, everything. At first thats
what I thought it might be...
 
jsorrell84 said:
Hello All.

This is my first post to this site and I think this was just GREAT to
stumble on. I'm having a problem thats got me scratching my head, and
honestly, its starting to really annoy me. :-/

I have a Gateway 550GR 3.2Ghz P4 running Windows XP. The problem I am
having has to do with Random Shutdowns. These are the weirdest I've
seen and I've stumped. The computer could just be sitting idle, or
doing an intensive task, but all of a sudden all the open windows'
titlebars will flash a couple times, and then all start closing out,
and then the computer will go to the shutdown screen and then turn
itself off. Within 10-15 seconds of this happening, the Machine tries
to turn itself back on, but only gets a 5-10 seconds into start up,
and it acts like someone pulled the plug on it!?! it will then wait a
little bit, and then do it again. The only way to make it stop is to
unplug it. After unplugging it, I'll let it sit for 10-15 mins, then
plug it back in and hit the power button. It will work for a while
again, then sure enough, shut down and do this all over again. I have
checked the temps in the BIOS and nothing seems to be overheating.
Click to expand...

It sure sounds like the CPU is overheating, despite what the
BIOS says. I assume you checked all fans to make sure
they're working. You might try removing the CPU heatsink
and re-doing the thermal interface. How did you check for
bad ram? If not with Memtest86 or Memtest86+, try
testing with Memtest86+ from http://www.memtest.org
You might also try reseating everything inside your computer --
all the modules, including the memory modules, and all cables.

-- Bob Day
http://bobday.vze.com
 
Only time I've ever seen that is when the system power supply
is marginal. Makes me think you have some new add-ons like
a gamer video card. Also, Gateways in general tend to be
designed as "all you need" kind of systems, and you cannot
add beans to one without upping the psupply.

johns
 
Speaking of the Power Supply. It does seem a bit little for all th
horsepower this thing has. its 305W, does that seem a little smal
for a 3.2Ghz P4 loaded to the gills

I was thinking it might be the CPU overheating too, but it doesn'
make sense to me how it could work fine, then have the problem, an
after a good air blow, work alright until now when it happens again
In between the first and last cleaning, it was running many processo
intensive games and such, and never had a problem, now just having th
windows login on, it can't seem to take it, or even the bios..
Grrr

Thanx again
Justi
 
jsorrell84 said:
Speaking of the Power Supply. It does seem a bit little for all the
horsepower this thing has. its 305W, does that seem a little small
for a 3.2Ghz P4 loaded to the gills?

I was thinking it might be the CPU overheating too, but it doesn't
make sense to me how it could work fine, then have the problem, and
after a good air blow, work alright until now when it happens again.
In between the first and last cleaning, it was running many processor
intensive games and such, and never had a problem, now just having the
windows login on, it can't seem to take it, or even the bios.. ?
Grrr.

Thanx again!
Justin
Click to expand...

That does sound a bit marginal for a system like yours. Most major
manufacturers like Gateway use "just enough" of a PSU to get by and many
times that will be the first component failure. If you have a high-end video
card and lots of extras, that could very well be the problem. A faulty PSU
can cause all kinds of strange problems including random restarts like you
have. The fact that when you unplug the system and then it begins normal
operation for awhile makes me think even more about a faulty/marginal PSU.

Ed
 
Thanx for all your help guys

I've ordered some Thermal Paste to see if that will help. If not, ho
do I find out which Power supply to get? I've looked at them and
have seen quite a few, but how exactly do I know which one will fi
in my case? Are they a standard size or do I have to do som
investigating to find out which one will fit in the spot? Also
should I be able to change it myself or will I need some specia
tools/accessories

Also, could it be cause by having too many items plugged into th
outlet? ive got multiple powerbars, and I know they are drawing quit
a bit of power, just wondering if maybe the PSU isn't getting enoug
Juice..

Thank you
Justi
 
I suspect bad capacitors on your motherboard or a bad power supply.
Start with the simplest / cheapest suggestions:

1. Try removing and reconnecting the front panel/motherboard
connections. (Make sure the power supply cord is unplugged first!)
Facing your Mobo so the rear panel I/O connections are on your upper
left, the front panel connections are on the extreme lower right corner
of your Intel motherboard.

No joy?

2. Try removing and reconnecting the mobo power connectors. There is
one 24-pin plug and one 4-pin plug.

3. When you blew the dust out, did you include cleaning the power
supply unit (PSU) and cleaning between the cpu heat sink fins?

Probably not cheap-but easy to diagnose suggestion:

4. Check for bad capacitors. The caps are cylinders mounted
perpendicular to the motherboard. The look like miniature soda pop
cans. You'll see 4 or 5 of them between the cpu and the rear panel I/O
connectors. When they suffer "capacitor plague" they leak or bulge.
(See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_Plague for a description
and photos.) If that is the problem (and it can cause all manner of
bizarre symptoms) your motherboard is toast unless the caps are
replaced.

I've heard rumors that Gateway and others have agreed to replace
mobos that fail due to bad caps even though they are long out of
warranty. Doesn't hurt to ask.

The bad cap problem is so widespread that some companies specialize
in replacing motherboard caps.
http://www.motherboardrepair.com/index.php?sec=home, among others. I
haven't tried these so I cannot recommend one. Unless you are very
good with a soldering gun and don't mind spending your time, this may
not be a good do-it-yourself project.

PSU-related

5. A dying power supply also can cause many strange symptoms. OEMs
tend to put marginal capacity PSUs in their machines - marginal, but
adequate, unless you want to upgrade a processor or video card or add
drives or other equipment. In answer to your question, No, PSUs are
not a standard size, so you must carefully measure the space available.
If you are looking at a modular unit (where you plug the connectors
into the PSU so your case isn't full of wires you don't need, be aware
that the plugs going into the PSU take extra room - more than the wires
coming out of a pre-wired PSU. For example the Ultra X-connect modular
PSUs require more than an inch extra length to accommodate the plugs
and stiff cables that come with them.

Be skeptical of manufacturers' ratings. You can buy 400 Watt PSUs
that actually have lower capacity than the 300 W unit that came in your
Gateway. Two common rating "tricks" are (a) giving the peak power
rating, rather than the more important sustained output rating, and (b)
giving the rating (peak OR sustained) at an unrealistic temperature.
Tom's Hardware Guide put 19 name brand PSUs through a six week test.
Each was kept at the manufacturer's rated capacity throughout the test.
A third of them failed!
(http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/200507111/index.html)

In answer to your other question, Yes, you can screw up your system
sharing too many electrical devices on a circuit. Notice I wrote
circuit, not outlet. If you plug half the equipment into another
outlet which is on the same circuit, you still have to accommodate all
the equipment. The outlets in another room may be on the same circuit.
If so, you have to consider the power draw of devices there, as well.
(The electrical supply panel -- where you would go to change a fuse
or reset a circuit breaker -- should have the circuits labeled.) It
depends on the current draw. Low-draw items like 2 watt speakers, a
telephone, a clock, your cable/DSL modem and router don't add up to
much. If you are using a laser printer, a copier, or an electric space
heater or air conditioner on the same circuit, you need to talk to your
electrician about dedicated power lines.

Good luck!
 
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