Serious Hardware or OS Problem?

[Lee Beck]

I rescued my computer from a house fire.

I was pleased that after cleaning it up it recognized my drives. I had to
move and get a new DSL carrier, so I got a new gateway from them and also
replaced my mouse and keyboard. The first problem that I encountered was
that I could not get the setup.exe file to activate for the MSFT hardware CD,
but I did get the mouse/keyboard working (w/o the MSFT software on the CD).
Next, I figured that I'd connect to the Internet. My computer did recognize
the setup executable on the setup CD and I was able to begin installing the
gateway modem. On the step where I installed the Ethernet cable my computer
crashed and shut sown. I have been able to reboot, but am experiencing all
sorts of problems never experienced before like not able to access Control
Panel or System Restore. Also, I was never able to connect the modem to the
computer (I’m working from my notebook computer now).

Because my computer is acting so strange, I clicked on My Computer. The
information bar at the bottom shows the correct microprocessor and memory.
But if I right-click on Properties the window returns Processor: Not
Available; Memory (RAM): Not Available; Computer Description: Not Available.
My Vista install CD was destroyed in the fire, so I can’t do a repair from
that (if needed).

At this point, I’m just trying to diagnose the big question – is my computer
ruined or is my OS terribly out of whack (maybe from the aborted/botched
installations)? Is there some way to do this? I have MS OneCare that
initially worked (I turned off the firewall to try the DSL install) but now
isn’t accessible.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Take it to a technician.

 

[Lee Beck]

That response could go to every post here. What I'm trying for is to
diagnose the major problem myself, with the help of expertise from the
newsgroup community.

The computer is a Dell Dimension E510, which I paid about 1000 for a couple
of years ago. I'm hoping that I won't need to trash it. I'll try to figure
out how bad it is first. If I determine, with the help of whatever I learn
from forums such as this, that the hardware is seriously compromised, I'll
replace it. However, it may be a software (Windows) problem that can be
repaired with the right care. An added advantage to self-diagnosis is that I
get smarter. If I take it to a technician I'm out the lost time to
deliver/pickup and whatever expense to diagnose and fix it. And I still have
a questionable computer.

 

[R. C. White]

Hi, Lee.

Your first line was:

That immediately raises some obvious questions that you never tried to
answer. Mainly, did the computer get hot enough to fry some components? Or
to melt some plastic inside? No amount of guessing by us newsgroup readers
is going to answer that question for you. That will take someone who can
actually open up your computer case and look - with expert eyes - inside it.

If you assure us that no such physical damage happened, then we can think
about what else might be causing your problem. Until then, there's this
nagging notion in the back of our minds that, no matter what we suggest, it
ain't gonna help because the problem is in hardware, not software.

Of course, if there was physical damage, then you probably need to be
discussing this with your fire insurance agent.

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP
(Running Windows Live Mail 2008 in Vista Ultimate x64 SP1)

 

[Mike Hall - MVP]

That response could go to every post here. What I'm trying for is to
diagnose the major problem myself, with the help of expertise from the
newsgroup community.

The computer is a Dell Dimension E510, which I paid about 1000 for a
couple
of years ago. I'm hoping that I won't need to trash it. I'll try to
figure
out how bad it is first. If I determine, with the help of whatever I
learn
from forums such as this, that the hardware is seriously compromised, I'll
replace it. However, it may be a software (Windows) problem that can be
repaired with the right care. An added advantage to self-diagnosis is
that I
get smarter. If I take it to a technician I'm out the lost time to
deliver/pickup and whatever expense to diagnose and fix it. And I still
have
a questionable computer.

Lee

Re your network cable problem..

If the NIC is integrated, get hold of a 'brand new' PCI NIC and try it in
one of the spare slots.

If it doesn't work, suspect a non-functional PCI slot caused by excess heat
or Vista isn't working properly.

--
Mike Hall - MVP
How to construct a good post..
http://dts-l.com/goodpost.htm
How to use the Microsoft Product Support Newsgroups..
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?pr=newswhelp&style=toc
Mike's Window - My Blog..
http://msmvps.com/blogs/mikehall/default.aspx

 

[Bob F.]

If any smoke got into your computer and did get it working, you could be
facing a load of mysterious failures in the future. Carbon conducts, and
with expansion and contractions due to heat cycling, there could be hundred
of circuits making and breaking all over the place. Carbon is extremely
hard to remove from the surface of circuit boards without a complete board
removal, chemical cleaning, and strategic parts replaced. Do yourself a
favor and use the time else ware. Besides, your insurance company already
paid for it, didn't they?

 

[Lee Beck]

Thanks to everyone for thoughts and advice. On the insurance questions,
yes, it's likely that I'll get some reduced replacement cost for the lost
hardware. But we all know that it's the time and thought that went into the
data that is frequently more valuable than the hardware. But those are all
discussions for another arena.

On the questions regarding the physical damage. Yes there was some heat
distortion of outside plastic parte and LOTS of soot on the inside. In my
attempt to recover from the damage I disassembled down to the mainboard,
used a paintbrush to remove most of the visible soot, and compressed air to
clean what I could find of the rest.

I really expected to attempt a restart and get nothing or to throw the PS
circuit fuse on first try. That may actually have been best rather than the
tease if it is truly ruined. but to my surprise it booted to the "keyboard
failure" screen, so I purchased a keyboard and mouse, continued, and without
doing a lot of testing, it appeared to be okay. Desktop looked the same as
before the fire and AI was able to access files on all 3 HDDs. So I figured
that I'd purchase a new machine and use the traumatized one as a spare after
I recovered the data. First I needed the Internet, and that's when I
experienced my first problem. But I know that these things can be tricky so
I'mm still thinking that my inability to connect may be the result of things
other that fire damage to the computer.

The ethernet connection is part of the MB on the Dell E510.

I'll continue to try to establish that first step of determining if the
messages that I'm seeing are software or hardware related. Thanks forthe
advice, though. I was hoping that there is a simple DOS test or something
that could diagnose the hardware apart from my Vista that seems to be
behaving badly. However, many of my programs still work (e.g., graphics and
sound software).

 

[Cal Bear '66]

In a former life, I was a service manager for a professional, industrial video
equipment sales and service center. We would repair soot and smoke damaged
electronic equipment by soaking the circuit boards in ordinary dish detergent
and water for a couple of days, scrubbing with a toothbrush, rinsing thoroughly,
and letting dry for a week. You'd be surprised at the great number of units
that were successfully salvaged this way.


I Bleed Blue and Gold
GO BEARS!

 

[Mick Murphy]

A mate of mine still does it; good old dishwashing liquid detergent!

 

[RalfG]

It really depends on what degree of exposure the computer and peripherals
had. If any circuitry got wet you might as well trash those parts. Smoke
contaminated water is highly acidic and any circuitry that was exposed to it
can corrode very quickly. If you can save your data off of the harddrive
(onto another PC) you'll have got off lucky. Anything saved beyond that is a
bonus. IMO of course.

 

[Lee Beck]

Thanks to all for your educated advice and opinions. I am placing an order
for a new replacement computer but will continue to diagnose the dirty one.
I don't think acid water got into it, but as mentioned earlier there was a
substantial amount of soot. I will clean the add-on circuit boards and
install them in the replacement computer and I think that I'll be able to get
the data from the hard drives of the burned one.

I almost wish that I was not getting the tease of a familiar boot and
desktop. After I get the new computer up and my data off, I'll continue to
look for a utility that can at least determine if the problems that I'm
seeing are Windows or hardware related. I may be able to use the damaged one
as a backed-up spare for non-essential work.

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Use of any electrical product following exposure to a fire is very risky to
the user. Only a qualified technician can determine its safety.