Pacific Image and Vuescan, color management

[Fanta]

Hello,
I am interested in moving to the Pacific Image PF3650 PRO3 because of
its capability to batch scan uncut films, but have concerns related to
color management. My workflow would be:
- scan with Vuescan and save RAW files;
- open the RAW file with (say) Photoshop, and assign the scanner color
profile to it.

If you have a PF3650 PRO3, did it come with a color profile (.icc or
..icm file)?

If so, have you tried to assign the scanner color profile to RAW scans
made with Vuescan? Was the result any good?

Thank you for any help. Ciao,
Fanta

 

[keyes04]

Hello,
I am interested in moving to the Pacific Image PF3650 PRO3 because of
its capability to batch scan uncut films, but have concerns related to
color management.

Personally, I've chosen to cut my rolls and went with the Nikon Cool
Scan V ED, and couldn't be happier. Plus, the reviews are far better
with this than the Pacific Image. Specs are far better, too. Unless
you just really need keep the rolls intact, I'd recommend the Nikon
hands down.

C.R.

 

[Roy]

Hi there.

My knowledge of Colour Management is not all that great, because I have only
been interested for a couple of years, and I know that a lot of the experts
seem to have been studying it for very many years, so please forgive me if
this should be a stupid question.

I have noticed a few people advocating this techique of importing Raw scans
and then Assigning the Scanner Profile.
Does this mean that Photoshop would then be using the Scanner Profile as its
Working Space, or is there another step in the process to convert that
scanner Profile to Adobe RGB or sRGB.

Roy

 

[Bart van der Wolf]

SNIP

I have noticed a few people advocating this techique of importing
Raw scans and then Assigning the Scanner Profile.
Does this mean that Photoshop would then be using the Scanner
Profile as its Working Space, or is there another step in the process
to convert that scanner Profile to Adobe RGB or sRGB.

No, Photoshop will use the scanner profile with the scanned image,
converts it to the working space (if selected) for processing, and
uses/converts to an output profile for output.

With color management all input and output devices are characterized
by the characteristics of the device in question. Scanners and cameras
should have input profiles that describe the device's gamut, gamma and
whitepoint. Output devices, such as a printer a monitor or a film
recorder, should have output profiles that decribe the device's gamut,
gamma and whitepoint.
As an intermediary a profile connection space is used, a kind of an
interpreter's universal Esperanto, independent of any device's
limitations.

For processing the input device's data, a working space is used. It is
usually chosen to be a bit more capable of discriminating between
subtle nuances than the output device can. That will ensure that
losses due to processing will be less noticable when output, after
conversion from working space (e.g. Adobe RGB for process printing or
ProPhoto RGB for inkjet/photochem printing) to output space (e.g.
sRGB).

Bart

 

[Roy]

SNIP

No, Photoshop will use the scanner profile with the scanned image,
converts it to the working space (if selected) for processing, and
uses/converts to an output profile for output.

With color management all input and output devices are characterized
by the characteristics of the device in question. Scanners and cameras
should have input profiles that describe the device's gamut, gamma and
whitepoint. Output devices, such as a printer a monitor or a film
recorder, should have output profiles that decribe the device's gamut,
gamma and whitepoint.
As an intermediary a profile connection space is used, a kind of an
interpreter's universal Esperanto, independent of any device's
limitations.

For processing the input device's data, a working space is used. It is
usually chosen to be a bit more capable of discriminating between
subtle nuances than the output device can. That will ensure that
losses due to processing will be less noticable when output, after
conversion from working space (e.g. Adobe RGB for process printing or
ProPhoto RGB for inkjet/photochem printing) to output space (e.g.
sRGB).

Bart

Thanks Bart.

I know what you are saying, and have just tried Assigning my scanner profile
to an Image.

Everything looked ok, but after I saved that image, closed it and then
re-opened it in P'shop, I got the Profile Mismatch dialogue.

At that point I could Convert it to Adobe RGB, or leave it with the Scanner
Profile embedded.
So that would seem to indicate that P'shop is using the Scanner Profile as a
Working Space, otherwise it would not suggest the conversion.

When I looked in the Print with Preview Screens the Source Profile was the
Scanners, rather than Adobe RGB, which is my chosen Working Space.

If I had allowed the Scanner Col. Management to use the Scanner Profile and
output as Adobe RGB, I would not get the Profile Mismatch Dialogue when
opening that file.

I can understand that it might well be better to use P'shop Colour
Management, rather than the Scanner C. M., to Convert and Tag Files.

So should the File be Converted from the Scanner Profile to Adobe RGB at
opening?
Is that closing and re-opening and the subsequent Conversion, the missing
step?

Roy

 

[Roy]

Thanks Bart.

I know what you are saying, and have just tried Assigning my scanner
profile to an Image.

Everything looked ok, but after I saved that image, closed it and then
re-opened it in P'shop, I got the Profile Mismatch dialogue.

At that point I could Convert it to Adobe RGB, or leave it with the
Scanner Profile embedded.
So that would seem to indicate that P'shop is using the Scanner Profile as
a Working Space, otherwise it would not suggest the conversion.

When I looked in the Print with Preview Screens the Source Profile was the
Scanners, rather than Adobe RGB, which is my chosen Working Space.

If I had allowed the Scanner Col. Management to use the Scanner Profile
and output as Adobe RGB, I would not get the Profile Mismatch Dialogue
when opening that file.

I can understand that it might well be better to use P'shop Colour
Management, rather than the Scanner C. M., to Convert and Tag Files.

So should the File be Converted from the Scanner Profile to Adobe RGB at
opening?
Is that closing and re-opening and the subsequent Conversion, the missing
step?

Roy

Bart.

Sorry, about the previous message, I have now got the idea.

When they are advocating "Assign" Profile, what they mean, and what I did
not do, was tick the last box in the "No Profile" Dialogue.

Which makes the instruction "Assign Profile" and "Then Convert to Working
Space".

So everyone seems to have been correct.

Without the "Convert to Working Space", then P'shop would be using the
Scanner Profile as its Working Space.

I just hope that the other less expeienced people, like me, don't make the
same mistake.

Roy