OT Bill Gates tells senators "we need more foreign programmers to remain competitive"

[John Doe]

Bill Gates was in Washington this week, as usual lobbying for an
increase in H-1B visas. The richest man in the world earned his keep
when he looked our president in the eye and (without laughing) said
"Microsoft needs cheap, easy to control foreign programmers to
remain competitive". Both Bill Gates and our president probably get
a good laugh out of that one.

Microsoft doesn't want to pay for education and training of American
programmers. Instead of giving Americans the jobs, Microsoft would
rather import easy to control low-wage programmers. Since
Americans are under strict intellectual property law, they do
however have to pay to maintain Microsoft's empire. On the other
hand, many other countries have no intellectual property law or
don't enforce it, so they get Windows for free. The easy to
control imported programmer sends much of his Microsoft money home
to where his countrymen don't even pay for Windows.

That can't be good for our economy. There's something very wrong
about the New World order especially as it relates to intellectual
property.

 

[ToolPackinMama]

Microsoft doesn't want to pay for education and training of American
programmers.

So? Few people do. Ask your neighbor if he'd pay for it. I'll bet he
says no.

Microsoft also doesn't want to pay for education and training of PC
technicians, like me. Somehow, I don't feel like a victim.

Instead of giving Americans the jobs, Microsoft would
rather import easy to control low-wage programmers.

Wow, there is so much wrong with that sentence that I hardly know where
to begin.

1) Giving Americans jobs: shouldn't they earn their right by
demonstrating ability and willingness? Who actually gives jobs away?
Jobs are not a gift.

2) WOW! Instead of "Americans", "Microsoft" "would rather" "import"
"easy-to-control" "low-wage" programmers! OMG! Where To Begin.

You say that like it's a bad thing! LOL!



ROFL!



I call bullshit. Prove/show something solid to support your
assertions, if you please.

 

[John Doe]

So?

Microsoft's income comes mostly from Americans. Microsoft is located
in the United States. Microsoft has all the benefits of living here,
with easy access to American goods and services. Instead of just
living off its cash cow Windows and giving to its pet charities of
women and minorities, Microsoft should help empower our people.
Instead, Microsoft bleeds the average American under strict
intellectual property laws and gives American cash to Microsoft's
subservient foreign programmers who send the money home to where the
people don't even pay for Windows.

Still Microsoft whines the ludicrous "we don't have enough H-1B
visas... we can't outsource enough jobs to remain competitive".

Outsourcing isn't good for our economy, it's a quick fix for big
companies.

Wow, there is so much wrong with that sentence that I hardly know
where to begin.

Maybe by sobering up.

1) Giving Americans jobs: shouldn't they earn their right by
demonstrating ability and willingness? Who actually gives jobs
away? Jobs are not a gift.

Land is not a gift. Food is not a gift. Work is not a gift.

But the income from Windows is a gift since consumers have no
choice.

2) WOW! Instead of "Americans", "Microsoft" "would rather"
"import" "easy-to-control" "low-wage" programmers! OMG! Where To
Begin.

Probably by taking a pill.

<Snipped hysterical ranting>

 

[ToolPackinMama]

ToolPackinMama <laura lauragoodwin.org> wrote:


Probably by taking a pill.

LOL That's your answer to everything.

 

[Ken]

Microsoft's income comes mostly from Americans. Microsoft is located
in the United States. Microsoft has all the benefits of living here,
with easy access to American goods and services. Instead of just
living off its cash cow Windows and giving to its pet charities of
women and minorities, Microsoft should help empower our people.
Instead, Microsoft bleeds the average American under strict
intellectual property laws and gives American cash to Microsoft's
subservient foreign programmers who send the money home to where the
people don't even pay for Windows.

Still Microsoft whines the ludicrous "we don't have enough H-1B
visas... we can't outsource enough jobs to remain competitive".

Outsourcing isn't good for our economy, it's a quick fix for big
companies.


Maybe by sobering up.


Land is not a gift. Food is not a gift. Work is not a gift.

But the income from Windows is a gift since consumers have no
choice.


Probably by taking a pill.

<Snipped hysterical ranting>

You sound like a disgruntled liberal who thinks the world owes you a
living. I would remind you that Microsoft writes and sells its software
in many languages. Certainly some of the programing for this software
needs to be written by people who are fluent with the language it is
written.

Additionally, MS and Bill Gates gives millions of dollars to causes all
over the world. How much have YOU given??? My advice to you is that if
you are not already in France marching with others who believe it is
someone else's responsibility for YOUR success, that you go there and
join in.

 

[sbb78247]

LOL That's your answer to everything.

yes, he does forget to take his meds from time to time

 

[sbb78247]

Bill Gates was in Washington this week, as usual lobbying for an
increase in H-1B visas. The richest man in the world earned his keep
when he looked our president in the eye and (without laughing) said
"Microsoft needs cheap, easy to control foreign programmers to
remain competitive". Both Bill Gates and our president probably get
a good laugh out of that one.

Microsoft doesn't want to pay for education and training of American
programmers. Instead of giving Americans the jobs, Microsoft would
rather import easy to control low-wage programmers. Since
Americans are under strict intellectual property law, they do
however have to pay to maintain Microsoft's empire. On the other
hand, many other countries have no intellectual property law or
don't enforce it, so they get Windows for free. The easy to
control imported programmer sends much of his Microsoft money home
to where his countrymen don't even pay for Windows.

That can't be good for our economy. There's something very wrong
about the New World order especially as it relates to intellectual
property.

hey you bitch and moan about spam and shit, but here you go off topic - this
is not a political discussion group. now please go back to your hole and
die

hth, hand, and gfia

 

[Kalesh]

i think the world is moving towards a *GLOBAL MARKET* sort of
state
u cant blame microsoft for hiring foreign programmers if ur counter
dosent have enough of them

now to ur low wage statement.
me being an indian have different monetary expectations as compared t
u living in the US. we have a different kind of economy and a ver
different kind of living here..so u just cant compare what wage w
get and u get

and MICROSOFT is not an NGO its a goddamn private busines
empire...wont u want cheap and effective labour for ur business...

 

[johns]

X-No-Archive:yes

I thought Microsoft was "exporting" itself ?? Bill had gone to
China to set up business there ?? What gives now ? I imagine
he realized that China would nationalize MS-China if it became
successful .. rather than return the profits to Bill. Think about it.
The most successful economy car in the world is the Ford
Focus ( diesel ) in Europe and England. The issue of American
business going International has been in debate since the 60s.
Read old copies of INOVATION MAGAZINE for that. Inovation
said the real problem was WHO was going to run the Federal
Government .. American Business located on foreign soil, or
the Old Money Rich-Guy politicians in DC ?????? Who is
worse ?? Neither of them pays taxes. Neither of them lives
in our American streets like normal people. Neither of them
has anything to lose because of their bad ( or good ) political
decisions. It is a life-style that has nothing to do with any of
us. One thing is for sure ... most of us simply don't give a
damn. Innovation said .. Sell a toothpick for 1 cent to everybody
in China, and you have 1.37 billion cents. That was back when
I only paid $22,000 for my HOUSE. Hmm, maybe the Chinese
actually READ Inovation Magazine.

johns

 

[Mxsmanic]

Microsoft's income comes mostly from Americans.

False. About 80% of Microsoft's income comes from outside the U.S.,
last time I checked.

Microsoft is located in the United States. Microsoft has all
the benefits of living here, with easy access to American goods
and services.

And the high cost of American labor.

Instead of just
living off its cash cow Windows and giving to its pet charities of
women and minorities, Microsoft should help empower our people.

Corporations have no obligation to serve the public good, and most
feel no compulsion to do so.

Outsourcing isn't good for our economy, it's a quick fix for big
companies.

Publicly-owned companies care only about making money, and only over
the short term. Outsourcing makes sense from that viewpoint.

 

[Schrodinger's cat]

Microsoft doesn't want to pay for education and training of American
programmers. Instead of giving Americans the jobs, Microsoft would
rather import easy to control low-wage programmers. Since
Americans are under strict intellectual property law, they do
however have to pay to maintain Microsoft's empire. On the other
hand, many other countries have no intellectual property law or
don't enforce it, so they get Windows for free. The easy to
control imported programmer sends much of his Microsoft money home
to where his countrymen don't even pay for Windows.

That can't be good for our economy. There's something very wrong
about the New World order especially as it relates to intellectual
property.

Unfortunately, a lot of people in Europe (not me) have the impression that
most Americans are ill-educated, pampered and most of all insular, insofar
as they find it difficult to look outside of their own state or country and
see their place in something much wider (the world).

Your post does much to reinforce that unfair stereotyping.

Martin

 

[John Doe]

False.

Says who?

About 80% of Microsoft's income comes from outside the U.S.,
last time I checked.

Provide your citation.

 

[Conor]

i think the world is moving towards a *GLOBAL MARKET* sort of a
state.

Moving? It is already there.

now to ur low wage statement.
me being an indian have different monetary expectations as compared to
u living in the US. we have a different kind of economy and a very
different kind of living here..so u just cant compare what wage we
get and u get.

It is like comparing living in London in the UK and living in the North
East of the country. Just because you earn a salary 100 times higher
doesn't mean you are better off if your home and goods cost over 100
times more.

 

[John Doe]

Ken <user domain.invalid> wrote:

You sound like a disgruntled liberal who thinks the world owes you
a living.

I'm for competition in the marketplace.

You sound like a might-makes-right libertarian living in a fantasy
land, who cannot comprehend the importance of playing by the rules.

I would remind you that Microsoft writes and sells its software
in many languages. Certainly some of the programing for this
software needs to be written by people who are fluent with the
language it is written.

That is an off-the-wall, erroneous, and irrelevant excuse.

Additionally, MS and Bill Gates gives millions of dollars to
causes all over the world.

To its pet women and minority charities, but I already mentioned
that. Perhaps you do not read?

Microsoft and other elitists looking for a quick buck are in a
counterproductive/premature push for globalization. It's
counterproductive because the rest of the world couldn't care less
about our (United States) intellectual property.

How much have YOU given???

Significantly more, percentage wise.

How much have you given?

My advice to you is that if you are not already in France marching
with others who believe it is someone else's responsibility for
YOUR success, that you go there and join in.

Another subject you might want to read about before you discuss. The
protests in France were staged by young Muslim immigrants. My
argument revolves around the H-1B visa immigration issue and
outsourcing.

 

[Conor]

Says who?


Provide your citation.

Population of the USA - 250 million. Population of Europe 500 million.
Microsoft products cost more in Europe than the US.

 

[John Doe]

Unfortunately, a lot of people in Europe (not me) have the
impression that most Americans are ill-educated, pampered and most
of all insular, insofar as they find it difficult to look outside
of their own state or country and see their place in something
much wider (the world).

"I held off mentioning they were French, but it had to be said!"

Your post does much to reinforce that unfair stereotyping.

In other words "I don't have a counter argument, so I use the oldest
lamest argument known to man."

Of course you like the idea of being paid for helping to produce the
products you pirate. The more drain you put on our intellectual
property, the more those corporate executives will scream for your
cheap foreign labor.

Again, it's just bad for our economy. Letting us do the heavy
intellectual property lifting while you sit around sucking it dry
might be good for your economy in the long-run though.

 

[John Doe]

Population of the USA - 250 million. Population of Europe 500
million.

Population of China, 3 billion. Number of paid-for copies of
Windows, maybe 2.

I'm sure the sales data for Europe versus the United States exists,
it shouldn't be that difficult to find.

At least three major countries do not even have intellectual
property law, China, Russia, and Brazil. And for those who do, there
is no way for us to enforce their intellectual property law. Their
law enforcement agencies can easily/undetected turn the other cheek.

Taking over the world would solve the problem, but that effort is
failing miserably. However, the part of globalization that sucks our
resources is going full steam ahead. It's like putting the cart
before the horse.

Microsoft products cost more in Europe than the US.

I don't think so. Pirated software is easier to get in Europe than
here in the United States.

Not long ago, Microsoft began selling Windows bundled with Office in
Malaysia for $40.

 

[David Maynard]

Troll

 

[John Doe]

i think the world is moving towards a *GLOBAL MARKET* sort of a
state.

If it were a global market, we would play by the same intellectual
property rules.

Microsoft's money comes from Americans. Microsoft pays easy to
control H-1B Visa immigrants. Those immigrants send the money home
to their family. Their family pirates our intellectual property.
Their income isn't spent here, and at home it isn't spent on our
intellectual property. It's the worst economics for the United
States.

If you all paid for our intellectual property, the software you are
paid for helping to produce, it wouldn't be so bad.

u cant blame microsoft for hiring foreign programmers if ur
countery dosent have enough of them.

If the only reason weren't too keep startup American companies under
foot, that might be true. Outsourcing is done by large companies for
short-term profit.

and MICROSOFT is not an NGO its a goddamn private business
empire...wont u want cheap and effective labour for ur
business....

Windows is a monopoly, Microsoft is not at liberty to act like just
another private business.

 

[John Doe]

My post was properly labeled off-topic and posted to an associated group.

But I wanted to ask David Maynard again anyway, does Microsoft
possess monopoly power over the personal computer desktop operating
system market? In other words, is Windows a monopoly?