New PC w/ AM2 5600

[surface9]

I am considering building a new PC using the AM2 5600 CPU. It will be
used for 3d modelling and not connected to the internet. I haven't
built a PC since the P4 so I am feeling overwhelmed by so many changes
since then. Any advice would be apprecitated - mboard, vidcard,
memory, power supply, case, etc.

I am hoping to make it as quiet as possible - I do not intend to
overclock any component, but I do need to be able to view 3d objects
in real time (not offline rendering) and use various 3d modelling apps
to create detailed objects with a huge number of triangle and quads.

 

[Mike T.]

I am considering building a new PC using the AM2 5600 CPU. It will be
used for 3d modelling and not connected to the internet. I haven't
built a PC since the P4 so I am feeling overwhelmed by so many changes
since then. Any advice would be apprecitated - mboard, vidcard,
memory, power supply, case, etc.

I am hoping to make it as quiet as possible - I do not intend to
overclock any component, but I do need to be able to view 3d objects
in real time (not offline rendering) and use various 3d modelling apps
to create detailed objects with a huge number of triangle and quads.

OK, you chose a great CPU. Another good choice would be a core 2 duo (e6600
or similar). But going with the AM2 5600, I tried to spec. out something
for you. I went with www.mwave.com as I believe that they are probably one
of the best vendors for computer components (specifically including newegg,
btw). I couldn't find the 5600, but I threw in a 5200, which is another
very capable processor for what you want to do. You can always pick up a
5600 from newegg or somewhere else, though.

Bundle from www.mwave.com :

AMD ATHLON 64 X2 5200+ (ADA5200CSBOX) RETAIL BOXED W/1MB X 2 CACHE 90NM 65W
(WINDSOR) BUNDLE W/=EVGA 122-M2-NF59= KINGSTON 2GB DDR2 667=(1GB x 2)=
TESTING OPTIONS
$388.90 $388.90
SKU: MB-BA23083 -AA52390 -BA23237 -
spacer.gif
# ENERMAX ELT620AWT LIBERTY ATX 12V VERSION 2.0 620W UL FCC POWER SUPPLY FOR
ATX CASES)TESTER OPTIONS
# Y CABLE OPTIONS

$154.00 $154.00
SKU: BA22028 - -
spacer.gif
XFX GEFORCE 7600 GS XXX 512MB 533MHZ DDR2 TV DUAL DVI HDTV HEATSINK PCI
EXPRESS (Retail)
$121.00 $121.00
SKU: 4272963

Sub Total $663.90

The reasons for the above choices:
1) The EVGA motherboard with nvidia chipset was one of the best quality
motherboards I could find for your chosen processor (well, the slightly
slower little brother of it, ha ha), and the price was really low. Kingston
is very good quality RAM, you will NOT have any problems with it. 2GB RAM
should be plenty to start with. If your 3D work gets bogged down, you can
always double that later.
2) Enermax liberty 620, because it is a very QUIET power supply, and has
plenty of power to run your rig in SLI mode, if you choose to do that.
(which wouldn't be a bad idea)
3) XFX Geforce 7600 GS for several reasons. First, it's SLI capable, which
you might want to do (so just buy two of them). Second, it has a lot of
RAM, which you will need for 3D modelling work. Third, it is PASSIVELY
COOLED. This is very important, if you are trying to keep your system
quiet. Fourth, the price is incredibly low, for a relatively powerful video
card. You could easily afford to go with two of them to start with, which
would be an incredible amount of video processing power.

That's a good start if you are trying to build silent, at the moment, and
am2 platform. When choosing your case and DVD burner, make sure that the
panel color of the DVD burner matches the case color. ALSO, make sure that
your DVD burner includes a copy of Nero 7 Essentials. That's important, as
(from what I've read anyway), that seems to be the only DVD burning software
suite that runs OK on Vista, without spending a small fortune on premium DVD
burning software. Also, make sure your case has mounts for *120mm* sized
case fans. If it includes fans, you might want to replace them with
slower/quieter ones. But the mounts have to be there!

Good luck, -Dave

 

[surface9]

Thankyou, Dave, I have these items in my shopping cart, but, I am
wondering how you find out about the case mounting holes for the 120mm
fan (I prefer a desktop, or media center, model to a tower or mid
tower, if possible), as well as which DVD burner would have Nero 7
Essentials. I could go to Fry's and look over thier cases, but, I
would like to go ahead and use mail order as it is a long drive (gas
is getting too high these days).

I do not have Vista, and I was planning on loading Win2000 (SP4) and
XP Pro (SP2). Since I will not be online, isn't there a problem with
the Vista acceptance proceedure - how do I get past Msoft's hold
during the install?

Also, I was wondering about the idea of using two of the xfx video
cards - would you need two monitors? How would that work?

Thanks for your help. Will I run into any snags that are new since
when I built my northwood P4? It seems so much has chnaged, I feel a
bit lost.

 

[Dave]

Thankyou, Dave, I have these items in my shopping cart, but, I am
wondering how you find out about the case mounting holes for the 120mm
fan (I prefer a desktop, or media center, model to a tower or mid
tower, if possible), as well as which DVD burner would have Nero 7
Essentials. I could go to Fry's and look over thier cases, but, I
would like to go ahead and use mail order as it is a long drive (gas
is getting too high these days).

Wow. Ummmm, I haven't seen any ATX desktop cases with 120mm fans that
weren't ultra-expensive or slightly modified. I'm sure they exist, but good
luck finding that puppy. Some mid-towers are made to be used upright or on
the side. That might be something to look at. But that won't be a perfect
solution, as your drives will be sideways. (which should still work,
but...)

I do not have Vista, and I was planning on loading Win2000 (SP4) and
XP Pro (SP2). Since I will not be online, isn't there a problem with
the Vista acceptance proceedure - how do I get past Msoft's hold
during the install?

Good question. The only systems I've installed Vista on were able to
connect to the Internet for install. I've activated zillions of XP machines
over the phone though. I do that so often I've got it on speed-dial on my
cell phone. (really!) It takes 4-6 minutes. I would hope that vista would
be similar.

Also, I was wondering about the idea of using two of the xfx video
cards - would you need two monitors? How would that work?

In SLI, the 2 video cards work together to produce one image. Essentially,
half your video is passed through one of the video cards. Essentially you
double your video processing speed. It's a lot cheaper though (than
doubling your video processing speed with a single card solution), if you've
got a power supply that can handle it. (two cards draw a lot of current).
For more information, see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scalable_Link_Interface

Thanks for your help. Will I run into any snags that are new since
when I built my northwood P4? It seems so much has chnaged, I feel a
bit lost.

Not that much has changed, -really-. Some new sockets on the scene, some
newer RAM technology, video cards are much faster, hard drives have a sexy
new interface. Just feel lucky that the idiotic BTX idea died a very early
death. -Dave

 

[surface9]

Dave,

Boy it adds up quick. Here is what I have in my carts from Mwave and
newegg:

From Newegg (burner, case, fans):
$35.99 AOpen 18X DVD±R DVD Burner (w/Nero 7 Essentials)
$59.99 Spec-Research 01007 ATX Mid HTPC Computer Case
(accepts two 120mm fans on sides and two 80mm fans
in back)
$27.98 Scythe Minebea NMB Silent IC Series 120mm Case Fans (2)
(ball bearings, 1600 RPM, 63.6 CFM, 27.0 dBA)
$19.92 Shipping

$143.88 Total from Newegg.

From Mwave (mboard, cpu, memory, PSU, video);

$397.90 (motherboard) EVGA 122-M2-NF59-TR,
(cpu) AM2 5200+,
(memory) 2gb Kingston DDR2 667,
(testing) mwave assembles and tests bundle;
$242.00 (2 video cards) XFX GEFORCE 7600 GS XXX 512MB 533MHZ
DDR2 TV DUAL DVI HDTV HEATSINK PCI EXPRESS
$154.00 (Power Supply) ENERMAX ELT620AWT LIBERTY ATX 12V
VERSION 2.0 620W
$15.16 Shipping

$809.06 Total from Mwave

$952.94 Grand Total

I already have harddrive, keyboard, mouse, and monitor) - no floppy
needed anymore, I guess.

I decided on 2 video cards because of the wikipidea writeups that
claim 3d viewing would be nearly twice as fast. I want to be able to
rotate, tumble, transpose, and zoom very complex models without
worrying about freeze-ups (that is maddening).

If you have any more thoughts, please advise.

Thanks.

 

[Paul]

Dave,

Boy it adds up quick. Here is what I have in my carts from Mwave and
newegg:

From Newegg (burner, case, fans):
$35.99 AOpen 18X DVD±R DVD Burner (w/Nero 7 Essentials)
$59.99 Spec-Research 01007 ATX Mid HTPC Computer Case
(accepts two 120mm fans on sides and two 80mm fans
in back)
$27.98 Scythe Minebea NMB Silent IC Series 120mm Case Fans (2)
(ball bearings, 1600 RPM, 63.6 CFM, 27.0 dBA)
$19.92 Shipping

$143.88 Total from Newegg.

From Mwave (mboard, cpu, memory, PSU, video);

$397.90 (motherboard) EVGA 122-M2-NF59-TR,
(cpu) AM2 5200+,
(memory) 2gb Kingston DDR2 667,
(testing) mwave assembles and tests bundle;
$242.00 (2 video cards) XFX GEFORCE 7600 GS XXX 512MB 533MHZ
DDR2 TV DUAL DVI HDTV HEATSINK PCI EXPRESS
$154.00 (Power Supply) ENERMAX ELT620AWT LIBERTY ATX 12V
VERSION 2.0 620W
$15.16 Shipping

$809.06 Total from Mwave

$952.94 Grand Total

I already have harddrive, keyboard, mouse, and monitor) - no floppy
needed anymore, I guess.

I decided on 2 video cards because of the wikipidea writeups that
claim 3d viewing would be nearly twice as fast. I want to be able to
rotate, tumble, transpose, and zoom very complex models without
worrying about freeze-ups (that is maddening).

If you have any more thoughts, please advise.

Thanks.

Let's look at some prices and some benchmarks.

Prey benchmark 1280x1024
http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics.html?modelx=33&model1=519&model2=547&chart=214

A single 7600GS = 21.0 FPS (frames per second) $121
Two 7600GS in SLI = 28.0 FPS $242
A single 7600GT = 32.0 FPS $109 and up
A single 7950GT = 59.0 FPS $199 and up

Some things to note about SLI:

1) Memory does not add. Two cards having 256MB, still gives the
application only 256MB to work with. In your application, I would
expect the onboard video memory to be useful. (Note that some of the
7950GT cards have 512MB memory on the single card uption above.)

2) Application compatibility is an issue. An application does not
arbitrarily "just work" with SLI. Usually the driver design plays
a part. While SLI is good for gaming (because there are profiles
for the popular games), there is every possibility that SLI
wouldn't work well for what you want to do. You need to find a
discussion about the use of your particular app, with SLI or
Crossfire hardware setups.

3) Two cards in SLI can only drive one monitor. Only one of the
four connectors on the cards work, when in SLI. If the two
cards are put in non-SLI configuration, then you can drive up
to four monitors. If you use a single video card, it can
drive two monitors all the time, because there is no
going from SLI to non-SLI mode.

I would consider the pricing and performance carefully, before
buying something. Basic parameters for the cards can be found here:

http://www.techpowerup.com/gpudb/

For power, you can get some power numbers from xbitlabs.com, to
give you some idea of how much heat the various cards kick out.

A number of cards here:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/power-noise.html

A 7950GT is listed here as 61.1 watts. (I use the Xbitlabs search
page to find these articles, because the power numbers are sprinkled
all over the place.)
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/geforce7950gt_3.html

Also, you probably know your applications better than we do. Some
professional 3D applications (like ones using OpenGL), like to work with
certified drivers (Quadro cards or FireGL). I trust for what you
want to do, gamer cards are going to work ?

Finally, more as a joke than anything else, here is your finished build
The handle on the top is a nice touch.

iBUYPOWER Gamer-970A
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883227009

Paul

 

[Dave]

Dave,

Boy it adds up quick. Here is what I have in my carts from Mwave and
newegg:

From Newegg (burner, case, fans):
$35.99 AOpen 18X DVD±R DVD Burner (w/Nero 7 Essentials)
$59.99 Spec-Research 01007 ATX Mid HTPC Computer Case
(accepts two 120mm fans on sides and two 80mm fans
in back)
$27.98 Scythe Minebea NMB Silent IC Series 120mm Case Fans (2)
(ball bearings, 1600 RPM, 63.6 CFM, 27.0 dBA)
$19.92 Shipping

$143.88 Total from Newegg.

From Mwave (mboard, cpu, memory, PSU, video);

$397.90 (motherboard) EVGA 122-M2-NF59-TR,
(cpu) AM2 5200+,
(memory) 2gb Kingston DDR2 667,
(testing) mwave assembles and tests bundle;
$242.00 (2 video cards) XFX GEFORCE 7600 GS XXX 512MB 533MHZ
DDR2 TV DUAL DVI HDTV HEATSINK PCI EXPRESS
$154.00 (Power Supply) ENERMAX ELT620AWT LIBERTY ATX 12V
VERSION 2.0 620W
$15.16 Shipping

$809.06 Total from Mwave

$952.94 Grand Total

I already have harddrive, keyboard, mouse, and monitor) - no floppy
needed anymore, I guess.

I decided on 2 video cards because of the wikipidea writeups that
claim 3d viewing would be nearly twice as fast. I want to be able to
rotate, tumble, transpose, and zoom very complex models without
worrying about freeze-ups (that is maddening).

If you have any more thoughts, please advise.

Thanks.

(my reply):

Floppy MIGHT be needed to install SATA drivers. But if you are using a
recycled hard drive, this probably isn't an issue. You probably have
another system from which you could borrow a floppy drive anyway, right?

As someone else wrote, SLI might not be twice as fast on all applications.
You should probably contact others running your 3D program to see what they
are using for video card(s) and how it works for them. However, the video
card you've chosen is no slouch. Even if the performance doesn't increase,
I think it will still work fine. IMHO -Dave