More dumb thing Vista is doing... Now its demands I set up a 2nd Network. Unasked for and unwanted o

[Adam Albright]

The adventure continues...

Ok, I've been using my computer for about a hour. Everything seems
fine. I have several windows open and can't see my desktop. I hear one
of the new "cute" Windows audio cues. I go to my desktop to see what
if anything happened.

SURPRISE!

Vista popped up a rather large window titled "Set Network location"
and is now asking me to select a location for Network 2 network.

Well duh... I don't have a network 2 anything, didn't request it and
for sure don't need or want to set it up. It gives me three options,
set up as home, work or as a public location.

I click on my Task Bar tray at the extreme lower right. It now says:

Currently connected to: Access Local and Internet. Hmm... There are
two links I can click on, the first is connect to a network, the
second is Network and Sharing Center.

Now this is funny... Damn funny.

I click on the first choice. It pops up a new window.

It shows a icon for the MSN network, but it also says "this connection
is not available because there is a problem with your modem or network
adapter, then shows a red X.

I should point out at this time I have ONLY a single broadband
Internet connection with WOW as my ISP. I have no use for nor do I
want a dial-up to Microsoft's network.

Now this may explain another issue I've been having. Ever since
installing Vista it keeps telling me randomly that I'm offline and
can't access web pages when I open the IE7 browser or click on web
page shortcuts on my desktop.

Since I'm in a playful mood, I next right clicked on the MSN icon in
the connect to a network window that popped up to see its properties.
Guess what... right... lame stupid Windows Vista now tells me this:
"You do not have sufficent privileges for configuring connection
properties. Contact your administrator."

So lets review, Vista wants to set up a 2nd network connection I
didn't ask for, then tells me I don't have privilegs to configure it
and it keeps disconnecting me from the broadband connection I do have
that's worked fine for years telling me the web pages I want to view
can't be accessed because they now are offline. Priceless!

I'm not done.

There was a second link to click on called Network and Sharing Center.
I click and get taken to Local Area Connection Status. I click on its
properties and it correctly shows my WOW (or wowway) broadband
connection with it using my Marvell Yukon 88E8053 PCI-E Gigabit
Ethernet Controller.

Now someone tell me the following:

1. Why is Vista dumb enough to want to install a second network?
when I didn't ask it too?

2. Why is Vista randomly turning off by broadband connection and
attempting to access the Internet with a MSN dial-up account
I don't have or want?

3. Why is Vista constantly popping up a windows asking me to log on to
an network I didn't set up or want?

4. Why does it now nag to set up this 2nd network then in the next
breath tell me I don't have permission to do what it tells me
I should be doing?

5. How the hell can I turn if off when all attempts keep popping
the same moroinc you don't have administrative rights BS?

Just to be sure, I next go to Device Manager. No yellow or red warning
tags. My Gigabit Controller is working fine according to Vista.

 

[Alexander Suhovey]

Adam,

You seem to be confused about how Vista networking works and terminology it
uses. It is however quite amusing how people tend to be quick to jump from
"I don't understand it" to "it is dumb" (no offense) . Now, to the point.

MSN dialup connection is NOT the one Vista is referring to as "Network 2".

The window you've seen means that Vista has detected that there is a new
network you are connected to OR there's change in current network settings
(IP address etc). Usually this is relevant to laptops (think home network
and work/public here) but can happen on desktops too when some of settings
of the network you are connected to are changed or when you connect your
computer to your LAN initially, or when you configure a new dial-up/VPN
connection and use it first time. Since you probably want to have different
protection for different networks (like being able to access files on laptop
from other home computers but be maximally protected when connected to
airport hot spot), Vista asks you to identify the type of the "new" network
you are connected to giving you the choice between three predefined types
that have different levels of network protection and exposure.

It also worth mentioning that there may be some delay between network change
(e.g. connecting to a new network) and appearance of mentioned window.

It may sound a bit confusing but the idea is actually quite simple: There
are CONNECTIONS and there are NETWORKS. CONNECTION refers to particular
network card or VPN/Dial-up connection. Now, same network card can be
connected to different NETWORKS (home network, LAN at work, hotel Wi-Fi
etc). Each network in Vista can be assigned a type that has predefined
firewall settings. That's it, nothing too complicated.

If you open Network and Sharing Center, you should see your "Network 2"
which you BTW can rename to make more sense (For example, I have "Home",
"<My ISP>" and "<My Company>" networks).

Next, If you have preconfigured dialup connections (say, by OEM) that you do
not use, just delete them. In the left pane of Network and Sharing Center,
click "Manage Network Connections" link to open a list of all connections.

As for messages about insufficient privileges, do you use administrative
account or standard user account? Do you have UAC turned on or off?

 

[Adam Albright]

Adam,

You seem to be confused about how Vista networking works and terminology it
uses. It is however quite amusing how people tend to be quick to jump from
"I don't understand it" to "it is dumb" (no offense) . Now, to the point.

I'm not confused at all, I'm giving a very detailed blow by blow
account of what I'm seeing. Hint: I'm not new at this. Been fighting
with buggy versions of Windows for 20 years. I don't take offense to
people that try to help, I do get somewhat annoyed at some (not you)
that post here and have a smartass attitude, but don't take offense
either when I say I probably have more experience than 9 out of 10

MSN dialup connection is NOT the one Vista is referring to as "Network 2".

It actually will become exactly that, read the rest of my responses to

The window you've seen means that Vista has detected that there is a new
network you are connected to OR there's change in current network settings
(IP address etc).

Really? Well then perhaps you'll be so kind to explain HOW that came
to be since I haven't switched, changed or added networks or providers
and I'm not using a laptop or mobile anything.

However, I do understand as with most broadband providers my IP
address is changed every few days by their high automated system and
no customer's IP address is static.

I'm sure even the clueless Bozos at Microsoft are aware of this common
security precaution many, I dare say most broadband ISP's take to
REALLY protect their customers and which was handle transparently
behind the scenese in XP and earlier versions of Windows without hitch
or the stupidity of bringing up a warning box trying to impose a
dial-up connection on top of your broadband connect like stupid Vista
now does after it kicks you off the Intetnet for your actual broadband
connection. In a word, laughable!

So yes, WOW (wowway.com) does indeed automatically change ALL its
broadband customers IP addresses from time to time. Now just because I
know some of the people that work in a technical capacity at WOW, I
gave them a call. As I suspected they have been fielding inquiries
from other customers that have reported similar problems. You wouldn't
want me to repeat verbatim what I've been told these technical people
think of Vista do ya?

Usually this is relevant to laptops (think home network
and work/public here) but can happen on desktops too when some of settings
of the network you are connected to are changed or when you connect your
computer to your LAN initially, or when you configure a new dial-up/VPN
connection and use it first time.

Did NONE of the above. Nice guessing though. <wink> Now keep reading.

Since you probably want to have different
protection for different networks (like being able to access files on laptop
from other home computers but be maximally protected when connected to
airport hot spot), Vista asks you to identify the type of the "new" network
you are connected to giving you the choice between three predefined types
that have different levels of network protection and exposure.

One more time... instead of reciting a rehearsed response of what it
could be, actually READ what I told you it IS. I have no laptop, no
new network, nothing has changed since XP, I did a install in place,
meaning are you LISTENING? ... whatever IP address and other related
Internet settings including my provider are exactly the same. I
changed nothing,added nothing and removed nothing. In fact I didn't
touch network settings. Obviously Vista HAS fiddled with something
behind my back. Again I ask what and why?

It also worth mentioning that there may be some delay between network change
(e.g. connecting to a new network) and appearance of mentioned window.

THERE IS NO NEW NETWORK. What is happening is Vista is stupid. It
detects a simple change in your IP address (made by your ISP's
automated equipment) and incorrectly sees that as a "new network" and
foolishly attempts to set up a dial-up connection for it, without
asking you of course, after it disables your perfectly working
broadband connection. That usually requires a reboot to restore.
Now lets see a show of hands who thinks this is a improvement over how
XP and all prior versions of Windows seemlessly accepted dynamic
changes in IP addresses you have between your computer and you ISP
that happens seamlessly behind the scenes without your knowledge or
concent and always has. Now that's broken.

It may sound a bit confusing but the idea is actually quite simple: There
are CONNECTIONS and there are NETWORKS. CONNECTION refers to particular
network card or VPN/Dial-up connection. Now, same network card can be
connected to different NETWORKS (home network, LAN at work, hotel Wi-Fi
etc). Each network in Vista can be assigned a type that has predefined
firewall settings. That's it, nothing too complicated.

If you open Network and Sharing Center, you should see your "Network 2"
which you BTW can rename to make more sense (For example, I have "Home",
"<My ISP>" and "<My Company>" networks).

What I actually SEE and what I should see are obviously two different
things. Now try to LISTEN to what I'm telling you.

I click on Network and Sharing Center. It shows three icons, They are
as follows; Main (this computer) what I named my computer, Network and
Internet. There is no network 2 listed in this windows pane, yet the
moronic piece of crap Vista is will from time to time bring up another
window and want to add network 2 which I ready said is listed as a MSN
dial-up and it asks for a login and password after telling me I'm off
line. Now if you don't think this is stupid and totally dumb behavior
for a operating system, tell us.

Below that it says Network (Private network) why you'll have to ask
Vista I didn't set it up, it did. Click on its properties it shows my
broadband ISP and the number of bytes I have uploaded and downloaded.

Again there is NOTHING else listed here. NOTHING. So I can't click on
network 2 to delete was isn't shown. Got it?

Next, If you have preconfigured dialup connections (say, by OEM) that you do
not use, just delete them. In the left pane of Network and Sharing Center,
click "Manage Network Connections" link to open a list of all connections.

Geez, this is insane! I click on Manage Network Connections there is
only my broadband connection shown. As I'm literlly writing this post
that same message I talked about earliet again pops up asking if I
want to use my MSN dial-up, then all my web page links on my desktop
are again offline. I DON'T have and never installed MSN and guess
what, now there is a new MSN network dial-up icon in the left pane
under Manage network connections that wasn't that just a couple
minutes ago! So I guess you could say I could Vista in the act.
<wink>

I try to delete the MSN addition and to nobody's surprise the delete
option is grayed out! Too funny for words!

Saying this is insane behavior doesn't come close. Hold on... I'm
going to stop, reboot and see if that MSN icon which Networks now
shows at Network 2 still shows when I boot up again.

So funny, honestly Vista is so broken it will make grown men cry!

I did reboot and immediately when to Manage Network connections.
Again, MSN dial-up doesn't show. But wait...Again as I'm writing this
it pops up and installs itself as Network 2 again. This time I was
able to delete it. How much you want to bet it will come back the next
time I reboot or the next time my ISP does a dynamic IP change.

As for messages about insufficient privileges, do you use administrative
account or standard user account? Do you have UAC turned on or off?

Obviously I turned off the worthless UAC. It is pure crap. I'm the
single user on this PC so by default I have administrative rights
assigned automatically.

 

[Alexander Suhovey]

It actually will become exactly that, read the rest of my responses to
see what I mean... <giggle>

Probably you are right and I was too quick to jump to conclusion. I never
had to deal with MSN Internet Access software and was assuming it is casual
Dial-up connection which may not be the case. You see, for Vista to detect a
new network there must be an established connection to this network and from
you initial post I concluded that MSN dialup connection wasn't and couldn't
be dealed since you don't seem to have an MSN internet access account. But
perhaps there is more to MSN than casual dial-up.

However, I do understand as with most broadband providers my IP
address is changed every few days by their high automated system and
no customer's IP address is static.

Probably I wasn't clear but sure Vista doesn't threat every single change of
active network connection settings as a new network. Dynamic IP addresses
change but that doesn't make it a new network. But anyway that isn't
relevant since it appears that your problem is indeed in MSN software.

I'm sure even the clueless Bozos at Microsoft are aware of this common

Talking about attitude, eh?

One more time... instead of reciting a rehearsed response of what it
could be, actually READ what I told you it IS. I have no laptop, no
new network, nothing has changed since XP, I did a install in place,
meaning are you LISTENING? ...

Yes, I am but when troubleshooting I try to separate facts from opinions.
Apparently I didn't do a good job at it in this case.

THERE IS NO NEW NETWORK.

Well, if there is a single thing I'm sure about it is that there is a new
network connection. Because the pop-up window asking you to assign a type to
the connection only should appear when there is a new network detected.
Unless it is a bug in this routine we are dealing with and I don't think so.

yet the moronic piece of crap Vista

Please let me know if calling some names is why you actually post. If not,
please don't do that, all it does it just distracts from the issue we are
trying to troubleshoot.

Again there is NOTHING else listed here. NOTHING. So I can't click on
network 2 to delete was isn't shown. Got it?

Yes I got it but there can be a race condition, network 2 could be active
for just several seconds so when you open Network and Sharing Center it may
not be available anymore.

Geez, this is insane! I click on Manage Network Connections there is
only my broadband connection shown. As I'm literlly writing this post
that same message I talked about earliet again pops up asking if I
want to use my MSN dial-up, then all my web page links on my desktop
are again offline. I DON'T have and never installed MSN

Could it have been installed by OEM or along with some other software? Do
you have it under "Programs and Features" in Control Panel (you can run it
directly by name from Run box, it's appwiz.cpl applet)? Is your setup fresh
install, upgrade or new computer with OEM-preinstalled Vista?

I try to delete the MSN addition and to nobody's surprise the delete
option is grayed out! Too funny for words!

It's not clear if you mean a dial-up entry or MSN software (whatever its
called) under "Programs and Features".

Obviously I turned off the worthless UAC. It is pure crap. I'm the
single user on this PC so by default I have administrative rights
assigned automatically.

Can you check something for me? Just a check, since if you turned UAC off,
you shouldn't have "insufficient privileges" messages or disabled "delete"
options. Run following command at command prompt:

whoami /groups | find "Administrators"

If you get no output or output saying "Group used for deny only", that would
mean you don't have full administrator rights either because your account is
not a member of Administrators group or UAC is still active.

OK, to sum up, I'd recommend to take a look if there are any MSN products
installed, and if yes, try to uninstall them. Alternatively, take a look if
there's MSN Explorer shortcut under All Programs in start menu. If yes, you
can try to configure (read - disable) MSN connection settings in MSN
Explorer settings. Also you might want to look into Internet Options in IE
(or Control Panel), Connections tab to see if there are any wrong
connections configured by default.

 

[Alexander Suhovey]

Did NONE of the above. Nice guessing though. <wink> Now keep reading.
You may learn something. <wink>

I hope so. Learning something new every day is one of things that keeps me
here in this newsgroup

 

[Adam Albright]

Probably you are right and I was too quick to jump to conclusion. I never
had to deal with MSN Internet Access software and was assuming it is casual
Dial-up connection which may not be the case.

Well it makes no sense since this a custom built system I put together
myself from the ground up, there is no software that may have snunk in
anything to set up a MSN network that I'm aware of. Where it is coming
from I have no idea. Wouldn't it show up in Control Panel in
add/remove? There is no such entry for MSN anything.

Probably I wasn't clear but sure Vista doesn't threat every single change of
active network connection settings as a new network. Dynamic IP addresses
change but that doesn't make it a new network. But anyway that isn't
relevant since it appears that your problem is indeed in MSN software.

I looked in C:\Program files. There is a folder called MSN Explorer,
this was one of two Microsoft software items the Vista Update Advisor
said may cause problems in Vista. The other was Messenger. The issue
was unless I went looking for it I would have never seen it. All
that's in the folder is a shortcut labeled MSN Explorer. Clicking on
it is bring up a warning box; known compatibility issues. In the same
folder there is a Microsoft Win32 Cabinet self-extractor .exe file
dated 11/2/06. I never installed it, it never was visible in XP. Why
would Vista go here and on its own do something? Did Windows learn a
new trick to decompress cab files and install stuff without tell us?

Talking about attitude, eh?

If you had a solid week of one stupid Microsoft screw-up after another
how would you feel?

Well, if there is a single thing I'm sure about it is that there is a new
network connection.

Coming from where, instructed by who for what purpose? Answer that.

Because the pop-up window asking you to assign a type to
the connection only should appear when there is a new network detected.
Unless it is a bug in this routine we are dealing with and I don't think so.

Could it have been installed by OEM or along with some other software?

No chance, this is a custom built system.

Can you check something for me? Just a check, since if you turned UAC off,
you shouldn't have "insufficient privileges" messages or disabled "delete"
options. Run following command at command prompt:

whoami /groups | find "Administrators"

It reports BUILTIN\ADMINISTRATORS ALIAS S-1-5-32-544 MANDATORY GROUP
UP, Enable by default, Enabled group, Group owner

C:\Users\XXXXXXXX>

Where XXXXXXXX is me, the single user

OK, to sum up, I'd recommend to take a look if there are any MSN products
installed, and if yes, try to uninstall them.

That's the whole point, none listed, I looked further and saw what I
said MSN Explorer but that's only a uncompressed cab file or so it
seems. If it installed something somewhere lots of luck trying to find
where Windows hid it.

 

[Lang Murphy]

Didn't install VMWare or Virtual PC?

Lang

Well it makes no sense since this a custom built system I put together
myself from the ground up, there is no software that may have snunk in
anything to set up a MSN network that I'm aware of. Where it is coming
from I have no idea. Wouldn't it show up in Control Panel in
add/remove? There is no such entry for MSN anything.


I looked in C:\Program files. There is a folder called MSN Explorer,
this was one of two Microsoft software items the Vista Update Advisor
said may cause problems in Vista. The other was Messenger. The issue
was unless I went looking for it I would have never seen it. All
that's in the folder is a shortcut labeled MSN Explorer. Clicking on
it is bring up a warning box; known compatibility issues. In the same
folder there is a Microsoft Win32 Cabinet self-extractor .exe file
dated 11/2/06. I never installed it, it never was visible in XP. Why
would Vista go here and on its own do something? Did Windows learn a
new trick to decompress cab files and install stuff without tell us?

If you had a solid week of one stupid Microsoft screw-up after another
how would you feel?


Coming from where, instructed by who for what purpose? Answer that.




No chance, this is a custom built system.


It reports BUILTIN\ADMINISTRATORS ALIAS S-1-5-32-544 MANDATORY GROUP
UP, Enable by default, Enabled group, Group owner

C:\Users\XXXXXXXX>

Where XXXXXXXX is me, the single user


That's the whole point, none listed, I looked further and saw what I
said MSN Explorer but that's only a uncompressed cab file or so it
seems. If it installed something somewhere lots of luck trying to find
where Windows hid it.