Master Boot Record issue


C

casey.o

My external 1TB HDD appears to have a Master boot record (MBR) issue.
This is not the first time I have run chkdsk on it, and it says the
second copy of the MBR is bad. I just bought this drive in December, so
it's not old and has had little use. It's for backups, that's all. It
has around 400GB of backup data on it. But to be safe, I just copied
everything on it to a 500Gb regular HDD. Now that the stuff is copied,
I'd like to fix this MBR issue. I know there is that FIXMBR thing on XP
install CDs, but I dont think I can access a USB device from that repair
CD command line thing. Partition Magic is showing it as bad, so I cant
use that either.

How do I fix this? Or should I just format it? (it's NTFS, because Fat
32 cant be that big). After it's fixed, I think I'll cut it in half or
thirds. 1TB seems tooo large of a partition. I can either make two
500GB partitions, or three about 333GB partitions.

Thanks
 
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P

Paul

My external 1TB HDD appears to have a Master boot record (MBR) issue.
This is not the first time I have run chkdsk on it, and it says the
second copy of the MBR is bad. I just bought this drive in December, so
it's not old and has had little use. It's for backups, that's all. It
has around 400GB of backup data on it. But to be safe, I just copied
everything on it to a 500Gb regular HDD. Now that the stuff is copied,
I'd like to fix this MBR issue. I know there is that FIXMBR thing on XP
install CDs, but I dont think I can access a USB device from that repair
CD command line thing. Partition Magic is showing it as bad, so I cant
use that either.

How do I fix this? Or should I just format it? (it's NTFS, because Fat
32 cant be that big). After it's fixed, I think I'll cut it in half or
thirds. 1TB seems tooo large of a partition. I can either make two
500GB partitions, or three about 333GB partitions.

Thanks

Did it say the second copy of $MFT was bad, or did it say MBR ?

Paul
 
C

casey.o

Did it say the second copy of $MFT was bad, or did it say MBR ?

Paul


I ran chkdsk /f again... from the command prompt.

This is the exact wording.

"Security descriptor verification completed.
The second NTFS boot sector is unwriteable".


NOTE: I question whether that virus was on this drive, I ran the killer
and maliscious program on it. Maybe that contributed to this, but this
drive did give me the same or similar notice some months ago.

I also tried to delete
System Volume Information
and
Recycler

From Linux, abnd it refused to let me do it. (or all of it, because I
think it removed some parts of it). I have done that on other drives
using linux with no problem, but those were Fat32. This was data from
the old system which became infected, so I wanted to get rid of it if
possible. Actually, I would like to entirely avoid having those files
written to removable drives anyhow. But I dont know how.
 
C

casey.o

What brand is it? If you have a Seagate/Maxtor, you can run max diag
on it and see if the drive is bad.
I assume there is a diagnostic for other brands.


It's a USB portable HDD, Toshiba brand. Its under warranty, but it
could just need a format. It works fine as far as using it, but it just
gives this error. I'm looking on the Toshiba site right now to see if
they have any software tools to run on it.

I suspect the actual drive inside the case is made by Seagate Maxtor, or
one of them.... But I'm noy sure how to find out.
 
C

casey.o

He hasn't got the operating system CD so he is stuck.

If he decides to buy a new HD and an OS CD and perhaps more ram to bring
it to about 2GB for XP and perhaps a new mobo then he would end up
paying more than the cost of the cheapest DELL machine that is far
better than what he has already got.

If he is doing all these things for the sake of learning from it then
fine otherwise a new machine is definitely the best way to go.

My 2 pence here.

What you say about the computer is true. But I do have a XP Home Cd.

Either way, this drive has nothing to do with the computer, it's an
external USB drive.
 
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J

Jeff Barnett

My external 1TB HDD appears to have a Master boot record (MBR) issue.
This is not the first time I have run chkdsk on it, and it says the
second copy of the MBR is bad. I just bought this drive in December, so
it's not old and has had little use. It's for backups, that's all. It
has around 400GB of backup data on it. But to be safe, I just copied
everything on it to a 500Gb regular HDD. Now that the stuff is copied,
I'd like to fix this MBR issue. I know there is that FIXMBR thing on XP
install CDs, but I dont think I can access a USB device from that repair
CD command line thing. Partition Magic is showing it as bad, so I cant
use that either.

How do I fix this? Or should I just format it? (it's NTFS, because Fat
32 cant be that big). After it's fixed, I think I'll cut it in half or
thirds. 1TB seems tooo large of a partition. I can either make two
500GB partitions, or three about 333GB partitions.

Thanks
Just curious, did you try to reformat the disk?

Jeff Barnett
 
G

Good Guy

Just curious, did you try to reformat the disk?


He hasn't got the operating system CD so he is stuck.

If he decides to buy a new HD and an OS CD and perhaps more ram to bring
it to about 2GB for XP and perhaps a new mobo then he would end up
paying more than the cost of the cheapest DELL machine that is far
better than what he has already got.

If he is doing all these things for the sake of learning from it then
fine otherwise a new machine is definitely the best way to go.

My 2 pence here.
 
D

darkrats

You will need to reformat the drive, if you hope to fix your MBR problem.
It's possible that it's a hardware defect, but I've seen similar errors
fixed by a reformat.

You can make the whole drive Fat32, but you'll have to format under DOS,
maybe using something like Hiren's Bootdisk. If you try to format under
Windows only NTFS will be available to you.
 
P

Paul

I ran chkdsk /f again... from the command prompt.

This is the exact wording.

"Security descriptor verification completed.
The second NTFS boot sector is unwriteable".


NOTE: I question whether that virus was on this drive, I ran the killer
and maliscious program on it. Maybe that contributed to this, but this
drive did give me the same or similar notice some months ago.

I also tried to delete
System Volume Information
and
Recycler

From Linux, abnd it refused to let me do it. (or all of it, because I
think it removed some parts of it). I have done that on other drives
using linux with no problem, but those were Fat32. This was data from
the old system which became infected, so I wanted to get rid of it if
possible. Actually, I would like to entirely avoid having those files
written to removable drives anyhow. But I dont know how.

Someone here, thinks the second NTFS boot sector is near the
end of the partition.

https://forum.acronis.com/forum/6228

And what that suggests to me, is you used Linux to resize
the partition, and the physical and virtual size of the partition
no longer match.

The physical size of the partition, is recorded in the partition table.
The MBR holds the partition information. You can view that with
PTEDIT32 in Window or with sudo fdisk /dev/sda
type of command in Linux.

Now, within the physical disk (say it has a thousand sectors),
some number of clusters are defined. Say a cluster is eight
sectors. A thousand sectors would give me room for 125 clusters.

Now, say I do something dopey. I edit the MBR contents using PTEDIT32
and "make the partition a wee bit shorter". Suddenly, the last
clusters are outside the partition.

If you resize from Linux, it resizes in two stages. The order it
does this, is a function of whether the partition is expanding or contracting.
If you need to contract a partition...

reduce virtual cluster count, move stuff out of the way
now fix up the partition table and total number of LBA sectors

If you need to expand a partition...

set the partition table, so the total number of LBA sectors is larger
increase virtual cluster count, tidy up bookkeeping in file system header
(the first 63 sectors or so perhaps).

Now, I've seen file systems damaged in both Linux and Windows.
One user had a partition, where the physical size was
twice as large as the virtual size. It was like a sloppy
pair of shoes, with a tiny foot inside the shoe. This happened
when using the Disk Management shrink function or something.
Normally, Windows never gives even a whiff or a hint, of the
two aspects of a partition.

Whereas Linux is quite explicit about this. If you use GPARTED
partition manager, and check the log later, you can see the two
steps being done (order depends on expand or contract). If you're
lucky, you might even see when your partition has been ruined
by GPARTED (for that extra comedy effect, knowing instantly
that you're screwed).

Any time you resize something, it helps to have backups. Of
course, if this is simply a backup drive, you could reformat
the partition, and the reformat will properly "expand the foot
to fill the shoe" :)

So my guess is, the end of the partition is snipped off, or
there is a size mismatch involved. You may be able to list
the particulars for the volume and figure that out (either
using Partition Magic in Windows or GPARTED or similar in
Linux).

*******

As for SVI, make sure it isn't the spaces in the folder name
that is preventing removal. In Linux from command line, it might be
done like this, with double quotes to pass the folder name
as a string.

rm -Rf "System Volume Information"

System Volume Information is used by System Restore and
it might also be used by VSS subsystem. On a modern OS,
it might still be created, even if System Restore is
turned off. *Do not* delete that folder on your C:
operating system disk. For a data only partition,
you might be able to get away with it.

HTH,
Paul
 
P

Paul

darkrats said:
You will need to reformat the drive, if you hope to fix your MBR problem.
It's possible that it's a hardware defect, but I've seen similar errors
fixed by a reformat.

You can make the whole drive Fat32, but you'll have to format under DOS,
maybe using something like Hiren's Bootdisk. If you try to format under
Windows only NTFS will be available to you.

To repair an MBR (the 64 byte primary partition table portion),
you can use TestDisk. It scans the disk for file system
headers, and recomputes what the MBR should contain.This
tool must be used with caution, because it lacks a lot
of fancy artificial intelligence to determine if the
computed result is correct. For example, when I used this
on one drive, it managed to make two partitions to overlap.
(Which would have been deadly, the next time the disk
was mounted.) So don't accept just any new value for MBR
contents - you need to examine the results yourself, by hand,
for correctness. And as a result, you don't use this
tool on a whim.

http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk_Step_By_Step

Removing all partitions and defining new ones, will also
repair the integrity of the information. But depending on
your needs, might be a bit of overkill.

Repairing the 440 byte boot section of the MBR sector is
a separate matter. And in Windows a "fixmbr" can add boot
code for the currently booting Windows OS. But then, if
that was damaged, the complaints would happen at a different
time and place.

Paul
 
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H

Hot-Text

| My external 1TB HDD appears to have a Master boot record (MBR) issue.
| This is not the first time I have run chkdsk on it, and it says the
| second copy of the MBR is bad. I just bought this drive in December, so
| it's not old and has had little use. It's for backups, that's all.

Good Idle

| It
| has around 400GB of backup data on it. But to be safe, I just copied
| everything on it to a 500Gb regular HDD. Now that the stuff is copied,
| I'd like to fix this MBR issue. I know there is that FIXMBR thing on XP
| install CDs,

Yes with the CD have tools to fix it
But you have to see USB device[Hard Drive]

| but I dont think I can access a USB device from that repair
| CD command line thing.

Yes
But have to Boot to USB device First

| Partition Magic is showing it as bad, so I cant
| use that either.
|
| How do I fix this?

What you say about the computer is true.
But I do have a XP Home Cd.
Either way,
this drive has nothing to do with the computer,
it's an external USB drive.

When Starting Your computer
You need to Boot into
Your external USB (Hard) drive

Not to the computer internal Hard Drives


| Or should I just format it?

No
That not the way to Fix it MBR
You have to fix not format

| (it's NTFS, because Fat 32 cant be that big).
| After it's fixed,
| I think I'll cut it in half or thirds.
| 1TB seems tooo large of a partition.
| I can either make two 500GB partitions,
| or three about 333GB partitions.

Do not be a fool

| Thanks
|
 

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