Load/unload count

J

Jani Ahti

I have an one year old IBM ThinkPad A31p. Its hard drive crashed about
a month ago and was replaced with a new one (Hitachi DK23FB-60B 58,6
GB).

I installed HDD Health Monitor which now reports that the Load/Unload
cycle count (S.M.A.R.T attribute) has decreased from 100 to 93 and
the nearest T.E.C (Threshold Exceeds Condition) will be reached in
8-14-2004. Should I be worried?

Jani
 
F

Folkert Rienstra

Jani Ahti said:
I have an one year old IBM ThinkPad A31p. Its hard drive crashed about
a month ago and was replaced with a new one (Hitachi DK23FB-60B 58,6 GB).

I installed HDD Health Monitor which now reports that the Load/Unload
cycle count (S.M.A.R.T attribute) has decreased from 100 to 93 and
the nearest T.E.C (Threshold Exceeds Condition) will be reached in
8-14-2004. Should I be worried?

Probably. Contact IBM.
Maybe there is a firmware problem and a firmware update to take care
of it. If not then the drive may be doing a lot more load/unloads than is
normal for the drive.
 
J

John H.

Probably. Contact IBM.
Maybe there is a firmware problem and a firmware update to take care
of it. If not then the drive may be doing a lot more load/unloads than is
normal for the drive.


I installed HDD Health Monitor and had forgotten all about it until it
started showing popups every day telling me my drive was going to fail
within days. That was about 6 months ago. My solution was to uninstall
the program - my drive is fine and passes all SMART tests. The idea that a
program can tell you the exact date that a drive will fail seems a little
silly to me.
 
R

Rod Speed

John H. said:
I installed HDD Health Monitor and had forgotten all about it until it
started showing popups every day telling me my drive was going to fail
within days. That was about 6 months ago. My solution was to uninstall
the program - my drive is fine and passes all SMART tests. The idea that a
program can tell you the exact date that a drive will fail seems a little
silly to me.

It isnt trying to tell you the exact date. Its just saying that the
chances of it failing are increased above those with a drive
that doesnt exhibit that behaviour. That is after all the whole
point of SMART, being able to monitor deterioration in drive
performance that usually indicates that the drive will fail.

No one with a clue has ever been silly enough to claim that
all failures can be anticipated, but anyone with a clue realises
that some failures certainly can be and that it makes sense
to have the drive monitor its performance to allow that.
 
F

Folkert Rienstra

John H. said:
I installed HDD Health Monitor and had forgotten all about it until it
started showing popups every day telling me my drive was going to fail
within days. That was about 6 months ago.
My solution was to uninstall the program

Aah, the 'ignorance is bliss' solution: ignore it and it just goes away.
Unfortunately that will not stop that counter counting down.
- my drive is fine and passes all SMART tests.

That's now.
Who's to tell whether it still does that on 8-14-2004 when
that counter presumably will have reached the threshold?
The idea that a program can tell you the exact date that
a drive will fail seems a little silly to me.

It is not an exact date, it's the predicted date of when the threshold
will be reached, that is calculated from the current rate of countdown
when continued in the same pace.
 
J

John H.

Aah, the 'ignorance is bliss' solution: ignore it and it just goes away.

Appears that way. Like I said, it suddenly was supposed to fail within days
and it's been 6 months already.
Unfortunately that will not stop that counter counting down.

What counter counting down? I never saw any change in my attribute values.
The 'value' readings are still all at 100 except for temp and spin-up
(higher) and CRC error rate (200). I think I rightfully concluded that in
my case Health Monitor was FOS and that nothing was wrong with the drive.
(I did do a fresh backup at the time though, just in case :))
That's now.
Who's to tell whether it still does that on 8-14-2004 when
that counter presumably will have reached the threshold?

The fail date was almost 6 months ago for me - never came to be.
It is not an exact date, it's the predicted date of when the threshold
will be reached, that is calculated from the current rate of countdown
when continued in the same pace.

I wonder what the program would do if the threshold for an attribute is 50
and the reading for it is 100 one day and 90 the next (for one or a few
readings in a row)? Nothing I would hope, or would it immediately tell me
that my drive would fail in 4 days? It *should* IMO just keep track of the
readings for a couple days before getting the user all excited unless the
countdown starts to pick up steam.

MBM5 will sometimes show my 2500 RPM fan as having a low of 0 RPM and a high
of 5000 RPM, and a voltage or two as having a low of 0 volts due to bad
readings. So maybe one or more bad readings can screw up Health Monitor too
and cause false warnings. The program should have enough smarts to throw
out nonsense readings but apparently it doesn't.


What is a 'countdown' of an attribute value counting anyway? For my drives,
Start/stop count, Power cycle count, Power-off retract count and Load/unload
cycle count all have a raw value of 30h for one drive that I updated the
firmware for I guess 48 days ago, and values of 17Fh, 17Eh, 25Ch and 25Ch
for the 2nd drive. Probably all would be 17Eh (382 decimal) for the 2nd
drive if I hadn't had it set it for auto power off after 2 hours of idle
time for a while (I only wanted that for one drive, not both, and
unfortunately you can't do it).

So if there's an extra Load/unload cycle one day for some reason (one not
due to a power cycle), what does that do to the attribute value that's
normally 100? Would it drop to 99, -1 for each extra cycle? Would it stay
at 99 forever if there's no more extra load/unload cycles, or would it be
reset back to 100 after a number of power cycles with no more problems?

Since for Jani's drive the Load/unload value went from 100 to 93, and the
program is saying the drive will fail in 9 months (which I assume means it
will reach the threshold of 50), the time it took to drop from 100 to 93
must be about 6.3 weeks (or about one extra cycle every 6.3 days) if I did
the math right. Is that the way it works? If so, what's to say the drive
can't keep working for many YEARS with an extra load/unload cycle about
every 6 days? It may never fail, or it may fail in a week.

If Jani's problem is showing up in the raw values (he didn't say), unlike me
with my screwy mother board he may have a REAL problem.
 

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