Linux STILL has Font Problems. 10 Years later?,alt.os.windows-xp,

[Moshe Goldfarb]

http://ubuntusite.com/not-satisfied-with-firefox-try-opera-for-ubuntu/

So what is it about Fonts that Linux just can't seem to get right?
How long has Linux been around and still it can't manage to look decent?

And before you Linux freaks and unwashed bearded masses start whining that
firefox isn't Linux, or Linux is the kernel, average desktop Joe doesn't
care because most of his time will be using browsers and firefox is the
best one out there for Linux.
Except for the Linux cultist's favorite browser, dildo.

 

[Stephan Rose]

http://ubuntusite.com/not-satisfied-with-firefox-try-opera-for-ubuntu/

So what is it about Fonts that Linux just can't seem to get right? How
long has Linux been around and still it can't manage to look decent?

Read up on how truetype works and you'll know what they just "can't seem
to get right". The problem is not that nobody can't get it right, getting
it right is the easy part. The problem is a legal issue.

Here is a rough description of the problem:

The problem is that Truetype uses special glyph program (part of each
font) for the hinting process. Many of these instructions in that program
can be used without an issue.

SOME of these instructions however are patented and *cannot legally* be
used by someone without a license to those patents. Linux for instance
does not have such a license.

Unfortunately, it's these patented instructions that matter the most.

Here is some more detail on the issue:

http://freetype.sourceforge.net/patents.html

Now the latest version of the freetype font rendering library does come
with it's own auto-hinting mechanism to circumvent the patent issue which
does seem to do an excellent job.

Ubuntu 6.04 fonts were decent but could use improvement.

Ubuntu 7.10 I honestly can't complain about quality, and that includes
Japanese fonts. I'm looking at my text here right now on a 1980x1200 LCD
and the font is perfectly clear and sharp.

--
Stephan
1986 Pontiac Fiero GT

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[AZ Nomad]

Read up on how truetype works and you'll know what they just "can't seem
to get right". The problem is not that nobody can't get it right, getting
it right is the easy part. The problem is a legal issue.

A bigger issue is that truetype is designed to look pretty on low resolution
screens. What you see is not what you get.

I'd rather have accurate screen fonts and I don't mind the cost of a system
less than fifteen years old. Getting 1024x768 or 1280-1024 isn't
that much of a deal any more. Unless of course you're a moron windows
advocate.

 

[Moshe Goldfarb]

A bigger issue is that truetype is designed to look pretty on low resolution
screens. What you see is not what you get.

Switch the discussion to Windows tactic noted.

I'd rather have accurate screen fonts and I don't mind the cost of a system
less than fifteen years old. Getting 1024x768 or 1280-1024 isn't
that much of a deal any more. Unless of course you're a moron windows
advocate.

Attacking Windows users noted.
For the record, fonts look fine on Windows.
Linux?
Well it depends on what you are willing to settle for and how low your
standards are.
From what I can tell, AZ Nomad, your's are pretty low.

 

[Stephan Rose]

Switch the discussion to Windows tactic noted.



Attacking Windows users noted.
For the record, fonts look fine on Windows. Linux?
Well it depends on what you are willing to settle for and how low your
standards are.

http://www.somrek.net/fonts.png

Now please tell me what's sub-standard about those fonts.

That screenshot was taken 5 minutes ago, running Ubuntu 7.10

No modifications ever made to anything regarding font rendering. Nothing
special installed, no additional fonts and no windows fonts installed.

Now please do tell me what's so wrong with the font rendering on that
screenshot...

--
Stephan
1986 Pontiac Fiero GT

å›ã®äº‹æ€ã„出ã™æ—¥ãªã‚“ã¦ãªã„ã®ã¯
å›ã®äº‹å¿˜ã‚ŒãŸã¨ããŒãªã„ã‹ã‚‰

 

[Moshe Goldfarb]

http://www.somrek.net/fonts.png

Now please tell me what's sub-standard about those fonts.

That screenshot was taken 5 minutes ago, running Ubuntu 7.10

No modifications ever made to anything regarding font rendering. Nothing
special installed, no additional fonts and no windows fonts installed.

Now please do tell me what's so wrong with the font rendering on that
screenshot...

A little thin, but not bad.
Unfortunately that's Pan, not firefox.

Read the link.

 

[Hadron]

Switch the discussion to Windows tactic noted.



Attacking Windows users noted.
For the record, fonts look fine on Windows.
Linux?
Well it depends on what you are willing to settle for and how low your
standards are.
From what I can tell, AZ Nomad, your's are pretty low.

Fonts look fine on my Debian Gnome desktop too. In fact much better than
XP.

Don't ask me what I did to get it so - I simply can't remember. It
seemed that I was going nuts at one point with font caches and Xorg
files and drivers and kerning parameters.

How long it will last is anyones guess.

 

[Moshe Goldfarb]

Fonts look fine on my Debian Gnome desktop too. In fact much better than
XP.

Don't ask me what I did to get it so - I simply can't remember. It
seemed that I was going nuts at one point with font caches and Xorg
files and drivers and kerning parameters.

How long it will last is anyones guess.

It depends upon the application and the distribution which is my point.
IOW there is no consistency with Linux.

PCLinuxOS looks great in default mode.
Ubuntu IMHO looks terrible depending upon the application.
Firefox in particular looks awful which was the point of the OP.

 

[bob]

http://ubuntusite.com/not-satisfied-with-firefox-try-opera-for-ubuntu/

So what is it about Fonts that Linux just can't seem to get right? How
long has Linux been around and still it can't manage to look decent?

And before you Linux freaks and unwashed bearded masses start whining
that firefox isn't Linux, or Linux is the kernel, average desktop Joe
doesn't care because most of his time will be using browsers and firefox
is the best one out there for Linux.
Except for the Linux cultist's favorite browser, dildo.

go away troll

 

[Chris Game]

Now please do tell me what's so wrong with the font rendering on
that screenshot...

They look blurry...?

 

[Peter Köhlmann]

They look blurry...?

Actually, no, they don't.

View it at 100%, not in that small window

 

[AZ Nomad]

Now please tell me what's sub-standard about those fonts.

That screenshot was taken 5 minutes ago, running Ubuntu 7.10

No modifications ever made to anything regarding font rendering. Nothing
special installed, no additional fonts and no windows fonts installed.

Now please do tell me what's so wrong with the font rendering on that
screenshot...

How about using a decent screenshot, one that gets every single pixel
without compression or resizing?

 

[Stephan Rose]

How about using a decent screenshot, one that gets every single pixel
without compression or resizing?

I can't tell what resolution you or someone else is using. If I use a
smaller screenshot it may still be too large for you to fit.

Internet explorer though does have the ability to display a screenshot at
1:1 resolution with scrollbars if necessary.

--
Stephan
1986 Pontiac Fiero GT

å›ã®äº‹æ€ã„出ã™æ—¥ãªã‚“ã¦ãªã„ã®ã¯
å›ã®äº‹å¿˜ã‚ŒãŸã¨ããŒãªã„ã‹ã‚‰

 

[Stephan Rose]

A little thin, but not bad.
Unfortunately that's Pan, not firefox.

Read the link.

Font rendering is generally global to the operating system so it normally
doesn't really matter what application. Though fair enough, here is a
firefox screenshot on msn.com

http://www.somrek.net/firefox.png

--
Stephan
1986 Pontiac Fiero GT

å›ã®äº‹æ€ã„出ã™æ—¥ãªã‚“ã¦ãªã„ã®ã¯
å›ã®äº‹å¿˜ã‚ŒãŸã¨ããŒãªã„ã‹ã‚‰

 

[Stephan Rose]

They look blurry...?

Check your zoom, it's a 1920x1200 screenshot so you may be zoomed out by
default when viewing it.

--
Stephan
1986 Pontiac Fiero GT

å›ã®äº‹æ€ã„出ã™æ—¥ãªã‚“ã¦ãªã„ã®ã¯
å›ã®äº‹å¿˜ã‚ŒãŸã¨ããŒãªã„ã‹ã‚‰

 

[thad05]

http://ubuntusite.com/not-satisfied-with-firefox-try-opera-for-ubuntu/

So what is it about Fonts that Linux just can't seem to get right?
How long has Linux been around and still it can't manage to look decent?

What is it about wintrolls that they continue to spew such idiocy
when anyone can easily run Linux for themselves and see that your
claims are a load of crap. I use Ubuntu and Fedora/RedHat and
fonts have looked fine in both for years now. I recommend you
find something real to criticize if want any chance of having
credibility.

Thad

 

[AZ Nomad]

I can't tell what resolution you or someone else is using. If I use a
smaller screenshot it may still be too large for you to fit.

Internet explorer though does have the ability to display a screenshot at
1:1 resolution with scrollbars if necessary.

I tried internet explorer and it still looked like shit. However, I have
internet explorer 6 installed in crossover office and it didn't seem to
have a 1:1 option. No matter. I saved it off and viewed it in gimp.

They look fine to me. Don't see what all the fuss is about.
The trolls really need to get some new material.

 

[Hadron]

Font rendering is generally global to the operating system so it normally
doesn't really matter what application. Though fair enough, here is a
firefox screenshot on msn.com

http://www.somrek.net/firefox.png

I can only go by own findings and that is my Debian desktop is *much*
nicer than my XP one. I really can not remember which particular tweak
got it there or, to be honest, if any were really required at the last
install following Ubuntu giving up the ghost due to f***ing DBUS
issues. In the past such tweaks were a necessity and often simply didn't
work. Even Emacs 23 looks great now.

,----
| (require 'color-theme)
| (set-default-font "-adobe-courier-medium-r-normal-*-*-100-*-*-m-*-iso8859-1")
| (color-theme-initialize)
| (color-theme-classic)

See for yourself here:

http://imgplace.com/image/view/69131991b1306200d820e1d82ebb6ab3

 

[7]

Micoshaft Corporation's Fraudster and Asstroturfer Moshe Goldfarb wrote on
behalf of Micoshaft Corporation:

http://ubuntusite.com/not-satisfied-with-firefox-try-opera-for-ubuntu/

So what is it about Fonts that Linux just can't seem to get right?
How long has Linux been around and still it can't manage to look decent?

And before you Linux freaks and unwashed bearded masses start whining that
firefox isn't Linux, or Linux is the kernel, average desktop Joe doesn't
care because most of his time will be using browsers and firefox is the
best one out there for Linux.
Except for the Linux cultist's favorite browser, dildo.

Unfortunately for windummies, the issue of crap micoshaft fonts is
forever haunting them.
They are nowhere near as good and open source.
You can run distros side by side in virtual PCs say with qemu
and see it kill PISTA in no time at all.

In the mean time Linux is selling 3 million Embedded Linux
gadgets PER DAY and the rate is increasing.

Linux is free to download, copy and install on as many PCs as you
want. Unfortunately Micoshaft PISTA with DRM ridden crapola
and phone home software, you would get sued by the likes of BSA
if you tried that.

Linux is free with source code to learn and modify to
heart's content. See www.youtube.com and search for Linux,
beryl and compiz to see how more your PC could be doing
for you.

http://www.livecdlist.com
http://www.distrowatch.com

 

[Moshe Goldfarb]

Micoshaft Corporation's Fraudster and Asstroturfer Moshe Goldfarb wrote on
behalf of Micoshaft Corporation:



Unfortunately for windummies, the issue of crap micoshaft fonts is
forever haunting them.
They are nowhere near as good and open source.
You can run distros side by side in virtual PCs say with qemu
and see it kill PISTA in no time at all.

In the mean time Linux is selling 3 million Embedded Linux
gadgets PER DAY and the rate is increasing.

Linux is free to download, copy and install on as many PCs as you
want. Unfortunately Micoshaft PISTA with DRM ridden crapola
and phone home software, you would get sued by the likes of BSA
if you tried that.

Linux is free with source code to learn and modify to
heart's content. See www.youtube.com and search for Linux,
beryl and compiz to see how more your PC could be doing
for you.

http://www.livecdlist.com
http://www.distrowatch.com

Linux advocacy at it's finest!