LF: text editor with 2 "panels" for text

[Wishmaster]

I have worked with UNIX (Solaris, BSD) and use Linux.
My editor, in UNIX, is Vi/Vim. I think I will stick to 2 Vim windows...

GREAT! I just found that Vim window can be split vertically in 2:

http://hajek.stat.ubc.ca/~webmaste/howto/editor/gvim.html
" ctrl+w+v --- to split the current window vertically "

 

[Bernd Schmitt]

Hello John,

If you love Unix, command line operation etc. etc.

No it is for people which are too lazy to remember things. If I do not
know how a command is named, I can use autocompletion. For example I

Guess you are using a different Emacs to me. The "buffer" system is a
MAJOR annoyance. Guess the coders haven't used MDIs ?

Emacs can be used in terminal mode, too. The buffer system is suitable
there. To see a list of buffers, you can click the menu-entry *or* you

Or cannot understand them maybe ?

Using emacs for some time, you will understand (especially when you code
in emacs).

"Usability" with Emacs is last on it's list
of qualities. Capability is top on the list.

Not at all. Emacs is fully documented in its help. It includes a
tutorial in many languages as well. The only keystroke one has to
remember is esc-x in order to start autocompletion. The most important
command is apropos. If a command has a key-binding, the key-binding is
shown each time the command is invoked (and it is displayed in the
menu-bar as well).

Only good IF one wants to
remember a great many "commands" to get even the most minor things
done.

You do not neeed to remember them. Emacs has autocompletion. Emacs
offers apropos for searching. Emacs gives you a menu. Emacs gives you
key-bindings. That is by far more than any other editor.

Having to "jump through hoops" to get things done is not my idea
of fun. :-(

Loosing data because of no autosave is not fun.
Having
unlimited undo, split screens, autosave, syntax-highlightning,
paranthesis matching, online help for lots of programming languages,
(reverse) incremental and pattern search, configurable auto indent,
front end for version controll systems, front end for command line
debuggers, front end for command line compilers, front end for command
line interpreters, man page reader even on windows and a lot of special
commands ...
makes life much easier.

Ciao,
Bernd

 

[John Fitzsimons]

On Tue, 26 Jul 2005 07:18:58 +0200, Bernd Schmitt

Hi Bernd,

John Fitzsimons wrote:

No it is for people which are too lazy to remember things.

IF that were the case then it would be the perfect program for me. Not
that I am lazy, just that I would have just about the worst memory of
anyone here. That is a situation I have to live with. So "remembering"
syntax is a major problem for me.

If I do not
know how a command is named, I can use autocompletion. For example I
type tcl-<tab> to see all commands available for tcl-mode.

One needs however to remember the syntax to get a list of the syntax !
Forget the former and you don't get the latter. With normal windows
programs there is little to remember. One can search through the menu
system.

Emacs can be used in terminal mode, too. The buffer system is suitable
there. To see a list of buffers, you can click the menu-entry *or* you
can type buffer-<tab> to see a list of commands, or apropos buffer to
see a list of commands.

I don't want to see a list of buffers. I don't want to use a command
line for the most basic of operations. I would like to see Emacs as
user friendly as most other windows editors.

Using emacs for some time, you will understand (especially when you code
in emacs).

If I have a choice to remember a whole list of commands or simply
click a menu item then my preference will be the latter in almost all
cases.

Not at all. Emacs is fully documented in its help. It includes a
tutorial in many languages as well. The only keystroke one has to
remember is esc-x in order to start autocompletion. The most important
command is apropos. If a command has a key-binding, the key-binding is
shown each time the command is invoked (and it is displayed in the
menu-bar as well).

Isn't key binding just saying "keyboard shortcuts" ? If so then why
not use a term that windows users are familiar with ? Also, when using
a normal text editor I don't need to know what a "Major Mode" etc.
etc. is.

You do not neeed to remember them. Emacs has autocompletion.

Well, I was thinking of reading up on that but unlike normal editors
there is no "search" facility in the (Barry's) Emacs I checked. Even
Notepad has that.

I find web "help" far more tedious to use than windows help generally.
Add a whole pile of complicated terms/methods and the "help" becomes
almost useless. In any help system one must know what one is looking
for to do so efficiently and effectively.

I wonder for example how many people here know what "The Mark and the
Region" means ? Or even want to know.

Emacs
offers apropos for searching. Emacs gives you a menu. Emacs gives you
key-bindings. That is by far more than any other editor.

I didn't say Emacs wasn't capable. It is. IF one wants to spend a year
or two learning programming first.

man page reader even on windows and a lot of special
commands ...
makes life much easier.

Sure. IF you are a programmer. How many ordinary windows users would
even know what a "man page reader" is ?

Regards, John.
--
****************************************************
,-._|\ (A.C.F FAQ) http://clients.net2000.com.au/~johnf/faq.html
/ Oz \ John Fitzsimons - Melbourne, Australia.
\_,--.x/ http://www.vicnet.net.au/~johnf/welcome.htm
v http://clients.net2000.com.au/~johnf/

 

[Richard Steinfeld]

Settings --> Program Settings --> Editor --> Position of Right Edge

Set that to the number of characters the wrap boundary should be, then
toggle wrap with Ctrl-W.

Doing that causes it to wrap while typing for me.

Hey, Charlie,

Thanks so much for this reality check. I've just spent 1 1/2 hours
futzing with this program and I made it work. The word wrap command
wouldn't work nohow, so I searched out the program's user group and
found my answer there, although not well-explained by the participants.
The answer lurked in the control file (PSPAD.INI), where I was able to
set the appropriate switches. The program was now defaulted to wrap=on,
and at long last, the word wrap button was added to the menu bar. It has
now become my favorite (I hope).

And what an _awesome_ program this is!!!
The features and menus go on and on and on.
So, what did I discover today -- dig it; this is totally mind-boggling:
I mean, can you picture the expression on my face when I stumbled upon
the ability to translate Morse code into characters? And, of course, the
ability to translate characters into Morse!

Unreal.
Just unreal.

Anyone reading this, ya gotta try this program!

Richard

 

[CharlieDontSurf]

The program was now defaulted to wrap=on,

and at long last, the word wrap button was added to the menu bar. It has
now become my favorite (I hope).

And what an _awesome_ program this is!!!

Hey Richard, I'm really glad you got it working. PSPad is indeed a fine
text editor, I like it a lot. But it's not enough to entice me away from
my favorite of many years, Notetab Standard (Notetab Light is the
freeware version - http://www.notetab.com/ntl.php - Special no-install
version made for tinyapps.org -
http://www.fookes.com/ftp/free/tiny_notetab.zip)

 

[Bernd.Schmitt.News]

Hi John,

IF that were the case then it would be the perfect program for me. Not
that I am lazy, just that I would have just about the worst memory of
anyone here. That is a situation I have to live with. So "remembering"
syntax is a major problem for me.

so, then remembering only how things work is easier then to remember
details isn't it? so only one thing to remember: esc-x <start typing,

One needs however to remember the syntax to get a list of the syntax !

No and yes. If you are using emacs, you need to know 2 things besides
the menu&button-clicking:
1) esc-x will give you a prompt with autocompleting <tab>
2> esc-x apropos gives you help about anything

Really, I think, *this* is not too much to learn, if you get a
powerfull editor like emacs. In other editors you will have to learn
where all the commands are in the menu-tree.

Forget the former and you don't get the latter. With normal windows
programs there is little to remember. One can search through the menu
system.

One *has* to search through the menu system. Emacs gives you the
choice.
1) menu
2) buttons
3) esc-x command with autocompletion, which is much faster then
menu-labyrinths.
4) key-binding or as you want it to be named "keyboard-shortcuts"

I don't want to see a list of buffers. I don't want to use a command
line for the most basic of operations. I would like to see Emacs as
user friendly as most other windows editors.

As I said multiple times before. There is a menu, you can use it. You
will even find there a lot of commands you won't find in any other
editor (maybe vi, but you do not really want to call that one
userfriendly).

If I have a choice to remember a whole list of commands or simply
click a menu item then my preference will be the latter in almost all
cases.

And another time, so you can remember: Emacs has menues, a lot of
menues, you are allowed to use them. There are buttons as well, you are
allowed to use them as well. They *may* have another structure than you
are used to, but it is the same as with word<->openoffice.org or with

Isn't key binding just saying "keyboard shortcuts" ? If so then why
not use a term that windows users are familiar with ?

Why are you using a space befor "?"? I am used to use no space before
"?".
No, kidding.
The reason is: Emacs is much older than windows. From
http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki?EmacsHistory
"The users at the AI Lab Large soon accumulated a collection of custom
macros, TECO programs that could be launched from within the display
editing mode. In 1976, Stallman wrote the first Emacs ("Editor
MACroS"), which organized these macros into a single command set and
added facilities for extension and self-documentation. TecoEmacs soon
became the standard editor on ITS."

Also, when using
a normal text editor I don't need to know what a "Major Mode" etc.
etc. is.

Because you do not have any. You do not have to care about major modes,
too but you can, if you want to use things which are not possible this
easy in other editors.

Did I mention, that emacs has menues, buttons, etc. Is there need to
repeat it another time? You really have ever used emacs? You did not
see the menus nor the buttons? I doubt.

Well, I was thinking of reading up on that but unlike normal editors
there is no "search" facility in the (Barry's) Emacs I checked. Even
Notepad has that.

Now you are really kidding.
How many different search functions do you need?
There are 14 different search&replace commands available via menu.

I find web "help" far more tedious to use than windows help generally.
Add a whole pile of complicated terms/methods and the "help" becomes
almost useless. In any help system one must know what one is looking
for to do so efficiently and effectively.
I wonder for example how many people here know what "The Mark and the
Region" means ? Or even want to know.

I wonder how many people know what is a mouse, a cursor, a button, an
icon ... or even want to know. There are people who do not want to use
computers at all.
These terms are not too complicated. Driving a different car could mean
that some knobs have different color.

I didn't say Emacs wasn't capable. It is. IF one wants to spend a year
or two learning programming first.

Oh please stop this cut and dried opinions. If reading is not a
problem, you need 15 minutes for the basics (tutorial in many different
languages), some time to get used to the system and that is all.
If you did not took 15 minutes, don't talk about a year!

Sure. IF you are a programmer. How many ordinary windows users would
even know what a "man page reader" is ?

Yes, sure. Most windows user think that there is only Word, IE,
Outlook, Microsoft ... but there are still some clever ones (maybe they
all switched to linux/bsd SCNR).


Being able to use computers more efficient often means working more
efficient. So I don't want to push anybody, I just correct your false
informations.


Ciao,
Bernd

 

[Bernd Schmitt]

(e-mail address removed) maybe was quite a bit to offensive:

And another time, so you can remember: Emacs has menues ...

Why are you using a space befor "?"? I am used to use no space before
"?". ...

Is there need to repeat it another time? ...

Oh please stop this cut and dried opinions. If reading is not a
problem, ...

I just correct your false informations.

sorry,
Bernd

 

[jack horsfield]

Well, I was thinking of reading up on that but unlike normal editors
there is no "search" facility in the (Barry's) Emacs I checked. Even
Notepad has that.

??? what about the menu option Edit/Find.

and on the toolbars (if the Search toolbar is not shown, go to
View/Toolbars and then select Search.

jack
an intellectual carrot...the mind boggles!