LCD tech maturing ?

[kony]

I have no idea unless there is something about OLED that they aren't telling
us.

OLED is already in use on some cellphones and camera displays so it does
work.

OLED manufacturing can be done with an "inkjet printer" type technology, so
it should be pretty cheap.

Doesn't matter in the near future, any new techology is
typically having high market-entry price. Someday they may
be cheaper but today we look for monitors...

 

[DevilsPGD]

In message <[email protected]> "recursor"

<SNIP>
Must have drunk too much recently, I seem to have developed double vision
Good post though, oled currently only good for small screens, the new Samsung fab is for 24" +
(up to 50" ish) TFT's I believe. (if anyone from Samsung is reading I'll take any spare 48" screens
of your hands whenever you like)

Seconded. Hell, I won't even complain about a few dead pixels

 

[recursor]

In message <[email protected]> "recursor"


Seconded. Hell, I won't even complain about a few dead pixels

Yup, wouldn't a 4000 * 3200 desktop be nice, I'd have to get a bigger desk though.

 

[DevilsPGD]

In message <[email protected]> "recursor"

Yup, wouldn't a 4000 * 3200 desktop be nice, I'd have to get a bigger desk though.

I'd mount it on the wall behind my desk

 

[shawn]

| OLED is currently good for **Simple** portable displays. Not the kind of
| thing you would want to watch a DVD on AFAICT ...
|
| http://komar.cs.stthomas.edu/qm425/01s/Tollefsrud2.htm

Whether OLED will replace LCD or something else will, LCD as currently
employed is a relatively weak technology IMHO. When any technology
overall isn't as good as what it claims to be replacing, it's
definitely not an acceptable stopping place. I think any valid excuse
to get rid of it is going to be jumped on, kicking and screaming of
LCD manufacturers notwithstanding.

I'm sure the LCD manufacturers would be one of the first to switch if
it looked like another technology was ready to replace LCD technology.
It's just a question of when the next technology (OLED or something
else) is going to be ready for wide scale use in larger
implementations (TV/monitor).

 

[Gama Chameleon]

Well I don't know where samsung announced this. Apart from the comment on
the news site you linked to there is no mention of this on Samsung's own
website, or any of their press releases or own news items.

Until it is clearly stated by Samsung themselves, I wouldn't go buying an
LCD assuming this policy to be in force.

Last I read it was for Asia only anyway and not announced though the
rest of the world.

 

[Gama Chameleon]

In message <[email protected]> "recursor"


Seconded. Hell, I won't even complain about a few dead pixels

Heh at that size display a dead pixel will probably be the size of a
golf ball

 

[Gama Chameleon]

Now they just need to sort out the reaction times.

9ms is pretty good. I'd be more interested in a proper gaumt. I think
there are only one or two that say they can produce a proper colour
gaumy (Probably LaCie). Black is still ususally dark grey.

 

[Ian Stirling]

Nothing less than a complete zero dead pixel policy will do.

I know I'd be quite happy with the chance to pay less for a non-zero dead
pixel display.

 

[Gama Chameleon]

I know I'd be quite happy with the chance to pay less for a non-zero dead
pixel display.

<Billy Conoly>
I want a zero defect pixel display now, garuanteed with no
defects....ever. Aat a price where there is no way in hell you can
make a profit let alone invest in improvement of displays. I want it
with a perfect gamut that would put a CRT to shame, I want a 3 ms
response time and I want it at least 36" display. I also want it
smaller and lighter than my previous 17" display. I want 7.1 surround
sound, but I want all the speakers built into the display, but I don't
want a large bevel round the view area. And I want it yesterday by
overnight Saturday delivery.

And pay attention because I may just change my mind and change it for
an SED display.
</B C>

 

[Noozer]

I want a zero defect pixel display now, garuanteed with no

defects....ever. Aat a price where there is no way in hell you can
make a profit let alone invest in improvement of displays. I want it
with a perfect gamut that would put a CRT to shame, I want a 3 ms
response time and I want it at least 36" display. I also want it
smaller and lighter than my previous 17" display. I want 7.1 surround
sound, but I want all the speakers built into the display, but I don't
want a large bevel round the view area. And I want it yesterday by
overnight Saturday delivery.

They can ship truckloads of eggs hundreds of miles without having to sell
broken eggs to consumers.

They can make LCD panels with no dead pixels if they wanted to.

Until I can be guaranteed that I won't have dead/stuck pixels I'm sticking
to my CRT.

 

[Gama Chameleon]

They can ship truckloads of eggs hundreds of miles without having to sell
broken eggs to consumers.

Erm they still turn up broken on occasions. Its just that to throw
away an egg box is considerably more cost effective than scrapping LCD
pannels.

They can make LCD panels with no dead pixels if they wanted to.

Yep they do. They are called class I pannels.

Until I can be guaranteed that I won't have dead/stuck pixels I'm sticking
to my CRT.

In that case pay the extra for a class I pannel and don't buy a Class
II. Look at consumer LCD TVs compared to monitors. The pannels cost an
extra 10 to 20% but gaurantee zero defects. Do you complain that a 50
quid 17" monitor is not as good as a Lacie Diamond Blue 22" calibrated
screen?

Its still not a perfect science. The bit in the above that is probably
pertinent to what you say is that yes they can do it and they do, but
if you want rock bottom prices you have to accept that you ain't going
to get perfect quality every time .

A better comparison than eggs would be sound cards. I presume that you
wouldn't complain that a £5 sound card does not have the same signal
to noise ratio as an Audigy ZS? After all you are paying a premium on
the ZS for much superiod DACs and support components but is that fair?
Same goes with LCDs. You buy the cheaper altenative and you get the
chance of a Class II being in spec but not acceptable to you.

 

[Ian Stirling]

They can ship truckloads of eggs hundreds of miles without having to sell
broken eggs to consumers.

Consider that if you have a similar number of broken eggs to dead pixels,
you'd have one broken egg every 20 or so trucks.

 

[Noozer]

Erm they still turn up broken on occasions. Its just that to throw
away an egg box is considerably more cost effective than scrapping LCD
pannels.


Yep they do. They are called class I pannels.

And I don't see that mentioned in any of the specs that I can find, nor in
any of the guarantee's that I read.

 

[Gama Chameleon]

And I don't see that mentioned in any of the specs that I can find, nor in
any of the guarantee's that I read.

I'll have a look at the back of the TFTs here. I would have thought it
woudl be somewhere in the small print else they would have to conform
to Class I. Also worth cheking the text that is usually part of the
back of the display.


Have a look on Toms Hardware there are details there on the
differences between Class I and Class II monitors. Its ISO standard
13406-2

Qucik google gives:

http://graphics.tomshardware.com/display/20030319/lcd_pixels-06.html

This covers ISO standards for classes I to IV and the pixel fault type
codes.

What you have to remember is that people want these displays dirt
cheap and now. They are expensive to produce and at the same time
companies are having to retool to improve the quality.

If we only had class I displays I would not be supprised if a good 30%
price increase as the quality control would have to be higher and alot
of Class II pannels would have to be scrapped during production. As it
its IIRC quite a few get scrapped anyway. You also have to take into
account that pixels can fail though the display life so they would
have to also factor in these being scrapped at a later date if its not
just an address failing. As it is dead pixels rates are falling more
rapidly as companies re tool, but its still far from perfect.

 

[Noozer]

I'll have a look at the back of the TFTs here. I would have thought it
woudl be somewhere in the small print else they would have to conform
to Class I. Also worth cheking the text that is usually part of the
back of the display.

Kinda hard to look at the bad of a display on a website.

 

[DevilsPGD]

Until I can be guaranteed that I won't have dead/stuck pixels I'm sticking
to my CRT.

I've had a zero dead pixel policy on every LCD I've ever bought.

Specifically, if there were any dead pixels, I'd have simply returned
the product.

 

[DevilsPGD]

In message <[email protected]> Ian

Consider that if you have a similar number of broken eggs to dead pixels,
you'd have one broken egg every 20 or so trucks.

The difference isn't whether or not eggs get broken vs LCDs get broken,
it's that the grocery store doesn't try to sell you 12 eggs if one or
more are broken.

They'll either discount it at the till or get you a full dozen.

 

[kony]

They can ship truckloads of eggs hundreds of miles without having to sell
broken eggs to consumers.

They can make LCD panels with no dead pixels if they wanted to.

Until I can be guaranteed that I won't have dead/stuck pixels I'm sticking
to my CRT.

Can they make them with no dead pixels or is it rather a
matter of rejecting any panels with them, or diverting them
to other models/products/grey-market/whatever?

Seems like only selling product with no dead pixels will
raise the price. If you're willing to pay the difference
then certainly you deserve one with no dead pixels, but if
you just want to pay lowest price for best (all-around)
specs?

 

[Noozer]

Can they make them with no dead pixels or is it rather a
matter of rejecting any panels with them, or diverting them
to other models/products/grey-market/whatever?

Seems like only selling product with no dead pixels will
raise the price. If you're willing to pay the difference
then certainly you deserve one with no dead pixels, but if
you just want to pay lowest price for best (all-around)
specs?

Except that the crappy cheap panels drive the decent quality panels out of
the market, making them harder to find and even MORE expensive.