JAVA Fork to C#?

[E2CMonkeyBoy]

Quick Intro: was thumbing through a book on Programming Windows in C#
and was wondering if I shouldnt fork my developement: I've written a
program in windows script, and now a more robust version in Java
(using eclipse). I've hit the wall - in that the UI portions of
eclipse are still manual - as VE (visual editor) is now 2 versions out
of date (and I subsequently can't get it to work - where it used to on
my code).

So I picked up a C# book and downloaded the MS Express C# and was
smitten by the ease of which I was able to implement some of the
functionality. I used to do MS Studio 6.0 and MFC but I can not for
the life of me see any reference to it (MFC) on the MS website - I
don't know what the official UI "foundation classes" are - there are
so many - is it Windows Forms? Or .Net or - anyhow - the meat of the
matter is:

Do you recommend C# for development (specifically for the windows
platform) or is good ol' C++ and "X" (X was MFC now its? - what does
the Word 2007 UI use?) I was relying heavily on Java to do heavy
lifting in data base areas, Regular expressions and the like. I was
smitten with Java+SWT but find Eclipse/SWT is developing at a snails
pace. I read the intro to a "Charles Petzold Programming Windows C#"
book at the book store and C# seems like a "better" java and "easier" C
++. I'd rather "fork" my project now that wait till I sit back and
admire a complete project and find that C# might have been the better
answer.

Wish list: A level of abstraction like Java (C#?), with the power to
create a snazzy program with MS Office 2007 UI elements. I'm willing
to brush up on C++ do do the work if need be - I'm just so confused
with what "windows" is programmed in these days. MFC was so hard at
first but powerful. I've seen windows forms, windows PFC, wxWidnows
and a myriad of other things referenced on the net. My audience
(should I get the gumption to release the program) will be mainly
windows. I don't plan on porting it to anything.

Be kind - I graduated from Comp SCI from USC when SOAP was what I took
a shower with and I drank JAVA to study on - and ... Al Gore was JUST
creating the internet... he hem. (1994) Thank your very much for your
time.

-Dave

P.S. (don't bring up Standford in your response....I'm still cross)
Oregon did well - they deserved the win!

 

[Chris Shepherd]

Quick Intro: was thumbing through a book on Programming Windows in C#
and was wondering if I shouldnt fork my developement: I've written a
program in windows script, and now a more robust version in Java
(using eclipse). I've hit the wall - in that the UI portions of
eclipse are still manual - as VE (visual editor) is now 2 versions out
of date (and I subsequently can't get it to work - where it used to on
my code).

Why not use NetBeans?
I'm all for switching to C# when it makes sense, but taking an existing
application and porting it to a new language generally involves
rewriting all of it.

I'm guessing that you aren't doing this for an organization, and it's
purely for your own use. If that's the case, it's definitely a good
thing to learn from if that's where your interest lies.

Honestly though, it seems like you have the perception that C# > Java,
and in some cases it is, and in others it isn't. Just like most other
languages. It all depends on your use really. For GUI apps .NET works
pretty well.

Do you recommend C# for development (specifically for the windows
platform) or is good ol' C++ and "X" (X was MFC now its? - what does
the Word 2007 UI use?) I was relying heavily on Java to do heavy
lifting in data base areas, Regular expressions and the like. I was
smitten with Java+SWT but find Eclipse/SWT is developing at a snails
pace. I read the intro to a "Charles Petzold Programming Windows C#"
book at the book store and C# seems like a "better" java and "easier" C
++. I'd rather "fork" my project now that wait till I sit back and
admire a complete project and find that C# might have been the better
answer.

I don't really think there's often a "better answer" and language like
that is probably going to start a flamewar in most places.
Use whatever works for you. If you think C# will do all that you need to
better than Java, then why not give it a go and see for yourself?
Posting here is going to get you responses from a lot of people who have
probably not done a whole lot of work in both languages (given this is a
topical group).

Wish list: A level of abstraction like Java (C#?), with the power to
create a snazzy program with MS Office 2007 UI elements. I'm willing

What do you mean by "level of abstraction" exactly? Specifically, what
do you see Java doing that does a great job of abstracting, and compared
to what languages?

The snazzy UI elements are certainly there - ish. My one complaint with
..NET is the lack of consistency to the features in the controls. For
instance, in a DataGridView you have control over the column header
automatic sizing, but in a ListView in Details mode you don't. It seems
counterintuitive to me. There are specific little things like that which
I have to deal with daily. On the flipside, there weren't as many of
these kinds of consistency things, but rather more focus on optimizing
for speed because Swing isn't that fantastic on the speed.
Granted, I'm working on a fairly large application for the most part.

and a myriad of other things referenced on the net. My audience
(should I get the gumption to release the program) will be mainly
windows. I don't plan on porting it to anything.

Then certainly the main feature of Java (run anywhere there's a JVM,
which is basically everywhere) becomes useless to you.

Chris.

 

[=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?=]

Quick Intro: was thumbing through a book on Programming Windows in C#
and was wondering if I shouldnt fork my developement: I've written a
program in windows script, and now a more robust version in Java
(using eclipse). I've hit the wall - in that the UI portions of
eclipse are still manual - as VE (visual editor) is now 2 versions out
of date (and I subsequently can't get it to work - where it used to on
my code).

I think it is only 1 version behind.

And the following unofficial port is said to work:
http://www.ehecht.com/eclipse_ve/ve.html

So I picked up a C# book and downloaded the MS Express C# and was
smitten by the ease of which I was able to implement some of the
functionality. I used to do MS Studio 6.0 and MFC but I can not for
the life of me see any reference to it (MFC) on the MS website - I
don't know what the official UI "foundation classes" are - there are
so many - is it Windows Forms? Or .Net or - anyhow - the meat of the
matter is:

Windows Forms or WPF.

Do you recommend C# for development (specifically for the windows
platform) or is good ol' C++ and "X" (X was MFC now its? - what does
the Word 2007 UI use?) I was relying heavily on Java to do heavy
lifting in data base areas, Regular expressions and the like. I was
smitten with Java+SWT but find Eclipse/SWT is developing at a snails
pace. I read the intro to a "Charles Petzold Programming Windows C#"
book at the book store and C# seems like a "better" java and "easier" C
++. I'd rather "fork" my project now that wait till I sit back and
admire a complete project and find that C# might have been the better
answer.

Almost anything is better than traditional X or Win32 GUI programming.

Wish list: A level of abstraction like Java (C#?), with the power to
create a snazzy program with MS Office 2007 UI elements. I'm willing
to brush up on C++ do do the work if need be - I'm just so confused
with what "windows" is programmed in these days. MFC was so hard at
first but powerful. I've seen windows forms, windows PFC, wxWidnows
and a myriad of other things referenced on the net. My audience
(should I get the gumption to release the program) will be mainly
windows. I don't plan on porting it to anything.

You can stick with Java or you can go for C# and .NET.

Depends on what you prefer (and to some extent how far you are
with the project).

Arne

 

[=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?=]

I'm all for switching to C# when it makes sense, but taking an existing
application and porting it to a new language generally involves
rewriting all of it.

It is often very easy to port Java to C#.

But SWT to Win Forms or WPF will be a rewrite from scratch.

Arne

 

[Samuel R. Neff]

If converting the whole project is not an option, then you can use
IKVM to convert the java bytecode for the business logic / data stuff
to .NET and then only rewrite the UI stuff.

Then you can gradually move the rest over to .NET as time allows.

http://www.ikvm.net/

IKVM is very impressive and works great for middleware/backend stuff
(not designed for UI).

HTH,

Sam

 

[E2CMonkeyBoy]

Thanks you all for your comments.

1. The "level of abstraction" was to indicate that it feels nice to
say "JPanel().add(new Button("Press ME"))" than say - the 20 or so
lines of MFC code...
or any number of other Object manipulations inside Java I use (which
I'm sure exists in C#)

2. No flame war - please - I used to like Assembly Language (when I
programmed MFC code) so - don't go there!

3. Lastly the project I have is nowhere near complete. I must confess
that it is usable and saves me HOURS and HOURS of time but I do want
to press forward and C# seems to be the answer - I suppose I'm just so
OUT OF THE LOOP on all this stuff that I want a warm a fuzzy that C#
will do all that I want before "wasting" my time and realizing that VC+
+ might have been the better choice (and hunker down and learn to do
things....manually again). Again "manually" as in malloc(ing) and
newing and deleting and - Message mapping and - you get the idea?

4. The one thing I did use to like about MFC and VC++ was that it
produced AN executable that almost all windows could run - but alas -
even my old MFC program wouldn't run recently (after dusting off the
cobwebs on it) and had to download some old MFC DLL's off the net to
get it to turn over the engine again..(on XP). it was the 4.2 verisons
and I see MFC 8.0's running around. I just don't see that many folks
talking about it anymore... mostly folks talk about WPF and Forms....

5. Thanks for your pointers - as right now - I'm rudderless and
staring at all of this with "deer in the headlights."

-Dave