How can anything be this bad?

[Nogginsaked]

I open an Excel spreadsheet stored on one Vista machine on a second.
I cannot save the document because first it says it is read only (the
original is NOT read only).
I can not save the document back on the first machine with a different name
(e.g. vista sucks) because it says I do not have permission. However the
sharing on the first machine says I have full privileges for opening and
saving.
What a piece of crap this OS is. There is no reason for needlessly
complicating simple peer to peer networking with this layer of useless
non-security crud. It is obvious why businesses will not use the abomination
that is Vista.
I went through all the permission crap last week and it all worked fine.
Nothing has changed and now nothing works.
This is the reality of Vista.
I have been using Windows since it was DOS. If I did not have dedicated
Windows business software I would switch to the Mac. I've had it.

 

[Fred]

My two cents: The problems Vista has caused are absolutely not worth the
little, useless, added bells and whistles they added. None of my DOS
programs will run on Vista either, and networking is a nightmare.

Fred

 

[Jack \(MVP-Networking\).]

Hi
Since hundred thousands of people can use Network sharing successfully it
seems to be more of configuration problem rather than Vista being "Bad".
As well as specific adjustment of each computer according to what it is
allowed to be shared.
Vista File and Printer Sharing-
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb727037.aspx
Windows XP File Sharing -
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;304040
Printer Sharing XP -
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/networking/expert/honeycutt_july2.mspx
Windows Native Firewall setting for Sharing XP -
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/875357
Windows XP patch for Sharing with Vista -
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/922120
Jack (MVP-Networking).

 

[Mick Murphy]

How to network XP, and vista.
And link to vista file share from MS
For DOS, have a look at a Program called "dosbox" to install.
http://www.dosbox.com/

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb727037.aspx

Have a read of the above link re Vista File and Printer Sharing.

Permissions/Share info is there as well.

If using Norton, McAfee, Trend Micro I.S., make sure file and printer
sharing is enabled in THEIR firewall (or LAN allowed, depending on how their
Exceptions are worded in their Firewall)

1st thing to do is make sure that the Workgroup Name of ALL the computers is
the SAME.

In Vista Network and Sharing:

Network Discovery: ON (So it can see the other computers)

Network set to Private (Public is for hotspots, airports, etc)

File Sharing: ON

Public Folder Sharing: ON (Vista’s Public Folder is the same as XP’s Shared
Docs)

Password Protected: OFF (unless you want to set up identical usernames and
passwords (passwords can be different) on ALL computers in your Network) If
you have it ON, you will be asked for a username and password when you try to
access a Vista computer from an XP computer, or a Vista computer.

Also, run the XP’s Home or Small Office Network File and Printer Sharing
Wizard to include Vista in your “New†Network, even if you had an XP Network
set up prior to adding a Vista computer to it(redoing the Wizard seems to
work for XP machines!).

In “My Network Placesâ€: “Set up a Home or Small Office Networkâ€
OR under Accessories > Communications > Network Setup Wizard > Allow File
and Printer Sharing.

 

[Gordon]

My two cents: The problems Vista has caused are absolutely not worth the
little, useless, added bells and whistles they added. None of my DOS
programs will run on Vista either, and networking is a nightmare.

jeeeze. DOS programs? Why not just go back to Windows for Workgroups?
Networking is NOT a nightmare - mine worked "out of the box".

 

[Gordon]

I open an Excel spreadsheet stored on one Vista machine on a second.
I cannot save the document because first it says it is read only (the
original is NOT read only).

that's normal network behaviour. Has been since NT4.....

I can not save the document back on the first machine with a different
name (e.g. vista sucks) because it says I do not have permission.

And DO you have permission? That;s NORMAL network behaviour. Has been since
NT4....

However the sharing on the first machine says I have full privileges for
opening and saving.
What a piece of crap this OS is. There is no reason for needlessly
complicating simple peer to peer networking with this layer of useless
non-security crud. It is obvious why businesses will not use the
abomination that is Vista.

Well you obviously do NOT have "full permissions".

I went through all the permission crap last week and it all worked fine.
Nothing has changed and now nothing works.
This is the reality of Vista.
I have been using Windows since it was DOS. If I did not have dedicated
Windows business software I would switch to the Mac. I've had it.

Umm Windows never WAS "DOS"......

 

[Fred]

Gordon,

When you paid $5000.00 for a program that has been used for years, and has
the exact same functionality today as it did when I bought it, you might
begin to understand the frustrations with windows vista.

Fred

 

[Gordon]

Gordon,

When you paid $5000.00 for a program that has been used for years, and has
the exact same functionality today as it did when I bought it, you might
begin to understand the frustrations with windows vista.

You paid $5,000 for a DOS program?
They saw you coming then.....
have you thought of using Microsoft Virtual PC and actually running your DOS
program on DOS rather than on Vista that has NO DOS AT ALL?

 

[Paul Montgomery]

Gordon,

When you paid $5000.00 for a program that has been used for years, and has
the exact same functionality today as it did when I bought it, you might
begin to understand the frustrations with windows vista.

I feel your pain. I have a small fortune worth of automotive testing
equipment, etc. from "back in the day" and can't use any of it on
today's cars/trucks.

DAMN Detroit! Why did it have to change everything!??

 

[Tom Ferguson]

I open an Excel spreadsheet stored on one Vista machine on a second.
I cannot save the document because first it says it is read only (the
original is NOT read only).

Is the spreadsheet still open on the first machine when you attempt to open
it on the second? If so, file sharing provivions will not allow a copy to
open on any other networked machene except as read only.

I can not save the document back on the first machine with a different
name (e.g. vista sucks) because it says I do not have permission. However
the sharing on the first machine says I have full privileges for opening
and saving.

What are your permissions on the machine you are actually using concerning
saving through the network on the machine owning the document?

What a piece of crap this OS is. There is no reason for needlessly
complicating simple peer to peer networking with this layer of useless
non-security crud. It is obvious why businesses will not use the
abomination that is Vista.

the key word here is 'needlessly'. Think of how quickly a document would be
messed up if two people were making changes to a it unaware of and
uncoordinated with each other.

I went through all the permission crap last week and it all worked fine.
Nothing has changed and now nothing works.

Learn how to set up networking and how to use files that are shared. What
else can I say? Until you do, you will be frequently reduced to semi-lucid
ranting.

This is the reality of Vista.
I have been using Windows since it was DOS. If I did not have dedicated
Windows business software I would switch to the Mac. I've had it.

And why do you think that networked Macs or Unix or Linux or... would be
different in this regard? Think about it. Suppose three different people
open a document at the same time and edit it. Then they try to save it. How
does the operating system"know" which is authoratative and the one to keep?
The last saved? The first saved?

If you are resaving under a different name, make sure you have save
permission on the machine that owns the document.

 

[+Bob+]

You paid $5,000 for a DOS program?
They saw you coming then.....

I might tactfully suggest that you don't have much exposure to
commercial software if you think $5K is a lot for a "program".

have you thought of using Microsoft Virtual PC and actually running your DOS
program on DOS rather than on Vista that has NO DOS AT ALL?

And here you highlight yet another shortcoming of Vista and MS.

 

[+Bob+]

I open an Excel spreadsheet stored on one Vista machine on a second.
I cannot save the document because first it says it is read only (the
original is NOT read only).

I can not save the document back on the first machine with a different name
(e.g. vista sucks) because it says I do not have permission. However the
sharing on the first machine says I have full privileges for opening and
saving.

Vista has levels of alleged security that make things that used to
work fine stop working. Make sure you have full rights first (you
probably do). I had similar issues with items that I had full rights
to also - but you need to look check there first.

Next, you likely need to add the local (shared) drive to the trusted
sites. At least, if you don't need to now, you will sooner or later.
Go to Intner Explorer the choose Tools> Int Options >Security. Select
the Trusted Zone, click Sites, and check off "include all UNC's". Next
click on "Advanced" in that same Sites box. Add the IP of the other
system to the list. Also add it in this format "file://network-name".

What a piece of crap this OS is. There is no reason for needlessly
complicating simple peer to peer networking with this layer of useless
non-security crud. It is obvious why businesses will not use the abomination
that is Vista.

Yes, it does have some features that suck. This alleged new security,
implemented with moronically global restrictions is a royal PITA.

I went through all the permission crap last week and it all worked fine.
Nothing has changed and now nothing works.
This is the reality of Vista.
I have been using Windows since it was DOS. If I did not have dedicated
Windows business software I would switch to the Mac. I've had it.

Yes, MS has lost all touch with reality. It happens when companies get
big - they stop designing what customers want and instead design what
they want.

 

[Gordon]

Gordon, many businesses pay much more than that for custom programs
intended for specific purposes. If users' needs and the program's
functionality haven't changed why would a business want to shell out
that kind of money again just to get it ported to Vista?

I know. I'm a just-retired Systems Accountant having worked in several major
Public Companies in the UK.
I haven't seen a "custom" DOS program for nearly TWENTY YEARS........even
so, software is usually depreciated over 5 years or less, and if the OP had
a "custom DOS" application written less than 5 years ago, I would be VERY
surprised.

 

[Gordon]

I might tactfully suggest that you don't have much exposure to
commercial software if you think $5K is a lot for a "program".

And I would also tactfully reply that you know nothing about my background.
I'm a just-retired Systems Accountant having worked in several major Public
Companies in the UK.
I haven't seen a "custom" DOS program for nearly TWENTY YEARS........even
so, software is usually depreciated over 5 years or less, and if the OP had
a "custom DOS" application written less than 5 years ago, I would be VERY
surprised.

 

[+Bob+]

I know. I'm a just-retired Systems Accountant having worked in several major
Public Companies in the UK.
I haven't seen a "custom" DOS program for nearly TWENTY YEARS........even
so, software is usually depreciated over 5 years or less, and if the OP had
a "custom DOS" application written less than 5 years ago, I would be VERY
surprised.

First, "Depreciable life" is an accounting standard. The fact that
something is fully depreciated has no true relationship to its useful
business life. Second, depreciation is merely a reduction of overall
cost (tax benefit). The business still has to lay out the initial cost
of the asset - they merely get a marginal credit back over its life.

I have to assume that you never owned a business and had to pull that
$5K out of your own pocket. When you do, you tend to get a whole lot
more conservative in your spending habits than employees in major
companies and you mysteriously find that assets can be used a whole
lot longer before you "have to" replace them.

 

[+Bob+]

And I would also tactfully reply that you know nothing about my background.
I'm a just-retired Systems Accountant having worked in several major Public
Companies in the UK.
I haven't seen a "custom" DOS program for nearly TWENTY YEARS........even
so, software is usually depreciated over 5 years or less, and if the OP had
a "custom DOS" application written less than 5 years ago, I would be VERY
surprised.

See my other post in this thread.

 

[Darrick West]

Run your DOS apps in a DOS/Win 9x/XP physical box, or a virtual machine
using Virtual PC 2007 - it's free, but there are others to choose from. I
recommend to diehard DOS users that they keep an old box or two around for
must have apps, and that they find modernized versions of their DOS apps.
DOS is...well...

Vista Networking:

- Make sure all PCs are in the same workgroup (your XP boxes too).

- Enable network discovery (this and the following are found in the 'Network
and Sharing Center')

- Enable file sharing (and print sharing if necessary)

- Enable password protected sharing. You can disable this (makes sharing
simpler) , but it's good security practice to password protect your shares.
You'll also have to create user accounts on each PC where shares exist if
you enable password protected sharing..

- Put your files/folders in the Public share folder to simplify sharing.
You can specify anyone with network access (read-only), open/change/create
(full control), or no access (off).

Make sure your date/time are correct on all PCs.

I haven't experienced a nightmare yet, just a few snags. Overall, I'm
satisfied with Vista.


--
Regards,

Darrick West

 

[Darrick West]

What are you using? A CNC, wave soldering station, AutoCAD, ORCad, P-CAD,
EE Designer of old? It's time to move on, or start collecting old hardware
and maintaining copies of DOS floppies...It's time to move on. What app are
you using? Is the vendor still in business?