Hotmail takes over 5 DAYS to deliver mail (Outlook Express problem?)

[MonkeyBoy]

Some messages I have sent via my hotmail account have
taken over 5 days to be delivered (I'm not exagerating,
see the headers below). Some messages get to the
recipients within minutes.

I have been using Outlook Express (version 6) for
email... is this causing the problem?
One thing I noticed in the headers below is the use of
DAV vs HTTP as well as the initial mail servers used.
Look for "with DAV" and "with HTTP" in the headers.

Sidenote: seems that there should be an MS hotmail
newsgroup... but I'm sure I'm not the first person to
mention that.

HELP!!!
Thanks
-Matt

===========================================
excerpts from headres
mail sent via Outlook Express 6.
Note that it was first received 9/22
and finally delivered 9/30
===========================================

Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0
Received: from hotmail.com ([207.68.162.208]) by
censored.censored.org with Microsoft SMTPSVC
(5.0.2195.6713);
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 18:15:58 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC;
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:18:22 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV;
Mon, 22 Sep 2003 21:52:25 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
References:
<[email protected].
org>

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
web-based Hotmail (i.e., hotmail.com)
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.81;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:46 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.163.76 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.163.76) by mta204.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by
sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:34:41 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Bcc:
Subject: From Hotmail (web)
Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:41 -0700
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:34:42.0233 (UTC)
FILETIME=[0FA04290:01C38853]
Content-Length: 203

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
Outlook Express 6
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.87;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.162.124 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.162.124) by mta156.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav20.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:35:05 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Subject: From Outlook express
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:01 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----
=_NextPart_000_002B_01C38818.6E8EA2A0"
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:35:05.0384 (UTC)
FILETIME=[1D6CD280:01C38853]
Content-Length: 716

 

[Michael Santovec]

Each mail server that a message passes through inserts a Received header. They are in
reverse order, so that the top most one is the most recent. The server supplies the time
stamp.

In the case or your first example, the relevant headers are

Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 30 Sep 2003
17:18:22 -0700

Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 22 Sep 2003
21:52:25 +0000

So the message was delayed within Hotmail for about 8 days. The problem would not be
specific to Outlook Express. Outlook Express handed off the message. The delay occurred
either within server sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com or in handing the message off from that
server to the next. Apparently Hotmail had some internal problems.

Your 3rd example also used Outlook Express, but the headers showed the message moving
quickly within Hotmail.




--

Mike - http://pages.prodigy.net/michael_santovec/techhelp.htm

Some messages I have sent via my hotmail account have
taken over 5 days to be delivered (I'm not exagerating,
see the headers below). Some messages get to the
recipients within minutes.

I have been using Outlook Express (version 6) for
email... is this causing the problem?
One thing I noticed in the headers below is the use of
DAV vs HTTP as well as the initial mail servers used.
Look for "with DAV" and "with HTTP" in the headers.

Sidenote: seems that there should be an MS hotmail
newsgroup... but I'm sure I'm not the first person to
mention that.

HELP!!!
Thanks
-Matt

===========================================
excerpts from headres
mail sent via Outlook Express 6.
Note that it was first received 9/22
and finally delivered 9/30
===========================================

Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0
Received: from hotmail.com ([207.68.162.208]) by
censored.censored.org with Microsoft SMTPSVC
(5.0.2195.6713);
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 18:15:58 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC;
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:18:22 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV;
Mon, 22 Sep 2003 21:52:25 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
References:
<[email protected].
org>

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
web-based Hotmail (i.e., hotmail.com)
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.81;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:46 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.163.76 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.163.76) by mta204.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by
sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:34:41 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Bcc:
Subject: From Hotmail (web)
Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:41 -0700
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:34:42.0233 (UTC)
FILETIME=[0FA04290:01C38853]
Content-Length: 203

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
Outlook Express 6
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.87;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.162.124 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.162.124) by mta156.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav20.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:35:05 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Subject: From Outlook express
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:01 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----
=_NextPart_000_002B_01C38818.6E8EA2A0"
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:35:05.0384 (UTC)
FILETIME=[1D6CD280:01C38853]
Content-Length: 716

 

[Kevin]

And this is supposed to surprise anyone who has been using MSN/Hotmail for
any length of time? >g<

Some messages I have sent via my hotmail account have
taken over 5 days to be delivered (I'm not exagerating,
see the headers below). Some messages get to the
recipients within minutes.

I have been using Outlook Express (version 6) for
email... is this causing the problem?
One thing I noticed in the headers below is the use of
DAV vs HTTP as well as the initial mail servers used.
Look for "with DAV" and "with HTTP" in the headers.

Sidenote: seems that there should be an MS hotmail
newsgroup... but I'm sure I'm not the first person to
mention that.

HELP!!!
Thanks
-Matt

===========================================
excerpts from headres
mail sent via Outlook Express 6.
Note that it was first received 9/22
and finally delivered 9/30
===========================================

Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0
Received: from hotmail.com ([207.68.162.208]) by
censored.censored.org with Microsoft SMTPSVC
(5.0.2195.6713);
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 18:15:58 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC;
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:18:22 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV;
Mon, 22 Sep 2003 21:52:25 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
References:
<[email protected].
org>

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
web-based Hotmail (i.e., hotmail.com)
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.81;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:46 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.163.76 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.163.76) by mta204.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by
sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:34:41 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Bcc:
Subject: From Hotmail (web)
Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:41 -0700
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:34:42.0233 (UTC)
FILETIME=[0FA04290:01C38853]
Content-Length: 203

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
Outlook Express 6
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.87;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.162.124 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.162.124) by mta156.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav20.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:35:05 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Subject: From Outlook express
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:01 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----
=_NextPart_000_002B_01C38818.6E8EA2A0"
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:35:05.0384 (UTC)
FILETIME=[1D6CD280:01C38853]
Content-Length: 716

 

[PA Bear]

An excellent précis, Mike! Thank you for all your work in the OE NGs over
the years. We've all learned quite a bit from you.
--
~PA Bear

Each mail server that a message passes through inserts a Received
header. They are in reverse order, so that the top most one is the
most recent. The server supplies the time stamp.

In the case or your first example, the relevant headers are

Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft
SMTPSVC; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:18:22 -0700

Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV;
Mon, 22 Sep 2003 21:52:25 +0000

So the message was delayed within Hotmail for about 8 days. The
problem would not be specific to Outlook Express. Outlook Express
handed off the message. The delay occurred either within server
sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com or in handing the message off from that
server to the next. Apparently Hotmail had some internal problems.

Your 3rd example also used Outlook Express, but the headers showed
the message moving quickly within Hotmail.

Some messages I have sent via my hotmail account have
taken over 5 days to be delivered (I'm not exagerating,
see the headers below). Some messages get to the
recipients within minutes.

I have been using Outlook Express (version 6) for
email... is this causing the problem?
One thing I noticed in the headers below is the use of
DAV vs HTTP as well as the initial mail servers used.
Look for "with DAV" and "with HTTP" in the headers.

Sidenote: seems that there should be an MS hotmail
newsgroup... but I'm sure I'm not the first person to
mention that.

HELP!!!
Thanks
-Matt

===========================================
excerpts from headres
mail sent via Outlook Express 6.
Note that it was first received 9/22
and finally delivered 9/30
===========================================

Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0
Received: from hotmail.com ([207.68.162.208]) by
censored.censored.org with Microsoft SMTPSVC
(5.0.2195.6713);
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 18:15:58 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC;
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:18:22 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV;
Mon, 22 Sep 2003 21:52:25 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
References:
<[email protected].
org>

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
web-based Hotmail (i.e., hotmail.com)
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.81;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:46 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.163.76 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.163.76) by mta204.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by
sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:34:41 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Bcc:
Subject: From Hotmail (web)
Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:41 -0700
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:34:42.0233 (UTC)
FILETIME=[0FA04290:01C38853]
Content-Length: 203

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
Outlook Express 6
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.87;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.162.124 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.162.124) by mta156.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav20.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:35:05 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Subject: From Outlook express
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:01 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----
=_NextPart_000_002B_01C38818.6E8EA2A0"
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:35:05.0384 (UTC)
FILETIME=[1D6CD280:01C38853]
Content-Length: 716

 

[MonkeyBoy]

Thanks for the reply!

It definitely could be a server problem that has nothing to do with
the application I used to send the mails. However, I did some
experimenting and found that no messages I sent via web-based hotmail
(i.e., hotmail.com) were delayed whereas some (and not all as noted)
were significantly delayed (5-12 days) using Outlook Express. Nothing
conclusive... possibly just a coincidence.

What struck me as interesting are the delivery mechanisms...
all mails sent from hotmail.com show up as "WITH HTTP" in the headers
while all mails sent via Outlook Express show up as "WITH DAV" in the
headers.
Perhaps there's an intermitent problem with queuing mail delivered
using that protocol... locks on the posted content not always being
released by the client (Outlook Express) or something like that?
Just a guess.

___________________________________________________________


....
....

So the message was delayed within Hotmail for about 8 days. The problem would not be
specific to Outlook Express. Outlook Express handed off the message. The delay occurred
either within server sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com or in handing the message off from that
server to the next. Apparently Hotmail had some internal problems.

Your 3rd example also used Outlook Express, but the headers showed the message moving
quickly within Hotmail.

....
....

 

[PA Bear]

The server used to send Hotmail messages from OE is different than the one
used when sending from the online page, MonkeyBoy.
--
HTH...Please post back to this thread

~Robear Dyer (aka PA Bear)
MS MVP-Windows (IE/OE)
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
AH-VSOP
http://forum.aumha.org/

 

[MonkeyBoy]

Given that difference, is there a known problem with the servers used
to handle OE mail that would cause a 5-12 day delay? (not hours...
days)

Also, I looked through the headers that I asked recipients to mail
back to me hoping to find that delayed mail had been routed through
the same server...

sea1-dav69.sea1.hotmail.com -- 7 day delay
sea1-dav66.sea1.hotmail.com -- 1 day delay
sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com -- 12 day delay
sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com -- 8 day delay

I have no idea if the host names above are all really separate
servers... one would assume so.

Given that Hotmail support in OE is currently in Beta, I'm hoping that
someone from the Hotmail server staff will peek at logfiles to
determine what caused the lengthy delays. Maybe use the message ID's
in the full headers posted at the beginning of this thread?

__________________________________________________________________________

 

[Michael Santovec]

Thank you.

--

Mike - http://pages.prodigy.net/michael_santovec/techhelp.htm

An excellent précis, Mike! Thank you for all your work in the OE NGs over
the years. We've all learned quite a bit from you.
--
~PA Bear

Each mail server that a message passes through inserts a Received
header. They are in reverse order, so that the top most one is the
most recent. The server supplies the time stamp.

In the case or your first example, the relevant headers are

Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft
SMTPSVC; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:18:22 -0700

Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV;
Mon, 22 Sep 2003 21:52:25 +0000

So the message was delayed within Hotmail for about 8 days. The
problem would not be specific to Outlook Express. Outlook Express
handed off the message. The delay occurred either within server
sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com or in handing the message off from that
server to the next. Apparently Hotmail had some internal problems.

Your 3rd example also used Outlook Express, but the headers showed
the message moving quickly within Hotmail.

Some messages I have sent via my hotmail account have
taken over 5 days to be delivered (I'm not exagerating,
see the headers below). Some messages get to the
recipients within minutes.

I have been using Outlook Express (version 6) for
email... is this causing the problem?
One thing I noticed in the headers below is the use of
DAV vs HTTP as well as the initial mail servers used.
Look for "with DAV" and "with HTTP" in the headers.

Sidenote: seems that there should be an MS hotmail
newsgroup... but I'm sure I'm not the first person to
mention that.

HELP!!!
Thanks
-Matt

===========================================
excerpts from headres
mail sent via Outlook Express 6.
Note that it was first received 9/22
and finally delivered 9/30
===========================================

Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0
Received: from hotmail.com ([207.68.162.208]) by
censored.censored.org with Microsoft SMTPSVC
(5.0.2195.6713);
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 18:15:58 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC;
Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:18:22 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV;
Mon, 22 Sep 2003 21:52:25 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
References:
<[email protected].
org>

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
web-based Hotmail (i.e., hotmail.com)
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.81;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:46 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.163.76 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.163.76) by mta204.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by
sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:34:41 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Bcc:
Subject: From Hotmail (web)
Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:41 -0700
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:34:42.0233 (UTC)
FILETIME=[0FA04290:01C38853]
Content-Length: 203

===========================================
Headers from mail sent via
Outlook Express 6
===========================================

X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.87;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.68.162.124 (EHLO hotmail.com)
(207.68.162.124) by mta156.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
dav20.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
19:35:05 +0000
X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
From: "censored" <[email protected]>
To: (e-mail address removed)
Subject: From Outlook express
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:01 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----
=_NextPart_000_002B_01C38818.6E8EA2A0"
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:35:05.0384 (UTC)
FILETIME=[1D6CD280:01C38853]
Content-Length: 716

 

[Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]]

Really, must you crosspost into inappropriate groups, such as
microsoft.public.outlook NOT express??

--
Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]

Post all replies to the group to keep the discussion intact.


After searching google.groups.com and finding no answer
Michael Santovec <[email protected]> asked:

| Thank you.
|
| --
|
| Mike - http://pages.prodigy.net/michael_santovec/techhelp.htm
|
|
| || An excellent précis, Mike! Thank you for all your work in the OE
|| NGs over
|| the years. We've all learned quite a bit from you.
|| --
|| ~PA Bear
||
|| Michael Santovec wrote:
|||| Each mail server that a message passes through inserts a Received
|||| header. They are in reverse order, so that the top most one is the
|||| most recent. The server supplies the time stamp.
||||
|||| In the case or your first example, the relevant headers are
||||
|||| Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft
|||| SMTPSVC; Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:18:22 -0700
||||
|||| Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with
|||| DAV;
|||| Mon, 22 Sep 2003 21:52:25 +0000
||||
|||| So the message was delayed within Hotmail for about 8 days. The
|||| problem would not be specific to Outlook Express. Outlook Express
|||| handed off the message. The delay occurred either within server
|||| sea1-dav73.sea1.hotmail.com or in handing the message off from
|||| that
|||| server to the next. Apparently Hotmail had some internal problems.
||||
|||| Your 3rd example also used Outlook Express, but the headers showed
|||| the message moving quickly within Hotmail.
||||
|||| ||||| Some messages I have sent via my hotmail account have
||||| taken over 5 days to be delivered (I'm not exagerating,
||||| see the headers below). Some messages get to the
||||| recipients within minutes.
|||||
||||| I have been using Outlook Express (version 6) for
||||| email... is this causing the problem?
||||| One thing I noticed in the headers below is the use of
||||| DAV vs HTTP as well as the initial mail servers used.
||||| Look for "with DAV" and "with HTTP" in the headers.
|||||
||||| Sidenote: seems that there should be an MS hotmail
||||| newsgroup... but I'm sure I'm not the first person to
||||| mention that.
|||||
||||| HELP!!!
||||| Thanks
||||| -Matt
|||||
||||| ===========================================
||||| excerpts from headres
||||| mail sent via Outlook Express 6.
||||| Note that it was first received 9/22
||||| and finally delivered 9/30
||||| ===========================================
|||||
||||| Microsoft Mail Internet Headers Version 2.0
||||| Received: from hotmail.com ([207.68.162.208]) by
||||| censored.censored.org with Microsoft SMTPSVC
||||| (5.0.2195.6713);
||||| Tue, 30 Sep 2003 18:15:58 -0700
||||| Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
||||| Microsoft SMTPSVC;
||||| Tue, 30 Sep 2003 17:18:22 -0700
||||| Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
||||| dav73.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV;
||||| Mon, 22 Sep 2003 21:52:25 +0000
||||| X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
||||| References:
||||| <[email protected].
||||| org>
|||||
||||| ===========================================
||||| Headers from mail sent via
||||| web-based Hotmail (i.e., hotmail.com)
||||| ===========================================
|||||
||||| X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.81;
||||| Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:46 -0700
||||| Return-Path: <[email protected]>
||||| Received: from 207.68.163.76 (EHLO hotmail.com)
||||| (207.68.163.76) by mta204.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
||||| Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
||||| Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
||||| Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:34:42 -0700
||||| Received: from 208.54.143.1 by
||||| sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
||||| 19:34:41 GMT
||||| X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
||||| X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
||||| From: "censored" <[email protected]>
||||| To: (e-mail address removed)
||||| Bcc:
||||| Subject: From Hotmail (web)
||||| Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:34:41 -0700
||||| Mime-Version: 1.0
||||| Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
||||| Message-ID: <[email protected]>
||||| X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:34:42.0233 (UTC)
||||| FILETIME=[0FA04290:01C38853]
||||| Content-Length: 203
|||||
||||| ===========================================
||||| Headers from mail sent via
||||| Outlook Express 6
||||| ===========================================
|||||
||||| X-Apparently-To: (e-mail address removed) via 216.136.175.87;
||||| Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
||||| Return-Path: <[email protected]>
||||| Received: from 207.68.162.124 (EHLO hotmail.com)
||||| (207.68.162.124) by mta156.mail.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP;
||||| Wed, 01 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
||||| Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with
||||| Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:05 -0700
||||| Received: from 208.54.143.1 by sea1-
||||| dav20.sea1.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 01 Oct 2003
||||| 19:35:05 +0000
||||| X-Originating-IP: [208.54.143.1]
||||| X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
||||| From: "censored" <[email protected]>
||||| To: (e-mail address removed)
||||| Subject: From Outlook express
||||| Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2003 12:35:01 -0700
||||| MIME-Version: 1.0
||||| Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----
||||| =_NextPart_000_002B_01C38818.6E8EA2A0"
||||| X-Priority: 3
||||| X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
||||| X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158
||||| X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
||||| Message-ID: <[email protected]>
||||| X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Oct 2003 19:35:05.0384 (UTC)
||||| FILETIME=[1D6CD280:01C38853]
||||| Content-Length: 716

 

[...winston]

For one who spoke so loudly...Why didn't you remove the cross-posting and
strip the unnecessary content and set a better example.
..winston

: Really, must you crosspost into inappropriate groups, such as
: microsoft.public.outlook NOT express??
:
: --
: Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]
:

 

[Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]]

I wanted to be sure to hit whatever poster first started this thread.

--
Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]

Post all replies to the group to keep the discussion intact.


After searching google.groups.com and finding no answer
....winston <merlin@druid9#.com> asked:

| For one who spoke so loudly...Why didn't you remove the cross-posting
| and strip the unnecessary content and set a better example.
| ..winston
|
| || Really, must you crosspost into inappropriate groups, such as
|| microsoft.public.outlook NOT express??
||
|| --
|| Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]

 

[Val - Microsoft [.NOT MVP]]

and the fact that one mvp elected to chastise a non mvp instead of the mvp that committed exactly the same sin one step up in the thread.....seems ironic


--
val
micro$oft {dot.NOT.dot.NET.dot.NEVER} - mvp (since 1950)
hyperlinks used because they can be;
html posting encouraged;
bottom posters generally ignored as this is an "OE zone"
For one who spoke so loudly...Why didn't you remove the cross-posting and
strip the unnecessary content and set a better example.
..winston

: Really, must you crosspost into inappropriate groups, such as
: microsoft.public.outlook NOT express??
:
: --
: Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]
:

 

[Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]]

Ah, this must be originating from that infamous bawdyhouse known as the msn
discussions.

I understand all now.

--
Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]

Post all replies to the group to keep the discussion intact.

and the fact that one mvp elected to chastise a non mvp instead of the mvp
that committed exactly the same sin one step up in the thread.....seems
ironic


--
val
micro$oft {dot.NOT.dot.NET.dot.NEVER} - mvp (since 1950)
hyperlinks used because they can be;
html posting encouraged;
bottom posters generally ignored as this is an "OE zone"
For one who spoke so loudly...Why didn't you remove the cross-posting and
strip the unnecessary content and set a better example.
..winston

: Really, must you crosspost into inappropriate groups, such as
: microsoft.public.outlook NOT express??
:
: --
: Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]
:

 

[...winston]

Lol.."after searching google"..hardly Milly....the response was a result of
reading a useless post of a supposed intelligent awardee trying to play the
role of an omnipotent parlimentarian across multiple newsgroups by shooting
another messenger(third respondent in the thread) rather than the original
cross poster.

Tact can solve many problems..this time it didn't....keep up the good work
while standing on that pedestal.

Your vesion of OE(1158) does have a reset feature, especially usefull if
msft's recent problems are hindering the ability to find the first post.

..winston


"Milly Staples
: I wanted to be sure to hit whatever poster first started this thread.

: : After searching google.groups.com and finding no answer

:> ...winston wrote:
:> For one who spoke so loudly...Why didn't you remove the cross-posting
: >and strip the unnecessary content and set a better example.
:> ..winston
: |
: | "Milly Staples ...
: || Really, must you crosspost into inappropriate groups, such as
:

 

[...winston]

You're such a lovely audience
we'd like to take you home with us
we'd love to take you home,
We don't really want to stop the show,
but I thought you'd like to now
that the singer's going to sing a song,
and you really should sing along.

...billy shears


: Ah, this must be originating from that infamous bawdyhouse known as the
msn
: discussions.
:
: I understand all now.
:
: --
: Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]
:
: Post all replies to the group to keep the discussion intact.
:
: : and the fact that one mvp elected to chastise a non mvp instead of the mvp
: that committed exactly the same sin one step up in the thread.....seems
: ironic
:
:
: --
: val
: micro$oft {dot.NOT.dot.NET.dot.NEVER} - mvp (since 1950)
: hyperlinks used because they can be;
: html posting encouraged;
: bottom posters generally ignored as this is an "OE zone"
: : For one who spoke so loudly...Why didn't you remove the cross-posting and
: strip the unnecessary content and set a better example.
: ..winston
:
: : : Really, must you crosspost into inappropriate groups, such as
: : microsoft.public.outlook NOT express??
: :
: : --
: : Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]
: :
:
:

 

[lostinthenorthwoods]

Now that's the best description I've ever run into for this place..... bahaha.........


Ah, this must be originating from that infamous bawdyhouse known as the msn
discussions.

I understand all now.

--
Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]

Post all replies to the group to keep the discussion intact.

and the fact that one mvp elected to chastise a non mvp instead of the mvp
that committed exactly the same sin one step up in the thread.....seems
ironic


--
val
micro$oft {dot.NOT.dot.NET.dot.NEVER} - mvp (since 1950)
hyperlinks used because they can be;
html posting encouraged;
bottom posters generally ignored as this is an "OE zone"
For one who spoke so loudly...Why didn't you remove the cross-posting and
strip the unnecessary content and set a better example.
..winston

: Really, must you crosspost into inappropriate groups, such as
: microsoft.public.outlook NOT express??
:
: --
: Milly Staples [MVP - Outlook]
:

 

[PA Bear]

I apologize for my OE comrades, Milly, and for my perpetuating the
cross-posting. OP originated the excessive cross-posting and others
perpetuated it. My initial replies to OP, at least, reduced the
cross-posting, eliminating microsoft.public.outlook.

Congratulations on receiving the MVP Award for 2003-2004.[/QUOTE]

 

[Kevin]

Simple, she would rather bitch. >g<

 

[Kevin]

Like I said in my previous post to this thread.

 

[Andrew Hodgson]

Given that Hotmail support in OE is currently in Beta, I'm hoping that
someone from the Hotmail server staff will peek at logfiles to
determine what caused the lengthy delays. Maybe use the message ID's
in the full headers posted at the beginning of this thread?

The MSN 8 software will also use DAV to send emails to the Hotmail
servers, in this case the mails go through straight away (ala three
tests I have just done sending mails to my main address from my
Sister's machine running MSN 8:

|Return-Path: <[email protected]>
|Received: (qmail 21970 invoked by alias); 6 Oct 2003 15:27:53 -0000
|Delivered-To: (e-mail address removed)
|Received: (qmail 21946 invoked from network); 6 Oct 2003 15:27:52 -0000
|Received: from bay5-dav134.bay5.hotmail.com (HELO hotmail.com) (65.54.173.164)
| by brookfield.hodgsonfamily.org (192.168.1.2) with ESMTP; 06 Oct 2003 15:27:52 -0000
|Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC;
| Mon, 6 Oct 2003 08:27:31 -0700
|Received: from 195.166.147.102 by bay5-dav134.bay5.hotmail.com with DAV;
| Mon, 06 Oct 2003 15:27:31 +0000
|X-Originating-IP: [195.166.147.102]
|X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
|From: "Andrew Hodgson" <[email protected]>
|To: <[email protected]>
|Subject: Testing with MSN
|Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2003 16:27:28 +0100
|MIME-Version: 1.0
|Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
| boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C38C26.BC312890"
|X-Priority: 3
|X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
|X-Mailer: MSN 8.5
|Seal-Send-Time: Mon, 6 Oct 2003 16:27:29 +0100
|X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V8.50.0017.1202
|Message-ID: <[email protected]>
|X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Oct 2003 15:27:31.0988 (UTC) FILETIME=[5C2D3540:01C38C1E]
|
[...]

Actually as the server machine is in the same room as my Sister's
computer, I pressed the send button in MSN8 and saw the disk light up
almost straight away on the server machine. So this begs the question
of whether OE users are given different servers to send/interact with
mail than MSN8 users, or whether it is just the time of day that I
have used Hotmail, as I have not experienced this slowdown.

Andrew.