Erratic behavior on Vista memory.

M

MJ

Hello,

I've installed Vista Business 32-bit on Core2Duo + GT7600 + 2GB DRAM.
I didn't installed much progams yet.

When I just log in to the desktop, the memory usage is around 760MB
for 38 processes. During the first 1~2 minute, the memory usage
remains between 750~780MB. However, after a couple of mintues, memory
usage sharply drops to around 540MB. After that, my hard disk makes a
seeking noise for another several minutes.

Is it normal behavior? I don't see why first time Vista uses 750MB and
then release 200MB after some time.

I'm not criticizing Vista, I'm loving it :) But, I think that it uses
too much memory!!
Any comments would be appreciated.

Thank you.
 
B

BigJim

I guess that is why MS recommends 2 gig of ram, but just guess I would say
that it preloads
some programs into ram memory to load the system faster. Then it might cache
them to the hard drive.
Just a guess.
 
S

smartie

that is "superfetch" - it loads apps like InternetExplorer,Sidebar and what
not into RAM in case you want to start it..

Also the services running at boot up - some of them have now "delayed start"
mechanism, meaning you see your Desktop, but vista is not really loaded at
all, best way is to boot it and then let it 10 minutes load all the rest and
then do work with it.

Plus : disable services and autostart stuff you don't need . I found 16 (!)
unneeded services that were set to "automatic" by default that are safe to
disable, that makes it load way quicker.

do a search for "tweaking guides" relating to vista, theres a lot pages in
the internet with tips and tricks.
 
S

smartie

exactly. that is what I wanted to say.

BigJim said:
I guess that is why MS recommends 2 gig of ram, but just guess I would say
that it preloads
some programs into ram memory to load the system faster. Then it might
cache them to the hard drive.
Just a guess.
 
R

Rock

Hello,

I've installed Vista Business 32-bit on Core2Duo + GT7600 + 2GB DRAM.
I didn't installed much progams yet.

When I just log in to the desktop, the memory usage is around 760MB
for 38 processes. During the first 1~2 minute, the memory usage
remains between 750~780MB. However, after a couple of mintues, memory
usage sharply drops to around 540MB. After that, my hard disk makes a
seeking noise for another several minutes.

Is it normal behavior? I don't see why first time Vista uses 750MB and
then release 200MB after some time.

I'm not criticizing Vista, I'm loving it :) But, I think that it uses
too much memory!!
Any comments would be appreciated.


That's normal in terms of decreasing memory usage after a few minutes of
starting, and eventually decreased disk activity. To see what it's doing go
to the Start Orb, type in Reliability (actually after a few letters)
Reliability and Performance Monitor will appear at the top. Click on that.
Once opened, in the right pane expand the disk section and see all that's
going on. After a few minutes activity slows down. Indexing will be very
active right after the initial installation.
 
C

Chad Harris

My assessment is that on that smoking machine Superfetch is not accounting
for your current memory and resource situation anymore than Superman,
Supertramp, and Superfly are.

I'm going to bet you haven't touched Help and Support on the start menu as
well. I'm not lecturing you--I'm acquainting you with it because it answers
85% of the questions posed on this group now and another 10% are answered by
using View>Find in Winmail Vista or Outlook Express XP.

1) You might try running the memory diagnostic on reboot. I know you
probably didn't know it was in Vista, but it can be helpful.

How do I know if my computer has a memory problem?
http://windowshelp.microsoft.com/Windows/en-US/Help/4edd5f80-def2-4d32-965c-116d49fb98721033.mspx

If the Windows Memory Diagnostics tool does not run automatically, you can
run it manually.


1. Open Memory Diagnostics Tool by clicking the Start button , clicking
Control Panel, clicking System and Maintenance, clicking Administrative
Tools, and then clicking Memory Diagnostics Tool.? If you are prompted for
an administrator password or confirmation, type the password or provide
confirmation.

2. Choose between the two options for when to run the Memory Diagnostics
Tool:

.. You can restart your computer and run the tool immediately.

.. You can restart your computer and run the tool later.

How do I know if my computer has a memory problem?
Applies to all editions of Windows Vista.
Which edition of Windows Vista am I using?

Usually, Windows automatically detects possible problems with your computer's
memory and displays a notification that asks if you want to run the Memory
Diagnostics Tool.

Running the Memory Diagnostics Tool
When you receive a notification about a possible memory problem, click the
notification so you can choose between two options for when to run the
Memory Diagnostics Tool:

.. You can restart your computer and run the tool immediately.

.. You can restart your computer and run the tool later.


If you choose to restart your computer and run the tool immediately, make
sure that you save your work and close all of your running programs. The
Memory Diagnostics Tool will run automatically when you restart Windows.
While the Memory Diagnostics Tool runs, you will see a progress bar
indicating the status of the test. Once the test is done, Windows will again
restart automatically.

Top of page
Getting the results of the memory test
If the Memory Diagnostics Tool does not find any errors, you'll get a
message that no errors were found.

If the Memory Diagnostics Tool detects errors, contact your computer or
memory manufacturer for more information.

Top of page
What do I do if the Memory Diagnostics Tool finds errors
If the Memory Diagnostics Tool detects problems with your computer's memory,
contact your computer or memory manufacturer for information about fixing
the problem.

Top of page
Advanced options for running the Memory Diagnostics Tool
We recommend that you let the Memory Diagnostics Tool run automatically.
However, advanced users might want to adjust the tool's settings.


1. When the Memory Diagnostics Tool starts, press F1.

2. You can adjust the following settings:

.. Test mix. Choose what type of test you want to run. These options are
listed when you run the Memory Diagnostics Tool

.. Cache. Choose the cache setting you want for each test.

.. Pass count. Type the number of times you want to repeat the tests.


3. Press F10 to start the test.


I also think given the contrast between that spiffy new box, and your memory
performance that again Superfetch ain't at all accounting for your memory
consumption. Read up on Superfetch here since it was invoked as a component
in this and it isn't:

Superfetch Explanations

Windows Ready Boost and Superfetch (Jim Allchin's blog)
http://windowsvistablog.com/blogs/windowsvista/archive/2006/11/20/windows-readyboost.aspx

http://windowsvistablog.com/blogs/w...1/03/building-a-more-intelligent-windows.aspx

http://blogs.msdn.com/winperf/

http://blogs.msdn.com/ianm/archive/2006/04/06/569715.aspx

From Jim Allchin who oversaw Vista ultimately:

We redesigned the memory manager in Windows Vista so that if you give the
system more memory, it uses that memory much more efficiently than previous
operating systems via a technique called SuperFetch -- part of Windows
Vista's intelligent heuristic memory management system. And so Windows
Vista on a PC with even more than 1 GB of primary memory (say 2 GB) will
generally outperform Windows XP on that same machine -- especially once you
have been using the machine for some time because Windows Vista learns what
you do the most often and optimizes for this.

One of the key enhancements to the Windows Vista memory management system is
a new feature called SuperFetch. I discussed this briefly in my blog post
about ReadyBoost. SuperFetch watches how you work and then uses the RAM on
your system in a new way that optimizes the system's performance to the way
you work. For example, in contrast to traditional memory management systems
that today use an approach to prioritizing how RAM is allocated to the
various programs and services running on the system, SuperFetch can
differentiate memory being used for interactive (high-priority) tasks from
memory used for background (low-priority) tasks. When the user isn't
interacting with the system, background tasks are allowed to run, but when
they complete, SuperFetch repopulates RAM with the content that supports the
interactive applications. SuperFetch is also smart enough to know which
applications are used most often (over a long period of time) and pre-loads
those applications into memory.

You need to maximize CPU efficiency to get maximum performance out of the
spiffy new box a dual core with 2GB Ram on the floor and here's how--it's
easy to make a P4 box with 1GB RAM and about 2GHx that is years old smoke
with Vista and most games, with a decent video card and I've done it on
several of them using these:

Speed PC and Control CPU Tips/Steps

SPEED AND CPU:

_______________

1) Trim processes you don't need in TM. Google them or "search engine of

your choice them" if you have to.

2) Go to

services.msc in run box and turn off services not needed and there are some.

SERVICE CONFIGURATION REFERENCES*

*Vista Services*

Part One

http://www.tweakvista.com/article38662.aspx

Part Two

http://www.tweakvista.com/article38664.aspx

Windows Vista Services Tweak Guide v1.0

http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showtopic=87443


3) Run System File Checker.

SFC: http://www.updatexp.com/scannow-sfc.html

In Vista run it from an elevated command prompt. Right click command on

start and run as administrator.

4) Run 3 or so spyware scans Windows Defender, , Adaware, and Spybot

5) Probably the most important for speed consistently and efficient resource

use DEFRAG with www.raxco.com or www.diskeeeper.com with 15% free space on

drive if DK and or >5% if Raxco's Perfect Disk.

http://groups.msn.com/windowsxpcentral/spyware.msnw

Download Adaware and

Spybot from here.

GOOD Overall Review for Defending Your PC:

http://defendingyourmachine.blogspot.com/

MSFT Defense Site MSFT Security:

http://www.microsoft.com/security/default.mspx

Protect Your PC from MSFT Security:

http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/protect/default.mspx

MSFT Windows Defender

http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/spyware/software/default.mspx

MSFT MSRT: (Malicious Software Removal Tool)

http://www.microsoft.com/security/malwareremove/default.mspx



MSFT "Windows One Care" in Wings (AV and Spyware Scans)

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2005/may05/05-13WindowsOneCarePR.mspx

6) Unck items from msconfig start tab you don't need starting and some

won't start--peoiple who think just uncking for many are naive because there

are 12 places things can be started including several reg keys like Run Once

keys and there are serveral.

7) Turn off Messaging service--it's a security vulnerability and it slows

you

8) Defrag very often every other day actually.

9) Turn off indexing.

10) Clear TIF and %temp% files (delete) and go to safe mode to get as many

as u can.

10) Do troubleshooting with msconfig.

11) Do Clean boot with msconfig utility and search for the directions here:





Vista RTM Tweak Guide (Tweaks to Improve Performances)

http://www.google.com/search?source...,GGLJ:2006-47,GGLJ:en&q=vista+rtm+tweak+guide



1) Task Manager lists the services on the services tab in Vista.

2) Type services.msc in run box and using the list of services, click the

service and you'll get a description of services.

3) There is a list here of the default services and a description>>click

"default settings for services" in the left pane.

http://technet2.microsoft.com/Windo...afb8-43ce-b39d-50e6d5b89bf81033.mspx?mfr=true



4) To view service dependencies

1.

Open Services.

2.

In the details pane, right-click the service that you want to view

dependencies for, and then click Properties.

3.

Click the Dependencies tab.

4.

To view services that are associated dependencies of the selected service,

in the list on the Dependencies tab, click the plus sign next to the

service.

Many of the services but not all in Vista are the same as in XP, so in that

context:

http://www.mvps.org/winhelp2002/services.htm


Also see the extremely helpful site:

Black Viper's Service List

http://www.dead-eye.net/WinXP Services.htm


Black Viper's Site (Many of the same services in Vista)

http://www.dead-eye.net/WinXP Services.htm


http://www.z123.org/techsupport/xpservices.htm


http://www.geocities.com/ziyadhosein/xpserv1.htm


http://www.pacs-portal.co.uk/startup_content.php

This will be helpful

http://web.archive.org/web/20041128084144/www.blackviper.com/WinXP/servicecfg.htm

______________________________________________________________________________________________

How to troubleshoot by using the System Configuration utility in Windows XP

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/310560/

Resources for troubleshooting startup problems in Windows XP

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/308041/

How to perform advanced clean-boot troubleshooting in Windows XP

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;316434

How to perform a clean boot in Windows XP

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/310353/

How to Disable a Service or Device that Prevents Windows from Starting

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/310602/



Also ck out these references:

http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1558,5155,00.asp



http://www.speedupyourcomputer.windowsreinstall.com/index.htm

and

http://www.extremetech.com/search_r...=how+to+speed+windows+xp&filterapp=&site=4P.S.



Defragging with a decent defrag every day will make a huge dent inefficient

resource/CPU use.

Perfect Disk has a 5 month full functionality trial on now for Windows

Vista.

Good luck,

CH
 
P

Pavel Lebedinsky [MSFT]

Do you see any changes in the process list during this time?

Can you run the following command from an elevated
command prompt (right click Command Prompt in start
menu, select Run as administrator) for a couple of minutes
before and after the problem occurs and post the output?

C:\> typeperf -si 10 -o output.txt "process(*)\working set" memory\*
 
M

MJ

Do you see any changes in the process list during this time?

Can you run the following command from an elevated
command prompt (right click Command Prompt in start
menu, select Run as administrator) for a couple of minutes
before and after the problem occurs and post the output?

C:\> typeperf -si 10 -o output.txt "process(*)\working set"memory\*

--
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.







- Show quoted text -

Thanks Pavel, I've sent an e-mail to you including the data you wanted.
 

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