Disaster With Rounded IDE Cables

[Timothy Daniels]

"Paul" insisted:

The questions I'd want an answer to, is:

1) Are round cables standardized ?

No.


Can I be assured of a good construction technique,
no matter where I buy them ?

No.


2) Have round cables, ones with good construction techniques,
been rated for characteristic impedance ?

No.


Do they behave differently than their simple ribbon counterparts

Electrically, not that I'm aware of. Physically, they unclutter
the case and make some impossible connections possible
due to their availability in various lengths. They also *appear*
to reduce air flow restriction. And you don't have to be an
origami expert to hook up a bunch of internal drives.

If there are standards, and someone has created a standard
that works well with the series damping to be found on
IDE controllers, I wouldn't have a problem with that. When
round cables were introduced, they were anything but
standardized.

There is no specification for round cables. If you're going
to assume liability for a system, you'd best not recommend
round cables because you'd be open to charges of
recklessness and disregard for professional standards.
But for personal use, I love 'em.

I wouldn't want to recommend a solution, where you have to
buy three or four different products, and play with them to
see which one works.

Why not? They're cheap. And I've had good luck (i.e. no
problems at all) with the round cables sold by this place:
http://www.svc.com/cables-ata-100-133-round-cables.html

*TimDaniels*

 

[tom]

--
---AVG Certified Virus-Free---

"Paul" insisted:


Electrically, not that I'm aware of. Physically, they unclutter
the case and make some impossible connections possible
due to their availability in various lengths. They also *appear*
to reduce air flow restriction. And you don't have to be an
origami expert to hook up a bunch of internal drives.




There is no specification for round cables. If you're going
to assume liability for a system, you'd best not recommend
round cables because you'd be open to charges of
recklessness and disregard for professional standards.
But for personal use, I love 'em.




Why not? They're cheap. And I've had good luck (i.e. no
problems at all) with the round cables sold by this place:
http://www.svc.com/cables-ata-100-133-round-cables.html

*TimDaniels*

For the FWIW department:

I've had good luck so far with 10" Vantec Copper/Copper Shielding cables.
Construction "seems" to be robust. But I wouldn't be
unconnecting/reconnecting them too many times (although they do have those
pull tabs...but most cables--round or flat--have that now).

 

[RussellS]

Although standard 40-pin/80-wire ribbon cables tend to be more reliable from
various manufacturers, I've had great luck using rounded cables from Antec.
They shield them with aluminum, them mesh tem, and have a separate grounding
wire that you can attach to a screw that's touching a metal case hole, such
as a mounting screw. Link:
http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=77227.

There are just too many cheapo rounded cables that are slapped together with
little to no standards enforcement.

Russell
http://tastycomputers.com

 

[Rod Speed]

RussellS" <rsullivan@tastycomputersdotcom_replace"dot"with".

Although standard 40-pin/80-wire ribbon cables tend to be more
reliable from various manufacturers, I've had great luck using
rounded cables from Antec. They shield them with aluminum, them mesh
tem, and have a separate grounding wire that you can attach to a
screw that's touching a metal case hole, such as a mounting screw. Link:
http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=77227.

There are just too many cheapo rounded cables that are slapped together with little to no
standards enforcement.

There are no standards to enforce with round ATA cables.

 

[- -]

Sheeesh.... "round" cables are NOT rolled up ribbon cables.
In the case of 80-wire round cables, each data wire is
twisted together with a ground wire, putting the data wire
in constant adjacency with its own ground wire.- just like with
spec'd IDE ribbon cables. How well this works is an open
question, but I, for one, have never had a problem with them
in the 3-4 years that I've used them with my (3) ATA/133 HDs.

*TimDaniels*

LOL. If you do a little work, you can position the ribbon cables
against a flat surface or edge on towards airflow. They can be
BETTER than round cables.

PS most round cables i've seen have been jumbled up junk. Twisted
pairs would be nice if you can find it. Heck, I don't even like the
ribbon cables you see at the corner store. I stick to what western
digital ships with the retail box.

 

[Timothy Daniels]

I stick to what western digital ships with the retail box.

Good luck when you have 3 ATA drives on a PCI card,
2 ATAPI drives on the motherboard, and you've got more
ribbons than you can fold and not enough length on some
and too much length on others. I've got such a setup, plus
a floppy drive, and I'm glad I have round cables for all of 'em.

*TimDaniels*

 

[- -]

Good luck when you have 3 ATA drives on a PCI card,
2 ATAPI drives on the motherboard, and you've got more
ribbons than you can fold and not enough length on some
and too much length on others. I've got such a setup, plus
a floppy drive, and I'm glad I have round cables for all of 'em.

*TimDaniels*

Actually I've got 2 on a pci card, 1 on the motherboard, and a
couple of burners too. Floppy ? Sure. No problems.

Don't know why everything has to be a crisis for people. I guess
some people just don't have any mechanical aptitude.

 

[Timothy Daniels]

Actually I've got 2 on a pci card, 1 on the motherboard, and a
couple of burners too. Floppy ? Sure. No problems.

Don't know why everything has to be a crisis for people. I guess
some people just don't have any mechanical aptitude.

Yup. I never learned to stretch ribbon cables. I also don't
like folding them - it creates impedance anomalies. I guess
I'll have to improve my mekanicool appytood.

*TimDaniels*

 

[JAD]

Yup. I never learned to stretch ribbon cables. I also don't
like folding them - it creates impedance anomalies. I guess
I'll have to improve my mekanicool appytood.

*TimDaniels*

what were you for halloween? rounded cable? Did you twist your pair?

 

[SAMF2000]

I think its more likely a bad round cable that damaged the data
on the drive. Thats why a reformat and reinstall worked fine
and why it showed up in the bios fine but wouldnt boot.

That sounds like what happened to my system. data on the drive was
damaged somehow when I connected the round cables. Live and learn I
guess. I check for viruses daily and did not mess with anything else.
If anyone is thinking of using rounded IDE Cables be very careful as my
system died from just connecting them . I tried resetting bios and all
the other logical things that would bring my system back.

 

[Timothy Daniels]

data on the drive was damaged somehow when I connected
the round cables. [.....]
If anyone is thinking of using rounded IDE Cables be very careful
as my system died from just connecting them .

Has anyone explained how your drive was damaged by
merely connecting a cable? How was that you were able
to reformat the drive, i.e. write to the drive, if the drive was
damaged?

*TimDaniels*

 

[Rod Speed]

SAMF2000 wrote

data on the drive was damaged somehow when I connected
the round cables. [.....]
If anyone is thinking of using rounded IDE Cables be very careful as my system died from just
connecting them .

Has anyone explained how your drive was damaged by merely connecting a cable?

It wasnt by 'merely connecting a cable', it was
obviously by writing to the drive using that cable.

How was that you were able to reformat the drive, i.e. write to the drive, if the drive was
damaged?

That was done with the original ribbon cables.

 

[SAMF2000]

data on the drive was damaged somehow when I connected
the round cables. [.....]
If anyone is thinking of using rounded IDE Cables be very careful
as my system died from just connecting them .

Has anyone explained how your drive was damaged by
merely connecting a cable? How was that you were able
to reformat the drive, i.e. write to the drive, if the drive was
damaged?

*TimDaniels*

To tell you the truth...I still am puzzled. All I did was disconnect
my old Ribbon cables, replace them with Rounded ones started computer
and got No 80 wire connection error .. and it did not boot into
windows. after replacing the ribbon cables...I still got same problem.
I then tried resetting bios, went and set bios defaults . checked
drives in bios ,Checked connections, took out battery, and let it sit
over night.
still same error. I was fiorced to reinstall everything from start
with my Windows 98 AND Windows XP Upgrade discs...a 3 Hour process to
get it back.

 

[SAMF2000]

data on the drive was damaged somehow when I connected
the round cables. [.....]
If anyone is thinking of using rounded IDE Cables be very careful
as my system died from just connecting them .

Has anyone explained how your drive was damaged by
merely connecting a cable? How was that you were able
to reformat the drive, i.e. write to the drive, if the drive was
damaged?

*TimDaniels*

no not really...just a guess the drive data was damaged somehow with
the rounded cables. I was able to reinstall everything by using floppy
to reformat, then install windows 98 and then xp upgrade.

 

[John Doe]

I was able to reinstall everything by using floppy
to reformat, then install windows 98 and then xp upgrade.

Why would you install Windows 98 before the Windows XP upgrade?

 

[SAMF2000]

Why would you install Windows 98 before the Windows XP upgrade?

Because I don't have a full copy of XP ...Just the upgrade. I have a
full copy of 98.
So to install xp I need to install 98 ---->> THEN UPGRADE VERSION OF
XP. Simple.

 

[John Doe]

Because I don't have a full copy of XP ...Just the upgrade. I
have a
full copy of 98.
So to install xp I need to install 98 ---->> THEN UPGRADE
VERSION OF
XP. Simple.

Because

Because why?

I don't have a full copy of XP ...

Neither do I.

Just the upgrade.

Me too.

I have a full copy of 98.

I have the upgrade version of 95, 98, Millennium, and Windows XP.

So to install xp I need to install 98 ---->>

Who told you that?

THEN UPGRADE VERSION OF XP.

I don't think so.

Simple.

Simple fishing maybe.

As I recall, all you need to install the upgrade is the CD key, you
might even need the CD key when installing over the prior version
which is discouraged.

Good luck.

 

[Crispy Critter]

Because I don't have a full copy of XP ...Just the upgrade. I have a
full copy of 98.
So to install xp I need to install 98 ---->> THEN UPGRADE VERSION OF
XP. Simple.

No, you just install XP Upgrade version like it is a full version and when
it asks for a previous installation you just put your old Win98 cd in the
drive and it will see that and allow you to install just like it is the
full version.

 

[Timothy Daniels]

"Crispy Critter" pointed out:

No, you just install XP Upgrade version like it is a full version
and when it asks for a previous installation you just put your
old Win98 cd in the drive and it will see that and allow you to
install just like it is the full version.

I think lots of people confuse "upgrade" with "update".

*TimDaniels*

 

[Rod Speed]

Crispy Critter wrote

I think lots of people confuse "upgrade" with "update".

He didnt realise that the upgrade is happy to inspect a CD of what its upgrading.