Daisy-chaining two routers

[Jess Jackson]

Hi:

I am a relative novice at networking. I have added a Vonage phone to my
four PC Home Network (three running Windows XP Pro and one Linux Box),
plus changed my four port wired router to a four port plus 802.11g
wireless. Everything is generally cool. I have the four PC's connected
as follows...

| Port 1 -- PCA
| Port 2 -- PCB |Port 1 -- PCD
Modem --> 4-Prt Router | Port 3 --> Phone Router|Port 3 -- Open
| Port 4 -- PCC |Port 3 -- Open

The original hookup had just the four PC's on the one router and
everybody peacefully shared resources one with another. Now, PCA, PCB,
and PCC all still connect just fine. But PCD can "see" the other PC's
"upline" but the other three cannot see PCD. But PCD can link to the
Internet just fine.

PCA thru C have assigned IP's of 192.168.1.n. PCD is assigned 192.168.15.n

Is this just the way things are, or have I missed something basic? I
have all my firewall, port forwarding, etc. setup in the 4-Prt Router
but the Phone Router (A linksys RT31P2) is connected upline as
192.168.1.51 and assigns downstream as 192.168.15.n.

Do I need to make the Local IP Address of the Phone Router a
192.168.1.??? number and make that the gateway in PCD?

To put it another way, I'd really like PCD and anything I plug into the
Phone Router to look just like more ports on the 4-Prt Router.

Please excuse my poor nomenclature. I am just learning networking.

Thanks for any advice.

Jess

 

[Rick Wintjen]

Hi:

I am a relative novice at networking. I have added a Vonage phone to my
four PC Home Network (three running Windows XP Pro and one Linux Box),
plus changed my four port wired router to a four port plus 802.11g
wireless. Everything is generally cool. I have the four PC's connected
as follows...

| Port 1 -- PCA
| Port 2 -- PCB |Port 1 -- PCD
Modem --> 4-Prt Router | Port 3 --> Phone Router|Port 3 -- Open
| Port 4 -- PCC |Port 3 -- Open

The original hookup had just the four PC's on the one router and
everybody peacefully shared resources one with another. Now, PCA, PCB,
and PCC all still connect just fine. But PCD can "see" the other PC's
"upline" but the other three cannot see PCD. But PCD can link to the
Internet just fine.

PCA thru C have assigned IP's of 192.168.1.n. PCD is assigned 192.168.15.n

Is this just the way things are, or have I missed something basic? I
have all my firewall, port forwarding, etc. setup in the 4-Prt Router
but the Phone Router (A linksys RT31P2) is connected upline as
192.168.1.51 and assigns downstream as 192.168.15.n.

Do I need to make the Local IP Address of the Phone Router a
192.168.1.??? number and make that the gateway in PCD?

To put it another way, I'd really like PCD and anything I plug into the
Phone Router to look just like more ports on the 4-Prt Router.

Please excuse my poor nomenclature. I am just learning networking.

Thanks for any advice.

Jess

I suppose the phone won't work when plugged into the main router? If
that's true, try connecting a LAN port of the phone router to the LAN
port of the main router. Otherwise, replace the main router with the
phone router, and use the main router as a switch.
What's happening is the phone router is performing NAT between the main
router's LAN and the phone LAN, which is the function of the router,
thus isolating one subnet from the other. Assigning the same subnet to
both sides of the router may work, but I wouldn't count on it. Far
simpler to have all the devices on the same LAN.

 

[shawnjewell]

At present time you have a setup something like is depicted here:
http://www.vonage.com/help_knowledgeBase_article.php?article=88. What
you need is what is depicted here:
http://www.vonage.com/help_knowledgeBase_article.php?article=61.

You are allowing both your 4 port and your RT31P2 to handle DHCP which
is why you have two different IP sets. Install your RT31P2 as the
first device after your modem, allow it to handle DHCP. Then connect
your 4 port to the RT31P2 making sure to disable DHCP in it (the 4
port), as you basically only want to use it as a switch and nothing
more. Then connect your computers, in any combination you like, i.e.
all to the 4 port, 2 to the RT31P2 and two to the 4 port, etc.

The other reason for connecting this way, (with the RT31P2 before your
other switch and computers is that it will allow it to handle the
bandwidth management which is recommended for the best quality on your
phone.

Hope this helps.

 

[Jess Jackson]

I suppose the phone won't work when plugged into the main router? If
that's true, try connecting a LAN port of the phone router to the LAN
port of the main router. Otherwise, replace the main router with the
phone router, and use the main router as a switch.
What's happening is the phone router is performing NAT between the main
router's LAN and the phone LAN, which is the function of the router,
thus isolating one subnet from the other. Assigning the same subnet to
both sides of the router may work, but I wouldn't count on it. Far
simpler to have all the devices on the same LAN.

No, the phone must plug into the Phone Router. Also, not sure swapping
order of routers would work as the current 4-Prt Router is also my
802.11g wireless server and I need it's DHCP functionality for my laptop.

I will look at making the Phone Router a "dumb switch." I have the
manual and have already done some configuration. Would it still need the
upline 192.168.1.51 address on the front side? I really want it
"invisible," right?

Thanks,
Jess

 

[Jess Jackson]

At present time you have a setup something like is depicted here:
http://www.vonage.com/help_knowledgeBase_article.php?article=88. What
you need is what is depicted here:
http://www.vonage.com/help_knowledgeBase_article.php?article=61.

You are allowing both your 4 port and your RT31P2 to handle DHCP which
is why you have two different IP sets. Install your RT31P2 as the
first device after your modem, allow it to handle DHCP. Then connect
your 4 port to the RT31P2 making sure to disable DHCP in it (the 4
port), as you basically only want to use it as a switch and nothing
more. Then connect your computers, in any combination you like, i.e.
all to the 4 port, 2 to the RT31P2 and two to the 4 port, etc.

The other reason for connecting this way, (with the RT31P2 before your
other switch and computers is that it will allow it to handle the
bandwidth management which is recommended for the best quality on your
phone.

Hope this helps.

Hi:

I had noted one of the articles you mentioned. I decided to try it the
optional downstream way. I have no voice quality issues, but I have
3MBs+ download and 512KBs upload speed, so that may not be a factor.

As I said, I am fairly novice, but the 4-port is also my 802.11g
wireless server. I am not sure I would be able to disable DHCP and still
keep my wireless functionality. Is that right?

I will look at disabling the DHCP in the phone router.

Thanks,
Jess

 

[shawnjewell]

Sorry, I overlooked the wireless part. If you want to do wireless then
yes, you will need it to handle DHCP instead of your RT31P2. Disable
DHCP on the R31P2, but you should be able to leave it on the front side
of your 4 port, but I can't say for sure until I have a chance to give
it a try.

I would try the recomended way (i.e. modem->RT31P2->4 port
switch->computer) except use the 4 port to handle DHCP. But the other
way will work as well, as long as you have only one of them handling
DHCP. I believe that was your main issue you were trouble shooting.
If bandwidth is not an issue (and it sounds like it won't be) you can
leave it in the sequence you have and disable DHCP on one of them (in
this case the RT31P2 since you need the 4 port for wireless.
Hope this helps
S

 

[Microfirmz]

In order for wireless to work, you do not need DHCP to be handled by
the wireless router. Turn DHCP off on it and use the main router with
DHCP. Use the wireless as a 'switch'...do not use the internet port on
it. The wireless signal will be handled by the wireless router, but IPs
will be assigned by the main router.

-Yosef Lifshits

 

[Rick Wintjen]

Hi:

I had noted one of the articles you mentioned. I decided to try it the
optional downstream way. I have no voice quality issues, but I have
3MBs+ download and 512KBs upload speed, so that may not be a factor.

As I said, I am fairly novice, but the 4-port is also my 802.11g
wireless server. I am not sure I would be able to disable DHCP and still
keep my wireless functionality. Is that right?

I will look at disabling the DHCP in the phone router.

Thanks,
Jess

Wireless does not require DHCP; you can set a fixed IP in the PC with
the wireless adapter. Or, with the wireless router connected as a
switch, it *should* pass the DHCP through to the phone router. This
worked with my wireless router, but I read a report on BroadbandReports
that his (same) wireless router wouldn't work this way, so there may be
a setting that can disable this.