Compaq Presario 2100 - CPU is 55 Degrees Celcius when idling - Isthis normal temperature?

R

RakperBanengen

Hi,

I've got a Compaq Presario 2100 - The CPU is at 55 Degrees Celcius
when idling. Is this a normal temperature?

The CPU is a Mobile AMD Athlon XP2800+ (AMD Athlon XP-M)

The heatsink and fan have been cleaned using compressed air (without
opening the laptop casing).
 
M

Mike Walsh

There have been many posts in this NG stating that 55 deg.C is normal.
The only PC I have with a temperature monitor runs at about 35 deg.C (much cooler than most people report). My laptops's exterior gets that hot, so the innards are obviously much hotter.
 
R

RakperBanengen

That wouldn't be a surprising temp for a laptop, though the
actual temp would vary based on ambient temperature, fan
speed, and quality of heatsink they used.

The idle temperature is fairly irrelevant, more important is
the highest temp it reaches in the environment you need to
use it in, running something like Prime95's Torture Test to
reach near that max load and temperature.

If under Prime95's test it gets above 70C, I would be
concerned and yet since it is a laptop, there is little you
can do to rectify the situation except not run things that
put it under full load, or accept that running so hot may
reduce it's lifespan so long as it's stable.  If on the
other hand you suspect the fan is worn and that causes
reduced RPM, you could try relubing the fan or replacing it
(the latter tends to be rather expensive on a laptop unless
you can find new old stock on ebay).

I've found the culprit.

It's the secondary cooling fan (pn:361808-001) that is not running,
even on full load. I've tested the fan and it's good. I've tested the
jack on the motherboard (volt meter on the jack's leads) and there's
no power even when the other fan (heat sink) turns. Do I have to
replace the whole motherboard for that?

Could I just connect the heat sink fan and the secondary fan together?
So when the heat sink fan would be started, the secondary fan would
also start. Is there enough juice there to power two fans?

By the way, the two fans have three connectors.
The motherboard : dakt3dmb6b6 Rev:B
Laptop p/n : dz400u
 
R

RakperBanengen

In theory someone competent at laptop electronics and good
with a soldering iron could probably fix the mainboard or
tap into the power rail to make the fan run.  If the fan
shorted out it might merely need a surface-mounted fuse or
transistor replaced.  It is uncommon to find someone with
this level of ability so for practial purposes it would
usually require replacing the whole motherboard.

However since you appear to have a bit of electrical ability
having already probed the power socket with a meter, if you
can follow the circuit backwards, probe till you find the
point where the power rail isn't yet regulated for fan
control, you could solder a jumper wire to that, and another
to ground, perhaps also putting a resistor in series to
limit current some since you probably don't need the fan at
full speed, and power the fan directly that way.


There is probably enough margin in the circuit to provide
power for both fans, but wired in parallel like this both of
them will spin much slower, perhaps not even starting at all
considering how slowly many laptops spin their fans at
anything less than high load/heat levels.

However, some aren't just two stage high/low RPM, rather
they gradually increase RPM based on temperature so it is
possible the fans running at lower RPM would cause higher
temp but that higher temp causes the fans to speed up in
response until there is an equilibrium.  That "might" keep
the laptop cool enough, "IF" that is what the circuit is
like.  

It's worth a try, but if that won't work I'd do what I
mentioned above, try to trace back the circuit or tap into a
power rail elsewhere.  If you can locate the switching
supply for the processor that is another area before which
you probably have access to solder pads on some surface
mounted capacitors at which point a jumper wire could be
soldered, but I don't know if electrical noise from having a
fan connected there would be problematic for proper CPU
operation.  Probably not at that point in the circuit, but I
mention it just in case it is.

Generally speaking, anywhere you probe and find enough
voltage per the fan's specs, where there is a larger amount
of copper or a larger capacitor, will be part of the circuit
capable of supplying enough current to power a fan.

There might be other options for powering the fan as well,
if all else fails you could try running a lead to the
battery pack input, putting a transistor on that used as a
switch activated (biased) by consuming only a little current
from the other fan's power lead when the other fan turns on.
You might want a capacitor between the other fan power lead
and ground to smooth what is probably a PWM control circuit
from the other, working fan.  Here's a basic example of a
transistor as a switch, though you might need something with
more current capability than a 2N3906 depending on the fan's
current rating.  If you cannot find the fan's current rating
I would assume something with a good margin like up to 500mA
though it's probably only half that.http://www.rason.org/Projects/transwit/transwit.htm

Hi Kony,

Thank you so much for this great information.

The heat sink fan seems to only run on low or high speed. So I guess
that connecting the two fans on one socket is not an option anymore.

I've followed the tracks. There not very long and they seem to
continue under the motherboard. I didn't want to bother removing the
whole motherboard from the bottom of the case. There was no power from
the top tracks going to that socket.

I thank you very, very much for the super information on how to go get
the power for the fan. It's a bit overwhelming for me right now since
I didn't do something like that before. But I'll keep it in mind, and
someday I might feel more comfortable to "get my hands dirty" (It's
not a car engine uhh?) and start modding some motherboards. :)

I think I'll just change the motherboard or buy a new laptop for what
it's worth.

Have a great day and thanks a lot again,
RakperBanengen
 
R

RakperBanengen

There is probably enough margin in the circuit to provide
power for both fans, but wired in parallel like this both of
them will spin much slower, perhaps not even starting at all
considering how slowly many laptops spin their fans at
anything less than high load/heat levels.

But wait. Why would the fans spin slower? If a fan is connected to a 5
volt current, alone or in parallel, it should run at the same speed,
no?
 
R

RakperBanengen

If it were directly wired to 5V, yes, but if it were then
why would the fan circuit be dead if the fan still works?

Most likely, and common, is that this is a controlled fan
circuit with an inherant current limitation.  IOW, a PWM
controller which is matched to the expected fan load per the
intention to speed up and slow down the fan appropriate to
the heat sensed, even if speed up and slow down is limited
to 2 or more steps instead of a smooth proportional
increase.

Isn't PWM a quite recent technology? The Compaq Presario 2100 is at
least four years old. How were they controlling fan speeds before PWM?
Were they just increasing/decreasing the voltage (ex: 3v for low speed
and 5v for high speed?) Probably I'm way off base and missing some
knowledge here.
 

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