Cloning windows 2000

[Guest]

OK, I hope someone can clarify something. Reading all these posts is confusing me. So sorry if this is answered and I didn't see it.

I have a PIII system (Windows 2000 Professional) with 2 hard drives C: and F:. D and E are cd roms. I believe my boot drive c: is starting to have problems. Yes it works fine, there are no errors but occasionally it makes a click sound. Anyways its only 10GB and 3/4 full so I bought a new 80GB drive. My second hard drive is simply one that I store backups to programs to and stuff like that. Both drives are formatted as NTFS and a single partition

I have read about using the backup program and then restoring, about ghosting, about cloning, about the SID being a problem, about the MBR not transfering correctly... etc etc. I am only a home user. I do not have a network. I do not have all the stuff like active directory replication going on like on a network that would relate to the SID's being a problem. Here is where I am confused. All I want to do is transfer all the data, windows and everything else from the old C: drive to the new 80GB drive I bought. How do I do that??? I read that when cloning or ghosting a system to multiple pcs that the SID's have to be different. Well I am not going to a different PC. So do I still need to download and run sysprep from microsoft and then use a third party utility like Powerquest or Paragon to clone and image to my new drive and then unhook the old one and make the new one the master???? Or do I even have to do a clone. I think I understand that cloing is the best way since it is on a sector level where as ghosting is on the software level. Someone please clarify this for me.

I know there are several posts here about similiar situations it just seems like everything is related to being on a network or something. All I want is to swap out this HD in my home computer and transfer everything to a new partition on the new 80GB drive. LOL I hope someone can give me some good advice related to the SID issue and whether it matters if staying on the same computer. OK well thanks a lot for the help

Dwayne

 

[I'm Dan]

I have a PIII system (Windows 2000 Professional) with 2
hard drives C: and F:. D and E are cd roms. I believe my
boot drive c: is starting to have problems. Yes it works fine,
there are no errors but occasionally it makes a click sound.
Anyways its only 10GB and 3/4 full so I bought a new
80GB drive. My second hard drive is simply one that I
store backups to programs to and stuff like that. Both
drives are formatted as NTFS and a single partition.

I have read about using the backup program and then
restoring, about ghosting, about cloning, about the SID
being a problem, about the MBR not transfering correctly...
etc etc. I am only a home user. I do not have a network.
I do not have all the stuff like active directory replication
going on like on a network that would relate to the SID's
being a problem. Here is where I am confused. All I want
to do is transfer all the data, windows and everything else
from the old C: drive to the new 80GB drive I bought.
How do I do that??? I read that when cloning or ghosting
a system to multiple pcs that the SID's have to be different.
Well I am not going to a different PC. So do I still need
to download and run sysprep from microsoft and then use
a third party utility like Powerquest or Paragon to clone
and image to my new drive and then unhook the old one
and make the new one the master???? Or do I even have
to do a clone. I think I understand that cloing is the best
way since it is on a sector level where as ghosting is on
the software level. Someone please clarify this for me.

If you're not trying to use multiple clones on the same network, you don't
need sysprep and don't need to worry about the SID.

If your new disk is a WD, Seagate, or Maxtor, see if it came with a utility
floppy. If not, download one for free from the manufacturer's website. The
utility floppy facilitates transferring everything from old disk to new
disk. The free utilities are not as robust as BootIt-NG, PartitionMagic,
DriveImage, Ghost, True-Image, CasperXP, et al, but they're free so try the
freebie first -- if it works, you've saved some money, and if not, no harm
done. Just connect both disks, boot from the utility floppy, do the
prep/copying (make sure you copy in the right direction), remove old-disk,
put new-disk as master, and reboot. For reliable results, don't let old-XP
see the new disk before it is copied over, and don't let new-XP see the old
disk until it has booted at least once and rebuilt its drive letter table.
It seems many people who run into trouble have made one of these two
mistakes. (BTW, to avoid confusion, I'd temporarily disconnect your data
disk while you're doing all this.)

 

[Guest]

----- I'm Dan wrote: ----

I have a PIII system (Windows 2000 Professional) with
hard drives C: and F:. D and E are cd roms. I believe m
boot drive c: is starting to have problems. Yes it works fine
there are no errors but occasionally it makes a click sound
Anyways its only 10GB and 3/4 full so I bought a ne
80GB drive. My second hard drive is simply one that
store backups to programs to and stuff like that. Bot
drives are formatted as NTFS and a single partition
restoring, about ghosting, about cloning, about the SI
being a problem, about the MBR not transfering correctly..
etc etc. I am only a home user. I do not have a network
I do not have all the stuff like active directory replicatio
going on like on a network that would relate to the SID'
being a problem. Here is where I am confused. All I wan
to do is transfer all the data, windows and everything els
from the old C: drive to the new 80GB drive I bought
How do I do that??? I read that when cloning or ghostin
a system to multiple pcs that the SID's have to be different
Well I am not going to a different PC. So do I still nee
to download and run sysprep from microsoft and then us
a third party utility like Powerquest or Paragon to clon
and image to my new drive and then unhook the old on
and make the new one the master???? Or do I even hav
to do a clone. I think I understand that cloing is the bes
way since it is on a sector level where as ghosting is o
the software level. Someone please clarify this for me

If you're not trying to use multiple clones on the same network, you don'
need sysprep and don't need to worry about the SID

If your new disk is a WD, Seagate, or Maxtor, see if it came with a utilit
floppy. If not, download one for free from the manufacturer's website. Th
utility floppy facilitates transferring everything from old disk to ne
disk. The free utilities are not as robust as BootIt-NG, PartitionMagic
DriveImage, Ghost, True-Image, CasperXP, et al, but they're free so try th
freebie first -- if it works, you've saved some money, and if not, no har
done. Just connect both disks, boot from the utility floppy, do th
prep/copying (make sure you copy in the right direction), remove old-disk
put new-disk as master, and reboot. For reliable results, don't let old-X
see the new disk before it is copied over, and don't let new-XP see the ol
disk until it has booted at least once and rebuilt its drive letter table
It seems many people who run into trouble have made one of these tw
mistakes. (BTW, to avoid confusion, I'd temporarily disconnect your dat
disk while you're doing all this.

----------------------------
OK, Thanks for the response. I think I understand now. So since I am not cloning my drive to more than one drive and or on multiple computers then I dont need to worry about sysprep and the SID's becoming an issue. Great

A little confused about the last part though. I was going to completely remove my backup drive f: when doing this. When you say dont let the old Windows2K see the new disk before it is copied over, what does that mean??? All I need to do is add the second newer drive as a slave, and then fdisk it (I want two partitions) and then format and transwer the c: contents to this first partition. Is that right? Do I still need to do the format or does it happen when I use either the WesternDigital tools or third party cloning software??? I mean wont windows see the drive as soon as it is FDISKed? And the very last part you mean that I should after cloning c: remove it from the cable and set the cloned drive to be the master and then reboot??? Sorry if this seems like bumb questions. Ive just never done anything like this before.

One other thing. One this new drive. I want to make two partitions. Its an 80GB drive so I was thinking maybe 70GB for one and 10GB for the other. Now the way my current drive is, is its NTFS and it says System Disk and type is BASIC disk in disk management. Now I thought I would have been able to add a partition long time before, but you cant. So is there a way where even after I create these two partitions now that I could go back and further partition 70GB one I am transfering to? Would I have to use a third party program like Pertition Magic or something or can you just never add a partition to the system partition???

Well thanks a lot for the help. Im learning a lot here

Dwayne

 

[I'm Dan]

A little confused about the last part though. I was going to completely
remove my backup drive f: when doing this. When you say dont let the
old Windows2K see the new disk before it is copied over, what does
that mean??? All I need to do is add the second newer drive as a slave,
and then fdisk it (I want two partitions) and then format and transwer
the c: contents to this first partition. Is that right? Do I still need to
do the format or does it happen when I use either the WesternDigital
tools or third party cloning software??? I mean wont windows see
the drive as soon as it is FDISKed? And the very last part you mean
that I should after cloning c: remove it from the cable and set the
cloned drive to be the master and then reboot???

Win2K (as well as NT and XP) "remembers" drive letters by matching with a
unique hardware signature for each partition and recording that in its
registry. When Win2K boots, it reviews the signatures of all partitions it
sees and checks them against the remembered drive letter table. If a match
is found, that partition gets the same drive letter it had before. If no
match is found, a new drive letter is assigned to the partition and recorded
for future bootups.

If you boot old-2K with the new drive in place and fresh partitions visible,
old-2K says, "Aha, new hardware! Let's give it a drive letter and remember
that in the registry." Of course, the drive letter won't be 'C' because the
old disk has that, so it might end up being 'H' or something else. When you
subsequently clone old-2K over to the new disk, the registry (and its
remembered drive letter table) goes with it. Then when you try to boot the
new disk, the new Win2K starts to boot and says, "Oh, look! I recognize the
disk I'm on -- it's 'H'." So it boots up calling itself 'H', which is a
problem because the OS and lot of other stuff expects to find a 'C', which
isn't there. Don't let old-2K see the new disk before cloning, and no
memory of the new disk will be carried over to foul you up.

If new-2K doesn't recognize its own partition, it will do so the first time
it boots up, assign a drive letter, and remember it for future bootups. If
it sees no previously assigned 'C' drive around, it will assign itself
'C' -- which is good because that's what it used to be on the old disk. But
if the old disk is still installed (even as a slave!), new-2K will spot it,
remember it was 'C', and assign itself something else because now 'C' is
taken -- again, bad news. So, leave the old disk out the first time new-2K
boots so it will assign itself 'C' and remember that for future bootups.
After new-2K fixes its drive letter table, everything will be fine and you
can reinstall the old disk as slave if you want; it's just that first bootup
when new-2K is sorting things out that you need to be careful.

If your new WD disk doesn't come with a utility floppy, download it ("Data
Lifeguard Tools") from the WD site. It contains the tools to create your
partitions and copy over the old-2K partition to the new disk, all without
having to boot into old-2K to prep the new disk:

(1) remove your backup disk;
(2) connect the new disk;
(3) boot from the DLT floppy, choose 'Install Disk';
(4) prep the new disk and copy the Win2K partition from the old disk to the
new;
(5) remove the floppy;
(6) remove the old disk and put new as master (rejumper if necessary);
(7) boot the new disk.

Be careful to copy in the right direction, and don't reformat your old disk
until you're sure new-2K is working correctly. Once new-2K has booted up
and rewritten its drive letter table, you can shutdown and reinstall your
backup disk.

Like I said earlier, the freebie utils may not be all that robust or
comprehensive, but the price is right and it usually works. Try it, and if
DLT doesn't do the trick for you, you'll still have your old-2K disk to try
again with something more powerful like PartitionMagic, DriveImage, Ghost,
et al.

 

[Guest]

----- I'm Dan wrote: -----
Win2K (as well as NT and XP) "remembers" drive letters by matching with
unique hardware signature for each partition and recording that in it
registry. When Win2K boots, it reviews the signatures of all partitions i
sees and checks them against the remembered drive letter table. If a matc
is found, that partition gets the same drive letter it had before. If n
match is found, a new drive letter is assigned to the partition and recorde
for future bootups

If you boot old-2K with the new drive in place and fresh partitions visible
old-2K says, "Aha, new hardware! Let's give it a drive letter and remembe
that in the registry." Of course, the drive letter won't be 'C' because th
old disk has that, so it might end up being 'H' or something else. When yo
subsequently clone old-2K over to the new disk, the registry (and it
remembered drive letter table) goes with it. Then when you try to boot th
new disk, the new Win2K starts to boot and says, "Oh, look! I recognize th
disk I'm on -- it's 'H'." So it boots up calling itself 'H', which is
problem because the OS and lot of other stuff expects to find a 'C', whic
isn't there. Don't let old-2K see the new disk before cloning, and n
memory of the new disk will be carried over to foul you up

If new-2K doesn't recognize its own partition, it will do so the first tim
it boots up, assign a drive letter, and remember it for future bootups. I
it sees no previously assigned 'C' drive around, it will assign itsel
'C' -- which is good because that's what it used to be on the old disk. Bu
if the old disk is still installed (even as a slave!), new-2K will spot it
remember it was 'C', and assign itself something else because now 'C' i
taken -- again, bad news. So, leave the old disk out the first time new-2
boots so it will assign itself 'C' and remember that for future bootups
After new-2K fixes its drive letter table, everything will be fine and yo
can reinstall the old disk as slave if you want; it's just that first bootu
when new-2K is sorting things out that you need to be careful

If your new WD disk doesn't come with a utility floppy, download it ("Dat
Lifeguard Tools") from the WD site. It contains the tools to create you
partitions and copy over the old-2K partition to the new disk, all withou
having to boot into old-2K to prep the new disk

(1) remove your backup disk
(2) connect the new disk
(3) boot from the DLT floppy, choose 'Install Disk'
(4) prep the new disk and copy the Win2K partition from the old disk to th
new
(5) remove the floppy
(6) remove the old disk and put new as master (rejumper if necessary)
(7) boot the new disk

Be careful to copy in the right direction, and don't reformat your old dis
until you're sure new-2K is working correctly. Once new-2K has booted u
and rewritten its drive letter table, you can shutdown and reinstall you
backup disk

Like I said earlier, the freebie utils may not be all that robust o
comprehensive, but the price is right and it usually works. Try it, and i
DLT doesn't do the trick for you, you'll still have your old-2K disk to tr
again with something more powerful like PartitionMagic, DriveImage, Ghost
et al