Can I use two SATA-II drives & Win XP for Backup?

[M. B.]

I am currently running Windows XP SP2 on a one partition hard drive (WD
Caviar SATA-II), which is 250 gigabytes. My curent backup unit is a HP
SureStor DAT 40 tape drive using DDS4.

Since it is now taking me like 5 tapes to backup my system, would the
following solution work for me better? Buy another INTERNAL 250 gig drive
SATA-II (around $120). Use the drive only to make "identical clone copies"
from the C: drive around about once a week using progrtam such as Norton
Ghost or Acronis True Image. So the 2nd drive would be only used for cloning
of the first. In other words in case my C: ever gets corrupted or dies, all
I do is enable the D: drive, which in essence becomes my new C:

The reason I don't want to buy an EXTERNAL drive (such as Maxtor OneTouch II
or alike) is that it takes up space, the data transfer will be slower even
on FireWire and it costs more.

My question is this:

Since I am dealing with SATA-II drives, I need to use the latest True Image
/ Norton Ghost versions. Both require that you run the program directly
from Windows XP. What will happen when I enable the D: drive for the
system boot, as since it's a clone of the C: drive, it also has a boot
sector. Will Windows boot off the correct drive? I assume that I can
disable the D: drive from within the BIOS of my motherboard (ASUS P4C800
Deluxe) for all other computer usage, but somehow I need to start the system
with both drives on in order for the cloning program to work correcly.

Can someone please enlighten me?

 

[Rod Speed]

I am currently running Windows XP SP2 on a one partition hard drive
(WD Caviar SATA-II), which is 250 gigabytes. My curent backup unit
is a HP SureStor DAT 40 tape drive using DDS4.

Since it is now taking me like 5 tapes to backup my system, would the
following solution work for me better? Buy another INTERNAL 250 gig
drive SATA-II (around $120). Use the drive only to make "identical
clone copies" from the C: drive around about once a week using
progrtam such as Norton Ghost or Acronis True Image. So the 2nd drive
would be only used for cloning of the first. In other words in case
my C: ever gets corrupted or dies, all I do is enable the D: drive,
which in essence becomes my new C:

Yes, the main downside with that approach is that if the PC gets stolen, the
house burns down etc, or the power supply kills both drives, you're stuffed.

You can put the new drive in a removable bay kit, but you may
not bother to remove it and so that can see you get shafted by
carelessness. And it isnt a good idea if you drop stuff much.

The reason I don't want to buy an EXTERNAL drive (such as Maxtor OneTouch II
or alike) is that it takes up space, the data transfer will be slower even on
FireWire and it costs more.

My question is this:

Since I am dealing with SATA-II drives, I need to use the latest True Image /
Norton Ghost versions. Both require that you run the program directly from
Windows XP.

That isnt true of True Image, you're welcome to
boot the rescue CD and do the clone using that.

What will happen when I enable the D: drive for the system boot, as since it's
a clone of the C: drive, it also has a boot sector. Will Windows boot off the
correct drive?

Yes, if you physically disconnect the C
drive for the first boot off the D drive.

I assume that I can disable the D: drive from within the BIOS of my
motherboard (ASUS P4C800 Deluxe) for all other computer usage,

Thats a bit tricky to do without physically disconnecting it, because
even if you set the drive type entry to NONE, XP will still find it at boot
time. While that wont cause any problems when booting the C drive,
the drive will still be visible to viruses and that is a serious downside.

but somehow I need to start the system with both drives on in order for the
cloning program to work correcly.

True Image will find both drives fine when you boot from
the rescue CD when you want to clone the C drive.

 

[dannysdailys]

M. B.wrote
I am currently running Windows XP SP2 on a one partition hard driv
(WD

Caviar SATA-II), which is 250 gigabytes. My curent backup unit is HP
SureStor DAT 40 tape drive using DDS4

Since it is now taking me like 5 tapes to backup my system, woul the
following solution work for me better? Buy another INTERNAL 250 gi drive
SATA-II (around $120). Use the drive only to make "identica clone copies"
from the C: drive around about once a week using progrtam such a Norton
Ghost or Acronis True Image. So the 2nd drive would be only used fo cloning
of the first. In other words in case my C: ever gets corrupted o dies, all
I do is enable the D: drive, which in essence becomes my new C

The reason I don't want to buy an EXTERNAL drive (such as Maxto OneTouch II
or alike) is that it takes up space, the data transfer will b slower even
on FireWire and it costs more

My question is this

Since I am dealing with SATA-II drives, I need to use the lates True Image
/ Norton Ghost versions. Both require that you run the progra directly
from Windows XP. What will happen when I enable the D: drive fo the
system boot, as since it's a clone of the C: drive, it also has boot
sector. Will Windows boot off the correct drive? I assume tha I can
disable the D: drive from within the BIOS of my motherboard (ASU P4C800
Deluxe) for all other computer usage, but somehow I need to star the system
with both drives on in order for the cloning program to wor correcly

Can someone please enlighten me

The best thing to do is use RAID 1 and RAID it. If you were worrie
about your house burning down, You'd have something already i
place

I use a small notebook drive/ USB for fire backup and keep it in
media fire safe. Another easy way, is to buy web space and backu
your computer to it via FTP

I know the horror stories of rouge power supplies spiking a killin
everything. The only thing is, these are stories and I've neve
heard of anyone that it happened to them. When PSU's go, the powe
goes out, not spikes

I had an Antec literally explode with pieces flying and it never hur
anything in the machine. Needless to say; you couldn't give me a
Antec PSU

If you do go with RAID, or add another hard drive. Make sure you hav
a cooling fan in front of them! Very important..

Best of luc

 

[Rod Speed]

I am currently running Windows XP SP2 on a one partition hard drive
(WD

The best thing to do is use RAID 1 and RAID it. If you were worried
about your house burning down, You'd have something already in place.

He may not have considered that risk.

And the main problem with RAID1 is that it doesnt
protect you against a virus doing your system over.

A SATA drive in a removable bay kit would at least allow
you to physically disconnect the backup drive easily.

I use a small notebook drive/ USB for fire backup and
keep it in a media fire safe. Another easy way, is to
buy web space and backup your computer to it via FTP.

I know the horror stories of rouge power supplies spiking
a killing everything. The only thing is, these are stories
and I've never heard of anyone that it happened to them.

I have.

When PSU's go, the power goes out, not spikes.

Wrong. The PSU failing can spike what's powered by it.

I had an Antec literally explode with pieces
flying and it never hurt anything in the machine.

The technical term for that is 'pathetically inadequate sample'

Needless to say; you couldn't give me an Antec PSU.

If you do go with RAID, or add another hard drive. Make
sure you have a cooling fan in front of them! Very important...

That isnt the only way to do that, even just a spare slot
between them can be enough in a decently designed case.

 

[Frazer Jolly Goodfellow]

(e-mail address removed) (dannysdailys) wrote in @fe12.news.easynews.com:

I know the horror stories of rouge power supplies spiking a killing
everything. The only thing is, these are stories and I've never
heard of anyone that it happened to them. When PSU's go, the power
goes out, not spikes.

You appear to base your judgement on experience as a user, which
is somewhat limited in this context.

IME, PSU failure is a significant proportion of all PC hardware
failure incidences that arrive at my workshop for repair. Of those,
I typically see several incidences a year where the PSU has failed
with knock-on failures, including hard drives.

BTW: Most of the PSUs I've seen have a plain metallic finish; rouge
is seldom applied

 

[J. Clarke]

I am currently running Windows XP SP2 on a one partition hard drive (WD
Caviar SATA-II), which is 250 gigabytes. My curent backup unit is a HP
SureStor DAT 40 tape drive using DDS4.

Since it is now taking me like 5 tapes to backup my system, would the
following solution work for me better? Buy another INTERNAL 250 gig drive
SATA-II (around $120). Use the drive only to make "identical clone
copies" from the C: drive around about once a week using progrtam such as
Norton Ghost or Acronis True Image. So the 2nd drive would be only used
for cloning
of the first. In other words in case my C: ever gets corrupted or dies,
all I do is enable the D: drive, which in essence becomes my new C:

The reason I don't want to buy an EXTERNAL drive (such as Maxtor OneTouch
II or alike) is that it takes up space, the data transfer will be slower
even on FireWire and it costs more.

Why not use an SATA external drive? Works fine and there is no compromise
in transfer rate.

My question is this:

Since I am dealing with SATA-II drives, I need to use the latest True
Image
/ Norton Ghost versions. Both require that you run the program directly
from Windows XP. What will happen when I enable the D: drive for the
system boot, as since it's a clone of the C: drive, it also has a boot
sector. Will Windows boot off the correct drive?

It should, but you need to test this. Generally the machine will give you
options in the BIOS setup screen to choose the boot device.

 

[Timothy Daniels]

It should, but you need to test this. Generally the machine
will give you options in the BIOS setup screen to choose
the boot device.

If the C: drive is removed, the next drive in the BIOS's
hard drive boot order will be given control at boot time
(assuming that it has a Master Boot Record). If the D:
drive is next in the boot order and it has an MBR, its
boot.ini file will direct its ntlder and ntdetect.com to do the
booting. Since the D: drive (actually the D: Local Disk,
i.e. D: partition) is a clone of C:, its boot.ini will be
appropriate to boot D: - and it will name itself "C:" when
it boots.

Rod Speed mentioned a caution which most people
forget to do - start up the clone OS for the 1st time in
ISOLATION from its "parent" OS. After that 1st startup,
the clone may be started with the "parent" visible with
no problems, but if the 1st startup isn't done in isolation
from the "parent", random files that appear to be in the
clone will actually be pointers to the actual files in the
"parent", and when you remove the "parent", they will no
longer be accessible to the clone and will have in effect
disappeared.

Of course, opening the case to disconnect the
"parent" OS in order to startup the clone in isolation is
a pain. That is why a removable tray is so convenient.
The effect of the extra connector interface is probably
less for a SATA drive than for a PATA drive, so that is
What *I* would recommend if you have an unused
drive bay. Here is just one manufacturer of such trays:
http://kingwin.com/pdut_Cat.asp?CateID=47
Details of one model:
http://kingwin.com/pdut_detail.asp?LineID=&CateID=47&ID=268

This product *appears* to be an external enclosure
with a wall wart power supply and internal fan that allows
connection via USB 2.0 OR by SATA cable:
http://kingwin.com/pdut_detail.asp?CateID=27&ID=264

I have been using CasperXP as my cloning utility.
It specializes in hard drive-to-hard drive cloning, and
it can take a single partition from among several and
clone it to a partition among several pre-existing
partitions. This is handy if the source drive has two or
more partitions, and/or if the destination drive has one
or more partitions that you don't want to disturb - such
as when the destination drive is an archive drive that
contains several clones. Acronis True Image cannot
do this directly - it only clones an entire hard drive to be
the entire contents of another hard drive.

If the archive hard drive has several clones on it,
each of them can be selected for booting, but you
have to be familiar with the syntax of the boot.ini file.
BTW, only a Primary partition can boot itself or boot
another partition, so that gives you a maximum of four
self-booting partitions on a hard drive. But any booting
partition can boot an OS from a logical drive in an
Extended partition, so you can put *many* cloned OSes
on an archive hard drive, the limit only being imposed
by its data capacity. I aways have several clones
archived on a couple hard drives stored away on their
removable trays, but as Rod Speed says, you have
to be careful not to drop them. But knowing that I can
in just a couple minutes recover from a failure of my
primary hard drive is a comfort, and not having to
select which files to backup is also a relief - I just
backup *everything* in one operation.

*TimDaniels*

 

[IDIDIT]

I partition my 300G drive into several partitions with C being around
20G. The rest around 85G each are used for storage. I do a backup
image of C around once a week which results in around a 10G image
which is stored on a seperate drive that is not constantly running. I
suppose this second drive could be a one time clone in case the first
one totaly dies, and have a partition strictly for images for the
first drive.
I use this drive with C partition hidden which is used for MP storage
and other uses. If needed I could un hide C to use in emergency such
as installing an image into the normally used C partition.