C# developers going back to vb.net

[Kevin]

I don't know if I should even start this topic but here goes.
I'm an ex vb6 developer, now developing in C#.
The reason why I started developing in C# is because the company that I
worked for at the time standarised on C#.

Many of my friends working in previous companies that I worked for are
starting to move back to VB.Net. When I asked them why, it seems that
the next release of VB.Net seems very promising and they kinda see
themselves in the same position I'm in. It seems that at the time when
..Net was first released many companies basically forced developers to
work in C# because as in my case the company they worked for
standarised on C#, why these companies did this is beyond me because
most of their developers were vb developers, I think it's because it
was marketed that C# was the main language to use on the .Net
Framework.

Now many companies as well as management in these companies are
starting to realise that vb.net is not that different from c# and are
starting to give their developers a choice and thus obviously the move
back to vb.

The reason why I'm posting this topic here is because I'm wondering how
many developers using c# are ex vb developers and would actually like
to develop in vb.net. I have actually convinced my superiors to use
vb.net as another language choice and they have agreed.

We have just started a new project in vb.net about 3 mths ago and I
must say that it's still a damn fun language to work in, I'm actually
enjoying my work again. Productivity couldn't be higher as other c# (ex
vb6) developers in my department have also wanted to go back.

Wondering how many of you out there would like to move back to the
lighter side of life?

 

[Mythran]

I don't know if I should even start this topic but here goes.
I'm an ex vb6 developer, now developing in C#.
The reason why I started developing in C# is because the company that I
worked for at the time standarised on C#.

Many of my friends working in previous companies that I worked for are
starting to move back to VB.Net. When I asked them why, it seems that
the next release of VB.Net seems very promising and they kinda see
themselves in the same position I'm in. It seems that at the time when
.Net was first released many companies basically forced developers to
work in C# because as in my case the company they worked for
standarised on C#, why these companies did this is beyond me because
most of their developers were vb developers, I think it's because it
was marketed that C# was the main language to use on the .Net
Framework.

Now many companies as well as management in these companies are
starting to realise that vb.net is not that different from c# and are
starting to give their developers a choice and thus obviously the move
back to vb.

The reason why I'm posting this topic here is because I'm wondering how
many developers using c# are ex vb developers and would actually like
to develop in vb.net. I have actually convinced my superiors to use
vb.net as another language choice and they have agreed.

We have just started a new project in vb.net about 3 mths ago and I
must say that it's still a damn fun language to work in, I'm actually
enjoying my work again. Productivity couldn't be higher as other c# (ex
vb6) developers in my department have also wanted to go back.

Wondering how many of you out there would like to move back to the
lighter side of life?

Well, I enjoy C# more than I do VB.Net. I originally started development in
QBasic then moved to C/C++ on *nix. From there I learned Visual Basic and
moved on to the .Net platform and learned VB.Net and C#. I just like C#,
the syntax is less wordy (no Then's or End If's), which means less typing...
and I really like the way it looks (looks and feels like C/C++).

Mythran

 

[Roger]

. I just like C#,

the syntax is less wordy (no Then's or End If's), which >means less

typing...
Actually, the IDE 'types' all this anyhow, and
does a real good job of aligning it too.
So this is not really an issue.

and I really like the way it looks (looks and feels like C/C++).

May look like C/C++, but it's really quite different.
Type safety in C#, is one very much appreciated
difference.

Roger

 

[Kevin]

Well, I enjoy C# more than I do VB.Net. I originally started development in

QBasic then moved to C/C++ on *nix. From there I learned Visual Basic and
moved on to the .Net platform and learned VB.Net and C#. I just like C#,
the syntax is less wordy (no Then's or End If's), which means less typing...
and I really like the way it looks (looks and feels like C/C++).

Mythran

Wow you've been back and forth, QBasic -> C/C++ -> Visual Basic -> C#.

I disagree with your 'less typing' statement in some respect as Then's,
End If's and even End Sub End Function are implemented for you as you
enter to the next line. Even Catch and Finally is automatically coded
for you as you hit enter after a Try statement.

I do agree with your statement about look and feel, this is exactly the
point I'm trying to make. I think look and feel is important as it, in
my mind, makes you a more productive developer because you feel
comfortable with the syntax.

But I can't help wondering if ex vb6 developers now working in C# would
be more productive going back to vb.net for this exact same reason. I
know I am.

 

[Kevin]

Couldn't type safety be implemented by turning Option Strict On.

 

[Roger]

Kevin

Couldn't type safety be implemented by turning Option Strict On.

Yes, but that's VB.

I was comparing type safety in C/C++, to C#

Good day,
Roger

 

[nikki]

The reason why I'm posting this topic here is because I'm wondering how
many developers using c# are ex vb developers and would actually like
to develop in vb.net.

I've developed in VB, VB.net, C, C shell, and various other languages,
but my main base is C and C-like languages (php, perl, etc).

Learning .net, I get to play with both VB.net and C#.net, and I have to
say, I sure hope it remains a viable option, because I never much liked
VB and it hasn't changed much. LOL

IMO, people who learned VB before C prefer VB.net and people who
learned C before VB prefer C#.
I don't think it really comes down to any more than that, regardless of
what they attempt to justify it with. But feel free to correct me.

(whoever came up with "on error resume next" needs to die a slow and
painful death caused by ingrown toenails...)

 

[William Stacey [MVP]]

Having used various languages over the years (like most programmers) such as
Cobol, VB6, Perl, KSH, C, C++ and C#, etc. I just prefer c# over them all,
and its not just one or two things you can point to. But that is me.
Others will find VB.Net more to their taste and that is great. Pick the one
you like and use that.

 

[Kevin Spencer]

It's all a matter of what you want to do with your life.

Now many companies as well as management in these companies are
starting to realise that vb.net is not that different from c# and are
starting to give their developers a choice and thus obviously the move
back to vb.

You put your finger on it right there - "not that different." In fact, C#
and VB.Net ARE different, in terms of what you can do with them. You can't
do unmanaged code in VB.Net, and certain types of control are difficult to
manage with VB.Net. But if you want to develop at a high level, and don't
like or need to get down to the nitty-gritty, and you don't have much
ambition, VB.Net is probably a good language for you.

There are all kinds of programmers in the world. Some of us work at a low
level, and some of us work at a high level. And everywhere in-between. At a
high level, it doesn't matter much. But my job, for example, requires some
fairly low-level stuff, and I like it that way. I'm something of a power
freak when it comes to programming. So, I would not think about going to
VB.Net. But for many people, programming is just a job. They do it for the
money. And for them, the easiest way is the best way.

There was a serious move to C# among VB.Net programmers, and it ended up
muddying the water a bit in terms of hiring. I think anyone wanting to move
back to VB.Net is probably thinking along some very helpful lines for
everyone involved.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Big things are made up of
lots of little things.

 

[Bob Powell [MVP]]

There are more programmers in the world who cannot afford Visual Studio than
those that can. Command line copiles with notepad as the editor of choice is
surprisingly popular.

C# is a more type-efficient language.

--
Bob Powell [MVP]
Visual C#, System.Drawing

Ramuseco Limited .NET consulting
http://www.ramuseco.com

Find great Windows Forms articles in Windows Forms Tips and Tricks
http://www.bobpowell.net/tipstricks.htm

Answer those GDI+ questions with the GDI+ FAQ
http://www.bobpowell.net/faqmain.htm

All new articles provide code in C# and VB.NET.
Subscribe to the RSS feeds provided and never miss a new article.

 

[Reginald Blue]

The reason why I'm posting this topic here is because I'm wondering
how many developers using c# are ex vb developers and would actually
like to develop in vb.net. I have actually convinced my superiors to
use vb.net as another language choice and they have agreed.

I'm somewhat surprised that no one has brought this up...

In the 1.0 and 1.1 world, the differences between the 3 primary .Net
languages were slight. And this was because they (the language developers)
were all focused on making the languages work in .Net.

Now, with 2.0 coming out, the languages are starting to go the path of
specialization within .Net. Each language is intended to provide
specialized capabilities to it's niche.

If I remember correctly, they are:

VB: Rapid Application Development, with constructs like My and Edit and
Continue to allow the developer to be efficient in doing a quick job of
putting together a prototype. (This is also intended to be the easiest to
do UI work, but, I doubt you'll see a difference.)

C#: Back end business coding. Perfect for day-to-day business objects and
the like. With the addition of generics, (even though this is a general
..Net feature) the ability to generate specialized business objects from
generic patterns will be greatly enhanced.

C++ (I forget what the moniker for this is now... used to be Managed C++,
but I think it's something else now): This is supposed to be the FAST
language. Doing something that's called a million times per second and it's
core to your code? You should do it in C++. The optimizers here are
intended to be the best of breed. Additionally, with the abilities to go
from native C++ to Managed C++, you can incorporate legacy capabilities into
..Net easily.

That's as best as I can remember from some article I read ages ago.
Presumably someone will correct me where I've misremembered.

So, as for your question, if you see yourself as a RAD kind of guy, then VB
sounds like your tool.

--
Reginald Blue
"I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my
telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my
telephone."
- Bjarne Stroustrup (originator of C++) [quoted at the 2003
International Conference on Intelligent User Interfaces]

 

[Jon Skeet [C# MVP]]

You put your finger on it right there - "not that different." In fact, C#
and VB.Net ARE different, in terms of what you can do with them. You can't
do unmanaged code in VB.Net

You can't do unmanaged code in C# either. You can write *unsafe* code,
but it's still managed.

 

[Larry Lard]

It's all a matter of what you want to do with your life.


You put your finger on it right there - "not that different." In fact, C#
and VB.Net ARE different, in terms of what you can do with them. You can't
do unmanaged code in VB.Net, and certain types of control are difficult to
manage with VB.Net. But if you want to develop at a high level, and don't
like or need to get down to the nitty-gritty, and you don't have much
ambition, VB.Net is probably a good language for you.

Nice to see the elitist attitude of some C++ developers is alive and
kicking in the .NET world. "Don't have much ambition", hoho.

There are all kinds of programmers in the world. Some of us work at a low
level, and some of us work at a high level. And everywhere in-between. At a
high level, it doesn't matter much. But my job, for example, requires some
fairly low-level stuff, and I like it that way. I'm something of a power
freak when it comes to programming. So, I would not think about going to
VB.Net. But for many people, programming is just a job. They do it for the
money. And for them, the easiest way is the best way.

Whereas 'power freaks' like to make things hard, deliberately...

 

[Leon Lambert]

Personally I think it is a cultural thing and not a language thing.
Following is a pretty good article about the differences between the VB
culture and the C# culture. I agree with most points made.
http://www.cmswire.com/cms/featured-articles/not-another-c-versus-vb-article-000591.php

Leon Lambert

 

[Kevin Spencer]

Technically, yes. But I was particularly referring to the use of pointers,
which I consider to be one of the most powerful aspects of C. Once you get
access to a pointer, you're talking about programming at light speed.
Pointers are dangerous, yes, but indispensible when used for certain types
of operations, such as working with graphics. For example, I have created
several custom filters for bitmaps, and classes which create bitmaps from
Digital Elevation Model data, for quick storage and delivery. In addition,
pointers are indispensible for working with binary file formats, both
formats that are not supported by the CLR, and formats which are supported
by the CLR, but in a limited way.

The VB capabilities for working with pointers are extremely limited. So much
so, in fact, as to be nearly useless, unless you want to grab a handle to a
window or something of that sort.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Big things are made up of
lots of little things.

 

[Kevin Spencer]

Nice to see the elitist attitude of some C++ developers is alive and

kicking in the .NET world. "Don't have much ambition", hoho.

It' not "elitist" at all. VB has limitations which C# does not have. If you
are satisfied with those limitations, you are less ambitious (as a
programmer, not as a person), by definition.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Big things are made up of
lots of little things.

 

[Kevin Spencer]

So, as for your question, if you see yourself as a RAD kind of guy, then

VB sounds like your tool.

Well, Reginald, that USED to be true. But not with C# and Visual Studio.Net.
You can drag and drop all day long, and the same classes are available to C#
as to VB.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Big things are made up of
lots of little things.

The reason why I'm posting this topic here is because I'm wondering
how many developers using c# are ex vb developers and would actually
like to develop in vb.net. I have actually convinced my superiors to
use vb.net as another language choice and they have agreed.

I'm somewhat surprised that no one has brought this up...

In the 1.0 and 1.1 world, the differences between the 3 primary .Net
languages were slight. And this was because they (the language
developers) were all focused on making the languages work in .Net.

Now, with 2.0 coming out, the languages are starting to go the path of
specialization within .Net. Each language is intended to provide
specialized capabilities to it's niche.

If I remember correctly, they are:

VB: Rapid Application Development, with constructs like My and Edit and
Continue to allow the developer to be efficient in doing a quick job of
putting together a prototype. (This is also intended to be the easiest to
do UI work, but, I doubt you'll see a difference.)

C#: Back end business coding. Perfect for day-to-day business objects
and the like. With the addition of generics, (even though this is a
general .Net feature) the ability to generate specialized business objects
from generic patterns will be greatly enhanced.

C++ (I forget what the moniker for this is now... used to be Managed C++,
but I think it's something else now): This is supposed to be the FAST
language. Doing something that's called a million times per second and
it's core to your code? You should do it in C++. The optimizers here are
intended to be the best of breed. Additionally, with the abilities to go
from native C++ to Managed C++, you can incorporate legacy capabilities
into .Net easily.

That's as best as I can remember from some article I read ages ago.
Presumably someone will correct me where I've misremembered.

So, as for your question, if you see yourself as a RAD kind of guy, then
VB sounds like your tool.

--
Reginald Blue
"I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my
telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my
telephone."
- Bjarne Stroustrup (originator of C++) [quoted at the 2003
International Conference on Intelligent User Interfaces]

 

[Danny Tuppeny]

typing...
Actually, the IDE 'types' all this anyhow, and
does a real good job of aligning it too.
So this is not really an issue.

Yeah, but it looks like "english", so any half-wit can read and understand
the code. The harder it is to understand, the less likely you can become
unemployed

 

[Kevin Spencer]

BTW, Jon, I did not mean to imply (in my previous reply) that the
distinction between "unmanaged" and "unsafe" is unimportant. Terms mean
things, and I will take your correction to heart. However, the distinction
between C# and VB.net is not insignificant either, in terms of what you can
do with either language, at least for someone in my position. That was the
point I was making.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Big things are made up of
lots of little things.

 

[Mythran]

typing...
Actually, the IDE 'types' all this anyhow, and
does a real good job of aligning it too.
So this is not really an issue.

Hrm, not in my IDE I use the VS.Net IDE and turned off all
autocompletion...for one reason, in VB.Net, I do not use the keyword "Then".
So my if's are like the following:

If True
DoSomething()
End If

Why the extra typing? Why the extra "Then"? Don't need it...compiler
doesn't need it...why have it automatically insert it for ya when it's just
"extra" wording?

Aligning? I like things aligned to my specifications, not .Net's. So I
turned that off too. My tabbing is 4 spaces (not tabs) and even my region
blocks are spaced differently. In .Net 1.0 and 1.1 (framework versions), I
couldn't really change things to how I wanted them and keep auto-completion
and auto-formatting on. But now in the 2.0 world, it looks much better. I
can specify a LOOOOOT more options...and this makes both languages even
better to work with (using the .Net IDE).

May look like C/C++, but it's really quite different.
Type safety in C#, is one very much appreciated
difference.

Type safety ... hmmm...



Mythran