Bizarre font behavior in charts

[Bill Weylock]

We publish research studies that have charts on every page. We use fairly
basic 3D pie, bar, column and line charts for the most part, and we are
careful to specify only Arial or Trebuchet fonts at normal screen-font
sizings. (12,11,12,14,16,18,20, 24.....)

Usually charts are built right in PowerPoint because we found they were most
stable and clients like it.

We work in 2007, saving to 2003 compatibility format...

Our production people send me a deck that looks very nice, but it does not
have all the data and often does not have data arranged the way I decide it
should be (on the fly) or by client request.

The moment I click on a chart, however, big problems happen and do not go
away.

We are asked not to Convert the charts to 2007 format, because clients have
complained that they get error messages opening our decks in 2003. But as
soon as I click the chart, fonts begin to misbehave stubbornly. It seems to
have something to do with the need to resize the chart to fit into a space
on the slide. It results in wildly fractional font sizes.

The most frequent problem is muddy letter drawing and negative kerning:
letters look as if they were generated by an old Atari (yeah, I¹m that old
but still cheerful) and are jumbled together. Still readable, mind you, but
sloppy as all hades.

Okay, so I click and open the chart again. Immediately when the chart enters
edit mode, the fonts get all cooperative and look the way I want them to.
When I click out and go back to slide view, they are nasty again. Nothing I
have thought to do affects this.

I get best results by going down a font size and saving the chart as I close
it. Arial 10 usually looks minimally acceptable.

Our work is suffering because clients figure we don¹t care or are too stupid
to manage our computers properly.

Is this rare?? I don¹t see any other discussion of it, and I expected to.

By the way, if I convert to 2007, the problems usually go away. I never get
quite what I expect, but the text next to the graph no longer looks designed
by an angry 8 year old. I do get warnings every time I save the file in
2003, and clients may have unpleasant results trying to deal with a partly
2007ed file.

I am grateful in advance for any help you can offer. This is making my life
less livable than you would want for me.

Thanks!



Best,

Bill
Imac 2.8Ghz -10.5.1
Office 2008/2007 - Windows XP Pro SP2

 

[Echo S]

Have you turned off autosizing on the chart fonts? See #2 at
http://www.echosvoice.com/charts.htm.

--
Echo [MS PPT MVP] http://www.echosvoice.com
What's new in PPT 2007? http://www.echosvoice.com/2007.htm
Fixing PowerPoint Annoyances http://tinyurl.com/36grcd
PowerPoint 2007 Complete Makeover Kit http://tinyurl.com/32a7nx


We publish research studies that have charts on every page. We use fairly
basic 3D pie, bar, column and line charts for the most part, and we are
careful to specify only Arial or Trebuchet fonts at normal screen-font
sizings. (12,11,12,14,16,18,20, 24.....)

Usually charts are built right in PowerPoint because we found they were most
stable and clients like it.

We work in 2007, saving to 2003 compatibility format...

Our production people send me a deck that looks very nice, but it does not
have all the data and often does not have data arranged the way I decide it
should be (on the fly) or by client request.

The moment I click on a chart, however, big problems happen and do not go
away.

We are asked not to Convert the charts to 2007 format, because clients have
complained that they get error messages opening our decks in 2003. But as
soon as I click the chart, fonts begin to misbehave stubbornly. It seems to
have something to do with the need to resize the chart to fit into a space
on the slide. It results in wildly fractional font sizes.

The most frequent problem is muddy letter drawing and negative kerning:
letters look as if they were generated by an old Atari (yeah, I'm that old
but still cheerful) and are jumbled together. Still readable, mind you, but
sloppy as all hades.

Okay, so I click and open the chart again. Immediately when the chart enters
edit mode, the fonts get all cooperative and look the way I want them to.
When I click out and go back to slide view, they are nasty again. Nothing I
have thought to do affects this.

I get best results by going down a font size and saving the chart as I close
it. Arial 10 usually looks minimally acceptable.

Our work is suffering because clients figure we don't care or are too stupid
to manage our computers properly.

Is this rare?? I don't see any other discussion of it, and I expected to.

By the way, if I convert to 2007, the problems usually go away. I never get
quite what I expect, but the text next to the graph no longer looks designed
by an angry 8 year old. I do get warnings every time I save the file in
2003, and clients may have unpleasant results trying to deal with a partly
2007ed file.

I am grateful in advance for any help you can offer. This is making my life
less livable than you would want for me.

Thanks!



Best,

Bill
Imac 2.8Ghz -10.5.1
Office 2008/2007 - Windows XP Pro SP2

 

[Steve Rindsberg]

Boy is this ever an opportunity to prove we're not just a bunch of MS shills.
;-)

If stability and predictability are important in an environment where you need
to share files with people using previous versions of PPT, you may want to give
serious consideration to blitzing 2007 and sticking with 2003, at least for the
near-term.

If you're going back and forth between 2007 and 2003, and editing charts is a
consideration, you really want to stick with MS Graph charts. In PPT 2007, when
you insert a chart, it automatically inserts an Excel chart. You can change
that key in the registry so that when you choose Insert | Chart, PPT will
instead insert an MS Graph chart.

When your users double-click that MS Graph chart in PPT 2003, it will behave
just like the charts they're used to working with.

Edit the registry on the PPT 2007 machine and add this registry key:

HKEY_CURRENT_USER/SOFTWARE/MICROSOFT/OFFICE/12.0/Common/Charting/MSGraphEnable

and set its value to 1.

So, navigate to this folder in the registry:

HKEY_CURRENT_USER/SOFTWARE/MICROSOFT/OFFICE/12.0/Common/Charting/

then Edit | New | Dword
type MSGraphEnable
and set the data value to 1

This will allow you to insert a MSGraph chart instead of an Excel chart when
you Insert | Chart, and it will also not convert the MSGraph charts to Excel
charts (which is PPT 2007's typical behavior), so you can stick with MSGraph
all the way 'round.

 

[Bill Weylock]

Irrelevant article as far as I can see. It¹s talking about charts built in
Excel and about colors. None of that is a problem.

And the answer to your actual question is that I have clicked and unclicked
the ³auto-scale² option box in the font selection dialog. I will try the two
dialogs and the two checks and saves for each chart each time I make a small
edit. And my reaction to that is phoo! If that¹s what it takes for fonts to
behave properly in a PRESENTATION program, oh my god.

Is there a global setting or process or precept we can follow to make the
program stop trying to destroy our work?

Truly, I will try the click-around approach. Sorry for venting. This is very
frustrating, and I am having to look at a complicated work-around for
something that they should be able to manage these days.

Nothing better to be done than this?

Does anyone else have this problem?


Best,


- Bill

 

[Bill Weylock]

Steve -

I hope you know how incredibly helpful this is!!

And I mean that even if you¹re completely psychotic and making all this up!


I knew it had to be something other than a little tweak in dialogs ­ for one
thing, because they don¹t work.

I personally wish the world would convert to 2007, because it really does
have some nifty advantages. I just hate the thought of having to go back to
2003. We may well do though.

I¹m also thinking of buying separate charting software and seeing if that
might not work for us.

I personally vastly prefer the Excel approach ­ if only the world would
adopt it.

This seems like a wonderfully thorough approach. You are going to make me a
hero, and you¹re already mine!

Thanks so much again. I¹m right in thinking that the same little editor I
got to tweak my WindowsMobile6 PocketPC will work on the desktop? Cool.

Hope I can help you with something sometime. And if you¹re making it up,
don¹t tell me. Make me feel inadequate when I come sniveling back to the
group reporting failure.

Thank you!!!!!!!!!


Best,


- Bill

Boy is this ever an opportunity to prove we're not just a bunch of MS shills.
;-)

If stability and predictability are important in an environment where you need
to share files with people using previous versions of PPT, you may want to
give
serious consideration to blitzing 2007 and sticking with 2003, at least for
the
near-term.

If you're going back and forth between 2007 and 2003, and editing charts is a
consideration, you really want to stick with MS Graph charts. In PPT 2007,
when
you insert a chart, it automatically inserts an Excel chart. You can change
that key in the registry so that when you choose Insert | Chart, PPT will
instead insert an MS Graph chart.

When your users double-click that MS Graph chart in PPT 2003, it will behave
just like the charts they're used to working with.

Edit the registry on the PPT 2007 machine and add this registry key:

HKEY_CURRENT_USER/SOFTWARE/MICROSOFT/OFFICE/12.0/Common/Charting/MSGraphEnable

and set its value to 1.

So, navigate to this folder in the registry:

HKEY_CURRENT_USER/SOFTWARE/MICROSOFT/OFFICE/12.0/Common/Charting/

then Edit | New | Dword
type MSGraphEnable
and set the data value to 1

This will allow you to insert a MSGraph chart instead of an Excel chart when
you Insert | Chart, and it will also not convert the MSGraph charts to Excel
charts (which is PPT 2007's typical behavior), so you can stick with MSGraph
all the way 'round.





-----------------------------------------
Steve Rindsberg, PPT MVP
PPT FAQ: www.pptfaq.com
PPTools: www.pptools.com
================================================

Best,

Bill
Imac 2.8Ghz -10.5.1
Office 2008/2007 - Windows XP Pro SP2

 

[Echo S]

No, the article is not talking abouit charts built in Excel. And neither are
you, if you're still using MSGraph charts -- which I thought you said you
are. But it seems that at least part of your problem is that you're not
working exclusively in MSGraph. I got the impression from your first post
that you were because you said you're not converting them to 2007 format.

Anyway, if you turn off autoscaling for the fonts in the chart when you
build it in the first place (it's on by default), then the fonts won't go
wacky. Sorry it's not the answer you wanted to hear. You may want to do this
in the MSGraph charts you build after setting the registry key Steve pointed
out, as it's still helpful to keep fonts from going crazy when the chart is
resized.

--
Echo [MS PPT MVP] http://www.echosvoice.com
What's new in PPT 2007? http://www.echosvoice.com/2007.htm
Fixing PowerPoint Annoyances http://tinyurl.com/36grcd
PowerPoint 2007 Complete Makeover Kit http://tinyurl.com/32a7nx

--
Echo [MS PPT MVP] http://www.echosvoice.com
What's new in PPT 2007? http://www.echosvoice.com/2007.htm
Fixing PowerPoint Annoyances http://tinyurl.com/36grcd
PowerPoint 2007 Complete Makeover Kit http://tinyurl.com/32a7nx


Irrelevant article as far as I can see. It's talking about charts built in
Excel and about colors. None of that is a problem.

And the answer to your actual question is that I have clicked and unclicked
the "auto-scale" option box in the font selection dialog. I will try the two
dialogs and the two checks and saves for each chart each time I make a small
edit. And my reaction to that is phoo! If that's what it takes for fonts to
behave properly in a PRESENTATION program, oh my god.

Is there a global setting or process or precept we can follow to make the
program stop trying to destroy our work?

Truly, I will try the click-around approach. Sorry for venting. This is very
frustrating, and I am having to look at a complicated work-around for
something that they should be able to manage these days.

Nothing better to be done than this?

Does anyone else have this problem?


Best,


- Bill


On 3/8/08 4:07 PM, in article
(e-mail address removed), "Echo S"


Have you turned off autosizing on the chart fonts? See #2 at
http://www.echosvoice.com/charts.htm.


Best,

Bill
Imac 2.8Ghz -10.5.1
Office 2008/2007 - Windows XP Pro SP2

 

[Steve Rindsberg]

Steve -

I hope you know how incredibly helpful this is!!

And I mean that even if youre completely psychotic and making all this up!

If I am, it may well be 2007 that's given me a lift 'round the bend.

I personally wish the world would convert to 2007, because it really does
have some nifty advantages.

And some pretty interesting bugs too ... but it'd be a lot easier if everyone
were on one page, no question. There are still lots of people using 2000 and a
fair number on 97. I'm not holding my breath.

In person, I'm nowhere near the cynic I sound like on-line. ;-)

Im also thinking of buying separate charting software and seeing if that
might not work for us.

Do your clients need to be able to edit the charts? If so, they'd have to have
the same software as well. On the other hand, if they don't need to edit, you
might want to convert the charts to WMFs/EMFs or PNGs before turning them loose
to the clients.

This seems like a wonderfully thorough approach. You are going to make me a
hero, and youre already mine!

Thanks so much again. Im right in thinking that the same little editor I
got to tweak my WindowsMobile6 PocketPC will work on the desktop? Cool.

Not a clue ... send me your mobile device for a few years and I'll give it a
thorough test.

 

[Bill Weylock]

It¹s hard to know exactly how to apologize to someone named Echo, but I do
apologize for the tone and content of the reply.

You deserved better for having tried to help.

I think I was off base, but I did think you had referred me to an
out-of-date and inappropriate web page.

Here is a question back to you, if we are still speaking...

Can auto-scaling of fonts be turned off as a global preference?

As for working exclusively in MS Graph, I would be happy to. The only reason
I convert any charts is to avoid sending something to the clients that is
borderline illegible. Sad to say, I have no idea how the thing looks when
they get it and open it in 2003. I hope it looks the way it did when I sent
it.

Steve, as you¹ve seen, makes the point that converting a chart does change
it to Excel. That¹s the only reason it happens.

Occasionally, though, I have to change something in a chart built from a
complicated table. To save key entry, I sometimes paste the data back and
forth into and out of Excel. I don¹t think that would really change the
chart creator though.

Thanks for the help. Hope it can go one more round.


Best,


- Bill

 

[Bill Weylock]

Yep, clients need to edit the charts ­ and they often want to take them from
our slides and re-purpose them. They would kill us if we sent them PNG,
although you¹d best believe that would please me no end.


Best,


- Bill

If I am, it may well be 2007 that's given me a lift 'round the bend.


And some pretty interesting bugs too ... but it'd be a lot easier if everyone
were on one page, no question. There are still lots of people using 2000 and
a
fair number on 97. I'm not holding my breath.

In person, I'm nowhere near the cynic I sound like on-line. ;-)


Do your clients need to be able to edit the charts? If so, they'd have to
have
the same software as well. On the other hand, if they don't need to edit, you
might want to convert the charts to WMFs/EMFs or PNGs before turning them
loose
to the clients.


Not a clue ... send me your mobile device for a few years and I'll give it a
thorough test.


-----------------------------------------
Steve Rindsberg, PPT MVP
PPT FAQ: www.pptfaq.com
PPTools: www.pptools.com
================================================

Best,

Bill
Imac 2.8Ghz -10.5.1
Office 2008/2007 - Windows XP Pro SP2

 

[Steve Rindsberg]

Yep, clients need to edit the charts  and they often want to take them from
our slides and re-purpose them. They would kill us if we sent them PNG,
although youd best believe that would please me no end.

In that case, give the reg tweak a go.

An alternative is keeping a couple versions of Office on the same computer using
virtual machines (Virtual PC from MS is free; VMWare isn't but it's probably the
more flexible of the two).

Using Virtual PC / VMWare virtual computers
http://www.pptfaq.com/FAQ00819.htm

Best,


- Bill


On 3/9/08 1:28 PM, in article (e-mail address removed), "Steve

Steve -

I hope you know how incredibly helpful this is!!

And I mean that even if youre completely psychotic and making all

this up!

If I am, it may well be 2007 that's given me a lift 'round the bend.

I personally wish the world would convert to 2007, because it really does
have some nifty advantages.

And some pretty interesting bugs too ...
but it'd be a lot easier if everyone
were on one page, no question.
There are still lots of people using 2000 and a
fair number on 97. I'm
not holding my breath.

In person, I'm nowhere near the cynic I sound
like on-line. ;-)

Im also thinking of buying separate charting software and seeing if that
might not work for us.

Do your clients need to be able to edit the charts? If so, they'd have to
have
the same software as well. On the other hand, if they don't need to
edit, you
might want to convert the charts to WMFs/EMFs or PNGs before
turning them loose
to the clients.

This seems like a wonderfully thorough approach. You are going to make me a
hero, and youre already mine!

Thanks so much again. Im right in thinking that the same little editor I
got to tweak my WindowsMobile6 PocketPC will work on the desktop? Cool..

Not a clue ... send me your mobile device for a few years and I'll give it a

thorough test.

Hope I can help you with something sometime. And if youre making it up,
dont tell me. Make me feel inadequate when I come sniveling back to the
group reporting failure.

Thank you!!!!!!!!!


Best,


- Bill




On 3/8/08 4:27 PM, in article

(e-mail address removed), "Steve

 

[Nicolo]

Hello all.

Thanks for the tweak.
I am facing another problem when doing this.

I am trying to save default chart types in MS Graph, (esp with Arial 14
font) but the MS graph in Office 2007 does not seem to register it. it
allways sticks to a standard chart type and to Calibri 20 font.

Do you know how we could fix this ?

Thanks a lot