Bad Sectors

[Gerry]

Cronos

You were saying -"HDTune is no longer free"?
http://www.majorgeeks.com/download4130.html


--


Hope this helps.

Gerry
~~~~
FCA
Stourport, England
Enquire, plan and execute
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Arno]

Intelligent people don't sit around yapping about HDDs all day. They
spend it reading Kafka, Hesse, Sarte, etc. I think you mean, requires
knowledge and not "intelligence". Anyway, no way am I going to credit
Rod Speed as an intelligent being.

I found both Kafka and Hesse to be exceedingly boring and often
obvious. Quite a waste of time. Did not try Sartre.

What it takes is intelligence to recognize it is actually a
difficult problem (which is rather hard for many people, obviously)
and experience to give intelligence something to work with.
Knowledge does not really come into it besides that. otherwise
you could just read up oh how to do it.

Arno

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Intelligent people don't sit around yapping about HDDs all day. They
spend it reading Kafka, Hesse, Sarte, etc. I think you mean, requires
knowledge and not "intelligence". Anyway, no way am I going to credit
Rod Speed as an intelligent being.

Well I doubt Kafka, Hesse, or Sartre could've recognized a failing hard
drive. But I will say that certain computer programs like HD Sentinel
are much better than average at recognizing a failing hard drive beyond
the idiotic SMART "OK" ratings, they're getting closer to human-level
quality. But of course, HD Sentinel is the culmination of years of human
experience, rolled into rules for a computer program.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Arno]

Well I doubt Kafka, Hesse, or Sartre could've recognized a failing hard
drive. But I will say that certain computer programs like HD Sentinel
are much better than average at recognizing a failing hard drive beyond
the idiotic SMART "OK" ratings, they're getting closer to human-level
quality. But of course, HD Sentinel is the culmination of years of human
experience, rolled into rules for a computer program.

Indeed. And so far the only pice of software I know that is halfway
competent in this area. The rest just gives you plain data
without interpretation. Truely a sad state for data storage,
but it seems a) people do not care and b) people do not have
made really bad experiences in large enough numbers.

Arno

 

[Cronos]

Cronos

You were saying -"HDTune is no longer free"?
http://www.majorgeeks.com/download4130.html

I just checked the author's site and it says "free trial" so is still
free but there is a pay for pro version too with advanced features.
Calling it a "trial" threw me off because that implies it is just a time
limited version but in fact it is not and is free forever. He should
change it to read 'Free Version'.

http://www.hdtune.com/download.html

 

[Cronos]

I found both Kafka and Hesse to be exceedingly boring and often
obvious. Quite a waste of time. Did not try Sartre.

Hesse is considered one of the greatest existential writers ever so
disagree with your comment greatly. I have read almost all of his books.
If you find it boring then it is because you don't have the intellect
for it.

What it takes is intelligence to recognize it is actually a
difficult problem (which is rather hard for many people, obviously)
and experience to give intelligence something to work with.
Knowledge does not really come into it besides that. otherwise
you could just read up oh how to do it.

And anyone can read up on how to decipher the SMART data. Doesn't take a
rocket scientist to do that.

 

[Arno]

Arno wrote:

Hesse is considered one of the greatest existential writers ever so
disagree with your comment greatly. I have read almost all of his books.
If you find it boring then it is because you don't have the intellect
for it.

Not really. My problem is that I don't like the style and
that the ideas were not new to me. So no entertainment value
and no insight value, hence boring and a waste of time for me.
This is not to imply his writing generally is, just for me it
was. Should have qualified that, sorry.

And anyone can read up on how to decipher the SMART data. Doesn't take a
rocket scientist to do that.

Actually you cannot read it up. Well, you can, but mostly in
the archives of this group, as the actual meaning differs by
drive and environmental conditions. The part that takes
intelligence is to find out whether the meaning for a similar
drive is duplicated or not and how a specific drive behaves.


Arno

 

[Gerry]

Cronos

The version you are referring to is 4, whereas an earlier version still
available is Freeware.


--


Gerry
~~~~
FCA
Stourport, England
Enquire, plan and execute
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Franc Zabkar]

Indeed. And so far the only pice of software I know that is halfway
competent in this area. The rest just gives you plain data
without interpretation.

IME, some of the worst SMART tools are the ones where the author has
offered his own, often incorrect, interpretation without supplying the
actual raw data so that we can make our own judgments.

For example, the author of HD Tune doesn't appear to understand that
raw attribute values are 48-bit numbers rather than 32-bit. HD Tune
will therefore sometimes report negative decimal numbers for the "LBAs
Read and Written" attributes.

PCWizard's author only quotes the lowest 20 bits, and has no idea how
Seagate's Seek Error Rate and Raw Read Error Rate numbers are encoded.
Therefore a score of 60 for the Seek Error Rate is given a low health
assessment whereas in reality it usually reflects error-free
performance.

Some attribute values make no sense in decimal format. Their true
meaning is often only visible when expressed in hexadecimal.

- Franc Zabkar

 

[Arno]

On 21 Jan 2010 18:30:49 GMT, Arno <[email protected]> put finger to
keyboard and composed:

IME, some of the worst SMART tools are the ones where the author has
offered his own, often incorrect, interpretation without supplying the
actual raw data so that we can make our own judgments.

True, of course. Wrong interpretations are worse than none at all.

For example, the author of HD Tune doesn't appear to understand that
raw attribute values are 48-bit numbers rather than 32-bit. HD Tune
will therefore sometimes report negative decimal numbers for the "LBAs
Read and Written" attributes.
Urgh!

PCWizard's author only quotes the lowest 20 bits, and has no idea how
Seagate's Seek Error Rate and Raw Read Error Rate numbers are encoded.
Therefore a score of 60 for the Seek Error Rate is given a low health
assessment whereas in reality it usually reflects error-free
performance.

Well, I think I still do not undertsand the seek error rate attribute,
but at least I know that I do not understand it. This will likely
cause poeple to toss complety healthy disks. Not good.

Some attribute values make no sense in decimal format. Their true
meaning is often only visible when expressed in hexadecimal.

Indeed.

Arno

 

[Cronos]

Not really. My problem is that I don't like the style and
that the ideas were not new to me.

I take it you don't watch any movie that has the same general theme as
another movie then? That must weed out 99% of your movie watching
because there are only about 4 general themes in all movies.

Actually you cannot read it up. Well, you can, but mostly in
the archives of this group, as the actual meaning differs by
drive and environmental conditions. The part that takes
intelligence is to find out whether the meaning for a similar
drive is duplicated or not and how a specific drive behaves.

You call Hesse boring but reading about SMART data isn't? Gee, you must
be a really exciting guy and I bet the women just love your
conversational skills.

 

[Cronos]

For example, the author of HD Tune doesn't appear to understand that
raw attribute values are 48-bit numbers rather than 32-bit. HD Tune
will therefore sometimes report negative decimal numbers for the "LBAs
Read and Written" attributes.

I don't care about that. If HDTune shows a red block on a pretty yellow
background then I know there is an issue with the HDD.

 

[Cronos]

Cronos

The version you are referring to is 4, whereas an earlier version still
available is Freeware.

OK, thanks.

 

[Franc Zabkar]

I don't care about that. If HDTune shows a red block on a pretty yellow
background then I know there is an issue with the HDD.

What you know is that HD Tune's author thinks there is an issue.

Tell me why HD Tune's author chooses to highlight the following Spin
Retry Count in yellow:
http://eric514.mailpeers.net/hd-tune-ST3500630A.jpg

- Franc Zabkar

 

[Arno]

Franc Zabkar wrote:

I don't care about that. If HDTune shows a red block on a pretty yellow
background then I know there is an issue with the HDD.

A bit of an extremely simplicitic view of a complex issue...

Arno

 

[Cronos]

What you know is that HD Tune's author thinks there is an issue.

No, what I know is that from my actual experience it accurately detected
a bad block that the manufacturer's diagnostic software failed to
detect. You on the other hand have no first hand experience to your
claims and are just making it up as you go along.

 

[Cronos]

A bit of an extremely simplicitic view of a complex issue...

Arno

I'm a subscriber to KISS. You should try it sometime instead of over
analyzing the data.

 

[Arno]

Arno wrote:
I'm a subscriber to KISS. You should try it sometime instead of over
analyzing the data.

KISS aplies to synthesis, not to analysis. I think you may
have simplified analysis so much that you have no idea
what you miss.

Arno

 

[Cronos]

KISS aplies to synthesis, not to analysis. I think you may
have simplified analysis so much that you have no idea
what you miss.

Arno

Red = Bad

That's all I need, or want, to analyze.

 

[Arno]

Arno wrote:

Red = Bad

That's all I need, or want, to analyze.

Well, do it any way you like. It is not my job to
prevent you from shooting yourself in the foot or
using inadequate procedures.

A competent approach to the problem looks differently though.

Arno